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47 minutes ago, Bat Fastard said:

All you negative types must be "supporting" a different Bristol City than the one that I have supported since the halcyon days before the Dolman Stand was built.  I see a club with a newly refurbished stadium, that would be the pride of any club in our division. I see that we are getting a new training ground that will be up there with the very best around. I see a large number of academy products playing senior and league football on loan and a couple joining the first team this season as important players. I see a club that has bought some very good players and managed to make a good profit on some of these after they have served the club well during their development. I see an owner who writes off millions of £s in our debts on a pretty regular basis so that we are not as vulnerable as many clubs who run continual losses. I see a club with huge infrastructure development plans that will feed further cash into the club to help in the goal of becoming sustainable after SL departs the scene.  I see stability - something Bristol City has not always known!

On the other hand I see a bunch of critical pygmies who say the support the club but criticise every decision without knowing the reasons for those decisions. At every turn they denigrate the members of the board, management  and even SL himself.  I see these people and am willing to bet that they are not hugely successful individuals, their sort seldom are, and that they represent a very small minority of the fan base but a larger percentage of the people on this forum who seem to have nothing better to do than obsess about what they see as failures.  We see things differently.

Exaggeration.

Better yes but it will not be up there with the best. 

Bristol City are not producing large amounts of pros via its academy. It is not a high performing academy. Last season the XI included regularly no academy graduates in its matchday squad.. A comparison, a large is Derby who fielded five graduates.  

Bristol City's youth coaching network is smaller than Exeter Citys.

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2 minutes ago, Cowshed said:

Exaggeration.

Better yes but it will not be up there with the best. 

Bristol City are not producing large amounts of pros via its academy. It is not a high performing academy. Last season the XI included regularly no academy graduates in its matchday squad.. A comparison, a large is Derby who fielded five graduates.  

Bristol City's youth coaching network is smaller than Exeter Citys.

We had 1 academy graduate in every match day squad..... partly because its an EFL requirement...

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1 minute ago, Lrrr said:

We had 1 academy graduate in every match day squad..... partly because its an EFL requirement...

No. Its is not a EFL requirement. Bristol City had Antonine Semenyo on the bench. He did not graduate from the academy he came from the SGS football programme to play for the U18 team. 

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1 minute ago, Cowshed said:

No. Its is not a EFL requirement. Bristol City had Antonine Semenyo on the bench. He did not graduate from the academy he came from the SGS football programme to play for the U18 team. 

And he counts as an academy product/club developed player by the rules of the EFL, brought in before pro deals are handed out. Same way Massengo will count towards being a club developed player this season as he spent a season here before the age of 19. Why do you think Semenyo was on the bench? And why Jojo then sat on the bench instead of Maenpaa?

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Just now, Cowshed said:

The player is not an academy graduate. 

Depends on your definition of academy graduate.... he played games for the u18's deal already signed or not, similar to how if you were educated somewhere but transferred somewhere else for your last year of your education, you'd graduate from the place.

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7 hours ago, bris red said:

Jon Lansdown is hopeless. I cringe so badly for him when he publicly speaks. Somebody on here (cant remember who it was) said they felt sorry for him because public speaking isn’t for everyone. Well **** me is that not one of the KEY aspects of being a modern day chairman? To be able to engage with your fanbase? This club is farcical and watching SL in that video has just wound me right up again. I had actually started to come to terms with Holden but **** sake people we are being taken for MUGS.

Well, I suggest you watch Elon Musk's broadcasts, most notably the most recent for his Neuralink company. It was a f****** traincrash!!! Incoherent, dithering etc, but he must be doing something right I'll assume you'll agree!?!?

 

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1 hour ago, Bat Fastard said:

All you negative types must be "supporting" a different Bristol City than the one that I have supported since the halcyon days before the Dolman Stand was built.  I see a club with a newly refurbished stadium, that would be the pride of any club in our division. I see that we are getting a new training ground that will be up there with the very best around. I see a large number of academy products playing senior and league football on loan and a couple joining the first team this season as important players. I see a club that has bought some very good players and managed to make a good profit on some of these after they have served the club well during their development. I see an owner who writes off millions of £s in our debts on a pretty regular basis so that we are not as vulnerable as many clubs who run continual losses. I see a club with huge infrastructure development plans that will feed further cash into the club to help in the goal of becoming sustainable after SL departs the scene.  I see stability - something Bristol City has not always known!

On the other hand I see a bunch of critical pygmies who say the support the club but criticise every decision without knowing the reasons for those decisions. At every turn they denigrate the members of the board, management  and even SL himself.  I see these people and am willing to bet that they are not hugely successful individuals, their sort seldom are, and that they represent a very small minority of the fan base but a larger percentage of the people on this forum who seem to have nothing better to do than obsess about what they see as failures.  We see things differently.

You really do talk a load of nonsense don’t you. What on Earth has someone’s personal circumstance and ‘success’ got to do with their ability, as a supporter of City, to discuss the tenure of SL and it’s ‘success’ or otherwise. Id suggest your wanton slagging of anyone that deems it fair game to question SL suggests that you have rather a lot of shortcomings yourself old chum. The ability to debate being one of them.  

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6 hours ago, MarcusX said:

Why is it so impossible to believe that:

It took so long because they didn't expect him to be such a strong candidate? That they interviewed a number of experienced managers who may or may not have come across well or agreed with the targets/parameters the club set out?

Happy to sit in the background, or working hard learning his trade? How do you know what influence he may have tried to have and how much LJ listened or wanted to use?

There's lots of coaches that go "unearthed", if he hasn't applied for another job then why would teams consider him over any other assistant manager in football?

 

That is, of course, a possible explanation of what happened. Or there could be others. But I won’t argue over that though. 

My question would be, if the club, who in their own words, interviewed a number of more experienced managers and NONE fitted the parameters, perhaps they should be looking at their parameters.

The fact remains, they’ve gambled, at a time when we had a real opportunity, not even on someone with a little experience or success, or even just lower league success, but on someone with next to no experience as a manager, let alone success.

So, rightly the fans are left doubting, wondering if it will be another season of rebuilding, of a manager learning his trade in the toughest league in the world where things can go wrong very quickly.

And this brings in more problems, 2 of them in particular: 1) We’ve been here before (Millen, Tinnion) and no one has huge trust in SL’s appointments from within anymore and 2) He can’t, nor even can MA or JL even explain exactly what took Holden, from, in his own words after LJ got sacked, someone who’d “like a shot a management one day”, to becoming the ‘outstanding’ candidate for a club aiming for the premier league (Owners words).

And the kicker in it all....he comes out and talks AGAIN about the premier league and the top 6 as if people will just swallow it. 

Or perhaps Holden was held back by LJ and is ready to shine. We’ll soon see and we can chat about this again in a few months!

For the record, I for one had pretty much gotten over the Holden appointment and I’ll certainly be behind him when the whistle is blown, but this interview, wow. It’s another episode in what has been a series of PR **** ups by the club, IMO. You don’t do what they’ve just done and then come out digging at the fans.

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3 hours ago, ScottishRed said:

How about a bit of honesty from the owner.

Particularly in light of the infamous Talksport interview, in what world was DH the best candidate? 

I would really appreciate your response to that.

Let's not forget they all say right not best for the job.

Also thought SL didn't look that well 

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12 hours ago, JonDolman said:

You think Jon Lansdown is hopeless because of how he struggles to talk in public?

And then again other people take a pop at Ashton for using corporate speak and perhaps being a bit too polished - not sure that they can win.

 

12 hours ago, JonDolman said:
12 hours ago, JonDolman said:
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8 hours ago, Bat Fastard said:

All you negative types must be "supporting" a different Bristol City than the one that I have supported since the halcyon days before the Dolman Stand was built.  I to, have been a fan since before the Dolman was built, buying a ST for the first 2yrs after it was, seeing evey home game and most away in those "halcyon days" I see a club with a newly refurbished stadium, that would be the pride of any club in our division. I see that we are getting a new training ground that will be up there with the very best around. I see a newly refurbished stadium from which we have no influence on who actually plays there or on how much income it pays us or we pay it I see a large number of academy products playing senior and league football on loan and a couple joining the first team this season as important players. I see a club that has bought some very good players and managed to make a good profit on some of these after they have served the club well during their development.As most clubs do I see an owner who writes off millions of £s in our debts on a pretty regular basis so that we are not as vulnerable as many clubs who run continual losses. I see a club with huge infrastructure development plans that will feed further cash into the club to help in the goal of becoming sustainable after SL departs the scene.  We have no control over Steves investmens I see stability - something Bristol City has not always known! I see us going around in circles can you not remember Tinion/Millen and many other SL selections? are there any that ended well?

On the other hand I see a bunch of critical pygmies who say the support the club but criticise every decision without knowing the reasons for those decisions. At every turn they denigrate the members of the board, management  and even SL himself.  I see these people and am willing to bet that they are not hugely successful individuals, I run my own LTD company have done for the last 14yrs, previously having worked on the most prestigous buildings in this country inc; Houses of Parliment, Windsor Castle, Clarence House etc, etc their sort seldom are, and that they represent a very small minority of the fan base but a larger percentage of the people on this forum who seem to have nothing better to do than obsess about what they see as failures.  We see things differently. WE certainly do, and unless you have surveyed the whole fan base you dont know how many fans share your somewhat everything is great head in the sand views

A critical pigmies view..... in red

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9 hours ago, Davefevs said:

I’m not a critic of SL, although I don’t agree with everything he says or does.  Some things I like, some I don’t.

There is however a streak in him that says “I’ve put millions in, I’m beyond criticism” (paraphrased).

There are multiple ways to skin a cat.  It’s possible to have achieved promotion without needing his millions every year.  A different strategy might’ve achieved it.  The current one hasn’t achieved it either.

His millions aren’t total charity either are they?  He’s got a big asset for his money....and kudos.  Some thrive on the power of kudos.

I’m grateful for his financial contribution and compliance, but I totally see why others aren’t, especially when you see failure / failure to achieve the objectives on the football side.

Criticism has degrees of justification, some if it on this thread and others is justified.

People who disagree with you aren’t all “negative”, nor a “bunch of critical pygmies”.  They have a different view to you.  Ever considered yours might be over-rose-tinted.  There’s middle ground here.

Excellent post.

What I found interesting was that SL addressed 2 of the most extreme view criticisms; he takes the cheap option and spends more money on the rugby.

This is IMO the ‘conspiracy’ view of a small minority of fans.

I’m convinced the vast majority don’t question his intentions, but do at times questions the methods. That does not make them pygmies criticising just for the sake of it or even unappreciative. 

The fact as you rightly say, is there is a middle ground, and that’s who you should speak to. The swing voters. SL had the chance to do that, to say Holden was the candidate because of X, Y, Z, or, just as the club would like to develop players, we’d like to develop coaches. Even that for budget reasons this season we’ll develop the squad we have and they felt Holden could hit the ground running on that with the right team around him. Given the level of candidates apparently available, he could without naming names, explain why some of the external candidates weren’t right. Something like that!

It seems to me there are a number of things he could have said that would have addressed the swing voters and that majority of people that sit in the middle ground.

Just a little humility to acknowledge his U-turn from the talk sport interview, rather than a politicians style deflection and denial, and back to the increasingly hollow old hymn sheet of “the aim’s the premier league”.

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9 hours ago, GrahamC said:

I thought his sniffy comments about Birmingham’s undue haste (!) by effectively suggesting that they just went for the first person who showed any interest by appointing Karanka inside 3 weeks was all a bit odd, too.

Clearly struck a bit of a nerve that it was even brought up, I thought.

Did you think so?  I thought his response to the question about Birmingham was measured and reasonable.  He says he didn’t see that six weeks was particularly long to make such an important appointment, and that he was pleased we didn’t rush the appointment by appointing the first candidate who seemed appointable.  I think it was a very good point.  It is quite common in business for the candidate who seems strongest on paper to reveal shortcomings and unsuitability when interviewed.  Sometimes this has to be tested further by a second interview process, because the important thing is to get it right.  It takes an awfully long time to recover from making the wrong appointment.

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9 hours ago, Dynamite Red said:

Once upon a time I would have hang on every word he says, now my initial reaction is he full of bullshit, it's the first time for many who now look at him with a lot of scepticism.

For his and Holden's sake I genuinely hope this works out, if it all goes pair shaped he has to take it on the chin, because the criticism is going to be pretty damning.

I think that’s you’re problem.  You admit that you prejudge what he says (‘my initial reaction is that he’s full of bullshit’) so you’re simply not listening to what he is saying.  Luckily for the club, it doesn’t matter too much if some fans are simply not listening and therefore don’t get it.  The important thing is that the club are trying to do the right thing.  

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15 hours ago, JoeAman08 said:

I will get abuse and thankfully there is no kore eggplant emoji ? but I can’t bring myself to listen to it. I can’t be fed more bullshit from SL and be expected to believe it.

You aren’t going to hear its my club and I will do what I want. Unfortunately that is probably the closest to the truth you can get. Everything else he says is just spin and more bullshit. No doubt this will get 80-90% of the fanbase back on board with this “interview.” You wonder why it took 3 weeks for him to talk about the guy he entrusted to his biggest investment in Bristol Sport. Probably because he knew he couldn’t say one thing wrong or there would be uproar. You can guarantee that it was probably scripted all the way down to facial expressions and tone. 
 

Will add he’ll keep getting my money and DH my support. I enjoy going to AG. I enjoy a beer or two with mates and those SC holders I have got to know over the past 6 years. DH deserves support as a person and he gets that. Just not expecting any ambition with their actions anymore. SL, JL and MA can say what they like. I just hope they can fluke their way to a promotion one of these years. 

If/when/how we get promoted, it won't be through "fluke" unless the FL & Premier league decide to restructure the divisions by alphabetical order..! 

It will be because we've made a good decision and worked hard to achieve it. 

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2 minutes ago, Bar BS3 said:

If/when/how we get promoted, it won't be through "fluke" unless the FL & Premier league decide to restructure the divisions by alphabetical order..! 

It will be because we've made a good decision and worked hard to achieve it. 

It may not be fluke, but will have to involve us getting lucky with several webster type signings at the same time, which given past performance, would appear to be unlikely. 

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10 hours ago, Bat Fastard said:

All you negative types must be "supporting" a different Bristol City than the one that I have supported since the halcyon days before the Dolman Stand was built.  I see a club with a newly refurbished stadium, that would be the pride of any club in our division. I see that we are getting a new training ground that will be up there with the very best around. I see a large number of academy products playing senior and league football on loan and a couple joining the first team this season as important players. I see a club that has bought some very good players and managed to make a good profit on some of these after they have served the club well during their development. I see an owner who writes off millions of £s in our debts on a pretty regular basis so that we are not as vulnerable as many clubs who run continual losses. I see a club with huge infrastructure development plans that will feed further cash into the club to help in the goal of becoming sustainable after SL departs the scene.  I see stability - something Bristol City has not always known!

On the other hand I see a bunch of critical pygmies who say the support the club but criticise every decision without knowing the reasons for those decisions. At every turn they denigrate the members of the board, management  and even SL himself.  I see these people and am willing to bet that they are not hugely successful individuals, their sort seldom are, and that they represent a very small minority of the fan base but a larger percentage of the people on this forum who seem to have nothing better to do than obsess about what they see as failures.  We see things differently.

I agree with the first paragraph of your post 100%. The point is very well-made.

With regard to the second paragraph  I don’t think there would’ve been a problem if the club had appointed Holden at the outset. The criticism surrounding his appointment arises from the fact that we were told we needed a “breath of fresh air” and someone who could “take us to the next level”. The five week selection process during which quality candidates, including Chris Hughton, were interviewed only served to increase expectations.  The subsequent appointment of Holden who was part of the previous failed regime and who has no managerial experience understandably came as a great disappointment to many fans, including myself, who had believed the comments SL made on Talksport.

As for your comment that you are willing to bet that those criticising are not highly successful individuals then obviously I cannot speak for others but so far as I am concerned you would have lost your bet.

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9 minutes ago, Simon bristol said:

It may not be fluke, but will have to involve us getting lucky with several webster type signings at the same time, which given past performance, would appear to be unlikely. 

Not necessarily... 

It would need us to get 8points more than we did, based on last season (for a play off spot) 

So an improvement in home form could realistically achieve that. 

Tightening up defence and being more willing to shoot in attack could also help make up the current shortfall. As could a little more consistency. 

Who knows what will follow, but we aren't in a position where we need complete and utter overhaul to make up the difference that we currently need, imo. 

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6 minutes ago, Bar BS3 said:

If/when/how we get promoted, it won't be through "fluke" unless the FL & Premier league decide to restructure the divisions by alphabetical order..! 

It will be because we've made a good decision and worked hard to achieve it. 

?

1 minute ago, Simon bristol said:

It may not be fluke, but will have to involve us getting lucky with several webster type signings at the same time, which given past performance, would appear to be unlikely. 


It is also just different opinions. If DH got us promoted I’d still consider it a fluke. Just because you make a decision and it works out against the odds doesn’t mean it was the right one when you made it. Wrap your head around that one?

All in all, I just don’t trust the board to make the decisions for a serious promotion threat. You look at clubs like Brentford, Preston or Swansea. They are all a little bit different but have their way of doing things that work to varying degrees. Idk if we are going to win the league or get relegated. But safe bet the 3 I named finish top half at worst. What is our at worst? 
 

There is evidence we have no plan either. Look at communication through the pandemic. Robins TV last season and this. No plan. Look at our recruitment over the last few years with the same CEO and HC. Players from France, Sweden, Italy, Germany and Portugal. The ages range from 18-30. We are all over the place. Look at the recruitment of the last head coach. 5-6 weeks of nothing. Nothing. Just SL saying we need a breathe of fresh air and MA saying we have applicants from across the world. Then we go with the assistant to the guy that got sacked with basically 0 head coaching/managerial experience. To top it off after 1 weekend we had a new coaching staff who had nothing to do with city before with tentative links to DH as former teammates(don’t recall them coaching together). 
 

It might work out. Hell I hope it does. It just isn’t a club that is organised enough to sustain top 6 pushes. So in that sense promotion would be a fluke for me. I can genuinely see us finish 5th one year and then 17th the next. The board say the right things but act completely against what they say

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12 hours ago, MarcusX said:

OH, we're suggesting he's not of sound mind now? ?

Not at all, Marcus. SL has two decades of making poor managerial appointments. Tony Pulis is the only manager in that time to have gone on to bigger and better things after leaving City. A wiser man than me once said the definition of madness is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result. Let’s hope SL finally disproves Einstein’s theory.

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As far as the complaints about the term of “clear vision” goes, it would be reasonably easy to work out what was proposed by DH that won the day. SL could have gone into more detail I suppose, but the actions so far seem to demonstrate it better than words.

I doubt it was as simple as “I want to play attacking football” as some are crassly suggesting, I would imagine it was more like.

. A more dynamic type of football, perhaps more in keeping with that which got us to 2nd in the table at Xmas in our best season under LJ

. To do that, a focus on youthful (preferably home grown) players playing with energy

. To help with that, assistants that have a track record of getting the best from young players

. A focus on a particular playing formation, at all levels of the club to give the younger players stability and a simplicity of structure

. Recognising we have limited scope for recruitment, but identifying key positions that require it.

I am sure there was even more detail than that, around individuals already at the club, because DH is in a good position to see that, but I am sure it was more than “gissa a job, I’m cheap and I will pick the team you ask me to”

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9 hours ago, ScottishRed said:

How about a bit of honesty from the owner.

Particularly in light of the infamous Talksport interview, in what world was DH the best candidate? 

I would really appreciate your response to that.

Here we go again. Perhaps Hughton wanted too much money / wanted too much transfer funds which ruled him out. Perhaps Holden interviewed well and agreed to take the job within the financial realities of the club. Would t that make him the best candidate in the eyes of the owner? The truth is we will never know so I suggest we all get over it and crack on. 

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SL deserves a lot of credit for the way he portrays this club , yes mistakes have been made and it seems that for every 2 steps we go forward at least one goes backwards,. He is not perfect but given some of the other chancers involved in football we have a man of principle in it for the long haul and for that alone I am grateful.

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The only new thing I got from this latest Hollywood production was a hint at the desire to take control of the way football is funded. In this video, which I believe  has also been said before, the need for a salary cap is the ultimate goal. This would provide “a level playing field “, which could be interpreted as ‘owners take back control’ (Jimmy Hill must be getting restless).

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8 hours ago, Alessandro said:

That is, of course, a possible explanation of what happened. Or there could be others. But I won’t argue over that though. 

My question would be, if the club, who in their own words, interviewed a number of more experienced managers and NONE fitted the parameters, perhaps they should be looking at their parameters.

The fact remains, they’ve gambled, at a time when we had a real opportunity, not even on someone with a little experience or success, or even just lower league success, but on someone with next to no experience as a manager, let alone success.

So, rightly the fans are left doubting, wondering if it will be another season of rebuilding, of a manager learning his trade in the toughest league in the world where things can go wrong very quickly.

And this brings in more problems, 2 of them in particular: 1) We’ve been here before (Millen, Tinnion) and no one has huge trust in SL’s appointments from within anymore and 2) He can’t, nor even can MA or JL even explain exactly what took Holden, from, in his own words after LJ got sacked, someone who’d “like a shot a management one day”, to becoming the ‘outstanding’ candidate for a club aiming for the premier league (Owners words).

And the kicker in it all....he comes out and talks AGAIN about the premier league and the top 6 as if people will just swallow it. 

Or perhaps Holden was held back by LJ and is ready to shine. We’ll soon see and we can chat about this again in a few months!

For the record, I for one had pretty much gotten over the Holden appointment and I’ll certainly be behind him when the whistle is blown, but this interview, wow. It’s another episode in what has been a series of PR **** ups by the club, IMO. You don’t do what they’ve just done and then come out digging at the fans.

Good post ?????? Bit in bold I resonate with.  I really saw a lot to be encouraged about in Holden’s 5 games in charge, but no way 1) did I think he’d get the job (at the start of the process) and 2) could he ever be the outstanding candidate.  For him to be the outstanding candidate, to me, means the process was flawed.  It now sounds as if “we are looking for the right TYPE of person” constrained the chances of some candidates from getting the job....and it took them several interviews to reach that decision.

We will never know the real truth. it’s not like there was an advert that listed the requirements.  You can see why agents would be putting their clients names forward.  But should they have retracted their clients interest when they saw that City were looking to progress  differently.  Should MA and JL have filtered out more earlier?  They spoke to over 10.  I’m fine with that.  Get an initial impression, cull those that you now realise don’t fit what you’re looking for.  They spoke to 4 extensively. If the likes of Hughton and Cook, together with Holden, got through the initial funnel, and were then interviewed several times, I find it hard to believe that the interview process wasn’t then loaded towards Holden - MA “he was the best fit”.

At the end of the day, it’s old news.  I was comfortable with Holden, I still am.  I think it was right to conduct a thorough search, cast the net....but I do think early in the 6 week process they should’ve filtered out much earlier.

Without needing to be critical of the ones who didn’t get the job (and no names have been mentioned), explain to the fans why Dean was the “best fit”.  Was it his knowledge of the squad, was it his commitment to develop what was already here, was it his clear tactical approach, etc?  Tell us.  We then have a better understanding.

1 hour ago, Alessandro said:

Excellent post.

What I found interesting was that SL addressed 2 of the most extreme view criticisms; he takes the cheap option and spends more money on the rugby.

This is IMO the ‘conspiracy’ view of a small minority of fans.

I’m convinced the vast majority don’t question his intentions, but do at times questions the methods. That does not make them pygmies criticising just for the sake of it or even unappreciative. 

The fact as you rightly say, is there is a middle ground, and that’s who you should speak to. The swing voters. SL had the chance to do that, to say Holden was the candidate because of X, Y, Z, or, just as the club would like to develop players, we’d like to develop coaches. Even that for budget reasons this season we’ll develop the squad we have and they felt Holden could hit the ground running on that with the right team around him. Given the level of candidates apparently available, he could without naming names, explain why some of the external candidates weren’t right. Something like that!

It seems to me there are a number of things he could have said that would have addressed the swing voters and that majority of people that sit in the middle ground.

Just a little humility to acknowledge his U-turn from the talk sport interview, rather than a politicians style deflection and denial, and back to the increasingly hollow old hymn sheet of “the aim’s the premier league”.

The season card / streaming offer will be the acid test.

57 minutes ago, Bar BS3 said:

Not necessarily... 

It would need us to get 8points more than we did, based on last season (for a play off spot) 

So an improvement in home form could realistically achieve that. 

Tightening up defence and being more willing to shoot in attack could also help make up the current shortfall. As could a little more consistency. 

Who knows what will follow, but we aren't in a position where we need complete and utter overhaul to make up the difference that we currently need, imo. 

I’ve just written a piece comparing the numbers / data for last season and in particular Holden v Johnson.

There is no rocket science in the first conclusion I draw.  We don’t create enough chances and we concede too many (measured by shots and xG).

Without boring the pants off people, if we look at the cross section of shots v xG, there were only 5 games where City created more than the average conceded.  There were however 23 games where we conceded more more than the average we created.

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