Semenyo not good enough at this level

[westonred]

A nice little piece from this mornings Yorkshire post about Semi

Sometimes you have to just hold your hands up and admit when the opposition are just better than you, and 68th-minute substitute Antoine Semenyo put in one of the best individual performances Town have come up against this season.

[Hampshire Red]

Can't be a young, raw talent, being developed by Lj and Dean Holden AND, at the same time be an experienced striker who always scores. I know that's stating the obvious but we should be excited by him as a home grown player, been out on loan, (well managed) improving under top coaches (remember the differences between arrival and departures of Kodjia and Tammy) and now pushing for starts and goals. Exciting times and as always, he got every chance of improving as long as he doesn't read this forum for his confidence

[Bristol Oil Services]

7 hours ago, Davefevs said:

 He's raw, he's off the cuff.  Just let him loose and see what happens.

That's Level 5 stuff on the 'A' badge, Dave! Love it. "Don't ***k about, get in their faces, get it in the box, see what happens."

[brady bunch]

got me off my seat as soon as he came on with his aggression, direct play and will to win.... but I still think he will have games in the future (maybe Friday!) when he frustrate the pants off everyone. But they will become less the more time he gets.

[grifty]

10 hours ago, Better Red said:

I thought he had a great game when he came on. He is player that could play wide in a front three. But I have not changed my mind I don’t think he will make a championship striker.
I dont think he will score goals at this level. I think he can cause problems playing wider especially when coming on later in games. But will he get you 10/15 goals a season, I just don’t think so. I hope I am proved wrong and have to eat humble pie. I am sure I will be reminded when he scores a goal but for the moment sticking to my guns not a striker.

I think he would score goals, but I can see him being the sort of player who would get 5 in 5 then not score for 5. Once he gets on or two, I could see the floodgates opening a bit.

[maxjak]

I know hindsight is a wonderful get out........but "Better Red's" original post stating Semenyo is not a striker was turned well and truly on it's head tonight?  Give this young man a series of games, either from the start or coming on off the bench and he shows the quality and confidence that has always been there.  Outstanding from Semenyo tonight, and original poster, please do better in the future with your analysis?

[maxjak]

11 hours ago, Better Red said:

I thought he had a great game when he came on. He is player that could play wide in a front three. But I have not changed my mind I don’t think he will make a championship striker.
I dont think he will score goals at this level. I think he can cause problems playing wider especially when coming on later in games. But will he get you 10/15 goals a season, I just don’t think so. I hope I am proved wrong and have to eat humble pie. I am sure I will be reminded when he scores a goal but for the moment sticking to my guns not a striker.

Come on........tuck into that humble pie, and stop being so obtuse

[Red Skin]

3 hours ago, Hampshire Red said:

Can't be a young, raw talent, being developed by Lj and Dean Holden AND, at the same time be an experienced striker who always scores. I know that's stating the obvious but we should be excited by him as a home grown player, been out on loan, (well managed) improving under top coaches (remember the differences between arrival and departures of Kodjia and Tammy) and now pushing for starts and goals. Exciting times and as always, he got every chance of improving as long as he doesn't read this forum for his confidence

Out of likes, but spot on.

He strikes the ball more cleanly and harder than both Famara and Weiman.  He is stronger than both on the ball.  His passing and his awareness of others is really good.   He can dwell on the ball a little long and he needs to play between the sticks and gamble a bit more, but a great talent.   I'm really enjoying his performances this season and as his confidence grows he will get better.  

[Numero Uno]

More often than not it’s the same people moaning “the Academy is not working” who are the same people who will not make allowances for young players full stop. They expect young ‘uns to come in and be the finished article.

At this stage you can expect a player lacking his experience and of his type to come in and have games where the ball is bouncing everywhere off him and then the following week he will completely tear a team apart like he did last night.

Give the kid a bit of time, cut him some slack and watch his consistency levels improve. Even the very best young players like Hudson Odoi, Sancho etc. have this issue to get over.

[BetterRedthanBlue]

6 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

More often than not it’s the same people moaning “the Academy is not working” who are the same people who will not make allowances for young players full stop. They expect young ‘uns to come in and be the finished article.

At this stage you can expect a player lacking his experience and of his type to come in and have games where the ball is bouncing everywhere off him and then the following week he will completely tear a team apart like he did last night.

Give the kid a bit of time, cut him some slack and watch his consistency levels improve. Even the very best young players like Hudson Odoi, Sancho etc. have this issue to get over.

What you have to remember is Semenyo doesn't have the academy background. We got him from the college he was and in some ways still is quite raw. 

But that being said you can see the hard work he's put in and he looks confident as well (didn't look too confident under LJ but when he's chopping and changing week in and out its understandable). He caused Huddersfield all sorts of problems whether being wide or central because he is direct. 

I do think he needs to gamble a bit more in the box but I do think the goals will come this season (assuming he stays injury free). 

[Lew-T]

There’s definitely a player there. That little cameo last night was the best I’ve seen of Semenyo. His pace, power, passing and touch was sublime! 
 

I’m just not sure what formation or striking partner suits him. 

[hinsleburg]

Semenyo is a bit of a strange one for me currently.

Seems to be making more of an impact off of the bench as opposed to starting, but does that then hinder is development if he's not regularly starting games? Or is it where he's playing a different role when he comes on out wider as opposed to starting through the middle?

As per the above I would like to see us start a game as a 433 with Semenyo wide Left and alternating with whoever is on the right. (O'Dowda I guess due to our lack of wingers

So maybe (and not neccessarily Friday as unsure due to fatigue injuries) we could see comething like this soon

Bentley

Hunt

Vyner/Moore

Kalas

Dasilva

 

Nagy/Bakinson (Deeper)

Brunt/ the other of the AN/TB above

Paterson

O'Dowda

Martin/Wells/Fam

Semenyo

Seems to be quite balanced and structured with lots of options off the bench, I also think it may benefit Massengo who I feel would provide useful energy but not as the deepest midfielder as per the first game of the season.

The only other thing with Semenyo, he seems to have gone from having two left feet to actually being really strong on both feet which is a really useful attribute to have. Would love to see him bag a league goal soon as think he could take off.

[Yellow&Blue&Red]

I didn't watch the game last night, only the highlights. One thing I've been looking for signs of a developing connection between Semenyo and Dasilva. Were they linking up well?

[Davefevs]

56 minutes ago, BetterRedthenBlue said:

What you have to remember is Semenyo doesn't have the academy background. We got him from the college he was and in some ways still is quite raw. 

But that being said you can see the hard work he's put in and he looks confident as well (didn't look too confident under LJ but when he's chopping and changing week in and out its understandable). He caused Huddersfield all sorts of problems whether being wide or central because he is direct. 

I do think he needs to gamble a bit more in the box but I do think the goals will come this season (assuming he stays injury free). 

I wrote the other week about his rawness and recalled another striker who didn’t go through the youth system....Kodjia.  Not saying they’re the same, but they will do things unexpected....good and bad.

[Red-Robbo]

3 hours ago, JonDolman said:

Was amazed by the over the top criticism of Antoine last season.

Yes, he had some bad games, some okay games too I thought. 

 

I think you are being too generous, Jon. His contribution in the games he played last season was next to nothing.

However, he was only 19. There was the potential for improvement. With young players, there always is. 

I'd say that potential is beginning to be realised.

I wonder how good he might be when he reaches his mid-20s?

[Whitchurch1966]

Also have to remember some of the comments by LJ last season about Semenyo, he said as he didn't come through a traditional academy he had a bit to learn about the basics, there was no doubting his potential ability but he had to learn where to be when not in possession and also some of the things not to do when in possession. These things are drummed into kids at a young age in the academy, I think this is why he didn't go out on loan last season, he needed to stay and be coached. We are seeing the benefits of this now. I think he can go on to great things, hopefully with City.

[Mr Popodopolous]

There's a player in there for sure.

Strikers and goals, maybe that Semenyo is more of a support striker. Maybe mix of goals, assists and all round contribution as opposed to say a Toney, goals galore.

Pulling wider could be useful tactically, especially with Weimann injured. None of the below in back 3 are natural left footers which is a problem but..in theory with current injury issues?

           Bentley

 Vyner Moore Kalas

Hunt Bakinson Nagy DaSilva

    Semenyo        Paterson

                Martin 

A sort of 3-4-1-2. NOT wingers, more like wide strikers in the case of Semenyo and Paterson. Which when Paterson shifts to the 10, can become a 3-4-1-2 and latterly 3-5-2 with Semenyo and Martin pairing up front.

However Semenyo and Paterson would also be tasked with stopping Hunt and DaSilva getting isolated or bypassed hence the two layers in wide areas ie 3-4-2-1.

           Bentley

Hunt Kalas Moore DaSilva

       ? Bakinson Nagy

Semenyo            Paterson

              Martin

4-3-3/4-3-2-1. Some similar principles to the above, but unsure who third man in CM might be.

Brunt feels too old from the start, O'Dowda not a true central midfielder though he can commit players and display high energy.

[Lanterne Rouge]

I want to see him running at the Cardiff defence on Friday, they`re not exactly blessed with skilful ball players at the back. Get a couple booked early doors and he can fill his boots.

[Davefevs]

3 hours ago, JonDolman said:

Semenyo was on the right. Though he did set up Dasilva's goal.

Yep....although he showed up well with Jay down the left channel v Swansea....so he’s got some versatility too.

[Better Red]

9 hours ago, maxjak said:

I know hindsight is a wonderful get out........but "Better Red's" original post stating Semenyo is not a striker was turned well and truly on it's head tonight?  Give this young man a series of games, either from the start or coming on off the bench and he shows the quality and confidence that has always been there.  Outstanding from Semenyo tonight, and original poster, please do better in the future with your analysis?

As I said when he starts to score goals  I will be the first to say he proved me wrong. But almost ten league games in his goal tally is zero championship goals. Again I will say he could play wide in a three but as with O’Dowda if they don’t score goals on a more regular basis then we will have to find players who can or we won’t improve and get into the top six. Yes it’s not all about goals but come on let’s all be honest if Wells does not score for a few games everyone is scrambling for him to be replaced.  But because he is young and one of our own he gets bigged up beyond what we have actually seen. Last night he was good for 25 mins. But I have watched all the games this season and I am just being calling what I have seen. I don’t see a Championship striker in him. This season we will see as I am sure he will get plenty of game time unless we buy/loan in then window. Maybe I am wrong but lets judge that on goals not on future promise. He is a Striker and ultimately that is about goals. Unless we are now saying he is a winger as he can’t make it as a striker and that where I started. So not ready for the humble pie just yet....

[Port Said Red]

Another assist and dynamic display last night.

Not bad for a player not good enough for this level. 

[Numero Uno]

It amazes me that people fail to make allowance for younger players. All they see is the here and now and are unable to look at a player and think.... give him 12 months and he’ll be a player.

Go back 6 months on here and look through some of the comments on Semenyo.......embarrassing tbh.

[Lanterne Rouge]

56 minutes ago, Port Said Red said:

Another assist and dynamic display last night.

Not bad for a player not good enough for this level. 

He obviously tired in the second half, faded a bit and was out on his feet at the end. Just goes to show the shift he`s been putting in.

Of all the players I think he`ll appreciate the two weeks off now more than most.

[slartibartfast]

The Ben Bloom "watch along "channel made him MOM, he was raving about him, and very complimentary about City, in general .

[Davefevs]

He sorted his defensive positioning second half, he got caught a bit half and half earlier in the game...and Hunt had a pretty comfortable night against Hoilett who’s caused us probs over the years.  He got through good work too.

[mozo]

I was really impressed last night. I think Semenyo looked like a solid Championship player. I know we describe him as raw, but compared to Kasey Palmer for example he looks more tactically aware and less error prone.

[Sheltons Army]

4 minutes ago, mozo said:

I was really impressed last night. I think Semenyo looked like a solid Championship player. I know we describe him as raw, but compared to Kasey Palmer for example he looks more tactically aware and less error prone.

His game has improved so much , a massive kick on for me

Not in a case of suddenly beating three players and dipping one in the top corner but what I would say in game awareness and good basics - Game awareness , when to drop , when to make a run , positional discipline

Reviewing the game last night , both he and Wells did a admirable amount of work as we dropped into a 4-1-4-1 and there were a number of occasions where they were hand in hand with Hunt / Jay helping them out - That can easily go unnoticed 

He has a lot of obvious qualities and potential in the final third but his all round game is where the progression and development is quite stark and impressive

He has developed into a player that can and will contribute to a performance even if he has a game where he’s not having success in the final third

[Port Said Red]

46 minutes ago, Lanterne Rouge said:

He obviously tired in the second half, faded a bit and was out on his feet at the end. Just goes to show the shift he`s been putting in.

Of all the players I think he`ll appreciate the two weeks off now more than most.

 

30 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

He sorted his defensive positioning second half, he got caught a bit half and half earlier in the game...and Hunt had a pretty comfortable night against Hoilett who’s caused us probs over the years.  He got through good work too.

Did I hear the commentator say he had picked up an injury in the first half and he was surprised he came back on?

I thought he showed he was learning though, as Dave said he got caught a couple of times, but then later on he was covering well.

[Numero Uno]

2 minutes ago, Sheltons Army said:

His game has improved so much , a massive kick on for me

Not in a case of suddenly beating three players and dipping one in the top corner but what I would say in game awareness and good basics - Game awareness , when to drop , when to make a run , positional discipline

Reviewing the game last night , both he and Wells did a admirable amount of work as we dropped into a 4-1-4-1 and there were a number of occasions where they were hand in hand with Hunt / Jay helping them out - That can easily go unnoticed 

He has a lot of obvious qualities and potential in the final third but his all round game is where the progression and development is quite stark and impressive

He has developed into a player that can and will contribute to a performance even if he has a game where he’s not having success in the final third

That what talented youngsters do....they improve as they go. Great to see.

[italian dave]

Is this going to be the 'Matt Smith is awful' thread of 20/21?