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Dean Holden (Merged)


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If we appoint Holden I will...   

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4 minutes ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

So if we paid Holden twice as much, would that make him acceptable to you?

No. I don’t want Dean Holden in charge of the football club full stop. Too much of a gamble if the aim is the top 6. A lovely guy as im sure he is IMO he should have gone with Lee.

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46 minutes ago, mozo said:

Which brings us to a good question: what metric should the board use to judge whether Holden has the ability to be as good a gaffer as Hughton has already proved himself to be?

If we disregard playing career, managerial experience and track record, what helps us know he's the one?

Is it just a punt? Intuition? His powers of persuasion? His popularity?

More likely Hughton has been told the conditions of employment (eg you report to Mark Ashton, can only bring one coach with you etc) and won't accept them whereas DH will as it's what he's used to, in order to get the job you have to accept the T&C's, it's not just about coaching ability

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14 minutes ago, bris red said:

No. I don’t want Dean Holden in charge of the football club full stop. Too much of a gamble if the aim is the top 6. A lovely guy as im sure he is IMO he should have gone with Lee.

Maybe (and I appreciate this is not what everyone wants to hear) the aim next season is not top 6. It's going to be a very difficult year financially for us and a lot of other clubs and I can't see many incomings other than to replace any we let go.

So maybe the aim is to just get through the season relatively unscathed, give the younger players a good go (Morrell, Vyner, Moore, Walsh, O'Leary) and re-assess next season.

Maybe the board think Holden is the best person to do that as he knows the younger players and probably trusts them a lot more than an incoming manager might. They know him too.

Just a thought.

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While we still have no idea if it will be Holden I hate the feeling I get when I think about his appointment.

I absolutely don't want him managing our club. I see nothing in what he did in the last few games that makes me think he will be anything better than what went before. 

In terms of fans attitudes to the manager, of course if Holden is given the job everyone of us would back him and want him to succeed but, with the level of negativity around his appointment, things could turn very sour, very quickly. 

Holden isn't going to get anywhere near the same breathing space or length of time to produce results that LJ was given. Because he's associated closely with what has come before him he can't be considered as needing time to settle into the club. 

The whole appointment sends out the wrong message especially when there are managers of obvious quality at Championship level available and in some cases obviously interested in the job.

We can only hope Gregor and the post got it wrong (and that wouldn't be the first time) otherwise it's going to be "The Toxic Years part 2 - the ghost of LJ" 

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2 minutes ago, CHAZ MICHAELS said:

Maybe (and I appreciate this is not what everyone wants to hear) the aim next season is not top 6. It's going to be a very difficult year financially for us and a lot of other clubs and I can't see many incomings other than to replace any we let go.

So maybe the aim is to just get through the season relatively unscathed, give the younger players a good go (Morrell, Vyner, Moore, Walsh, O'Leary) and re-assess next season.

Maybe the board think Holden is the best person to do that as he knows the younger players and probably trusts them a lot more than an incoming manager might. They know him too.

Just a thought.

Made this point to my mate and he rightly argued “in that case why not just keep LJ?”. Surely cheaper overall, knows the squad better than anyone, and should’ve been capable of keeping us safe at least.

Can see MA trying to go down this route in his justifications though, hope Gregor interrogates him on it.

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9 minutes ago, CHAZ MICHAELS said:

Maybe (and I appreciate this is not what everyone wants to hear) the aim next season is not top 6. It's going to be a very difficult year financially for us and a lot of other clubs and I can't see many incomings other than to replace any we let go.

So maybe the aim is to just get through the season relatively unscathed, give the younger players a good go (Morrell, Vyner, Moore, Walsh, O'Leary) and re-assess next season.

Maybe the board think Holden is the best person to do that as he knows the younger players and probably trusts them a lot more than an incoming manager might. They know him too.

Just a thought.

Maybe - as you say...

...but that would beg the question why we've been through this interminable process. It's certainly a justification for appointing someone who was available and on the staff and could have been announced weeks ago and I wouldn't be at all surprised if that was the justification...but it's not very convincing!

 

EDIT: @Matty Taylors a Red, you beat me to it!

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54 minutes ago, GTFABM said:

Ok sol campbell? Tony adams? John Barnes? I could go on, the level you played at should hardly even come into the conversation when appointing a manager

No it shouldn't you can't just go by that alone, Playing at the higher helps him he seems to have that natural character to be good manager not just a coach, With Barnes,Adams,Campbell they come across as good coaches nothing more.. Its more than just being on the training ground day in day out,For me Holden is just a coach not a manager he hasn't got that advantage like Parker has had and then it comes down to the natural character which Holden doesnt seem to have. The City job needs something a little more than just being coach which I think it's part of the issue.

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1 hour ago, ChubStixx said:

The fact that we haven't heard anything about Korey Smith gives me hope that a new man is incoming, who'll then have that decision to make.

Don’t want to break the news but Hughton was the manager (at Norwich) who let Korey go (to Oldham).  He only selected him once as an unused sub in the Prem. ☹️☹️☹️

1 hour ago, Street red said:

Parker has played at a higher level than Holden ever has and probably gets a lot more respect but look at the tools at his disposal.

Holdens never played above league 1 level? 

Apart from the games he played in the Champ. Albeit not many ?

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13 minutes ago, CHAZ MICHAELS said:

Maybe (and I appreciate this is not what everyone wants to hear) the aim next season is not top 6. It's going to be a very difficult year financially for us and a lot of other clubs and I can't see many incomings other than to replace any we let go.

So maybe the aim is to just get through the season relatively unscathed, give the younger players a good go (Morrell, Vyner, Moore, Walsh, O'Leary) and re-assess next season.

Maybe the board think Holden is the best person to do that as he knows the younger players and probably trusts them a lot more than an incoming manager might. They know him too.

Just a thought.

I can understand the logic of this and it may be correct. If so, it’s crazy as it means appointing a coach to keep things just ticking over for a year or two. If, as I unfortunately believe, this means we go nowhere, Holden will get the sack and we start this crazy saga all over again. The logical solution is to appoint a coach with a long term plan in mind. Sadly I’m not sure anything logical has anything to do with the way City operate

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20 minutes ago, CHAZ MICHAELS said:

Maybe (and I appreciate this is not what everyone wants to hear) the aim next season is not top 6. It's going to be a very difficult year financially for us and a lot of other clubs and I can't see many incomings other than to replace any we let go.

So maybe the aim is to just get through the season relatively unscathed, give the younger players a good go (Morrell, Vyner, Moore, Walsh, O'Leary) and re-assess next season.

Maybe the board think Holden is the best person to do that as he knows the younger players and probably trusts them a lot more than an incoming manager might. They know him too.

Just a thought.

It's a good theory (and all we have right now is theories). 

If that were the case, the board would be advised to carefully manage expectations. 

Instead of trotting out the usual "Dean's objective is to take us to the Premier League and we believe he will" rhetoric, I'd prefer they go for a more measured tone and convey that decision making has been impacted by austerity measures.

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15 minutes ago, Ron Swanson said:

Putting my positivity hat on but I feel if Holden was on the verge of being appointed it would of been announced today, or there would be more noise on media outlets saying an appointment is imminent. 

He's on holiday thou..

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44 minutes ago, Yoyo2345 said:

If Holden gets this job the revolt from the fans will be huge. SL surely isn't that thick.... 

I think you’ll be surprised.  Yes, a few people will throw their toys out of their prams, but most supporters will just keep on coming (assuming we can).  Remember Pulis?  I can’t think of an appointment more liable to cause a revolt, but nothing happened, aside from many people hating him.  I think if Holden is appointed, many supporters will be disappointed, but they’ll listen to what he has to say and give him a chance.

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Just now, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

I think you’ll be surprised.  Yes, a few people will throw their toys out of their prams, but most supporters will just keep on coming (assuming we can).  Remember Pulis?  I can’t think of an appointment more liable to cause a revolt, but nothing happened, aside from many people hating him.  I think if Holden is appointed, many supporters will be disappointed, but they’ll listen to what he has to say and give him a chance.

I actually think that on this occasions thousands will rebel and be very unhappy. Some will give him a chance. A huge majority won’t 

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46 minutes ago, Yoyo2345 said:

If Holden gets this job the revolt from the fans will be huge. SL surely isn't that thick.... 

They can always go and find another club to support if they aren't happy with the decisions made by man whose spent tens of millions on the club i

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2 minutes ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

I think you’ll be surprised.  Yes, a few people will throw their toys out of their prams, but most supporters will just keep on coming (assuming we can).  Remember Pulis?  I can’t think of an appointment more liable to cause a revolt, but nothing happened, aside from many people hating him.  I think if Holden is appointed, many supporters will be disappointed, but they’ll listen to what he has to say and give him a chance.

I think apathy would be the reaction of most. Maybe the club don’t care, given we can’t come anyway.

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1 minute ago, ORANGE500 said:

They can always go and find another club to support if they aren't happy with the decisions made by man whose spent tens of millions on the club i

I'm not sure that's how support for football clubs works!

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1 minute ago, ORANGE500 said:

They can always go and find another club to support if they aren't happy with the decisions made by man whose spent tens of millions on the club i

So because a billionaire who decided to buy a football club with his huge wealth. We all have to accept his decisions and not have an opinion about it . 

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25 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Don’t want to break the news but Hughton was the manager (at Norwich) who let Korey go (to Oldham).  He only selected him once as an unused sub in the Prem. ☹️☹️☹️

Apart from the games he played in the Champ. Albeit not many ?

I'm hoping for Hughton ? It was that many I didn't even know he did did ?

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12 minutes ago, ORANGE500 said:

They can always go and find another club to support if they aren't happy with the decisions made by man whose spent tens of millions on the club i

Not a great start to your OTIB postings even robored wouldn't come out with a remark like that.

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