Davefevs Posted September 17, 2020 Report Share Posted September 17, 2020 17 minutes ago, Kibs said: I must admit, I've never seen this "lack of work rate" that others have and I don't blame him, or any other player for not performing last season. Even when he did play well (e.g. Shrewsbury at home in the cup), he was bombed out for the next game. People often call out WBA away as an example of his poor performance. I went to that game with 3 non City fans. They went to the bar at half-time whilst I sulked and were genuinely shocked when they came back to see he had been hauled off - felt he was our only player who looked remotely like he'd seen a football before. Brownhill had a stinker for their first goal yet he wasn't hauled off and thrown under the bus. How can you expect to motivate any player, or expect any player to perform well when they know they are always one mistake or one poor performance away from spending the next 10 games on the bench or not in the squad? I'm not saying KP is the answer or that he should stay, but last nights performance didn't surprise me one bit. Paterson is rightly ahead of him at the moment but I think every single player should be given a clean slate and judged under Holden, not on what they did/didn't do for Lee Johnson because quite frankly, his man management of certain players was shocking. Yep, for the first 15 minutes that night, him and Weimann (another much maligned by some) passed and moved well, and it looked encouraging. But we give a goal away, and we are all over the shop...AS A TEAM! Palmer stuffs up on the edge of our box, and rightly culpable for his part in the goal. But he’s the one, just recalled to the team who gets hauled off at h-t as LJ switches 5311 to 442....how many times did that happen? 9 minutes ago, downendcity said: I think the one thing that made a difference to Palmer's game was the other 10 players. Last season he was often trying too hard to make something happen with the rest of the team pretty static and the ball played slowly so he was under pressure in the wrong part of the pitch. Last night the pace and movement meant that KP was able to play much more in the last third, where he can do more damage. More importantly the rest of the team seemed to be on the same wavelength as him. Not everything came off for him. The difference is that a year ago that would have been his lot but last night more came off than didn't and what did affected the game positively. Very true. It’s no coincidence that Palmer’s better games have generally been when he’s had good movement ahead of him...typically the Weimann / Afobe partnership. He hasn’t yet had a chance with Wells. It’s one of the frustrations of the LJ era. KP needs to keep working hard. Can’t go too OTT about last night, but he’s set a bar for himself now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin phantom Posted September 17, 2020 Admin Report Share Posted September 17, 2020 36 minutes ago, bcfc01 said: I saw no evidence of that at all tbh. What I saw was a player who was playing himself into the game. Palmer is damned for trying to make the killer pass and damned for playing safe - he can't win with some. As Fevs said, after a season of being hauled off for making a mistake and being left out of the squad, he probably played it safe in the first half. It wouldn't surprise me if Holden told him at half time to be himself a bit more, move a bit further up the pitch and get that swagger back that had probably been knocked out of him last season. Just to clarify, until he has played himself into the game it's accepted that he passes the ball back needlessly, rather than play the ball forward? Honestly, watch the first 30 minutes back., he did it on numerous occasions, when there was space and players in front of him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheltons Army Posted September 17, 2020 Report Share Posted September 17, 2020 4 hours ago, Shuffle said: You seem a very knowledgeable football man Graham but just don’t understand why you do not seem to rate Palmer at all? He was superb and previously wrongly in my opinion people have questioned his work rate but that was exceptional last night. He is technically gifted and just needs a run of games although doesn’t start for me at the moment as Pato has earned that right. Whatever your view and opposition, that was a fantastic make or break performance from him. I will try Problem 1 & Quote the wily experienced football man Tony Mowbray 'He doesn't know when to defend' 2 Unable to establish himself under four different managers to date - coincidence ? He has some exceptional talent and at times in flashes does things where he looks too good for the Championship But theres a lot more to becoming a regular part of a team at this level IMHO A whole number of aspects to his '11 v 11' Championship game that need addressing Seems a decent lad and prepared to work but needs improvement in some 11 v 11 fundimentals including when to perform his tricks and when to play the sensible option (Personally feel there are too many times he tries to beat players unneccissarily when I actually see him at his best when playing and moving and interracting more with teamates) (Was much better at this in second half last night) He has the potential to be absolutely outstanding at this level but needs to play his part and role in the team and make more good decisions on and off the ball - How he has reached this point without doing so is surprising Poor coaching , or not taken on board ? To some degree hel's what a call a 'street footballer' with great feet and skills, and vision but not fully wise how to use them or play his part in 11 v 11 a, not be a more consistent contributor to team performance rather than a potential star in occasional flashes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHILINFRANCE Posted September 17, 2020 Report Share Posted September 17, 2020 On 13/09/2020 at 12:06, Marina's Rolls Royce said: Au contraire: L'oie cacarde. Fin. I am intrigued. Whilst I understand what you are saying, to the best of my knowledge this is not a well-known expression and, certainly in my experience, the verb cacarder is not widely used - apart from when one is discussing geese . Is this a phrase you recall from your schoolboy French, a la Eddie Izzard, 'Le singe est dans l'arbre', or am I reading too much in to your post? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC Rich Posted September 17, 2020 Report Share Posted September 17, 2020 6 hours ago, Kibs said: It's ironic isn't it, because he's often criticized for over-playing it and losing possession. Perhaps he was just playing his way into the game. I think the team were playing their way into to it the first 30 mins or so. Northampton pressed more in the opening 30 - after that we got more and more on top as a team and KP started to express himself more. Something to be said for keeping it simple early on and letting the game open up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcfc01 Posted September 17, 2020 Report Share Posted September 17, 2020 2 minutes ago, BCFC Richard said: I think the team were playing their way into to it the first 30 mins or so. Northampton pressed more in the opening 30 - after that we got more and more on top as a team and KP started to express himself more. Something to be said for keeping it simple early on and letting the game open up. I think thats beyond the wit of Calderwood & co. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swede Posted September 17, 2020 Report Share Posted September 17, 2020 Class is permanent. I have always believed in him. Given the right situation he will destroy teams. He is a top top player. The conundrum is the coaches finding the system to platform his undoubted talents. There can't be any excuses now as we have two (not one) ex England coaches. Obviously you have to take into account the opposition but here is a guy who can turn a match on its head. Brum (a) Sheff Utd (a) Charlton (h) as examples. Consistency and discipline is what's needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marina's Rolls Royce Posted September 17, 2020 Report Share Posted September 17, 2020 2 hours ago, PHILINFRANCE said: Whilst I understand what you are saying so long as you understand let's just leave it at that. My french is creme de la menthe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTone Posted September 17, 2020 Report Share Posted September 17, 2020 45 minutes ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said: so long as you understand let's just leave it at that. My french is creme de la menthe. Very good Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mozo Posted September 18, 2020 Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 That impressive performance might put Palmer on a few more transfer wishlist. He might be easier to shift. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red white and red Posted September 18, 2020 Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 40 minutes ago, mozo said: That impressive performance might put Palmer on a few more transfer wishlist. He might be easier to shift. Mate this was the way I was looking at it. That performance against Northampton smacked of ‘a shop window’ performance. Especially the chasing down after 90 mins and being 4-0 up. He may have a few managers willing to take him on after that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted September 18, 2020 Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReggyRed Posted September 18, 2020 Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 if we even think about selling him after that performance then we’ve lost the plot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted September 18, 2020 Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 Just for comparison, 1st half v 2nd half. No, the pitch didn’t get bigger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcfc01 Posted September 18, 2020 Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 4 minutes ago, Davefevs said: Just for comparison, 1st half v 2nd half. No, the pitch didn’t get bigger. That confirms exactly what we saw. A tidy but fairly safe first half and a much more advanced and "in the thick of it" second half. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted September 18, 2020 Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 37 minutes ago, bcfc01 said: That confirms exactly what we saw. A tidy but fairly safe first half and a much more advanced and "in the thick of it" second half. Yep. I miss having the Statszone app (it only covers Prem this season), so I have to wait for Wyscout to update (usually with 24 hours) to get these pics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
And Its Smith Posted September 18, 2020 Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 1 hour ago, ReggyRed said: if we even think about selling him after that performance then we’ve lost the plot Or we should sell him as he is too inconsistent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin phantom Posted September 18, 2020 Admin Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 21 hours ago, bcfc01 said: I think thats beyond the wit of Calderwood & co. Clearly you know better than them 1 hour ago, bcfc01 said: That confirms exactly what we saw. A tidy but fairly safe first half and a much more advanced and "in the thick of it" second half. You mean it is exactly what YOU chose to see, those graphics don't show where team mates were stood and where the opposition player was stood at the time of the pass. That was the point being made I've watched the opening back again, Calderwood was spot on with his comments Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted September 18, 2020 Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 1 minute ago, phantom said: Clearly you know better than them You mean it is exactly what YOU chose to see I've watched the opening back again, Calderwood was spot on with his comments What did Calderwood say? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin phantom Posted September 18, 2020 Admin Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 2 minutes ago, Davefevs said: What did Calderwood say? That he released the ball too early when not under pressure. He passed the ball backwards on too many occasions when there was either no pressure on him to release the ball, or there were better placed players in space in front of him. Don't get this confused with my opinion of him on the night that has already been written in this thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dolman Pragmatist Posted September 18, 2020 Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 On 17/09/2020 at 10:30, ReggyRed said: I don’t think anyone can call KP inconsistent until he’s had a chance to show he’s inconsistent He’s had his chances - he was in the line-up for the first game of last season - he just hasn’t taken them. Let’s hope this is a new beginning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcfc01 Posted September 18, 2020 Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 12 minutes ago, phantom said: That he released the ball too early when not under pressure. He passed the ball backwards on too many occasions when there was either no pressure on him to release the ball, or there were better placed players in space in front of him. Don't get this confused with my opinion of him on the night that has already been written in this thread Did Calderwood also say that Palmer was playing for himself not the team ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1960maaan Posted September 18, 2020 Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 2 hours ago, Davefevs said: Just for comparison, 1st half v 2nd half. No, the pitch didn’t get bigger. A query. What constitutes "key" as regards to a pass? The pass going out of the 6 yard box (2nd half) was the back heel for Semenyo to score, surely that's key. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReggyRed Posted September 18, 2020 Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 1 hour ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said: He’s had his chances - he was in the line-up for the first game of last season - he just hasn’t taken them. Let’s hope this is a new beginning. And performed every game at the start of last season until Afobe got injured and we changed the way we played. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted September 18, 2020 Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 1 hour ago, phantom said: That he released the ball too early when not under pressure. He passed the ball backwards on too many occasions when there was either no pressure on him to release the ball, or there were better placed players in space in front of him. Don't get this confused with my opinion of him on the night that has already been written in this thread 1 hour ago, bcfc01 said: Did Calderwood also say that Palmer was playing for himself not the team ? That’s why I asked, because i thought I’d read the above previously....and wanted to clarify. So Calderwood didn’t say (paraphrased) “he’s playing for himself”? As you said, he looks like he was easing himself in, trying to build his confidence, having been out so long....before building on it big time in the second half. 1 hour ago, 1960maaan said: A query. What constitutes "key" as regards to a pass? The pass going out of the 6 yard box (2nd half) was the back heel for Semenyo to score, surely that's key. Key pass Subtype of: Pass A pass that immediately creates a clear goal scoring opportunity for a teammate who in turn fails to score. For info here’s his passing stats from Wed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mozo Posted September 18, 2020 Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 6 hours ago, JonDolman said: Could be the case. It is strange that he's never done that before for us. He's never been in this position for us before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steviestevieneville Posted September 18, 2020 Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 It’ll be interesting to see what happens with him. If he gets the chance , let’s see if he can kick on against teams that will press him quickly . Always thought he wanted too much time on the ball. That could well be because of the lack of movement in front of him under LJ. I hope he can become the player we all hope under better coaching . As it stands at the moment I’d still expect him to move on this summer . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IAmNick Posted September 18, 2020 Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 50 minutes ago, Davefevs said: That’s why I asked, because i thought I’d read the above previously....and wanted to clarify. So Calderwood didn’t say (paraphrased) “he’s playing for himself”? As you said, he looks like he was easing himself in, trying to build his confidence, having been out so long....before building on it big time in the second half. Key pass Subtype of: Pass A pass that immediately creates a clear goal scoring opportunity for a teammate who in turn fails to score. For info here’s his passing stats from Wed. No assists? Is that because Semenyo's first shot came back and he scored the rebound? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted September 18, 2020 Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 10 minutes ago, IAmNick said: No assists? Is that because Semenyo's first shot came back and he scored the rebound? I believe so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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