Jump to content

Welcome to One Team in Bristol - Bristol City Forums

Welcome to One Team in Bristol - Bristol City Forums, like most online communities you must register to view or post in our community, but don't worry this is a simple free process that requires minimal information for you to signup. Be a part of One Team in Bristol - Bristol City Forums by signing in or creating an account.

  • Start new topics and reply to others
  • Full access to all forums (not all viewable as guest)
  • Subscribe to topics and forums to get email updates
  • Get your own profile page and make new friends
  • Send personal messages to other members.
  • Support OTIB with a premium membership

IGNORED

Cheltenham Town Friendly


Recommended Posts

12 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said:

 I may be wrong but I'm guessing Bakinson was involved partly to assess him within a match situation to decide IF he is going to be part of the squad or loaned out. It may well come down to whether he did enough to prove he can be part of the squad.

However that does potentially mean that we have the following players competing for 3 midfield berths:

Williams

Nagy

Walsh

Massengo

Paterson

Palmer

Eliasson

Bakinson

Morton (although guessing loaned)

Weimann (although could be treated as a forward)

O'Dowda (although could be treated as a wing-back)

Rowe (although almost certainly will be treated as a wing-back)

 

 

Even taking out those who could be used in other positions, that is still eight or nine for three places. It is a lot of depth but some players would surely be frustrated at their playing time. Guessing some will leave on loan or permanent. 

 

9 minutes ago, RedRoss said:

And Szmodics and Morrell

Sums up a few things in recent times. All those midfielders and we were weak in midfield!

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said:

 I may be wrong but I'm guessing Bakinson was involved partly to assess him within a match situation to decide IF he is going to be part of the squad or loaned out. It may well come down to whether he did enough to prove he can be part of the squad.

However that does potentially mean that we have the following players competing for 3 midfield berths:

Williams

Nagy

Walsh

Massengo

Paterson

Palmer

Eliasson

Bakinson

Morton (although guessing loaned)

Weimann (although could be treated as a forward)

O'Dowda (although could be treated as a wing-back)

Rowe (although almost certainly will be treated as a wing-back)

 

 

Even taking out those who could be used in other positions, that is still eight or nine for three places. It is a lot of depth but some players would surely be frustrated at their playing time. Guessing some will leave on loan or permanent. 

Yep too many for sure. Some will never play if we keep all them.

And you forgot Szmodics and Morrell. Absolutely loads of options!

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Davefevs said:

Beat me to it.

 

15D92F61-8019-44B3-8F57-6EF05C9F80C0.jpeg

Way too many but all bring different qualities. Prior to today I thought Elliason was certainly gone and may still do but interesting more central.

Hard decisions to be had..

I would keep at CM:

Morrell, Walsh, Williams, Nagy (I'm still 50/50 with him)

Loan out:

Massengo  (still think he's got a lot to learn but maybe keep instead of Nagy) and loan Bakinson and Morton.

Sell: O'Dowda if possible (PLEASE!)

Rowe for back up to Dasilva,

Keep Weimann up top.

Keep Vyner at the back.

The real difficulty is the AM's because they are all very talented but lack different qualities.. Elliason is a very good player and may excel in a new role/new coach/new system and those set pieces, Palmer has great technical ability but seems unfit and hasn't been able to sustain a proper run in the team, Szmodics has proven his quality in the below leagues but hasn't been given a proper chance. Pato I would of let go before his Derby loan but came back much better but still not completely decided on. I really struggle to pick between the above so Dean has some very tough choices to make. 

 

  • Like 1
  • Haha 1
  • Confused 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Beat me to it.

 

15D92F61-8019-44B3-8F57-6EF05C9F80C0.jpeg

Would love to know where everyone played today. Might suggest what Holden is planning.

Wells as a lone striker would suggest we may need quite a number of midfielders.

But even then we'd have too many if we don't loan some out or sell some.

Eliasson might even come into the attacking midfielder category under Holden. 

Gregor not really giving much away. Probably because he wants everyone to read what he puts in Bristol post. 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

Would love to know where everyone played today. Might suggest what Holden is planning.

Wells as a lone striker would suggest we may need quite a number of midfielders.

But even then we'd have too many if we don't loan some out or sell some.

Eliasson might even come into the attacking midfielder category under Holden. 

Gregor not really giving much away. Probably because he wants everyone to read what he puts in Bristol post. 

 

We could play a variation of the 3 5 2 but 3 5 1 1  instead. 

Rotate Wells, Weimann and Diedhiou if he's staying.

  • Confused 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

Would love to know where everyone played today. Might suggest what Holden is planning.

Wells as a lone striker would suggest we may need quite a number of midfielders.

But even then we'd have too many if we don't loan some out or sell some.

Eliasson might even come into the attacking midfielder category under Holden. 

Gregor not really giving much away. Probably because he wants everyone to read what he puts in Bristol post. 

 

From what I can make out, Weimann played up top with Wells. Eliasson was on the left of a midfield 3, Massengo on the right and Bakinson holding. Basically Eliasson was playing the role Pato played in the run in.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

I will take a guess that the reasons for those that played varied from, Bakinson and Massengo being the players that the assistant coaches know least about and wanting to see them in a game situation, to looking at Eliasson to see if he can play a free(ish) role. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, RedRoss said:

We could play a variation of the 3 5 2 but 3 5 1 1  instead. 

Rotate Wells, Weimann and Diedhiou if he's staying.

Yep many options. I was thinking more a Mark Robins type 3421. But however he does it, if it's one up top then we probably don't need another striker with Fam competing with Wells. Obviously giving us something completely different to Wells.

6 minutes ago, Gillies Downs Leeds said:

From what I can make out, Weimann played up top with Wells. Eliasson was on the left of a midfield 3, Massengo on the right and Bakinson holding. Basically Eliasson was playing the role Pato played in the run in.

Wow Eliasson in that role I was never expecting. 

  • Flames 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
26 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said:

Not realised Morrell was same age as Williams and Palmer and older than Walsh. It's probably because of the age when he made his debut but I still have him in my head as the young 'un amongst our midfield options!

Yeah I do the same thing. Really makes you realise when some teams like Brentford and Swansea had an average starting 11 age of only 24 or so!

I was going to say they're young in terms of experience rather than years, but Vyner and Morrell have getting on for 100 professional appearances each now as well.

Lots of them need to start doing something soon or be moved on I think- Williams has 100 appearances in the Championship at the same age. Our "youngsters" aren't brand new 18/19yr olds like Massengo any more.

 

  • Thanks 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
23 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

Would love to know where everyone played today. Might suggest what Holden is planning.

Wells as a lone striker would suggest we may need quite a number of midfielders.

But even then we'd have too many if we don't loan some out or sell some.

Eliasson might even come into the attacking midfielder category under Holden. 

Gregor not really giving much away. Probably because he wants everyone to read what he puts in Bristol post. 

 

5036DD3E-35C7-4FD8-BA31-EDD893FAC820.thumb.jpeg.df1d87ff649963f28413af4ff14f9dec.jpeg

18 minutes ago, Gillies Downs Leeds said:

From what I can make out, Weimann played up top with Wells. Eliasson was on the left of a midfield 3, Massengo on the right and Bakinson holding. Basically Eliasson was playing the role Pato played in the run in.

In the shot above, Eliasson and Massengo the other way around, but I’m sure there was fluidity.

So:

                             Bentley

 ⬇️Hunt / Vyner / Kalas / Baker / Dasilva⬇️

          Eliasson / Bakinson / Massengo

                      Weimann / Wells

Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, IAmNick said:

Yeah I do the same thing. Really makes you realise when some teams like Brentford and Swansea had an average starting 11 age of only 24 or so!

I was going to say they're young in terms of experience rather than years, but Vyner and Morrell have getting on for 100 professional appearances each now as well.

Lots of them need to start doing something soon or be moved on I think- Williams has 100 appearances in the Championship at the same age. Our "youngsters" aren't brand new 18/19yr olds like Massengo any more.

 

Here’s a snapshot of some data for of an article I’m writing re loans.

image.thumb.png.64e161a81f35d963de26e56422ac2405.png

 

  • Thanks 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, IAmNick said:

Yeah I do the same thing. Really makes you realise when some teams like Brentford and Swansea had an average starting 11 age of only 24 or so!

I was going to say they're young in terms of experience rather than years, but Vyner and Morrell have getting on for 100 professional appearances each now as well.

Lots of them need to start doing something soon or be moved on I think- Williams has 100 appearances in the Championship at the same age. Our "youngsters" aren't brand new 18/19yr olds like Massengo any more.

 

Yeah - obviously a massive question is whether they have been held back by lack of quality of lack of opportunity. But I definitely think we have a lot of players we need to either use or lose. I don't see any point in any of Moore, Vyner, Walsh, Morrell, Palmer or Szmodics having any more time loaned away from the club or playing under-23 football. 

They need to be given a chance to play regularly here or given a chance to prove they can do it elsewhere. 

  • Like 6
Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

5036DD3E-35C7-4FD8-BA31-EDD893FAC820.thumb.jpeg.df1d87ff649963f28413af4ff14f9dec.jpeg

In the shot above, Eliasson and Massengo the other way around, but I’m sure there was fluidity.

So:

                             Bentley

 ⬇️Hunt / Vyner / Kalas / Baker / Dasilva⬇️

          Eliasson / Bakinson / Massengo

                      Weimann / Wells

I love it. Holden ripping up the coaching manual.

Link to post
Share on other sites
23 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said:

Yeah - obviously a massive question is whether they have been held back by lack of quality of lack of opportunity. But I definitely think we have a lot of players we need to either use or lose. I don't see any point in any of Moore, Vyner, Walsh, Morrell, Palmer or Szmodics having any more time loaned away from the club or playing under-23 football. 

They need to be given a chance to play regularly here or given a chance to prove they can do it elsewhere. 

Lack of opportunity - yeah I think so!

I suppose you could ask why we last summer bought Massengo, Smodics, and Palmer if we have Walsh, Bakinson and Morrell kicking about already having been here for a few years and want to play in similar positions. Massengo and Smodics aren't 1 year players until our kids are ready, they're longer term investments - but we already had some of them. If the ones we had weren't good enough, why haven't we moved them on after looking at them for 3+ years?

Morrell could well be wondering why we spent £1m and 9k/wk on Walsh a couple of years ago who now seems to be slightly ahead of him. Maybe Bakinson and Walsh are thinking the same about Palmer and Smozdics. This year we've bought Williams. I know they're not necessarily exactly the same type of player, but you can only have so many young midfielders (or players in general) looking for a place. Are our players getting to the point they could almost break into the team, and then we just parachute someone in above them and they disappear off to L1 on a loan before being forgotten?

And of all the players mentioned in my post, I think it's only Morrell who actually came through our academy... the rest were bought in (albeit some at a youngish age).

Maybe I'm just overly negative but I'd love to see more young players from our academy in the team as I think we all would - it gets talked about a lot but I'm still a bit skeptical about the results. Lots of people know far more than me about it though!

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, IAmNick said:

Lack of opportunity - yeah I think so!

I suppose you could ask why we last summer bought Massengo, Smodics, and Palmer if we have Walsh, Bakinson and Morrell kicking about already having been here for a few years and want to play in similar positions. Massengo and Smodics aren't 1 year players until our kids are ready, they're longer term investments - but we already had some of them. If the ones we had weren't good enough, why haven't we moved them on after looking at them for 3+ years?

Morrell could well be wondering why we spent £1m and 9k/wk on Walsh a couple of years ago who now seems to be slightly ahead of him. Maybe Bakinson and Walsh are thinking the same about Palmer and Smozdics. This year we've bought Williams. I know they're not necessarily exactly the same type of player, but you can only have so many young midfielders (or players in general) looking for a place. Are our players getting to the point they could almost break into the team, and then we just parachute someone in above them and they disappear off to L1 on a loan before being forgotten?

And of all the players mentioned in my post, I think it's only Morrell who actually came through our academy... the rest were bought in (albeit some at a youngish age).

Maybe I'm just overly negative but I'd love to see more young players from our academy in the team as I think we all would - it gets talked about a lot but I'm still a bit skeptical about the results. Lots of people know far more than me about it though!

Really good post.

Morrell is the only one of these that we produced (we paid a huge fee to take both Bakinson & Hinds from Luton’s academy).

This stockpiling of players makes no sense, we do need to be far more ruthless, rather than as was the case with Lemonheigh-Evans this month, releasing him to non league when he is nearly 24.

There are still several on our books with minimal (or no) League experience at 22,23.

  • Like 4
Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, GrahamC said:

There are still several on our books with minimal (or no) League experience at 22,23

Bare in mind we still need to fill a u23's team, if our promising u23's are all out on loan some need to remain to play at that level/be 19th man travellers for 1st team.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I think Wells will do so much better under Holden. Seems so much happier.

Regarding the CM problems being discussed in this thread, I wouldn't be surprised if we hold onto all of them. If Holden is talking about fixture congestion (a match every 3 days on average I think?) and talking about a high level of fitness, and he also spoke about emphasising the role of "the squad" to the players recently.

I think we will keep all the CMs and just rotate them in and out. If we honestly believe a lot of them are at a similar ability level, then why not?

I also think Weimann might stay as a striker now, seeing as we have plenty of CMs, and we have no Afobe.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Interesting starting line up. I presumed Elliasson was off so shocked to see him start. 

Also thought Bakinson would go out on loan again although may just be a case of having a good look at him before that happens.

Looked like we pressed well which was impressive. Although Cheltenham didn't look great. 

Makes sense to me to cash in for Fam as don't see him fitting Holden's high energy high pressing game. 

Really interesting to see who he goes with in centre midfield. We have a lot of high energy players there who would seem to fit Holden's style perfectly.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, IAmNick said:

Lack of opportunity - yeah I think so!

I suppose you could ask why we last summer bought Massengo, Smodics, and Palmer if we have Walsh, Bakinson and Morrell kicking about already having been here for a few years and want to play in similar positions. Massengo and Smodics aren't 1 year players until our kids are ready, they're longer term investments - but we already had some of them. If the ones we had weren't good enough, why haven't we moved them on after looking at them for 3+ years?

Morrell could well be wondering why we spent £1m and 9k/wk on Walsh a couple of years ago who now seems to be slightly ahead of him. Maybe Bakinson and Walsh are thinking the same about Palmer and Smozdics. This year we've bought Williams. I know they're not necessarily exactly the same type of player, but you can only have so many young midfielders (or players in general) looking for a place. Are our players getting to the point they could almost break into the team, and then we just parachute someone in above them and they disappear off to L1 on a loan before being forgotten?

And of all the players mentioned in my post, I think it's only Morrell who actually came through our academy... the rest were bought in (albeit some at a youngish age).

Maybe I'm just overly negative but I'd love to see more young players from our academy in the team as I think we all would - it gets talked about a lot but I'm still a bit skeptical about the results. Lots of people know far more than me about it though!

The other thing worth mentioning here is that we have to have at least one "Home grown player" in the squad. Last year we fudged it by including Woolacott or Semenyo to make up the numbers but it would be so much better to have players in there on merit.

In fairness, I think it was always going to take a few years to take root and there was always going to be a six or seven year wait between improving our academy and seeing the results in the first team. Even Morrell arguably pre-dates those changes and is a rare potential success from before the academy was upgraded and improved. But we are now at a point where the results need to start to show - the 17 - 20 year olds coming in now should include players who are starting to be ready to step up to the first team. Some will take a little longer than others but it is reasonable to start to expect to see homegrown players featuring in our team in a meaningful way rather than a token spot on the bench 

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, LondonBristolian said:

 I may be wrong but I'm guessing Bakinson was involved partly to assess him within a match situation to decide IF he is going to be part of the squad or loaned out. It may well come down to whether he did enough to prove he can be part of the squad.

However that does potentially mean that we have the following players competing for 3 midfield berths:

Williams

Nagy

Walsh

Massengo

Paterson

Palmer

Eliasson

Bakinson

Morton (although guessing loaned)

Weimann (although could be treated as a forward)

O'Dowda (although could be treated as a wing-back)

Rowe (although almost certainly will be treated as a wing-back)

 

 

Even taking out those who could be used in other positions, that is still eight or nine for three places. It is a lot of depth but some players would surely be frustrated at their playing time. Guessing some will leave on loan or permanent. 

I've heard Walsh is off to Coventry for a million, although not sure how reliable that is. 

Looks like one of the midfield players will be an attacking midfielder and we have a lot of players fighting for one position there. Pato, Elliasson, Palmer and Szomodics. 

Reckon Szomodics may be seen more a striker though and be competition for Weimann. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, MATT BCFC said:

I've heard Walsh is off to Coventry for a million, although not sure how reliable that is. 

I'd be sceptical. Didn't we pay a million for him? The best player in league one ought to be worth considerably more than that even bearing in mind his contract situation and Covid-19. 

  • Like 6
Link to post
Share on other sites
24 minutes ago, MATT BCFC said:

I've heard Walsh is off to Coventry for a million, although not sure how reliable that is. 

Looks like one of the midfield players will be an attacking midfielder and we have a lot of players fighting for one position there. Pato, Elliasson, Palmer and Szomodics. 

Reckon Szomodics may be seen more a striker though and be competition for Weimann. 

I would be amazed if that's true after we just signed his mate.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...