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Mark Ashton - Opinions


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42 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I really don’t think this is financial at all.  I think it is Gregor (who’s been pretty much spot on through this) trying to add some sense to it....but it doesn’t fit.

It appears that Hughton is City’s number one choice (Gerrard was as a vanity appointment initially), but they’ve been at an impasse for various reasons, e.g. control of transfers, Hughton still holding out for Fulham etcetc.  Holden is the back up plan, because it’s either get the number one or not.

They need to thrash out differences with Hughton quickly.

why is DH the back up plan? There were eight interviewees the other week? Surely there are better candidates if what MA/GmG said was true? (MA said loads of applications and GmG reported eight)

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2 minutes ago, exAtyeoMax said:

why is DH the back up plan? There were eight interviewees the other week? Surely there are better candidates if what MA/GmG said was true? (MA said loads of applications and GmG reported eight)

I know, that’s the bit I don’t quite get....unless all the others have ruled themselves out.

Its been a weird process.

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1 minute ago, Major Isewater said:

If we run out of time to properly prepare for the new season then DH knows the club, the players etc .

Motor running .

surely he could be caretaker until the main man comes in?

Seems really incompetent on behalf of the club to end up in this situation when there were so many applicants (allegedly)

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3 hours ago, headhunter said:

Ashton has form when it comes to upsetting the fans - this was from Watford forum in 2009:

Chris the Vic 23rd October 2009 9:47 am Well if I never get anything else right, this was the exception. I attacked him openly a year plus before he went over the inept way he ran the club, bad negotiation of contracts, inept spin and generally poor decision making and boy did many of our present contributors give me stick and with two exceptions never had the good grace to apologise. If this article is confirmed it is awesome. This man more than any other damaged our club so badly we will be picking up the pieces for several years to come.

Whole article in Watford Observer makes for interesting reading. In short he sued them for breach of contract and then withdrew his claim even paying part of their costs. Make of that what you will! I wonder what due diligence SL did when appointing him as CEO:

https://www.watfordobserver.co.uk/sport/4698518.former-ceo-mark-ashton-withdraws-300000-claim-against-watford-and-will-pay-part-of-the-clubs-costs/

Thanks, interesting read. We need the same set up as Bristol Rugby. Mark Tainton (CEO) & Pat Lam (DoR in effect Head Coach with full control). Jon Lansdown should review roles & responsibilities and make the necessary improvements.

Ashton seems ok negotiating contracts, dealing with agents etc. but he shouldn't be recruiting players. Perhaps it's time to review Ashton's position. I think it's untenable if Holden is appointed.

Perhaps the focus for Bristol Sport is rugby, signing some of the best players in the world (appreciate this requires less funding than football) and a world class coach who's role & responsibilities wasn't up for negotiation when he signed. If they qualify for the European Champions Cup they'll easily attract 25k plus crowds when the likes of Munster, Leinster & French sides visit the Gate.

 

 

 

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5 hours ago, Major Isewater said:

Possible but hardly coherent. If you are a racing team with the fastest car you’re going to want the best driver in it , aren’t you ? 
 

Do you think the club have handled the situation well ? 
 

 

I honestly don’t know if they’ve handled it well, there’s been next to nothing released officially by the club, probable there’s been leaks to the press and definitely a lot of speculation. I enjoy reading people’s views, guesses and insider knowledge during transfers but until the player is on the roof it’s just that, similarly with this manager appointment.
using the F1 analogy, Lando Norris hasn’t been doing badly this season but would Lewis Hamilton do better in the same car? (I don’t know,  probably)

Would Houghton get more out of our squad than Dean Ashton? Maybe? That’s the thing the owner and his board are evaluating - they don’t know for certain, they can only give it their best guess.

the thing I’m fairly sure about, the owner isn’t trying to do this on the cheap (just look at our stadium, new training ground, etc.) and he has backed the managers when he trusts them. He’s an expert in investment, I believe whoever he appoints will be the person he trusts and believes in the most

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1 hour ago, exAtyeoMax said:

by whom? The report by GmG? 

Even so, why would DH be the back up plan? 

Here's a possible scenario as it plays out in my head - bear in mind this is all speculation. I used to work as a headhunter for some senior executive roles and I know that one of the most time-consuming parts is negotiating the contract, which can take weeks. So I could see a situation that happened like the following.

MA holds the interview process and there are essentially 2 candidates they like at the end of the process:

  • Chris Hughton who is the stand-out candidate, but has a lot of demands - possibly around salary, performance bonuses, transfer budget, control of transfers, promotion of youth etc.
  • Dean Holden who they hold in high regard and doesn't have any major demands that would be deal-breaking.

Contract negotiations begin with the board's preferred candidate (Hughton) but after a couple of weeks of back and forward they hit an impasse with both parties still some way apart on their positions. Hughton is waiting by the phone to find out if a mutually agreed deal can be done. Meanwhile they've kept Holden on hold as their backup candidate and leak to Gregor that they are strongly considering Holden. This is an attempt to get Hughton's agent to realise that the club have a 2nd option that they'll appoint if they reluctantly cannot agree terms with Hughton as they are getting frustrated at the to-and-fro in negotations. These protracted negotiations are why the process has taken so long.

As Gregor posts his tweet OTIB and Twitter go up in flames, helping the club to realise that the appointment of Holden will not be received well by the fanbase. Negotiations with Hughton are ongoing and both sides are trying to find something that they can agree to. Worried that the negative reaction will turn the fans against the board and possibly is going to put Hughton off, they then tell Gregor this morning that nothing is done and dusted and it is still an open field. Gregor then tweets some more this morning that nothing is done, it's still in process etc. 

My guess would be that the club would like Hughton too in an ideal world, but there needs to be movement both from Bristol City on certain contractual/structural points and Hughton. If there is no agreement then the backup option, Holden is now the candidate they'll go for. 

Edited by haggis_farewell
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25 minutes ago, haggis_farewell said:

Here's a possible scenario as it plays out in my head - bear in mind this is all speculation. I used to work as a headhunter for some senior executive roles and I know that one of the most time-consuming parts is negotiating the contract, which can take weeks. So I could see a situation that happened like the following.

MA holds the interview process and there are essentially 2 candidates they like at the end of the process:

  • Chris Hughton who is the stand-out candidate, but has a lot of demands - possibly around salary, performance bonuses, transfer budget, control of transfers, promotion of youth etc.
  • Dean Holden who they hold in high regard and doesn't have any major demands that would be deal-breaking.

Contract negotiations begin with the board's preferred candidate (Hughton) but after a couple of weeks of back and forward they hit an impasse with both parties still some way apart on their positions. Hughton is waiting by the phone to find out if a mutually agreed deal can be done. Meanwhile they've kept Holden on hold as their backup candidate and leak to Gregor that they are strongly considering Holden. This is an attempt to get Hughton's agent to realise that the club have a 2nd option that they'll appoint if they reluctantly cannot agree terms with Hughton as they are getting frustrated at the to-and-fro in negotations. These protracted negotiations are why the process has taken so long.

As Gregor posts his tweet OTIB and Twitter go up in flames, helping the club to realise that the appointment of Holden will not be received well by the fanbase. Negotiations with Hughton are ongoing and both sides are trying to find something that they can agree to. Worried that the negative reaction will turn the fans against the board and possibly is going to put Hughton off, they then tell Gregor this morning that nothing is done and dusted and it is still an open field. Gregor then tweets some more this morning that nothing is done, it's still in process etc. 

My guess would be that the club would like Hughton too in an ideal world, but there needs to be movement both from Bristol City on certain contractual/structural points and Hughton. If there is no agreement then the backup option, Holden is now the candidate they'll go for. 

Thank you for the info and clarification. For me, it still begs the question why the club would think DH be capable of being head coach/manager? Being a top bloke, familiar with the club and respected by the players doesn't seem to be good enough criteria to take on the running of a Championship club. It does actually sound like they only have one candidate…DH is already employed and obviously doesn't want to lose his job. I like DH, and it makes me wonder if he would be being fed to the lions by taking on this role? :dunno:

 

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Conspiracy Theory #17863:

Ashton got rid of Ayling

Why?

Having read the Watford article posted earlier (I’d read it some time ago too), it hasn’t dawned on me until now that Ashton sacked Ray Lewington as Watford boss.  So what you may ask?  Lewington is Ayling’s uncle is what.  Did Ayling have Ashton’s cards marked from day 1 and possibly vice versa.

Also saw this:

https://www.watfordobserver.co.uk/sport/4698518.former-ceo-mark-ashton-withdraws-300000-claim-against-watford-and-will-pay-part-of-the-clubs-costs/

 

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9 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Conspiracy Theory #17863:

Ashton got rid of Ayling

Why?

Having read the Watford article posted earlier (I’d read it some time ago too), it hasn’t dawned on me until now that Ashton sacked Ray Lewington as Watford boss.  So what you may ask?  Lewington is Ayling’s uncle is what.  Did Ayling have Ashton’s cards marked from day 1 and possibly vice versa.

Also saw this:

https://www.watfordobserver.co.uk/sport/4698518.former-ceo-mark-ashton-withdraws-300000-claim-against-watford-and-will-pay-part-of-the-clubs-costs/

 

I found the comment section of both articles very interesting…:noexp:

Edited by exAtyeoMax
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22 hours ago, windmillhillred said:

 We do know that the club offered to make Gerrard the highest paid manager in the championship. I also highly doubt anyone interviewed said “I won’t be bothering developing younger players.” 

Gerrard said he nor his reps had any contact with City.

It was reported by GMG that City contacted Rangers to reiterate that no contact had been made.

 

 

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7 hours ago, irishreds said:

Thanks, interesting read. We need the same set up as Bristol Rugby. Mark Tainton (CEO) & Pat Lam (DoR in effect Head Coach with full control). Jon Lansdown should review roles & responsibilities and make the necessary improvements.

Ashton seems ok negotiating contracts, dealing with agents etc. but he shouldn't be recruiting players. Perhaps it's time to review Ashton's position. I think it's untenable if Holden is appointed.

Perhaps the focus for Bristol Sport is rugby, signing some of the best players in the world (appreciate this requires less funding than football) and a world class coach who's role & responsibilities wasn't up for negotiation when he signed. If they qualify for the European Champions Cup they'll easily attract 25k plus crowds when the likes of Munster, Leinster & French sides visit the Gate.

 

 

 

Is it possible that this is one element of why this is taking so long - looking at tweaking the structure ?

Its been said many times on this forum that to get someone like Hughton in they will have to compromise and change the structure to accommodate him. 

I agree that MA has too much on his plate - he's a very competent CEO, but that has nothing to do with recruitment where you cannot compete just with data and analysis against a seasoned professional with an eye for a player.

They either keep it as it is and employ Holden or tweak it to employ Hughton or the like.

We'll find out soon.

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25 minutes ago, bcfc01 said:

Is it possible that this is one element of why this is taking so long - looking at tweaking the structure ?

Its been said many times on this forum that to get someone like Hughton in they will have to compromise and change the structure to accommodate him. 

I agree that MA has too much on his plate - he's a very competent CEO, but that has nothing to do with recruitment where you cannot compete just with data and analysis against a seasoned professional with an eye for a player.

They either keep it as it is and employ Holden or tweak it to employ Hughton or the like.

We'll find out soon.

Whoever takes over they may well be expected to play the up and coming stars and that may lead to a period of more erratic results.  Maybe the big ticket managers think that this would cost them a promotion bonus whereas DH knows the lads and knows what is expected from the specifications of the project that he has worked on for the last four years. 

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I think the club are worried that without full capacity this season the majority of fans will be seeking a season ticket refund leaving the club in financial problems hence going for the cheap option for manager. Personally I would get rid of Mark Ashton who i feel has too much of a say in the day to day running of the club and must be one of the top earners at the club. I think its now time for JL to step up and take on the CEO role this would free some of the cash to get in a decent more established manager.  

 

 

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I agree I think Ashton needs to go and we need a big push to get him out.  The lack of communication is a disgrace but also he as CEO is responsible for the interview/ appointment of a new manager and what a mess that is.

Also as Bristol Post has said everything is last minute.  Why have we not released the new kit yet?  Season ticket refunds we were the last club.

Ashton is the trouble and needs to be gone...

 

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59 minutes ago, Nigelmalta said:

I agree I think Ashton needs to go and we need a big push to get him out.  The lack of communication is a disgrace but also he as CEO is responsible for the interview/ appointment of a new manager and what a mess that is.

Also as Bristol Post has said everything is last minute.  Why have we not released the new kit yet?  Season ticket refunds we were the last club.

Ashton is the trouble and needs to be gone...

 

We got rid of one bullshitter, 5 weeks ago, when it should have been two.

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1 hour ago, westonred said:

I think the club are worried that without full capacity this season the majority of fans will be seeking a season ticket refund leaving the club in financial problems hence going for the cheap option for manager. Personally I would get rid of Mark Ashton who i feel has too much of a say in the day to day running of the club and must be one of the top earners at the club. I think its now time for JL to step up and take on the CEO role this would free some of the cash to get in a decent more established manager.  

 

 

Why do you think JL is in any way suitable to be the CEO, other than the obvious fact that his dad owns the club?

Edited by Calculus
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I think we can all agree that Dean Holden is pretty much the worst conclusion we could have reached after five long weeks, but the retweeting of positive Holden articles by both Wells and Pato are the final nail in the Johnson successor saga. 

But it’s important that we don’t blame Holden. None of us on here would turn down the chance of a bumper pay rise and the chance to manage our club - and deep down we know we’re not the best choice. 

This debacle is Mark Ashton’s fault and he should pay with his job. 

What a ******* disgrace, but at the same time, good luck Holden  

(secretly hoping this is all a charade to allow Paul Cook to see out a no working period)

 

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3 minutes ago, Fordy62 said:

I think we can all agree that Dean Holden is pretty much the worst conclusion we could have reached after five long weeks, but the retweeting of positive Holden articles by both Wells and Pato are the final nail in the Johnson successor saga. 

But it’s important that we don’t blame Holden. None of us on here would turn down the chance of a bumper pay rise and the chance to manage our club - and deep down we know we’re not the best choice. 

This debacle is Mark Ashton’s fault and he should pay with his job. 

What a ******* disgrace, but at the same time, good luck Holden  

(secretly hoping this is all a charade to allow Paul Cook to see out a no working period)

 

Why Ashton ? The board make the final decision - this is made by the Lansdown family. Ashton May have a say in the appointment but will not make the final decision 

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I’m cancelling my season ticket as soon as this appointment happens, clubs saw all the toxicity, as well  as how upset and angry all the fans are and still go with Holden just sums up how far out of sync they are with the fans 

Players stay comfy and we can expect mediocrity for another couple of seasons until he gets sacked

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3 minutes ago, daored said:

Why Ashton ? The board make the final decision - this is made by the Lansdown family. Ashton May have a say in the appointment but will not make the final decision 

And them. **** all of them. 

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I like Dean Holden and best of luck to him . But when LJ left him and JM should of followed. IMO he should be nowhere near being our head coach. And unfortunately he will not get a fair opportunity. A couple of defeats and people will turn on him due to the anger and disappointment fans feel towards the board . What an absolute shambles this has been. And my trust for the board has completely gone . 
 

Good luck Dean Holden if you get the job because you certainly are going to need it

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