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Somethings not right at BCFC.


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14 minutes ago, Pedrino75 said:

Connor joined us at 16 in 2012 - Ashton didn’t arrive until 2016, although granted he was here when contracts were signed and extended. We have Joe Morrell a contemporary of Connor from youth teams as a full Welsh international coming back to us this summer - they were similarly rated at youth level & signed extensions together. We also have Liam Walsh returning - the best player in league one last season - not all mediocre! It takes time to develop into a first team player & not all make it. The number of people on here insisting we should sack off Bobby Reid for years was ridiculous. I’m no massive Ashton fan but I do support the policy of signing promising youth players - Taylor Moore will be phenomenal next year! Not all will come good but we have shown over the past few years that many will and some will make us a tidy profit if and when they move on. 

It's one big gamble though isn't it

Over 40 players signed, I guess with little financial impact individually. But all signed in the hope that they are the one player that we can sell on at some point for a massive profit and sell on clauses

The players you mention have all played lower level and are yet to make any impact on our first team, lets wait and see how good they are for Bristol City before assuming they are the answer to our problems

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10 hours ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

I actually fear we might sleepwalk into a relegation battle if we appoint Holden- I'm quite cautious often but not usually negative but I just have a bad feeling.

I hope this isn't history repeating, or at least replicating in some respects- 10 years on.

GJ leaves, us in and around midtable but on the slide- suddenly after a relative local derby, late goal loss 3-2- Plymouth.

LJ leaves us, in and around midtable but on the slide- sudenly after a relative local derby, late goal loss 1-0- Cardiff.

Millen comes in and does quite nicely as caretaker.

Holden comes in and does okay as caretaker.

The big name is chased- and appointed- Coppell...but something not quite right, didn't he begin the summer late?

The big name is chased- next level- but not yet/at all appointed??

Coppell walks early doors.

Big Name doesn't come at all.

Millen appointed early doors as a replacement- a stability factor.

Covid and financial pondering sees Holden appointed early doors, or in this case eventually- the continuity candidate.

We are significantly better placed off the pitch and I believe our squad has a reasonable to decent age profile- certainly better in a number of respects- and this if anything would make the appointment of Holden even more disheartening!

With the greatest of respect to Holden, this just has echoes of the past I fear.

The past doesn't always repeat itself. And there are differences - a major one being that, for better or worse, we now have a squad that is assembled by the club rather than the manager which means there won't be major changes in recruitment strategy or a load of players shipped out to be replaced by new players for no reason other than that the new manager doesn't rate them. 

Based on what we saw from Holden at the end of the season, I think we'll do... okay. We'll win some games, we'll lose some games. We'll occasionally play well and sometimes grind out results. I think Holden is slow to make subs but maybe that will change as he settles into the role.

But I think we could do better than okay with other candidates. That's where my disappointment is coming from. I don't think Holden will be a disaster but I think it is a missed opportunity. 

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19 minutes ago, Onthefence said:

I have to say this whole episode is turning into a shambles, its beyond embarrassing.

Well, actually all we know is that the club have been seeking to appoint a manager since Lee Johnson was relieved of his duties, and they have remained completely silent while that process is going on.  That situation may seem unusual to football fans, but it is normal practice in business.

The only thing that has turned this into a shambles, if it is one, is the constant speculation by press and fans.  What does the last four weeks of postings count for?  Absolutely nothing.  No one knows who the club is trying to appoint, and everything is presently guesswork.  Local press are too embarrassed to admit that they don't know anything, so they speculate that it might be Tom, Dick or Harry.  I suspect they know no more than we do, i.e. zilch.  There are many posters on here who are going to look rather ridiculous if the appointment is not what they were expecting, and they no longer need to hurl themselves off the top floor of a multi-storey car park.  The shambles and the embarrassment is presently limited to this forum.

For what it's worth, I know one of the players and either he is lying or he knows absolutely nothing.  If the players know nothing, then I suspect the press know nothing, and certainly the fans know nothing.  The player I know does, however, expects something to happen before he comes back on Monday.

All we have to look back on at the moment is a month of something bordering on mass hysteria.

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2 minutes ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

Well, actually all we know is that the club have been seeking to appoint a manager since Lee Johnson was relieved of his duties, and they have remained completely silent while that process is going on.  That situation may seem unusual to football fans, but it is normal practice in business.

The only thing that has turned this into a shambles, if it is one, is the constant speculation by press and fans.  What does the last four weeks of postings count for?  Absolutely nothing.  No one knows who the club is trying to appoint, and everything is presently guesswork.  Local press are too embarrassed to admit that they don't know anything, so they speculate that it might be Tom, Dick or Harry.  I suspect they know no more than we do, i.e. zilch.  There are many posters on here who are going to look rather ridiculous if the appointment is not what they were expecting, and they no longer need to hurl themselves off the top floor of a multi-storey car park.  The shambles and the embarrassment is presently limited to this forum.

For what it's worth, I know one of the players and either he is lying or he knows absolutely nothing.  If the players know nothing, then I suspect the press know nothing, and certainly the fans know nothing.  The player I know does, however, expects something to happen before he comes back on Monday.

All we have to look back on at the moment is a month of something bordering on mass hysteria.

Very well put. 

Agree 100%.

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2 minutes ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

Well, actually all we know is that the club have been seeking to appoint a manager since Lee Johnson was relieved of his duties, and they have remained completely silent while that process is going on.  That situation may seem unusual to football fans, but it is normal practice in business.

The only thing that has turned this into a shambles, if it is one, is the constant speculation by press and fans.  What does the last four weeks of postings count for?  Absolutely nothing.  No one knows who the club is trying to appoint, and everything is presently guesswork.  Local press are too embarrassed to admit that they don't know anything, so they speculate that it might be Tom, Dick or Harry.  I suspect they know no more than we do, i.e. zilch.  There are many posters on here who are going to look rather ridiculous if the appointment is not what they were expecting, and they no longer need to hurl themselves off the top floor of a multi-storey car park.  The shambles and the embarrassment is presently limited to this forum.

For what it's worth, I know one of the players and either he is lying or he knows absolutely nothing.  If the players know nothing, then I suspect the press know nothing, and certainly the fans know nothing.  The player I know does, however, expects something to happen before he comes back on Monday.

All we have to look back on at the moment is a month of something bordering on mass hysteria.

 

All I'd say to that, is "sources" for this sort of thing are very rarely players.  They will not usually be privy to decisions made by boards of directors.

But those more involved in the business side, and also friends and former directors, often will have a steer. 

GmcG may be proved wrong. He has hedged his bets anyway by saying likely to happen not definitely happening. But he won't have based that story on guesswork. He'll have spoken to people. Potentially someone involved in the decision-making process.

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11 minutes ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

Well, actually all we know is that the club have been seeking to appoint a manager since Lee Johnson was relieved of his duties, and they have remained completely silent while that process is going on.  That situation may seem unusual to football fans, but it is normal practice in business.

The only thing that has turned this into a shambles, if it is one, is the constant speculation by press and fans.  What does the last four weeks of postings count for?  Absolutely nothing.  No one knows who the club is trying to appoint, and everything is presently guesswork.  Local press are too embarrassed to admit that they don't know anything, so they speculate that it might be Tom, Dick or Harry.  I suspect they know no more than we do, i.e. zilch.  There are many posters on here who are going to look rather ridiculous if the appointment is not what they were expecting, and they no longer need to hurl themselves off the top floor of a multi-storey car park.  The shambles and the embarrassment is presently limited to this forum.

For what it's worth, I know one of the players and either he is lying or he knows absolutely nothing.  If the players know nothing, then I suspect the press know nothing, and certainly the fans know nothing.  The player I know does, however, expects something to happen before he comes back on Monday.

All we have to look back on at the moment is a month of something bordering on mass hysteria.

Don't disagree with a lot of that and hundreds of pages on Houghton, Gerrard, Holden, Cook and the rest is all a bit pointless.

However, I've never known a football managerial appointment take anything like 5 weeks. Clearly, in my view, considering Ashton's comment immediately after Johnson's sacking that it would give the new manager plenty of time before the new season starts, there is a major **** up going on behind the scenes.

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13 minutes ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

Well, actually all we know is that the club have been seeking to appoint a manager since Lee Johnson was relieved of his duties, and they have remained completely silent while that process is going on.  That situation may seem unusual to football fans, but it is normal practice in business.

The only thing that has turned this into a shambles, if it is one, is the constant speculation by press and fans.  What does the last four weeks of postings count for?  Absolutely nothing.  No one knows who the club is trying to appoint, and everything is presently guesswork.  Local press are too embarrassed to admit that they don't know anything, so they speculate that it might be Tom, Dick or Harry.  I suspect they know no more than we do, i.e. zilch.  There are many posters on here who are going to look rather ridiculous if the appointment is not what they were expecting, and they no longer need to hurl themselves off the top floor of a multi-storey car park.  The shambles and the embarrassment is presently limited to this forum.

For what it's worth, I know one of the players and either he is lying or he knows absolutely nothing.  If the players know nothing, then I suspect the press know nothing, and certainly the fans know nothing.  The player I know does, however, expects something to happen before he comes back on Monday.

All we have to look back on at the moment is a month of something bordering on mass hysteria.

Summed up perfectly. The press (esp. Bristol Post) have a lot to answer for. Plus, as fans maybe we should not be quite so gullible as to be taken in by every article preceded by those famous words "we understand that..." otherwise translated as, we haven't actually got a clue, but this will sell more papers or get us extra clicks! 

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In most cases, clubs have spoken informally to potential candidates before a manager is sacked.  They usually know who the replacement will be.  It therefore seems quite odd that they have waited so long to tell us with pre season training about to start.  This would suggest that the future is Holden.  How long he will last if we don't find ourselves in the top 6 after 10 games anyone's guess.

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1 minute ago, wendyredredrobin said:

In most cases, clubs have spoken informally to potential candidates before a manager is sacked.  They usually know who the replacement will be.  It therefore seems quite odd that they have waited so long to tell us with pre season training about to start.  This would suggest that the future is Holden.  How long he will last if we don't find ourselves in the top 6 after 10 games anyone's guess.

Yes, it may seem odd, BUT THERE MAY BE A VERY GOOD REASON FOR IT.   And if there is, then we don't know what that is, and we can't expect the club to tell us while recruitment is going on.  There is at least as much to suggest that it ISN'T Holden, as there is to suggest that it IS.  For instance, if it was Holden, why a delay in announcing it?  

So it comes back to the fact that we don't know anything and any little snippet of news, such as it is, can be interpreted in pretty much any way that you want.

If I had to put money down now, I'd put it on Cook, but then I don't know any more than anyone else, so my guess is as good as yours.  Maybe its Holden, maybe it's Hughton or Cook or Gerrard or maybe its someone completely different.  We won't know for certain until the club ANNOUNCES it.  Until then, why don't we all think of something more interesting to talk about?

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1 minute ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

Yes, it may seem odd, BUT THERE MAY BE A VERY GOOD REASON FOR IT.   And if there is, then we don't know what that is, and we can't expect the club to tell us while recruitment is going on.  There is at least as much to suggest that it ISN'T Holden, as there is to suggest that it IS.  For instance, if it was Holden, why a delay in announcing it?  

So it comes back to the fact that we don't know anything and any little snippet of news, such as it is, can be interpreted in pretty much any way that you want.

If I had to put money down now, I'd put it on Cook, but then I don't know any more than anyone else, so my guess is as good as yours.  Maybe its Holden, maybe it's Hughton or Cook or Gerrard or maybe its someone completely different.  We won't know for certain until the club ANNOUNCES it.  Until then, why don't we all think of something more interesting to talk about?

Like who the assistant manager might be?

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1 minute ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

Until then, why don't we all think of something more interesting to talk about?

...which is the killer question!

However, much as  it may all prove to be speculation there really isn't anything a great deal more interesting to talk about on a football forum than who the new manager might be...especially after 5 weeks in the close season.

You are of course right that much that is posted here is the modern equivalent of todays newspaper being tomorrow's chip wrapping - but over the years enough has come out to give us at least some understanding of the workings of the club, workings that would otherwise have been completely hidden...and were hidden in past eras.

 

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49 minutes ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

Well, actually all we know is that the club have been seeking to appoint a manager since Lee Johnson was relieved of his duties, and they have remained completely silent while that process is going on.  That situation may seem unusual to football fans, but it is normal practice in business.

The only thing that has turned this into a shambles, if it is one, is the constant speculation by press and fans.  What does the last four weeks of postings count for?  Absolutely nothing.  No one knows who the club is trying to appoint, and everything is presently guesswork.  Local press are too embarrassed to admit that they don't know anything, so they speculate that it might be Tom, Dick or Harry.  I suspect they know no more than we do, i.e. zilch.  There are many posters on here who are going to look rather ridiculous if the appointment is not what they were expecting, and they no longer need to hurl themselves off the top floor of a multi-storey car park.  The shambles and the embarrassment is presently limited to this forum.

For what it's worth, I know one of the players and either he is lying or he knows absolutely nothing.  If the players know nothing, then I suspect the press know nothing, and certainly the fans know nothing.  The player I know does, however, expects something to happen before he comes back on Monday.

All we have to look back on at the moment is a month of something bordering on mass hysteria.

OMG at last we have an intelligent post. Thanks DP.

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The Post has a lot to answer for - but you've only got to look at their sole agenda....clicks.....from that point of view, all this fan hysteria is brilliant for them and I expect their website traffic and click count will have gone through the roof. Ultimately everything and anything they've reported from the start has been entirely speculative. In fact they've said nothing exclusive.

The reason for the delay?

I suspect we've been turned down by one, maybe two targets. 

Other targets may well have specific reasons for delay, for example Cook with contractual issues, Hughton wanting to check all the other options out. 

These reasons would be out of our control - so unless you set deadlines, you have to let it play out.

If, for whatever reason, after weeks of interviews and negotiations, we've ended up settling for Holden, then we're simply waiting for him to get home from his holiday.

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4 hours ago, Abraham Romanovich said:

Away from OTIB's partisanship seen this comment from a Brighton fan ;-

"As regards Bristol City - they leaked that he was to get the job before negotiations were complete and, apparently, negotiations hit a snag a week ago. To suggest that the owners are Bristol City are favouring Dean Holden over Hughton is daft - Holden is their back-up plan if they can't persuade Hughton to take the job (and there clearly is some reason why he hasn't accepted the job so far - whatever movement is needed has to come from the club). Indeed - to me, the talk of Holden suggests a lack of ambition on Bristol city's part."

Fingers crossed that the board see sense and an agreement can be reached .

 

Funny, that’s what I heard late last night....albeit from someone who could have credibility but was miles out at the start of the recruitment process, so I’ve no idea how true.

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This really doesn't feel like my club

The way this has been managed is shambolic. 

To fire a manager and have no plan B is one thing. But to fire a manager and then take more than a month to decide a fella who's worked for the club for years is now the best fit is breathtaking.

Should MA already know what DH is capable of? Shouldn't this have been a quick appointment if he's genuinely the best fit?

It appears from the outside we've been clueless in out management of recruitment

The same can be said for Jamie's sackimg.

Unless I've missed something, I've no clue why we've sacked one of the "old gang" ??

The engagement with fans since the pandemic has been poor. Weren't we the last club to offer refunds? Then give 24hrs notice?

Ive never felt more like a customer in my life.

It's no longer my club. It's Steve's club that we pay to watch. Our opinion means nothing. Zero.

On a personal note, I can't blame DH. It's not his fault. He's done the best thing for him. He's taking time and thinking it through

They say you can change your wife, job, house but never your football team... Im starting to believe the unthinkable.... I don't think I care if that's how we are going to be ran. I feel totally disengaged

At some point, the fans have the right to question the competantcy of our board.

 

 

 

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1 minute ago, BcfcDuncs said:

Brilliant post?, hard to disagree with any of that. Im feeling really let down by my club, always been a proud city fan but tonight and coming days im afraid no proud city fan here. 

It's a dreadful feeling isn't it

I've had season tickets in all five stands. ( Williams ) prior to landsdown

Followed us up and down the country and loved it. We felt like a "club" now it's a shop to spend money and sod off.

It's unreal how we've acted for the last five weeks 

How can it take so long to appoint a bloke who's worked here for years and actually took the team for five matches! Unreal, amateurs

I've very little faith in the decisions taken by our board 

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6 minutes ago, Matthew me said:

It's a dreadful feeling isn't it

I've had season tickets in all five stands. ( Williams ) prior to landsdown

Followed us up and down the country and loved it. We felt like a "club" now it's a shop to spend money and sod off.

It's unreal how we've acted for the last five weeks 

How can it take so long to appoint a bloke who's worked here for years and actually took the team for five matches! Unreal, amateurs

I've very little faith in the decisions taken by our board 

I class myself as a happy clapper  aswell,so jarred off with this whole episode and i know the top dogs at the top will put a positive spin on this, there is always a chance Dean Holden will do well, but the poor fella had been dealt a handicap already with no one wanting him as manager..... Poor from every angle Bristol City 

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52 minutes ago, Matthew me said:

This really doesn't feel like my club

The way this has been managed is shambolic. 

To fire a manager and have no plan B is one thing. But to fire a manager and then take more than a month to decide a fella who's worked for the club for years is now the best fit is breathtaking.

Should MA already know what DH is capable of? Shouldn't this have been a quick appointment if he's genuinely the best fit?

It appears from the outside we've been clueless in out management of recruitment

The same can be said for Jamie's sackimg.

Unless I've missed something, I've no clue why we've sacked one of the "old gang" ??

The engagement with fans since the pandemic has been poor. Weren't we the last club to offer refunds? Then give 24hrs notice?

Ive never felt more like a customer in my life.

It's no longer my club. It's Steve's club that we pay to watch. Our opinion means nothing. Zero.

On a personal note, I can't blame DH. It's not his fault. He's done the best thing for him. He's taking time and thinking it through

They say you can change your wife, job, house but never your football team... Im starting to believe the unthinkable.... I don't think I care if that's how we are going to be ran. I feel totally disengaged

At some point, the fans have the right to question the competantcy of our board.

 

 

 

Don't say 'fans', it's 'supporters'

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It is interesting how the alternative perspectives and posts on this whole saga have been swamped on OTIB by the angry, frustrated and hugely unfair posts aimed against individuals and the club. It is also very sad because I still strongly believe, well guided or misguided, those who actually run the club want it to succeed. I am as frustrated as anyone on here but I have on a couple of occasions tried to look at an alternative perspective...i have to to keep the last strands of sanity I have left!! Similarly there have been a couple of new topics offering a more balanced view which have very quickly disappeared through requests for merging etc. It is important that whilst on the same topic alternative perspectives are given a space of their own otherwise, being human, some supporters will find it difficult to have the courage to speak out for fear of a verbal backlash. This happens not all the time but frequently. It can also be difficult to spot an alternative view in 160 pages under any one header.

The sad thing about this is how it also reflects the general public debate in politics and our society in these pretty harrowing times - less so about Covid but more in general public debate.

Back to the topic in question. Having supported City for more decades than most I shall be so disappointed if this appointment seems at best unambitious. I've craved success only to be fed disappointment with tiny morsels to keep me going. I still feel for various reasons that the decision on who to appoint is going to be better than who most on here expect and will be as hurt as any if it does not give me real hope - yet again. Will I still go down to the Gate. If my friends stop going will I? 

The way the club have seemingly behaved has been crazy I think but also they have been quite right to protect themselves and the candidates until a final outcome is delivered. They could have done it better though, much better. 

Yes, it's hugely important to me but please whilst we know nothing, whilst reporters, the betting, those in the know have all wallowed back and forth let's ensure that alternative views and perspectives are given a clear space and not just submerged into the negative rhetoric of the majority.  

If it does turn out that the appointment is a more generally accepted one those most angry will suddenly become the most supportive. We can be so fickle!! 

Please let's encourage more balance in the debate to be seen by all. 

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