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Dean Holden (Merged)


Bcfcbackwell

If we appoint Holden I will...   

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2 minutes ago, bcfcnick said:

Based on him getting the best out of at least five players and especially Paterson who played sublimely at times for Holden.  Also his points tally based on five games would be 73 - enough to get us in the play-offs.

Your reasoning why he wouldn't?  Aside from being a glass half-full misery of course.

I hope he does

So yours is based on (your views) of a tiny handful of games as a stand in 

 

Out of interest which 5 players btw

 

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The aim has to be top 6. Obviously. We can’t go from a target of ‘play-offs’ to anything worse? We are supposed to be getting a top coach in who is head and shoulders above the other candidates, right? So why would we lessen the target. However, when Holden guides us to a 16th place finish, 4 or 5 points above the drop zone, the wordsmith, spin-doctor extraordinaire will congratulate Holden in his ‘first’ season as a manager of a ‘big’ championship club, and what was a season of ‘transition’ due to COVID. 
 

Same old guff from the hierarchy.
 

Lather, rinse, ******* repeat! 

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52 minutes ago, downendcity said:

Who applied?

Who was shortlisted?

Who was interviewed?

When were they interviewed?

Where any of them called Johnson?

Does Stephen Gerrard really say eerrmm at the start of every sentence?

What questions were they asked?

Who asked for the biggest salary - and what was it?

Who asked for the biggest transfer and wages budget?

Who was not prepared to work with our strategy?

Who was not prepared to work with Mark Ashton?

Who was not prepared to work with SL?

Why didn’t we appoint Chris Hughton the day after sacking LJ?

Why didn't we appoint Predictive-spell Houghton?

Why didn't we appoint Cook the day after he resigned from Wigan?

What is due diligence and who cares about that sort of crap anyway?

What’s a budget and does it really matter?

:)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You forgot ‘ are we there yet? ‘ COYR

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1 hour ago, Numero Uno said:

You make a good point but also prove the point that the inaction of the club in failing to communicate with supporters has directly led to the current shit storm.

People can blindly defend Steve Lansdown, Jon Lansdown and Mark Ashton if they want but their management of this process has been rank amateur.

I disagree with this NU - in terms of communication, all the club ‘owes’ us is to tell us that LJ has been sacked - and then they need to tell us when they have appointed a successor - they should not feel pressured to talk publicly about any of the stuff in between those two milestones - they won’t give in to people with too much spare time who demand 24/7 updates - and nor should they 

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21 minutes ago, TheJudge07 said:

I think this is a poor appointment, in fact it is a horrendous appointment. What has Holden done to deserve the role? Nothing - no record so to speak of as a player, coach or manager. It is like giving the reigns of your brand new Audi R8 to your 16 old child who has just passed there driving test. I feel sorry for Holden. He is now under pressure through no fault of his own and this is a big job. It is vital that he gets a good start to the season or the knives will be out for him. All we can do is voice our discontent and then support the man. But for me, there were plenty of candidates with experience to take us forward and that is what is needed. What I am most puzzled by is Steve Lansdown - he goes on radio and says they want someone to take the club to the next step to the PL. There is nothing at all which says Holden can do this. In fact, he was part of the structure that failed. Sadly, those running the club are making poor decisions again.    

The bit in bold of your post is what gets to me. I don’t understand it, SL stated he wanted somebody to come in with fresh ideas and give the club a boost. The coaching staff were here 4 years and ultimately failed.
 

After what’s been a torrid year, an appointment like this just about tops it off. The whole place really needed a boost and this is anything but that!

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13 minutes ago, Matty Taylors a Red said:

Random thought - but I wonder how this appointment will be viewed by BLM/Kick It Out with all the recent discussion around lack of BAME managers?
 

I don’t mean to suggest that race came into this at all and I’m certainly not looking to stir up trouble, but with everything that’s gone on lately I wouldn’t be surprised to see the club under the spotlight. 
 

Would be embarrassing to see sky sports news debating why else Hughton was overlooked for Holden. We all know it’s typical City, but outsiders may conclude otherwise. 

No. No they wouldn't.

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2 minutes ago, Sheltons Army said:

I hope he does

So yours is based on (your views) of a tiny handful of games as a stand in 

 

Out of interest which 5 players btw

 

Paterson, Desilva, Vyner, Benkovic and Weiman - others played with a bit more freedom and positivity when perhaps they were a bit stifled under LJ with over instructions.  Hate to see players afraid of having the ball (as Jack Hunt for example seemed to be at times under LJ ) and I didn't see that under DH.  

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Weirdly the empty Ashton Gate for the start of the season will help Holden establish his style and buy him some breathing space but after that you feel he will be the most scrutinised BCFC manager appointment in modern time (apart from Pulis?). He must improve the brand of football first and foremost and then deliver a playoff spot which for novice coach is a huge ask. Anything less then surely it will turn ugly and Holden will be gone and so will the project and those who are embedded within. Massive 12 months for the club and those who run it.

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Unless LJ has been cheating a living for the past 4 years and it was in fact DH who was pulling the strings and was the brains behind the operation, how is appointing him now going to be the answer and the step SL suggested we needed to get over the line

 

Surely this is a measurable step backwards in terms of experience etc

 

I can't get my head around it. Nice guy he may be but he also comes across as abit dull and not someone who will fire up the team when the chips are down

 

It needs a new voice and face to give the whole club a lift and help fine tune the players and get us to the Premiership

 

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2 hours ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

I suggest you stop confusing social media with the real world.

Here twitter face book the friends circles people putting up sheets,

The vast majority dont want this that is a fact

We've been lied to yet again

They don't care aboit us fans only our money which I choose to withdraw

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2 minutes ago, bcfcnick said:

Paterson, Desilva, Vyner, Benkovic and Weiman - others played with a bit more freedom and positivity when perhaps they were a bit stifled under LJ with over instructions.  Hate to see players afraid of having the ball (as Jack Hunt for example seemed to be at times under LJ ) and I didn't see that under DH.  

They definitely did improve but it’s also important to remember that by this point, the pressure had been all but completely removed. We had nothing to play for. It’s a different game altogether when there’s pressure and expectation. But there were some positive signs for sure.

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7 minutes ago, bcfcnick said:

Paterson, Desilva, Vyner, Benkovic and Weiman - others played with a bit more freedom and positivity when perhaps they were a bit stifled under LJ with over instructions.  Hate to see players afraid of having the ball (as Jack Hunt for example seemed to be at times under LJ ) and I didn't see that under DH.  

What we wont get with DH if the rumour is true. at least is a lack of bluff and bull that we were dished up by his predecessor

Ive spoken to him a few times and hes a decent guy and far less ego, or any at all, a positive after the recently departed 

 

But with due respect me or you could have stepped in after Johnson for a few games and given them some freedom with nothing to lose

 

 

Bear in mind that 'the players want him' is often the wrong message in football

 

 

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1 hour ago, Riaz said:

Why do people keep blaming Ashton?

a decision like this would he down to SL

when you get a mangirsenior managers job it isnt the owner who interviews you or appoints you its the next person up the rung which in city's case is our beloved ceo,

This is mark ashtons decision in my opinion,

A decision taken so he doesnt have to give up the player recruitment side that he loves

We wont here from that ******* coward until city go on a good run

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2 minutes ago, Kibs said:

They definitely did improve but it’s also important to remember that by this point, the pressure had been all but completely removed. We had nothing to play for. It’s a different game altogether when there’s pressure and expectation. But there were some positive signs for sure.

Plus Benkovic won't be here and I doubt he'll play Andi and Pato in midfield once there's pressure to get results. 

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1 hour ago, RedM said:

I’ve read hardly anything in this thread, but saw your post and that pretty much sums it up for me. (Are we really taking Holden has the job as the truth, I still cannot quite believe it myself?).

For me it feels like a crossroads and we are heading down the wrong path. Very much like when Moysie lost by the deciding vote and we went for a different Manager. 

Moyes v Pulis? 

Thought was Taylor v Pulis. Unless you're referring to a different year.

A Devils Advocate approach may also have shown Pulis to already have a promotion under his belt at that time (Gillingham to the third tier) and one or two late goals from taking Gillingham to the Championship in playoff v Man City- would've been a historical achievement for them.

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3 minutes ago, Monkeh said:

when you get a mangirsenior managers job it isnt the owner who interviews you or appoints you its the next person up the rung which in city's case is our beloved ceo,

This is mark ashtons decision in my opinion,

A decision taken so he doesnt have to give up the player recruitment side that he loves

We wont here from that ******* coward until city go on a good run

If you actually think its Ashtons (Whatever your view of him) decision as opposed tp SL or Junior youre crackers 

Do you believe after a worldwide search LJ was Ashtons genuine belief and reccomendation ?

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30 minutes ago, bcfc01 said:

So why have a CEO paid hundreds of thousands a year ?

He pays him to make the right decisions for the club.

Mores the pity.

I am not here to defend Ashton but surely Lansdown has the final say. After all it is his club as he told us a couple of years ago.

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1 hour ago, Red-Robbo said:

 I guess his was the Imperial thumb that got turned upwards, but as head of recruiting Ashton would have been heavily involved in the process.

The other thing is it seems likely that Hughton was the preferred choice but couldn't agree to all the stipulations the club wanted him to stick to. One of these stipulations might well be that Mark Ashton remained in charge of buying and selling. 

 

 

 

 

 

Nail on head.

"Spend what you like Chris,buy who you like, run the club how you want.

Just run it past Mark and he'll flag it up to me.

I'll let you know what you can do.And how much you'll have to do it.

But besides that - it's all yours to do what you want, with as much funding as you need"

 

Small wonder Hughton walked way.

Which left DH who wasn't expecting to get it, but as CH basically wouldn't accept the conditions of appointment, here he is.

Not nailed on Holden will take the job either. 

He has a wife and 4 kids - plus they sadly lost a child. I'm not sure the family will be keen on DH taking the job with all the backlash that will follow.

Sometimes family comes first - who would want their kids to cop abuse for the sake of a job.

I'm fairly sure he didn't think he had a scooby's chance - hence the long chat with the family over this weekend.

The Holden family have had some rough times through no fault of their own, so I could see why they would want to have a long and considered think about things.

It's his family who will cop it too if it goes tits up.

 

I think he could still decline. But that would be it for him at BCFC.

Which might not be a bad thing - maybe another assistant job before applying for the big chair at a smaller (fanbase size anyway) club.

 

Holden doesn't deserve the crap he's getting. Sure he's a poor choice, but he genuinely didn't think he had a chance.He applied to experience the "process" initially, then things snowballed from there as Lansdowns ludicrous terms of appointment saw candidate after candidate withdraw.

The blame lies with SL and no-one else.

 

 

 

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1 minute ago, Kibs said:

They definitely did improve but it’s also important to remember that by this point, the pressure had been all but completely removed. We had nothing to play for. It’s a different game altogether when there’s pressure and expectation. But there were some positive signs for sure.

Fair point but I think it was a more fundamental than that.  DH set up to accommodate the available players in a consistent formation that suited the players strengths.  There was an intent to pose problems for the opposition rather than worry and contain them.  Granted that might have been because we needed wins to clinch an unlikely play-off place but it was refreshing to see it especially after the dire home form under LJ . Under LJ the players, presumably based on instructions, just seemed scared to play anything resembling a possession based game despite the Club recruiting players who were suited to that style.

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1 minute ago, SX227 said:

Nail on head.

"Spend what you like Chris,buy who you like, run the club how you want.

Just run it past Mark and he'll flag it up to me.

I'll let you know what you can do.And how much you'll have to do it.

But besides that - it's all yours to do what you want, with as much funding as you need"

 

Small wonder Hughton walked way.

Which left DH who wasn't expecting to get it, but as CH basically wouldn't accept the conditions of appointment, here he is.

Not nailed on Holden will take the job either. 

He has a wife and 4 kids - plus they sadly lost a child. I'm not sure the family will be keen on DH taking the job with all the backlash that will follow.

Sometimes family comes first - who would want their kids to cop abuse for the sake of a job.

I'm fairly sure he didn't think he had a scooby's chance - hence the long chat with the family over this weekend.

The Holden family have had some rough times through no fault of their own, so I could see why they would want to have a long and considered think about things.

It's his family who will cop it too if it goes tits up.

 

I think he could still decline. But that would be it for him at BCFC.

Which might not be a bad thing - maybe another assistant job before applying for the big chair at a smaller (fanbase size anyway) club.

 

Holden doesn't deserve the crap he's getting. Sure he's a poor choice, but he genuinely didn't think he had a chance.He applied to experience the "process" initially, then things snowballed from there as Lansdowns ludicrous terms of appointment saw candidate after candidate withdraw.

The blame lies with SL and no-one else.

 

 

 

With a very heavy heart - 47 Years and i'm done SORRY !!

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45 minutes ago, Sheltons Army said:

Difficult to say

But 'be assured' it will only be after a thorough and worldwide, rigorous process , trawling every pond

 

 

 

 

Welcome Cole Skuse

Don't joke - has had a chat about midfield coaching role. ITFG have offered 1 yr playing + 1 yr coach. He's settled in East Anglia but has been asked the question about coming back in a junior capacity.

 

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2 minutes ago, SX227 said:

Nail on head.

"Spend what you like Chris,buy who you like, run the club how you want.

Just run it past Mark and he'll flag it up to me.

I'll let you know what you can do.And how much you'll have to do it.

But besides that - it's all yours to do what you want, with as much funding as you need"

 

Small wonder Hughton walked way.

Which left DH who wasn't expecting to get it, but as CH basically wouldn't accept the conditions of appointment, here he is.

Not nailed on Holden will take the job either. 

He has a wife and 4 kids - plus they sadly lost a child. I'm not sure the family will be keen on DH taking the job with all the backlash that will follow.

Sometimes family comes first - who would want their kids to cop abuse for the sake of a job.

I'm fairly sure he didn't think he had a scooby's chance - hence the long chat with the family over this weekend.

The Holden family have had some rough times through no fault of their own, so I could see why they would want to have a long and considered think about things.

It's his family who will cop it too if it goes tits up.

 

I think he could still decline. But that would be it for him at BCFC.

Which might not be a bad thing - maybe another assistant job before applying for the big chair at a smaller (fanbase size anyway) club.

 

Holden doesn't deserve the crap he's getting. Sure he's a poor choice, but he genuinely didn't think he had a chance.He applied to experience the "process" initially, then things snowballed from there as Lansdowns ludicrous terms of appointment saw candidate after candidate withdraw.

The blame lies with SL and no-one else.

 

 

 

Within the grounds of FFP of course. Sheffield Wednesday got - 12 points and at least two embargoes since March 2018, we don't want that kind of thing!

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