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Dean Holden (Merged)


Bcfcbackwell

If we appoint Holden I will...   

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Tom Thumb (like the name you've picked) quality post, shame you haven't been on here for years - keep on posting, don't just bow out after your first 5!

I think the best thing to do though is wait until the manager is announced, there could still be a trick up the club's sleeve that none of us know about.

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46 minutes ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

You’ve supported City for 35 years.  You’ve therefore seen Russell Osman appointed, Tony Pulis in 1999 and, worst of all, Tony Fawthrop in 2000.  That was the most astonishing appointment in our managerial history, and one that had to be almost automatically rescinded in bizarre circumstances.

Dean Holden’s appointment would surely be more interesting than these!

Thanks for the reply, and I do indeed recall the mentioned appointments which, in hindsight, were bizarre and failed ventures, to caveat that however I would argue that the club as a whole has never been in a better place to make an appointment of intent, and expectation from the fans, justifiably I believe, has been set at a very high bar.

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18 minutes ago, pongo88 said:

There are many things I don’t understand about this convoluted saga, but one is why people believe Holden might be appointed as a cost saving measure because of Covid 19. He would be cheaper than Gerrard and Hughton but he won’t work for free. If, for example, he was offered £10k per week less than Hughton that’s “only” £520k per year. A lot of money for me but peanuts in the scheme of things for City. Particularly when the aim is to reach the Premier League where the big money is. The new manager may have to work with a small budget but there are experienced managers available who have previously worked with a small budget - eg Mick McCarthy 

It’s not just salary though, is it?  That’s just a small part of it. The real issue will be the extent to which managerial candidates would be prepared to work within whatever budget Steve Lansdown is going to set.  If Steve is saying that because of Covid 19 it would be unwise to spend mega bucks on transfer fees, then it makes absolute sense to make an internal appointment, someone who is already familiar with the club and knows the young players.  I suspect the likes of Hughton and Cook would want to build their own squads, which would create turbulence and cost an awful lot of money.

The more I think about it, the more all this is beginning to make sense, in the context of the pandemic.  Maybe we just need to start thinking differently about football for the immediate future.

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2 minutes ago, Red Army 75 said:

Hughton not out of it yet. His camp expects to hear back from the club. Holden too though. As reported yesterday, Holden sounding more likely to us from our information - but they could easily go for Hughton yet
 

Latest tweet from Gregor 

I can picture Hughton walking circles around his office, biting his nails shouting “why won’t they call damn it” whilst his team, all dressed in black suits, pass glances at each other nervously, not knowing what to say to him.

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30 minutes ago, mozo said:

The two candidates still waiting is a fascinating tidbit.

So if (and hopefully it is) it is one of the two (not Holden) then they don't even know yet. They still have to get to wherever the contracts are signed, sign them, do all the press. Can't see us finding out today.

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8 hours ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

What's wrong with Cook tbh?

If he was interviewed, then he would have laid out his vision for the future, and what money he would need.  Maybe that was simply incompatible with the club’s financial plans.  Potential candidates will have their own demands and requirements, which may be unacceptable to us.

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5 minutes ago, TomThumb84 said:

Thanks for the reply, and I do indeed recall the mentioned appointments which, in hindsight, were bizarre and failed ventures, to caveat that however I would argue that the club as a whole has never been in a better place to make an appointment of intent, and expectation from the fans, justifiably I believe, has been set at a very high bar.

Excellent first post. (That’s a hard act to follow ?)

It explains all the frustrations a lot of us followers are experiencing.

I have intimated in another thread that we are being sold a lie!

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10 hours ago, cityal said:

Did this really need another thread?

 

Yes we ALL KNOW you are annoyed at the situation but please for the love of god stop making endless threads on this topic

The situation is changing all the time. Now I believe we will have no alternative to Dean Holden and that is what I have just posted.

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4 minutes ago, southvillekiddy said:

The situation is changing all the time. Now I believe we will have no alternative to Dean Holden and that is what I have just posted.

If we have no alternative I think that would be the end for Mark Ashton at Bristol City.

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7 minutes ago, TomThumb84 said:

Thanks for the reply, and I do indeed recall the mentioned appointments which, in hindsight, were bizarre and failed ventures, to caveat that however I would argue that the club as a whole has never been in a better place to make an appointment of intent, and expectation from the fans, justifiably I believe, has been set at a very high bar.

Tbf, I wouldn't say the club has never been in a better place. Yes, we have a decent stadium, we have a new training ground (building looks huge, passed by yesterday) and good owners unlike a lot of others. In that respect, all good.

But we're in the middle of a global pandemic with the season interrupted and prolonged, no spectators allowed, and losing millions which will undoubtedly have a big negative effect on how the club operates moving forward. That must have a bearing on who comes in as the new manager - both the club and the new bloke need to be realistic and take the above into account. Not to say that they shouldn't go for the best they can get, just that the best may be out of reach at this time. Just my opinion, others more qualified to talk about the financial impact may disagree.

Having said that, I hope Hughton is appointed (but its looking doubtful imo).

 

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2 hours ago, Phileas Fogg said:

That’s what I’m wondering. So far it’s only Gregor reporting it. It’s possible the ‘manager negotiating his back room staff’ could mean Cook keeping Holden on as assistant. I think most would accept that.

Gregor will be the only one reporting because it’s a nothing club hiring a nothing manager ?

If they wanted the worlds media to sit up and take note at us appointing Gerrard, it’s going to be disappointing for them when nobody in media cares about Holden getting it.

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1 hour ago, Del Griffith said:

It should be Holden. All this let’s offer Hughton Gerrard Cook etc whatever they want is madness. City like everyone else will have to reign finances and expectations in a bit. Look at Wigan and Wednesday Bury Bolton and Macclesfield. Is that the future?

City of all clubs, remember the 80s, should tread warily.

The Gravy Train with Biscuit Wheels has hit the buffers.
 

They're all examples of clubs that were badly run before Covid 

We were reportedly offering Gerrard £50k pw four weeks ago, that is not evidence of a club planning on pulling in their finances 

 

(Ps love the username)

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City are linked with Gerrard we are prepared to offer 50k a week to take us to the next level. 

Chris Hughton has said he would like to manage us and has 2 promotions out of this league. Paul Cook was known to be interested and would have led a Wigan team to one place behind us in the table if the EFL weren't cruel and decide Wigan should be relegated but Sheffield Wednesday for breaking the rules their punishment is next season. 

Instead we go to Dean Holden a man whose record as a manager is 20 games 5 wins 7 draws and 8 defeats. I'm sure he is a lovely chap but to me he is not the manager to take us the next level if Holden is appointed it doesn't even feel like a step sideways it feels like a step back. 

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40 minutes ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

It’s not just salary though, is it?  That’s just a small part of it. The real issue will be the extent to which managerial candidates would be prepared to work within whatever budget Steve Lansdown is going to set.  If Steve is saying that because of Covid 19 it would be unwise to spend mega bucks on transfer fees, then it makes absolute sense to make an internal appointment, someone who is already familiar with the club and knows the young players.  I suspect the likes of Hughton and Cook would want to build their own squads, which would create turbulence and cost an awful lot of money.

The more I think about it, the more all this is beginning to make sense, in the context of the pandemic.  Maybe we just need to start thinking differently about football for the immediate future.

That’s exactly the point I made at the end of my post. A new coach may have to work with a small budget, but there are plenty of experienced managers / coaches who have done this successfully in the past - Mick McCarthy etc. Why go for Holden when you can get someone better who would work under the budgetary constraints set by SL?

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Frank Schmidt appearing in the betting at 25/1 which probably means very little.  I know little about him other than he has performed wonders with Heidenhelm (his birth place) and is the longest serving manager in the German leagues. 

Saw this quote on him "Although his own person, Schmidt shares the social competence that Jürgen Klopp is a master of. He has recognized that so long as the effort is right he knows that for many on-lookers in Heidenheim it doesn't matter how the team plays."

It's odd that there has been no announcement if Dean Holden is going to be appointed unless they are waiting for him to complete his holiday. That doesn't sound very credible though.

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43 minutes ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

It’s not just salary though, is it?  That’s just a small part of it. The real issue will be the extent to which managerial candidates would be prepared to work within whatever budget Steve Lansdown is going to set.  If Steve is saying that because of Covid 19 it would be unwise to spend mega bucks on transfer fees, then it makes absolute sense to make an internal appointment, someone who is already familiar with the club and knows the young players.  I suspect the likes of Hughton and Cook would want to build their own squads, which would create turbulence and cost an awful lot of money.

The more I think about it, the more all this is beginning to make sense, in the context of the pandemic.  Maybe we just need to start thinking differently about football for the immediate future.

Then why did lansdown talk a few weeks back about an appointment to take us to the next level. Why also did we waste 3 weeks chasing Gerrard. Whilst I’m at it what in gods name was the point in sacking lee Johnson then!!!???? What have we been doing for the past month? Baffling ?

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2 minutes ago, milo1111 said:

Then why did lansdown talk a few weeks back about an appointment to take us to the next level. Why also did we waste 3 weeks chasing Gerrard. Whilst I’m at it what in gods name was the point in sacking lee Johnson then!!!???? What have we been doing for the past month? Baffling ?

Did we chase Gerrard for three weeks?  I wouldn’t be so sure about that...

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33 minutes ago, bcfc01 said:

Tbf, I wouldn't say the club has never been in a better place. Yes, we have a decent stadium, we have a new training ground (building looks huge, passed by yesterday) and good owners unlike a lot of others. In that respect, all good.

But we're in the middle of a global pandemic with the season interrupted and prolonged, no spectators allowed, and losing millions which will undoubtedly have a big negative effect on how the club operates moving forward. That must have a bearing on who comes in as the new manager - both the club and the new bloke need to be realistic and take the above into account. Not to say that they shouldn't go for the best they can get, just that the best may be out of reach at this time. Just my opinion, others more qualified to talk about the financial impact may disagree.

Having said that, I hope Hughton is appointed (but its looking doubtful imo).

 

Hi and thanks for the reply, I completely take your points re: the pandemic and the unknown that it brings with it into the near future, however, financial security, for a football club run the right way, surely comes from the lifeblood of the club which is the supporters and footfall through the ground and in turn the associated products/merchandise etc?

If this forum and social media is an indicator (appreciate that’s a small % of our fan base) in any way of the feeling regarding the rumoured appointment of Holden, then when (and it will be when) we can return to watching football as we know it, it does not look like an enthused, passionate and motivated group of Reds will make that extra effort to prioritise the trip to Ashton Gate.

My point being, this was a great time to appoint someone who captured an imagination and we were poised to make that next step. This is what we were told, and not just some pie in the sky wishful thinking.

I struggle to find any sense in the appointment of Holden other than familiarity with the current regime and a willingness to work within it, especially based on, and again, at risk of repeating myself, what we were told the club was looking for and the criteria set out those long four and a half weeks ago.

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It must be a very strange holiday for the Holden household. He knows that when he returns he will either be appointed head coach (controversially!) or could very likely be sacked. How do you switch off and enjoy yourself?!

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