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Kasey Palmer


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38 minutes ago, GrahamC said:

This.

Never understood why we bought him, mediocre whilst on loan (& whilst on loan at Blackburn, Huddersfield, Derby) the reason he never gets a run is because he is never consistent enough to deserve one.

Does the occasional amazing pass but scores very few (11 in his career) and not much by the way of assists, either.

If Williams & Walsh were ever fit to make some sort of contribution I doubt he would even be mentioned.

Hoping Swansea take him off our hands but I doubt they will.

That was down to LJ who could see what strengths Palmer had but also his weaknesses and believed that with a full pre season under LJs tutelage that he could improve him.........unfortunately that improvement  didn’t happen.............

 

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9 hours ago, Wade Wilson said:

I would. He’s never been given the run, or as much of a chance to impress

Every player gets a chance to impress every day in every training session.  KP obviously hasn't convinced the current staff he deserves a chance more than others in the squad.

You might argue that Pato and Callum haven't translated that to performances on the pitch consistently enough, but the days of throwing a player on into the team to see how he does are gone.   We can't give every player in the squad a run of games to see how they get on.  You'd throw away a season doing that.  They have to earn it in training.  

It's a no from me.  

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9 hours ago, Wade Wilson said:

I would. He’s never been given the run, or as much of a chance to impress, as COD and Pato. Stick him, as said, in the hole behind Fam/Martin and he could thrive, he’d have Bakinson/Nagy behind him to protect him allowing him the freedom he needs to create for us. We’ve barely had any shots the last few games as we have absolutely zero creativity, you can say “Palmer doesn’t offer anything defensively” but does Pato? Half the time I’m not even sure he’s on the pitch let alone where on it, Palmer at least sticks to his position. 
 

With Eliasson permanently gone we’re totally bereft of that game changing pass player, at least we still own Kasey so why not use him? Can’t be worse then the current combo of Pato/COD can it?

Also Pato was the best he’s been after he returned from Derby last Jan so. . . who knows, could be a master stroke. 

When you say he has never been given a run in the team, pretty sure he started the the first 10ish games of last season, got a few assists but offered next to kettle defensively got dropped and  never got in! 
He needs a system built around him I think for him to shine and I’m not sure we are prepared to to do that, no matter how talented he is!

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43 minutes ago, bexhill reds said:

Not for me, I think he’s a bit of a show pony, tore apart a L2 defence at the start of the season, but offers little against better teams. Can anyone honestly say that he would have made a difference yesterday and against Watford?

Pato often does go ghost like, but I sometimes think that this is more to do with teams nullifying him as he is seen as our more creative output.

until Williams and Walsh are back, our midfield is full of busy bees with only a periodic creative element.

 

Stop blaming individual players can i suggest its DH the one you should be pointing your comments too and not the player or players. “Busy bees” and the lack of creative agreement I understand but its not the players its the positions they are put in by the governor and that is DH.

Many posts over the last few weeks are targeting players abilities by what I call home alone wan a be experts.

i think our current squad is good but not the depth for a true promotion push this season.

its the manager where the responsibility lies to manage the players and put forward his directive in the starting 11.

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I always liked KP when he came on to the pitch as he would take a chance with a pass - it might come off, it might not.

The problem with our overall play at the moment is that all the players seem afraid to try the difficult pass for fear of losing the ball - hence too much pass pass pass.

If you watch the ‘top’ teams in the division they seem to ‘lose’ the ball more often than we do - by trying the quick forward pass, and then fight to get it back - which they often do.

This way of playing makes for a more exciting, attacking style of play.

Looking at Readings first goal yesterday - when was the last time we had a player try to create a small space for a shot as Ejaria did, and admittedly he got lucky with the deflection - but .... if you don’t buy a ticket you don’t win the prize - ie shoot and sometimes you score with a deflection.

At least KP would try the defence winning ball. .....  I say, unless Williams and Walsh somehow come back fit and creative - bring KP back in Jan!

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1 hour ago, City oz said:

Robo,

nah its not the injuries that are the issue is that the injuries has showed that the squad is not good enough. 

And as for the last few seasons, Not got a midfield. Forwards must get so frustrated with lack of creativity, we haven’t had the balance right in midfield for how many seasons now?

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35 minutes ago, Bobbie said:

Absolute nonsense. He had an off game yesterday but he’s had a great season so far

Great season so far? Really? So why all the posts about him, as I think someone else has mentioned, you get one good game in five, if you’re lucky, and as for the other games ☹️☹️

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Besides his ability to see and deliver a killer pass, onee quality KP has that we lack, and have done for some time, is having the power and pace to break through opposition lines in midfield. 

I understand concerns about, and criticism of, KP's workrate and defensive ability, but can you play a 3 man midfield that works hard, covers back, holds its shape well and is solid but not question its almost complete lack of any threat going forward and the limited supply they provide to our forwards? 

It might be that Williams and/Walsh will provide what we are missing but if theirvrermturn is any more delayed DH could do worse than consider KP as an option. 

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14 minutes ago, petehinton said:

Clearly brought here under false pretences. Feel a bit sorry for him tbh. He’s an improvement on Paterson when he plays like he did yesterday. 

A bad Palmer performance is much worse than the Pato one yesterday imo.

Some games last season Palmer kept giving it away, often in deep, dangerous areas of the pitch. He doesn't have the work rate like Pato or the running off the ball either.

The best version of Palmer is very good, like Charlton sub appearance last season, first half of QPR, Derby away. But more bad than good overall so far for us.

It was probably a terrible signing, 3.5 million and apparently high wages. Other than the two Bolton games in league and cup, one being a late sub appearance on his debut, he didn't really do much on loan and was behind Paterson then.

LJ thought a preseason would get him fitter, which is bizarre because players should be fitter during the season, not before the season begins. He didnt look any fitter to me since signing him permanently.

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He couldn’t get in the Blackburn side when on loan . He can’t get in our team under two different managers . He can’t get into Swansea’s starting 11 either . 
we’ve all got a opinion and so we should , but none of us has a clue compared to the various managers that don’t play him . He’s obviously not good enough in certain aspects of his game . 

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1 hour ago, Robbored said:

That was down to LJ who could see what strengths Palmer had but also his weaknesses and believed that with a full pre season under LJs tutelage that he could improve him.........unfortunately that improvement  didn’t happen.............

 

I've never been convinced that LJ ever wanted to sign him. In fact, given what we could see from his loan spell, it was clear it was going to be a gamble. That it was a £4m gamble was unconscionable.

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1 hour ago, mossey said:

And as for the last few seasons, Not got a midfield. Forwards must get so frustrated with lack of creativity, we haven’t had the balance right in midfield for how many seasons now?

Oz is suggesting that the squad isn’t deep enough and the lengthy injured list has highlighted that. I daresay that applies to many Championship clubs.

As Deano said post match yesterday  ‘no excuses’.

I can’t help bu like the guy. As honest as they come.

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3 minutes ago, Sleepy1968 said:

I've never been convinced that LJ ever wanted to sign him. In fact, given what we could see from his loan spell, it was clear it was going to be a gamble. That it was a £4m gamble was unconscionable.

LJ took that gamble in the belief that he could develop Palmer into a more all round player but unfortunately  it didn’t pay off. 

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1 hour ago, JonDolman said:

A bad Palmer performance is much worse than the Pato one yesterday imo.

Some games last season Palmer kept giving it away, often in deep, dangerous areas of the pitch. He doesn't have the work rate like Pato or the running off the ball either.

The best version of Palmer is very good, like Charlton sub appearance last season, first half of QPR, Derby away. But more bad than good overall so far for us.

It was probably a terrible signing, 3.5 million and apparently high wages. Other than the two Bolton games in league and cup, one being a late sub appearance on his debut, he didn't really do much on loan and was behind Paterson then.

LJ thought a preseason would get him fitter, which is bizarre because players should be fitter during the season, not before the season begins. He didnt look any fitter to me since signing him permanently.

He started on fire last year, then as soon as Afobe got injured he was binned out and became LJ’s fall guy for whatever reason. FWIW I still buy into the fact that if we wanted Kalas and JD, Chelsea wanted us to buy Palmer as well. And the for the first few months of the season last season,  it looked like a master stroke. 

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Just perhaps the Blackburn and Swansea managers not putting him in their squads have the same thoughts about him as DH may have. Could be that he thinks a loan move could kick start his career and he comes back here a more rounded player or that he just doesn't trust or rate him. Apart from a few odd games I think the latter could be right.

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11 hours ago, phantom said:

Unless his work rate off the ball has massively increased I wouldn't bother.

I'm not sure he's started a game yet for Swansea yet,considering they've been chasing him for years he's hardly uprooting trees over there.

 

Tbf, it’s not work rate off the ball we need, it’s guile and ability ‘on’ the ball that’s needed.

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6 minutes ago, petehinton said:

He started on fire last year, then as soon as Afobe got injured he was binned out and became LJ’s fall guy for whatever reason. FWIW I still buy into the fact that if we wanted Kalas and JD, Chelsea wanted us to buy Palmer as well. And the for the first few months of the season last season,  it looked like a master stroke. 

Agree and people have short memories about how good he was at start of last season. Palmer literally gets one audition to perform and unless he does something spectacular then he’s considered a failure. Other players have been given hours and hours to perform and still get played in the hope that they come good, whilst Kasey gets cameos at best.  Not saying he always helps himself but personally don’t think he’s been given a fair crack.

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6 hours ago, Tipps69 said:

I think given our complete lack of options with regards to resting Paterson he has to come back unless the club can either get Swansea to agree to a permanent deal now or we intend to go into the transfer market ourselves to solve our problem.

Of course, our issues could be solved should Williams & Walsh suddenly become fit but seeing as they are currently as fit as myself, that looks unlikely & we can’t carry on through the second half of the season expecting them to hit fitness every two weeks to then be told they’ve relapsed again!

I guess we have until the end of January to decide unless things get worse here regards injuries.

If we do get Swansea to take him off our hands in January it’s likely to be for a cut-down price as they’ll need to take on his wages too.  I’d like to think we could play hardball, but I think even MA might struggle to charm a deal on this one.

So if Diedhiou signs a pre-contract abroad and say Palmer goes for £1m....we’ve lost £8m combined.  Now, from an FFP point of view it’s not quite that bad as most of Fam’s fee has been amortised over the first 3 years of his contract.

2 hours ago, Robbored said:

That was down to LJ who could see what strengths Palmer had but also his weaknesses and believed that with a full pre season under LJs tutelage that he could improve him.........unfortunately that improvement  didn’t happen.............

 

Another player who LJ thought his excellent management skills could sort.

In fairness I think Palmer could be a decent player, but even being a fan, I’d cut my losses.

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4 hours ago, The Horse With No Name said:

We seem to have an awful lot of problems , dont we?

It's weird because on paper Palmer should solve one of our biggest, and most persistent, problems of the past couple of years. For a while we've struggled with creative and penetrative passing in the 10-15 yards in front of the opposition penalty box. We saw it again yesterday where we had lots of passing and possession in midfield but couldn't get the ball in to the strikers to turn that possession into a chance.

Palmer should solve it, and on occasions he did. However he either didn't do it regularly enough or in solving that issue his actions created others. 

Personally I would not have signed him permanently and would be fine to let him go and have a good career elsewhere.

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50 minutes ago, petehinton said:

He started on fire last year, then as soon as Afobe got injured he was binned out and became LJ’s fall guy for whatever reason. FWIW I still buy into the fact that if we wanted Kalas and JD, Chelsea wanted us to buy Palmer as well. And the for the first few months of the season last season,  it looked like a master stroke. 

Agree that is probably why we signed him. Which seems like it meant we got Dasilva very cheap as part of the deal.

A big problem for me about Kasey is his fitness levels.

Start of 19/20 season I think he played well in Derby game, QPR first half before being subbed early in the 2nd as he could barely run, Boro on the left wing he scored from Eliasson cross, again decent first half before tiring badly early in the 2nd.

Apparently he worked really hard in preseason to improve his fitness levels, but he didnt look fit at all

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12 hours ago, BCFC Grim said:

Oh come on. Patterson offers nothing. Bottles tackles, doesn't look for the ball. Waste of a shirt.

A ridiculously blinkered statement. Isn’t he our joint top scorer who has created more chances for his teammates than any player in our side, in fact the most in the division until recently. That’s some going for a player who you are accusing of hiding.

By all means have a pop at his inconsistency but to say “he offers nothing” just flies in the face of simple facts, nothing else to be said about that statement. He was poor yesterday, no doubt about it, but it doesn’t make him useless. Ask his teammates if they think he is as crap as you think he is.

Always the same on here, we lose a game and the whole lot of them are rubbish. The sense of entitlement from a sizeable minority of our “supporters” given the squad we’ve got, the long term injuries we have to our better players and where we sit in the table despite all that is truly baffling.

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21 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

It's weird because on paper Palmer should solve one of our biggest, and most persistent, problems of the past couple of years. For a while we've struggled with creative and penetrative passing in the 10-15 yards in front of the opposition penalty box. We saw it again yesterday where we had lots of passing and possession in midfield but couldn't get the ball in to the strikers to turn that possession into a chance.

Palmer should solve it, and on occasions he did. However he either didn't do it regularly enough or in solving that issue his actions created others. 

Personally I would not have signed him permanently and would be fine to let him go and have a good career elsewhere.

I don’t think the midfield was the problem in that respect yesterday but a front-man who it’s virtually impossible to play off of when he’s playing like that.  Palmer wouldn’t have solved it yesterday.  You need a striker who loves it into feet....Chris Martin, or a clever runner off the shoulder....Wells.

13 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

Agree that is probably why we signed him. Which seems like it meant we got Dasilva very cheap as part of the deal.

A big problem for me about Kasey is his fitness levels.

Start of 19/20 season I think he played well in Derby game, QPR first half before being subbed early in the 2nd as he could barely run, Boro on the left wing he scored from Eliasson cross, again decent first half before tiring badly early in the 2nd.

Apparently he worked really hard in preseason to improve his fitness levels, but he didnt look fit at all

Dasilva was already an agreed fee (as part of the loan) and we signed him 6 weeks ahead of Palmer.  So very unlikely to be anything to do with it.  If anything Chelsea made us pay over the odds on Kalas (1 week after Jay) as we’d pulled their pants down on Jay (£2m).

Might be Swansea’s kit, but he looked like he’d put a bit of timber on in the highlights I saw the other night.

He has a lot of talent, but he would t be the first player with talent not to fulfil it.

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3 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

He has a lot of talent, but he would t be the first player with talent not to fulfil it.

The world is full of players who look like Messi against limited opposition which fools some people into thinking they’re something they’re not and then you ask them to do it against more cute players who don’t easily get sent to fetch a hotdog and they are found wanting more often than not.

By the same token you get players like James Milner who don’t look ridiculously pleasing on the eye but have the ability and the character to do their job season in and season out for the best managers at the very top levels of the game.

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