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Who can we not afford to lose?


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2 hours ago, Simon bristol said:

Well at the moment, vyner moore or mawson being out isnt an option. 
 

what happens when kalas and baker are back fully fit im not quite sure though, cause kalas baker and mawson would be a right handful at this level

Baker I'm not so sure on, if we want to play the higher line and press- it's an odd one really as I don't see him as a ball carrying CB in the same way as say Moore-Kalas-Mawson- right to left or whichever way round would work best, anyway that back 3 seems an excellent combination of ball-carrying, technical ability and ease in terms of a higher line to get us up the pitch- Baker not so sure in that sense. Vyner too is improving all the time and is the right age/profile for that system.

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2 hours ago, LondonBristolian said:

Of course it is but O'Leary did okay when thrown in at the deep end 18 months ago and excelled at Shrewsbury and other young players who have come into the team have performed about expectations. Bentley is a quality keeper and outstanding when on form but I'd not be that panicked if O'Leary stepped in for him and, if Bentley's standards slip again mid-season, I can easily see him getting a run in the team. 

Personally I had a lot more faith in Maenpaa as a back up, with Oleary as third choice. Jojo could maybe do with one more loan season.

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1 hour ago, The Horse With No Name said:

Personally I had a lot more faith in Maenpaa as a back up, with Oleary as third choice. Jojo could maybe do with one more loan season.

I understand that and Maenpaa is an exceptionally reliable goalkeeper but I think this is a problem with young goalkeepers across the board. It is a crucial position where you don't want anyone to make mistakes and it is always going to be difficult to trust a young players in the role because young players make mistakes as they learn and you can end up with a catch 22 where nobody wants to trust a young keeper until they prove they are good enough but no young keeper can prove that unless they are in the team.

I just feel that O'Leary is the first goalkeeper we have brought through the ranks in years who has a genuine shot at being good enough for the first team. He's done some time as emergency first choice when Fielding and Maenpaa were injured and then had a successful loan in a division below last year and our only options were to show some faith in him or let him get a chance elsewhere. I don't think keeping him as third choice would have been fair on him and I suspect he would have questioned where his career at City was going had we done that. I've a lot of respect for Maenpaa but he had a few injury problems last year, is not getting any younger and, whilst I am not sure if he is fully fit yet, it is notable nobody has yet offered him anything elsewhere. I don't want to do the guy down but I do think there is a risk of losing young players if you do not trust them or offer them a pathway towards the team and I think Max is an example of someone who, if we let him leave now, we would regret in two or three years time but, if we keep him and never play him, we'd just be stalling his development. 

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50 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said:

I understand that and Maenpaa is an exceptionally reliable goalkeeper but I think this is a problem with young goalkeepers across the board. It is a crucial position where you don't want anyone to make mistakes and it is always going to be difficult to trust a young players in the role because young players make mistakes as they learn and you can end up with a catch 22 where nobody wants to trust a young keeper until they prove they are good enough but no young keeper can prove that unless they are in the team.

I just feel that O'Leary is the first goalkeeper we have brought through the ranks in years who has a genuine shot at being good enough for the first team. He's done some time as emergency first choice when Fielding and Maenpaa were injured and then had a successful loan in a division below last year and our only options were to show some faith in him or let him get a chance elsewhere. I don't think keeping him as third choice would have been fair on him and I suspect he would have questioned where his career at City was going had we done that. I've a lot of respect for Maenpaa but he had a few injury problems last year, is not getting any younger and, whilst I am not sure if he is fully fit yet, it is notable nobody has yet offered him anything elsewhere. I don't want to do the guy down but I do think there is a risk of losing young players if you do not trust them or offer them a pathway towards the team and I think Max is an example of someone who, if we let him leave now, we would regret in two or three years time but, if we keep him and never play him, we'd just be stalling his development. 

Thankyou for your detailed answer, even though it maybe differs from my view. Beats the one word reply from Mr Shakespeare himself. 

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1 hour ago, LondonBristolian said:

I understand that and Maenpaa is an exceptionally reliable goalkeeper but I think this is a problem with young goalkeepers across the board. It is a crucial position where you don't want anyone to make mistakes and it is always going to be difficult to trust a young players in the role because young players make mistakes as they learn and you can end up with a catch 22 where nobody wants to trust a young keeper until they prove they are good enough but no young keeper can prove that unless they are in the team.

I just feel that O'Leary is the first goalkeeper we have brought through the ranks in years who has a genuine shot at being good enough for the first team. He's done some time as emergency first choice when Fielding and Maenpaa were injured and then had a successful loan in a division below last year and our only options were to show some faith in him or let him get a chance elsewhere. I don't think keeping him as third choice would have been fair on him and I suspect he would have questioned where his career at City was going had we done that. I've a lot of respect for Maenpaa but he had a few injury problems last year, is not getting any younger and, whilst I am not sure if he is fully fit yet, it is notable nobody has yet offered him anything elsewhere. I don't want to do the guy down but I do think there is a risk of losing young players if you do not trust them or offer them a pathway towards the team and I think Max is an example of someone who, if we let him leave now, we would regret in two or three years time but, if we keep him and never play him, we'd just be stalling his development. 

Had there been interest in Bentley (alleged / rumoured Bournemouth when Ramsdale left), then I think we might have re-signed Niki....but the time is right for Max to wait patiently for his chance.  I’m sure he’ll get the FA Cup games in January and I think he will improve by training with the first team.

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With reference to contracts, are we quite disorganised in tying players down to suitable secure contracts?, as it does seem to be an ongoing problem, with players nearing the end of contracts, and being in position to leave on frees.           Ending up with us losing players who we would prefer to retain, and playing russian roulette with their length of contract.  Are we just the same as the majority of clubs, who are also constantly facing similar dilemmas. and thats just the way it is?, or do we have a particular problem with this issue.  Just asking, as it does seem to be an ongoing problem, or am I being naive and ill informed?

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1 hour ago, maxjak said:

With reference to contracts, are we quite disorganised in tying players down to suitable secure contracts?, as it does seem to be an ongoing problem, with players nearing the end of contracts, and being in position to leave on frees.           Ending up with us losing players who we would prefer to retain, and playing russian roulette with their length of contract.  Are we just the same as the majority of clubs, who are also constantly facing similar dilemmas. and thats just the way it is?, or do we have a particular problem with this issue.  Just asking, as it does seem to be an ongoing problem, or am I being naive and ill informed?

We are improving, and there is a balance between not contracting players for long enough and too long.

I’m sure in a non-covid world a few more deals would’ve been done before the end of last season.  That coupled with a potential playoff / promotion chance, may have seen reticence on both sides.

I think we are pretty good in the main, there will always be the odd player who runs his contract down, and there will always be the odd player who we’ve given too long a contract too.

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