Gerry Gow-Graeme Souness comparison

[Slacker]

I am currently reading a book by Jimmy Greaves,in which he lists his top 50 all time great footballers.Having just arrived at the chapter featuring Graeme Souness,it got me thinking about Gerry Gow.I saw Gerry play a few times and watched Graeme on the telly.In my mind they had much in common as players.Obviously someone that played for Bristol City is never going to be featured in any of these kind of lists,but how good was Gerry compared to Souness?

Was Souness a better player or just part of a better,more fashionable team?Please try to be objective and not just say "Gerry would have kicked his arse" 

 

I already know that!

[Davefevs]

Souness was class and a vital part of Liverpool's success.  Without him Liverpool would not have been so good.  Right up there as one of the best midfielders in Div1 at the time, if not the best.

Gerry was our equivalent for City, but not anywhere Souness's level imho.

[Lanterne Rouge]

2 minutes ago, Slacker said:

I am currently reading a book by Jimmy Greaves,in which he lists his top 50 all time great footballers.Having just arrived at the chapter featuring Graeme Souness,it got me thinking about Gerry Gow.I saw Gerry play a few times and watched Graeme on the telly.In my mind they had much in common as players.Obviously someone that played for Bristol City is never going to be featured in any of these kind of lists,but how good was Gerry compared to Souness?

Was Souness a better player or just part of a better,more fashionable team?Please try to be objective and not just say "Gerry would have kicked his arse" 

 

I already know that!

Difficult to say. I probably saw Sir Gerry play 100+ times but Souness only on TV (might have seen him live a couple of times in his Boro days) so I`d always go for GG. I do think Gerry was a bit more honest and up front though - he never hid his competitiveness whereas Souness always struck me as a nasty bastard and a bit snidey with it.

[B1ackbird]

I always felt Souness must have been a great player to keep Gow out of the Scotland team, I saw Jerry Rob  Kenny Dalglish of the ball at Aston Gate, when Liverpool played there. 

Was Souness a great player? Yes, 

Gow had a touch of genius, and he'd be the first name on my best City player I ever saw list, given that I never got to see The Great John Atyeo.. 

[cidered abroad]

10 minutes ago, B1ackbird said:

I always felt Souness must have been a great player to keep Gow out of the Scotland team, I saw Jerry Rob  Kenny Dalglish of the ball at Aston Gate, when Liverpool played there. 

Was Souness a great player? Yes, 

Gow had a touch of genius, and he'd be the first name on my best City player I ever saw list, given that I never got to see The Great John Atyeo.. 

I believe that Big John and Sir Gerry would have nominated each other for the greatest City player of the years since the end of the Second War. I say that without any disrespect to any from 1900 to 1939 and without any attempt to belittle any other City player of the same period. Both started as young players in their late teens and if we had not had the relgation in 1980 followed by the financial disaster, both would have ended their careers as one club men.

I saw them play hundreds of matches, home and away, and never walked out of the ground at the end of the game, feeling that they had not given their all for Bristol City.

As to the comparison with Souness, perhaps Souness was lucky that he was with bigger clubs which helped to build his reputation over a Gerry Gow.

[GrahamC]

Gow was the fiercest of competitors, I’m pretty sure AD said once that he was always favourite for a 40/60 ball..

He was a regular contributor of goals too but Souness, who of course was also a hard man, was a better user of the ball.

Scotland were simply a far better side in those days, the likes of Rioch, Masson, Gemmill, Hartford & Wark were all competing for central midfield places, so unbelievably Gow never won a single cap.

[Sheltons Army]

23 minutes ago, GrahamC said:

Gow was the fiercest of competitors, I’m pretty sure AD said once that he was always favourite for a 40/60 ball..

He was a regular contributor of goals too but Souness, who of course was also a hard man, was a better user of the ball.

Scotland were simply a far better side in those days, the likes of Rioch, Masson, Gemmill, Hartford & Wark were all competing for central midfield places, so unbelievably Gow never won a single cap.

Would say he matched Souness in physicality , possibly a better tackler than Souness , and would match him in engine and workrate

As you say Graham I’d say Souness was the better passer of a ball and more of a goal threat

Both fantastic players, and legends in their own right 

[wendyredredrobin]

Put Souness in our team and Gow in Liverpools and I think you would find that Gow would have proved an improvement on Souness.  I'm biased of course because Gerry Gow is my favourite City player of all time having watched his home debut and nearly every home game he ever played in along with a handful of away games (Fulham,Spurs, Arsenal, Villa and Coventry away games spring to mind). I was also lucky enough to meet Gerry and have a short chat to him in the early 70s.

That doesn't mean I don't think Souness was a freat player, but Gerry edges it for me on the basis that he was able to do it in a less expensive and less fashiinable team.

Don't forget also, that he is highly regarded by Man City fans as well.

[Robbored]

Souness was a classy midfielder and the core of the Liverpool team back then. Top, top player but with an edge that got him into trouble with referees many times. 
Much as I and all City fans of my generation who saw and admired GG  he was very much a poor mans Souness.

They had two things in common, both hard tackling midfielders and both Scottish but there was a definite gulf in footballing class.

[reddoh]

Just now, Robbored said:

Souness was a classy midfielder and the core of the Liverpool team back then. Top, top player but with an edge that got him into trouble with referees many times. 
Much as I and all City fans of my generation who saw and admired GG  he was very much a poor mans Souness.

They had two things in common, both hard tackling midfielders and both Scottish but there was a definite gulf in footballing class.

where's the bollocks emoji ?

[wendyredredrobin]

6 minutes ago, reddoh said:

where's the bollocks emoji ?

+1

[joe jordans teeth]

2 hours ago, Slacker said:

I am currently reading a book by Jimmy Greaves,in which he lists his top 50 all time great footballers.Having just arrived at the chapter featuring Graeme Souness,it got me thinking about Gerry Gow.I saw Gerry play a few times and watched Graeme on the telly.In my mind they had much in common as players.Obviously someone that played for Bristol City is never going to be featured in any of these kind of lists,but how good was Gerry compared to Souness?

Was Souness a better player or just part of a better,more fashionable team?Please try to be objective and not just say "Gerry would have kicked his arse" 

 

I already know that!

It’s standards mate,Souness was a hell of a player and as much as Gow is a legend here he was nowhere near as good 

[Ska Junkie]

Souness made the game look easy as if he was playing in slow motion at times.

GG was good, very good, Souness was great.

Gerry was and always will be a legend but Souness was a different level from everyone at the time IMHO.

[downendcity]

That Souness was a great player is not in doubt.

That those of us that saw GG play think that he was a great player, is also not in doubt - I strongly suspect that a large majority of my generation will have him as their all time favourite and probably best player.

Comparing the two is more difficult. It would be easy to say that Souness was the better because of the trophies and  international caps he won, but how much of that is due to the quality of the teams in which he played - the Liverpool team of the time was an absolutely great team?

Would Gow have been as good as Souness, had he been playing in that Liverpool team? We will never know, but I don't think he would have looked out of place and they might even have made him an even better player.

While it’s all speculation, I just count myself lucky enough to have seen him play from his early days as a youth team graduate to becoming the heartbeat of the promotion winning team. I can still picture him covering the muddy Ashton Gate with that distinctive run - bouncing along on the balls of his feet - and tearing into tackles like a terrier.

We will be lucky to see another player of his ilk any time soon.

 

 

[Ska Junkie]

10 minutes ago, downendcity said:

That Souness was a great player is not in doubt.

That those of us that saw GG play think that he was a great player, is also not in doubt - I strongly suspect that a large majority of my generation will have him as their all time favourite and probably best player.

Comparing the two is more difficult. It would be easy to say that Souness was the better because of the trophies and  international caps he won, but how much of that is due to the quality of the teams in which he played - the Liverpool team of the time was an absolutely great team?

Would Gow have been as good as Souness, had he been playing in that Liverpool team? We will never know, but I don't think he would have looked out of place and they might even have made him an even better player.

While it’s all speculation, I just count myself lucky enough to have seen him play from his early days as a youth team graduate to becoming the heartbeat of the promotion winning team. I can still picture him covering the muddy Ashton Gate with that distinctive run - bouncing along on the balls of his feet - and tearing into tackles like a terrier.

We will be lucky to see another player of his ilk any time soon.

 

 

Spot on DC. I certainly, for one, was not belittling GG as a player, he was and still is my hero.  He was great. 

Being compared to Souness is probably an unfair comparison as he could, potentially, have been possibly the best midfielder in the world at the time, certainly in the role he played and that includes the Germans, Dutch, Argentine and Brazilians so coming behind him is most certainly no criticism.

[City oz]

9 hours ago, Slacker said:

I am currently reading a book by Jimmy Greaves,in which he lists his top 50 all time great footballers.Having just arrived at the chapter featuring Graeme Souness,it got me thinking about Gerry Gow.I saw Gerry play a few times and watched Graeme on the telly.In my mind they had much in common as players.Obviously someone that played for Bristol City is never going to be featured in any of these kind of lists,but how good was Gerry compared to Souness?

Was Souness a better player or just part of a better,more fashionable team?Please try to be objective and not just say "Gerry would have kicked his arse" 

 

I already know that!

Not sure if you can compare as mostly they played at different levels. However I would like to think Sir Gerry was more tougher and aggressive. Gerry played in the great years of the 70s and he was a class player for City and I think he even got a cap for Scotland in his younger years.

Both Souness and Gow will always be heroes for the supporters of clubs they played for.

[Red7]

Gow is a legend. And rightly so. But he never did this:

[City oz]

Lifting up a cup is not a comparison as they were both at different levels and with different clubs in their respective Clubs and careers.

Both are and will always be hero’s. 

The original post was around the similarities between the two of them and not the success in lifting a cup.

 

 

[downendcity]

A long  time ago I attended a talk given by a retired referee. 

When asked who was the hardest player to referee he answered "Souness". 

He went on to say that while Souness was a hard player and a fearsome tackler, he was a snide off the ball and in the referees ear throughout the game. 

[Robbored]

10 minutes ago, downendcity said:

A long  time ago I attended a talk given by a retired referee. 

When asked who was the hardest player to referee he answered "Souness". 

He went on to say that while Souness was a hard player and a fearsome tackler, he was a snide off the ball and in the referees ear throughout the game. 

After he retired Souness admitted that he he needed that ‘edge’ to perform at his best and was down to his competitive nature. He added that he used it ‘excessively’  at times and that led to his poor disciplinary record.

GG didn’t have that side to him - at least I never saw it.

[Oh Louie louie]

Jimmy case, and souness in the same midfield.

Case didnt win a international cap, i recall, i think he was the only non international in that liverpool side.

 

[Barry Sheene]

Wrong to compare them in my opinion. Souness as I remember was absolute class as was Gerry Gow.

I know one thing if Gerry was playing today he would walk into the current Scotland side and make it better.

Both great players.

[Oh Louie louie]

You watch any of liverpools games in europe from that era, more often than not souness is the best player on the park.

If you upset him, and he got you, not many got up.

Funny thing i remember about him, he gave a interview, to be a player manager, you have to remain calm he said,

Needless to say he was sent off on his debut!

[Lanterne Rouge]

43 minutes ago, downendcity said:

A long  time ago I attended a talk given by a retired referee. 

When asked who was the hardest player to referee he answered "Souness". 

He went on to say that while Souness was a hard player and a fearsome tackler, he was a snide off the ball and in the referees ear throughout the game. 

This was my impression too - albeit from only watching him on TV.

I wonder if Souness and Gerry ever played against each other.

[ashton_fan]

I saw GG from when he first came into the team and he was the best midfielder to play for us, I'm not saying the most skilful but his work rate was phenomenal and he always made a contribution even if he wasn't playing well which is why he was never dropped as far as I can remember. I also saw Souness play and I have to say he was a higher skill level than GG, a top Div 1 player. GG played most of his games in Div 2 although having seen him play in Div 1 he was above average at that level so not quite up to Souness's level but that's no insult to GG, a player like Souness would never be playing for Bristol City anyway so GG's as good as we'll ever get.

[City oz]

6 minutes ago, Barry Sheene said:

Wrong to compare them in my opinion. Souness as I remember was absolute class as was Gerry Gow.

I know one thing if Gerry was playing today he would walk into the current Scotland side and make it better.

Both great players.

Another comparison would include Don Gillies another great scot that joined City around 1973. 

Everyone will compare players at different eras but its the quality and their success individually that needs to be taken in to account, who they played for and what they achieved.

You cant compare Souness with any City players as Souness was lucky enough to be at a team at the height of his career that managed to achieve. European success. 

Gerry Gow is a legend to City supporters and so Is Don Gillies, Jimmy Mann etc and many others.

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, Oh Louie louie said:

You watch any of liverpools games in europe from that era, more often than not souness is the best player on the park.

If you upset him, and he got you, not many got up.

Funny thing i remember about him, he gave a interview, to be a player manager, you have to remain calm he said,

Needless to say he was sent off on his debut!

The joke after that Rangers debut was:

Scottish bloke walks into a pub and asks the barman for a Souness.

The barman replies - what’s that

“One half and I’ll be off”

1 hour ago, Lanterne Rouge said:

This was my impression too - albeit from only watching him on TV.

I wonder if Souness and Gerry ever played against each other.

Pretty sure they played against each other in 78/79 (Liverpool won 1-0 at Anfield) and 79/80 (Liverpool won 3-1 and 4-0).  Souness played in all 3, likelihood Gow did too.  Probably played against each other in Div 2 against Boro in early 70s.

[Taz]

Never saw either live, only through video packages over the years - wasn't interested in football until the mid 90s when I was about 9/10.

Put them both in the same side though - you wouldn't concede too many goals!!

[RoystonFoote'snephew]

Gerry Gow was a Bristol City legend, one of the greatest players ever to wear the City shirt and arguably our greatest ever midfielder, certainly as a tackler, but there is a reason why Graeme Souness was the fulcrum of Scotland's midfield and it wasn't just because he played for Liverpool. Putting my rose tinted glasses away Souness was Gow plus, equally as strong in the tackle but with a better passing range. With Terry McDermott he formed the most formidable midfield in England at the time. Gow may have gone further in a better team but Souness was the better player. 

[Davefevs]

13 minutes ago, RoystonFoote'snephew said:

Gerry Gow was a Bristol City legend, one of the greatest players ever to wear the City shirt and arguably our greatest ever midfielder, certainly as a tackler, but there is a reason why Graeme Souness was the fulcrum of Scotland's midfield and it wasn't just because he played for Liverpool. Putting my rose tinted glasses away Souness was Gow plus, equally as strong in the tackle but with a better passing range. With Terry McDermott he formed the most formidable midfield in England at the time. Gow may have gone further in a better team but Souness was the better player. 

That’s a good way of describing him.