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Pato v KP

redpole

By redpole
in Football Chat

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Major Isewater

Major Isewater

Posted
Posted
15 hours ago, JonDolman said:

The interest for him from top championship clubs shows he is a talented guy. Fulham bid for him who have so much talent in their squad, Forest and Leeds rumoured to be after him too.

I actually think he presses very well. He has some engine and doesn't stop running. He has more upper body strength than Weimann imo. 

A number of times we have seen O'Dowda being the one who holds it by the corner flag when we are trying to see out a win. He uses his body to shield the ball and fights to keep it in the corner to waste time. I really don't see this weak player who lacks desire that some others do.

Many of our players didn't play to their best last season. The team and system kept changing. I think a good head coach with a clear plan can get him playing to his best, like the others. Hoping Holden is that man.

If we do sell him then I really would not be surprised if he goes on and does very well for whatever championship club he joins.

COD just needs to effect games more often. I agree with the posters who say that he’s not kicked on like Brownhill.

What adds to the frustration is the fact that LJ seemed to do everything he could to shoehorn the lad into his team at the cost of other player’s opportunities and , despite holding out for a possible move away , was then awarded a ridiculously long , and no doubt lucrative contract by the club. 
 

COD needs to deliver . 

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Robbored

Robbored

Posted
Posted
20 minutes ago, AshtonGreat said:

Palmer has had enough chances to shine. Pato had a pretty good season last season so it would be better keeping him. To be honest though, none of them fill me with much excitement

Has he tho? 

I don’t remember Palmer starting many games under LJ. He was used from the bench a number of times as I recall.

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WirralRobin

WirralRobin

Posted
Posted
28 minutes ago, AshtonGreat said:

Palmer has had enough chances to shine. Pato had a pretty good season last season so it would be better keeping him. To be honest though, none of them fill me with much excitement

I read a crazy stat on here a couple of weeks back that Palmer had only started something like 1 game since November, which just seems crazy to me considering how good he looked in August and September, how much LJ liked to chop and change players in and out of the side and how poor we were for most of the second half of the season. I'd definitely like to see Kasey give more opportunities to show his worth this season. I think Holden's more attack minded approach will suit him much better, a real shame he was injured for the bulk of Holden's 5 games in charge at the end of last season.

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AshtonGreat

AshtonGreat

Posted
Posted
48 minutes ago, Robbored said:

Has he tho? 

I don’t remember Palmer starting many games under LJ. He was used from the bench a number of times as I recall.

 

40 minutes ago, WirralRobin said:

I read a crazy stat on here a couple of weeks back that Palmer had only started something like 1 game since November, which just seems crazy to me considering how good he looked in August and September, how much LJ liked to chop and change players in and out of the side and how poor we were for most of the second half of the season. I'd definitely like to see Kasey give more opportunities to show his worth this season. I think Holden's more attack minded approach will suit him much better, a real shame he was injured for the bulk of Holden's 5 games in charge at the end of last season.

You have to take training into consideration though. Johnson must've felt that Palmer wasn't doing enough to warrant a starting place. Unless the two of them just didn't get on. There's certainly no harm in giving him a run of games under a new regime and seeing how it pans out.

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Robbored

Robbored

Posted
Posted
14 minutes ago, AshtonGreat said:

 

You have to take training into consideration though. Johnson must've felt that Palmer wasn't doing enough to warrant a starting place. Unless the two of them just didn't get on. There's certainly no harm in giving him a run of games under a new regime and seeing how it pans out.

Yep.....completely agree. Deano could well have a different opinion on Palmer.

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Sturny

Sturny

Posted
Posted

I'd like to see us keep both. We're not forced to sell. We need more healthy competition in these roles. It seriously lowers our chance of getting anywhere near top 6 if we don't have depth/competition for roles. 

Just because we can sell doesn't mean we should. 

And looking into depth stats of Tommy Rowe & COD just sounds/feels depressing. 

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Davefevs

Davefevs

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, WirralRobin said:

I read a crazy stat on here a couple of weeks back that Palmer had only started something like 1 game since November, which just seems crazy to me considering how good he looked in August and September, how much LJ liked to chop and change players in and out of the side and how poor we were for most of the second half of the season. I'd definitely like to see Kasey give more opportunities to show his worth this season. I think Holden's more attack minded approach will suit him much better, a real shame he was injured for the bulk of Holden's 5 games in charge at the end of last season.

image.thumb.png.6d588c2bed7e749bfbb9d16a06c61a26.png
 

 

31 minutes ago, ZiderEyed said:

One for you @Davefevs - Tommy Rowe vs Callum O’Dowda, ball progressions? Unless you haven’t got access to that data via Wyscout etc.?

O’Dowda v Rowe: 

Final Third Passes per 90 (success): 2.48 v 4.48 (53.06% v 40.52%)

Forward Passes per 90 (success): 7.85 v 10.36 (57.42% v 51.85%)

Progressive Runs per 90: 1.92 v 0.50

Dribbles per 90 (success): 5.06 v 1.24

(caveat: both had played predominantly different positions all season)

 

 

 

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ZiderEyed

ZiderEyed

Posted
Posted
24 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

image.thumb.png.6d588c2bed7e749bfbb9d16a06c61a26.png
 

 

O’Dowda v Rowe: 

Final Third Passes per 90 (success): 2.48 v 4.48 (53.06% v 40.52%)

Forward Passes per 90 (success): 7.85 v 10.36 (57.42% v 51.85%)

Progressive Runs per 90: 1.92 v 0.50

Dribbles per 90 (success): 5.06 v 1.24

(caveat: both had played predominantly different positions all season)

 

 

 

Thanks! Do you have those for a large enough sample of games where they played in the same positions?

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Davefevs

Davefevs

Posted
Posted
22 minutes ago, ZiderEyed said:

Thanks! Do you have those for a large enough sample of games where they played in the same positions?

No, O’Dowda has only really played odd minutes in a small number of games at LB, LWB so cannot give a fair comparison to Rowe.

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SBB

SBB

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, JonDolman said:

To be fair the one time we had a settled side in the last 2 seasons over a fairly long period O'Dowda was delivering every game along with most of our players.

I think there's quite a few who suffered from LJs changing of system so often this last season.

Even Brownhill didn't perform to his usual standards at times.

To my eye, O’Dowda has never delivered consistently. He had one very brief patch of form before he got injured(in which time as you said, all the players seemed to be in-form) and that’s it. I was excited after his debut and how he would progress.... but it seems LJ took a specialised winger and turned him into a jack of all, king of nothing player. 

For me, for every position he can now play - there are 2 or 3 better options in front of him. 

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Davefevs

Davefevs

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, JonDolman said:

I meant last season when we went on that amazing run. He played on the wing and Weimann on the other wing. But as you say he was very good as well in 17/18 before the bad injury. 

I still think in that “team run”, it was more flashes from Callum, rather than consistently strong performances.  The Norwich (a) goal was great, and I’ve said before that he’s generally better against the teams that don’t pressure him heavily.

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downendcity

downendcity

Posted
Posted
12 minutes ago, Murraysrightplum said:

I was the England team communal Box for 13 warm and dark years. Some hairy moments at times

I think you are talking bolux MRP!

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Davefevs

Davefevs

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, Simon79 said:

How about keep them both? Play them both in a 3(5)-4(2)-2-1. Both of them will create angles, both look for the ball & I expect Wells would thrive of these two playing. Would be interesting at the very least. COYR 

That set up will undoubtedly be an option / variant at times, even for part of games.

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Garland-sweden

Garland-sweden

Posted
Posted
On 23/08/2020 at 12:24, redpole said:

With it looking more likely that we are going to loose one of our Attack Minded players. I believe it will be out of Pato who is coming Into the final year of his contract or Palmer.

I know that Szmodics has been talked about as being moved on, however I think he can play in CF role as has played lone striker in his Colchester days so he offers extra options to our forwards. Same with Weimann being able to play up top.
 

Callum, can also fill in at LWB and as we are playing 3-5-2 I think he will be kept on as options in that area.
 

So with those players being able to fill in other areas in the team, I can see one of Pato or Palmer being moved on. 
 

who would people want to be moved on??

COD!

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