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Swansea City (h) - 15:00 Sat 24th Oct - Matchday thread


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1 hour ago, Nibor said:

Nagy and Massengo are both more than good enough to be involved IMO.

No idea about Walsh, but very wary that so many people on here have decided he's the saviour.

Williams I've not seen much of either but likewise there's a lot of hype.

Not sure anyone has gone as far as to say Walsh will be the 'saviour'.

However reports, and some videos, of his performances last season confirmed he is a talented player, and - potentially - offers the creativity we are often lacking.

His regular inclusion should improve us, but time will tell of course.

Williams is a fairly well known quantity, not too much hype there imo, he's well known to be a consistently good player at this level, and again it would be a big surprise if he didn't improve us.

I'm really looking forward to seeing Walsh and Williams playing regularly together in City's midfield, and asap - it's an exciting prospect.

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55 minutes ago, the1stknowle said:

Might be favourites for a reason??? Thought COD good again when he came on. Must be pushing for a start. 

 

 

41 minutes ago, ohhhshauntaylor said:

If COD starts a game in CM ahead of HNM or Nagy then it’s an embarrassment, how he still gets in the squad is baffling to me, a liability (as proven last week at Barnsley) who offers us nothing going forward. 
I’d imagine his stats for us- goals/assists etc wouldn’t make good reading, maybe a little Sunday job for @Davefevs to delve into!

For me Callum did ok when he came on.  To me he earned his corn, a 6/10....no more.  There were some nice bits, e.g. when he opened it out to the left side, when he ran 60 yards with the ball but that also led to the not so nice bits too, e.g. falling over at the end of it.  The frustrating bit for me was the working the ball back onto his left foot inside their half to cross....but dropped each cross short.  No striker wants to be coming towards the ball to flick it on.

Its not enough of a performance to oust any of the regulars, it’s kind okay as a squad player.  He’ll get minutes here or there....but regular starts and then influential starts seem a bit of a long way off to me.

 

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4 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

 

For me Callum did ok when he came on.  To me he earned his corn, a 6/10....no more.  There were some nice bits, e.g. when he opened it out to the left side, when he ran 60 yards with the ball but that also led to the not so nice bits too, e.g. falling over at the end of it.  The frustrating bit for me was the working the ball back onto his left foot inside their half to cross....but dropped each cross short.  No striker wants to be coming towards the ball to flick it on.

Its not enough of a performance to oust any of the regulars, it’s kind okay as a squad player.  He’ll get minutes here or there....but regular starts and then influential starts seem a bit of a long way off to me.

 

The voice or reason! 
 

be interested to see COD’s stats for us over his career here

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COD is a strange one for me - every time I see him I'm expecting to learn something about him, what he's like, what kind of player he is, what his strengths are. It's almost like he's a new signing and I still don't know much about him.

I then have to remind myself he's 25, been here 4 years and made 120 or so appearances for us. He's just... meh to me. It sounds mean, but I just can't think of anything exceptional, or even really good about him - but also nothing really poor. Some players like that I really rate, and I think every team needs a few, but again for some reason he doesn't make me feel like that.

Somehow, after 120+ appearances I STILL don't know what I really think of him, beyond not really rating him.

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4 minutes ago, IAmNick said:

COD is a strange one for me - every time I see him I'm expecting to learn something about him, what he's like, what kind of player he is, what his strengths are. It's almost like he's a new signing and I still don't know much about him.

I then have to remind myself he's 25, been here 4 years and made 120 or so appearances for us. He's just... meh to me. It sounds mean, but I just can't think of anything exceptional, or even really good about him - but also nothing really poor. Some players like that I really rate, and I think every team needs a few, but again for some reason he doesn't make me feel like that.

Somehow, after 120+ appearances I STILL don't know what I really think of him, beyond not really rating him.

and therein lies the problem with our ‘gang of three’ - CoD, Pato, Andi. 

All been here for ages, really would like to love them... but I still don’t know their best positions, who they can form a partnership with and why they appear to be so consistently, inconsistent. At some point you just say we cannot build a midfield or a team around any of them. Just rip it up and start again.

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58 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

You will be proved right by Callum by the end of the season, I am sure. He is too talented not to succeed at this level imo. Would love to see him start as I believe his pace, strength and energy would add a lot in this team, and in this system.

Callum has been here years and on a consistent basis has failed to deliver.  I’m not sure why all of a sudden he will add to this team / squad. He had to play centre midfield in our current formation , he’s not the answer 

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3 minutes ago, RedRock said:

and therein lies the problem with our ‘gang of three’ - CoD, Pato, Andi. 

All been here for ages, really would like to love them... but I still don’t know their best positions, who they can form a partnership with and why they appear to be so consistently, inconsistent. At some point you just say we cannot build a midfield or a team around any of them. Just rip it up and start again.

Yeah that's how I feel too.

Even though Pato and Weimann have done pretty well this season so far, I still didn't really feel "Wow, they've really made their position their own" or felt like they'd be playing there for the season, either individually or together - even taking into account the amount of games we have in a short period.

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1 hour ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

I don’t think home advantage counts for much in these COVID days.  Home and away results seem to be balancing themselves out, which is hardly surprising.  14 points from 7 games is clearly promotion form, and if we’ve got 20 points after 10 games then I’ll be very happy.

I'd agree that in these COVID times there is little advantage in home games, except perhaps for some familiarity with the pitch and surroundings. Certainly the evidence is that teams are finding it easier to win away without the influence of the home crowd. I was simply stating that teams like to win their home matches as the idea of a 'home fortress' is a great confidence builder. 

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I think COD could be a very good player, but (and I think someone said) he needs to play games. When he joined he was just having a run and looked like being very good, then got injured. The problem then is the Johnson factor . In and out the side and not able to get any rhythm. Happened to plenty of players . Nagy , Watkins even Paterson, who seemed un droppable , ended loaned out and back to undroppable . I don't think Holden is quite the same as LJ, it sounds like the bench is chosen for the game and what it might bring, the players aren't out of favour as such. I am still amazed that there has been no MF back up on the bench though. I see him as a natural swap for Paterson, supposing we will need to rest him at some time. 
Tuesday I hope we play an extra MF. If Weimann isn't fit, and Brunt can do another 90, I'd play Bakinson and bring Nagy in on the bench. TBH if it was me I'd rest Weimann and Paterson whatever, only been involved in flashes which is fine if it's just one creative player. Sadly it's been both of them for a lot of the last 3 games.

With the mystical sightings of Walsh & Williams not rumoured to be happening for weeks yet, we need to sort out a balance not only in MF but the centre of defence too.

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Credit where it's due, we kept going and got the point vs a decent side.

Throwing 4 forwards on- ballsy! Not my top, favourite hugely preferred approach but it did the job, by the end we had Martin, Wells, Semenyo and Diedhiou on the pitch??

4 forwards can often be quite shapeless but it's strong intent- still think there needs to be some building on strong points though. One negative though, what the hell is going on with all these injuries FFS?? I've lost count- Sessegnon and Weimann today is it.

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Happy that Wells scored the pen but something missing at the moment. To lttle movement makes our play difficault, no flow.. Thought Brunt was ok, he tries to do do something with the ball.. Semenyo big and strong, like him but he comes to deep and nothing happens. Defence good and that is important when we not playing good forward. Once again: good for the moral with Wells goal.

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21 hours ago, SedRA said:

Feels like we make the wrong choice quite often. Trying low percentage balls into the strikers when there’s more simple passes on to move us up the pitch. Then when Weimann makes a great run to break the lines, Brunt plays it simple instead of popping it over the top. Sessegnon hitting it from 40 yards when they’re out of shape after a counter. Paterson rushing his shot after that great run etc
 

Seems to be a theme I’ve noted a lot under Holden so far. I know we want to do things quickly, but still needs a little more composure. 

Yeah agreed bad decision making with the ball. We went direct when a shorter ball was more sensible. We went short at the end when the wide ball was on. We took the shot when we shouldn't have. Bad choices.

20 hours ago, handballbygordonparr said:

Was there a probation period in Holden's dream job contract?

Made I larf!

 

17 hours ago, Jerseybean said:

Mixed bag today, in the end IMO a draw was a fair reflection of a game of few chances in which neither side really imposed themselves. 

Pros:

Better performance than in the week (really not too difficult to achieve)

ZV and AS had solid games

Bold decisions from DH with both the selection and the subs 

Got a point when it was starting to look unlikely

Cons:

Too much sloppy passing resulted in us giving the ball away cheaply (a recurring issue) 

Much too often our ball out of defence went to an opponent (a recurring issue) 

Injuries (a recurring issue) to AW and SS 

When we had four strikers on the pitch we didn’t get the ball into them enough

 

Agree on all points!

Tinnion was clearly trying to resist running down to the touchline to scream at them, "Get it in the mixer!"

 

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On 24/10/2020 at 18:51, ohhhshauntaylor said:

If COD starts a game in CM ahead of HNM or Nagy then it’s an embarrassment, how he still gets in the squad is baffling to me, a liability (as proven last week at Barnsley) who offers us nothing going forward. 
I’d imagine his stats for us- goals/assists etc wouldn’t make good reading, maybe a little Sunday job for @Davefevs to delve into!

Penalty decision aside, O'Dowda was very good against Barnsley. 

If you couldn't see that then that is a case of you having already decided he's shit and refusing to have facts alter your view.

He had been poor for a while before that, but was decent when he came on in both the Barnsley game and the Swansea one.

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6 hours ago, JamesBCFC said:

Penalty decision aside, O'Dowda was very good against Barnsley. 

If you couldn't see that then that is a case of you having already decided he's shit and refusing to have facts alter your view.

He had been poor for a while before that, but was decent when he came on in both the Barnsley game and the Swansea one.

Let’s look at the Barnsley game- 
COD comes on- we’re 2-1 up at that time. 
His major involvement in that game is giving away a penalty in the last minute. We draw 2-2 and drop 2 points. 
 

The Swansea game- 

COD comes on @ 0-1, plays right wing back, makes 1 run forward and falls over in the box, thus creates nothing. He was the only recognised “winger” yet I don’t recall him making any crosses for 1 of our 4 strikers. 
We draw 1-1. 
 

my point on COD is we don’t know what his best position is, he has had 4 years to nail down a position, yet hasn’t. Aside from 4-5 games 2 years ago can you tell me when he’s been a consistent performer? 
 

with our 3-5-2 formation, there is no position that he fits into, potentially LWB at a push, where personally JD and TR are both ahead of him in terms of that being their position. 
 

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8 hours ago, JamesBCFC said:

Penalty decision aside, O'Dowda was very good against Barnsley. 

If you couldn't see that then that is a case of you having already decided he's shit and refusing to have facts alter your view.

He had been poor for a while before that, but was decent when he came on in both the Barnsley game and the Swansea one.

I don’t think he was very good...I thought he was more encouraging that normal.  He was only on for 5 minutes plus there was only action for 4 of the 12 minutes of injury time....so 9 minutes.  It’s not really long enough to get too carried away.

He was “alright” versus Swansea.  Nothing special.  It was not a continuation of Barnsley, and he had 25 minutes plus injury time.  It was ok, but it wasn’t a performance to me that said “he must be a regular starter” from now on.  He might well start on Wednesday, but I would suggest that’s mainly a rotation and rest selection than forcing his way in.  His Barnsley 9 minutes wasn’t enough to get him a start was it.

I am a bit down on Callum generally, but that’s because I think he has more to offer.  He hasn’t hit the heights of the 6-8 game spell in 17/18....that’s 3 years ago.  I can’t keep clinging to that hope, he’s 25, he’s established in the Ireland squad, but can’t get going here.  I had hoped it was an LJ stifling thing....so there is time under Holden, but boy has he got to do it soon.

 

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1 minute ago, Davefevs said:

I don’t think he was very good...I thought he was more encouraging that normal.  He was only on for 5 minutes plus there was only action for 4 of the 12 minutes of injury time....so 9 minutes.  It’s not really long enough to get too carried away.

He was “alright” versus Swansea.  Nothing special.  It was not a continuation of Barnsley, and he had 25 minutes plus injury time.  It was ok, but it wasn’t a performance to me that said “he must be a regular starter” from now on.  He might well start on Wednesday, but I would suggest that’s mainly a rotation and rest selection than forcing his way in.  His Barnsley 9 minutes wasn’t enough to get him a start was it.

I am a bit down on Callum generally, but that’s because I think he has more to offer.  He hasn’t hit the heights of the 6-8 game spell in 17/18....that’s 3 years ago.  I can’t keep clinging to that hope, he’s 25, he’s established in the Ireland squad, but can’t get going here.  I had hoped it was an LJ stifling thing....so there is time under Holden, but boy has he got to do it soon.

 

Nail on head had a spell of 6 to 8 games......and that’s it. Says it all.

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4 hours ago, Davefevs said:

I don’t think he was very good...I thought he was more encouraging that normal.  He was only on for 5 minutes plus there was only action for 4 of the 12 minutes of injury time....so 9 minutes.  It’s not really long enough to get too carried away.

He was “alright” versus Swansea.  Nothing special.  It was not a continuation of Barnsley, and he had 25 minutes plus injury time.  It was ok, but it wasn’t a performance to me that said “he must be a regular starter” from now on.  He might well start on Wednesday, but I would suggest that’s mainly a rotation and rest selection than forcing his way in.  His Barnsley 9 minutes wasn’t enough to get him a start was it.

I am a bit down on Callum generally, but that’s because I think he has more to offer.  He hasn’t hit the heights of the 6-8 game spell in 17/18....that’s 3 years ago.  I can’t keep clinging to that hope, he’s 25, he’s established in the Ireland squad, but can’t get going here.  I had hoped it was an LJ stifling thing....so there is time under Holden, but boy has he got to do it soon.

 

He wasn't as good against Swansea as he was against Barnsley, that foul aside. Granted the Barnsley game wasn't a huge amount of time, but he had been breaking forward out of defence when he got the ball deep, and generally making the right choices (again, penalty decision aside), when decision making seems to normally be a weak spot for him.

I'm not particularly an O'Dowda fan, but the post I quoted was OTT.

He hasn't done enough to start, absolutely agree with that. Just think in his last couple of outings it has been better than he had shown previously.

I also wouldn't say he was very good over the two performances, hence decent.

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On 24/10/2020 at 15:36, pillred said:

Brentford not the team they were are they.

Skimread this thread at the time, but worth noting- not even mentioning that they pulled it back to 3-2- that they had Jansson out and chose an odd formation and team as a result- I looked at it and didn't recognise half of them!

They have lost a certain something though, definitely.

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14 hours ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Skimread this thread at the time, but worth noting- not even mentioning that they pulled it back to 3-2- that they had Jansson out and chose an odd formation and team as a result- I looked at it and didn't recognise half of them!

They have lost a certain something though, definitely.

Looks like I may have spoken too soon.

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