DT The Optimist Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 It’s on YouTube Bristol City Channel, no doubt will appear on OS. To quote him ‘...we have to keep going until we get some of our players back in January. Then push on’ Well.. whose he refereeing to ? Can only be Walsh & Williams ? The return of Baker ? He seemed to agree about what we all saw today, the lack of quality and the final ball and passes. while some on OTIB say Walsh is unproven at this level and you cannot be sure what he brings to the table, I would say a massive improvement on what we have at present. Two footed, carrier of the ball and shown to us before he can pass the ball and his form when at Coventry... Williams..Top rated player at Wigan... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlastonburyRed Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 Thing is, January might only be next month, but that's six games away, a fair chunk of a season. There's no guarantee that come 2nd Jan, those players that are medically fit are going to be match fit, added to the fact that we might pick up even more injuries between now & then. I'd prefer the focus was on getting the most out of the XI on the pitch, rather than getting all misty eyed and yearning for some mythical line-up that includes players that haven't actually played Championship games for the club Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lew-T Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 Yep, he’s saying what we already know. We’re pretty much hanging on until the New Year where we might have a full strength side apart from Weimann. I’m praying Walsh and Williams can make that difference for us. Our passing in midfield is really poor at times, so I’m hoping these two can make us tick. If they can do that, then I’m sure the goals will follow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lrrr Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 Walsh, Williams, Mawson, Baker, Sessegnon We haven't been able to rotate too much in terms of a match day squad, so yes if we can still be around the play offs when we get these guys back then it will be a big boost. Hope a few of the u23's lads get a couple of chances to show why they should still be around the first team squad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid in the Riot Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 3 minutes ago, Lew-T said: Yep, he’s saying what we already know. We’re pretty much hanging on until the New Year where we might have a full strength side apart from Weimann. That assumes we don't pick up anymore injuries between now and January which is extremely unlikely. Either Holden is being naive, or making excuses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyTonyTony Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 I don’t normally do knee jerk reactions - I’ve seen enough footy in my life not to judge a team on a single game However today we were total shite - very poor indeed and worrying. I can accept individual errors but not a lack of effort - we didn’t look arsed at all today. We are all hoping the return of Williams / Walsh will be a fix - I hope so too but we were so shit today. im trying to find a glass half full but failing. Meh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alessandro Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 No excuses culture? We've seen it before, it's fantasy land forever relying on x, y, z to return. It rarely works out like that, they return late and take time to get up to fitness. There is still more than enough quality in this squad to see better performances than we've had recently. 4 excellent championship forwards he is not getting the best out of. Even with injuries you've got 5/6 options for the midfield 3. He had a window to recruit. He chose a system and now won't play it. What happened to developing and getting the best out of the players you have? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loosey Boy Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 1 minute ago, Kid in the Riot said: That assumes we don't pick up anymore injuries between now and January which is extremely unlikely. Either Holden is being naive, or making excuses. You think SL will invest in Jan if we are there/thereabouts @Kid in the Riot? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DT The Optimist Posted December 5, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 5 minutes ago, Lew-T said: I’m praying Walsh and Williams can make that difference for us. Our passing in midfield is really poor at times, so I’m hoping these two can make us tick. If they can do that, then I’m sure the goals will follow. In the past I have mentioned on threads Williams was our big money summer signing and came with massive expectations, so unlucky this injury. Walsh, the Bannan , Hartley type player ,we have been yearning for. DH is right, just stay in touch and Lady Luck with us should be lot better. We have certainly got away with a few results this season, thanks to a magnificent keeper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyTonyTony Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 1 minute ago, Alessandro said: No excuses culture? We've seen it before, it's fantasy to forever relying on x, y, z to return. It rarely works out like that, they return late and take time to get up to fitness. There is still more than enough quality in this squad to see better performances than we've had recently. 4 excellent championship forwards he is not getting the nest out of. Even with injuries you've got 5/6 options for the midfield 3. He had a window to recruit. He chose a system and now won't play it. What happened to developing and getting the best out of the players you have? I’m struggling to disagree with this tbh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numero Uno Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 5 minutes ago, GlastonburyRed said: Thing is, January might only be next month, but that's six games away, a fair chunk of a season. There's no guarantee that come 2nd Jan, those players that are medically fit are going to be match fit, added to the fact that we might pick up even more injuries between now & then. I'd prefer the focus was on getting the most out of the XI on the pitch, rather than getting all misty eyed and yearning for some mythical line-up that includes players that haven't actually played Championship games for the club That’s exactly what he’s been doing and why we have 27 points. Or don’t they count because we were shit today? Are you suggesting Holden hasn’t been focused and has cost us points? Were you expecting 37 points by now? The main problem is that to get the best out of the current players we have he has to play a very conservative style that is certainly not easy on the eye to put it mildly and that inevitably leads to criticism when we lose like today. How can he be talking about a “mythical” line up when he has the players at the club? Are you expecting Walsh, Baker and Williams to be out injured for life? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bristol Oil Services Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 20 minutes ago, DT The Optimist said: It’s on YouTube Bristol City Channel, no doubt will appear on OS. To quote him ‘...we have to keep going until we get some of our players back in January. Then push on’ Well.. whose he refereeing to ? Can only be Walsh & Williams ? The return of Baker ? No, he's referring to the window, when we bring Ayling, Freeman, Flint, Pack, Reid and Bryan back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numero Uno Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 3 minutes ago, Alessandro said: No excuses culture? We've seen it before, it's fantasy land forever relying on x, y, z to return. It rarely works out like that, they return late and take time to get up to fitness. There is still more than enough quality in this squad to see better performances than we've had recently. 4 excellent championship forwards he is not getting the best out of. Even with injuries you've got 5/6 options for the midfield 3. He had a window to recruit. He chose a system and now won't play it. What happened to developing and getting the best out of the players you have? There really isn’t that much quality in our current first team. There just isn’t. It’s jam packed with hard working, run of the mill Championship standard players and younger players who are making mistakes on their way to better things. I think most people accept that the last transfer window was not a “normal” window in any way, shape or form. How many windows did the previous manager have to build a counter attacking squad that can’t play on the front foot whilst the men in charged just sat there and wrote cheques for it to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AppyDAZE Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 So, I won't use injuries as excuse, except for when I do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phileas Fogg Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 I've always had this nagging feeling that it's going to go horribly wrong with Holden. I hope that's incorrect because he seems a genuinely great guy.. just can't shake this feeling that sooner or later it's all going to go wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Wood Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 1 minute ago, Phileas Fogg said: I've always had this nagging feeling that it's going to go horribly wrong with Holden. I hope that's incorrect because he seems a genuinely great guy.. just can't shake this feeling that sooner or later it's all going to go wrong. Things are no different to the last manager I would just like to see us play some decent football and give somebody a hiding but we are so bloody boring we just grind teams down there is very little difference between us and the boring baskets who beat us today Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northern Red Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 Would people rather he'd said that there was nothing wrong with today and that's how he wants us to play? Can't do right for doing wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phileas Fogg Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 2 minutes ago, Robin Wood said: Things are no different to the last manager I would just like to see us play some decent football and give somebody a hiding but we are so bloody boring we just grind teams down there is very little difference between us and the boring baskets who beat us today I don't know why my instinct is that it'll go wrong, I suppose because we've flattered to deceive. I always feel that Holden seems a bit naïve, I know that's very unfair - but it's just my gut feeling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sh1t_ref_again Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 Holden started out saying he wanted to play exciting attacking football, the mantra now seems to have changed to try and not concede and nick a win Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numero Uno Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 8 minutes ago, AppyDAZE said: So, I won't use injuries as excuse, except for when I do. “We have to keep going until we get some of our injured players back in January then push on”. I think many of you are being very harsh in interpreting that as making excuses. It’s a fact that at least three of our injured players would walk into our first team when fit and some of you would be the first to bellyache if performances didn’t improve with them playing. Without them we have a more than acceptable points return overall without micro analysing every single game. What we all agree on is the performances could be better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 24 minutes ago, TonyTonyTony said: I don’t normally do knee jerk reactions - I’ve seen enough footy in my life not to judge a team on a single game However today we were total shite - very poor indeed and worrying. I can accept individual errors but not a lack of effort - we didn’t look arsed at all today. We are all hoping the return of Williams / Walsh will be a fix - I hope so too but we were so shit today. im trying to find a glass half full but failing. Meh I was happy at h-t, but we were very poor second half. Dean, back to basics, back to your 352 principles....it’s what got us a good start and I know you lost certain players but you now have players back to play it again. Do it!!! Its no so much 352 itself (god, I’m such a hypocrite otherwise ), it’s more it’s the system the team learned over the summer, the one they played well in, the one they looked like they each knew how each other played too. Get on it Dean! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numero Uno Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 2 minutes ago, sh1t_ref_again said: Holden started out saying he wanted to play exciting attacking football, the mantra now seems to have changed to try and not concede and nick a win He probably lied through his teeth just to upset a few on here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AppyDAZE Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 3 minutes ago, Numero Uno said: “We have to keep going until we get some of our injured players back in January then push on”. I think many of you are being very harsh in interpreting that as making excuses. It’s a fact that at least three of our injured players would walk into our first team when fit and some of you would be the first to bellyache if performances didn’t improve with them playing. Without them we have a more than acceptable points return overall without micro analysing every single game. What we all agree on is the performances could be better. Every club in every league bemoans injuries, and if some of your better players are among them you just have to get on with it. This is more or less what DH himself was saying before today. But do you have to change mentality to a don't lose one with pretty much nothing going forward? Nope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlastonburyRed Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 23 minutes ago, Numero Uno said: That’s exactly what he’s been doing and why we have 27 points. Or don’t they count because we were shit today? Are you suggesting Holden hasn’t been focused and has cost us points? Were you expecting 37 points by now? The main problem is that to get the best out of the current players we have he has to play a very conservative style that is certainly not easy on the eye to put it mildly and that inevitably leads to criticism when we lose like today. How can he be talking about a “mythical” line up when he has the players at the club? Are you expecting Walsh, Baker and Williams to be out injured for life? When I say mythical I mean a line-up including Walsh & Williams etc., to my knowledge they haven't played together before. How many games do you think Walsh & Baker will play between now and the end of the season? I don't think DH has done a bad job to date, I just don't want the focus to shift away from the starting XI to if, buts, and maybes when there's no guarantee iwhen the absent bunch will make it back this season and, when they do, how many games they will play is incredibly hard to predict given that we are talking of three with long-term injuries (added to which Williams is an unknown quantity for us, Baker is renowned for his injuries & OOC shortly, and as for Walsh there's the added complication of his contract situation). I just think it's brave to pin hopes on them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Wood Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 8 minutes ago, Northern Red said: Would people rather he'd said that there was nothing wrong with today and that's how he wants us to play? Can't do right for doing wrong. Didn't do a lot right today did we Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numero Uno Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 1 minute ago, AppyDAZE said: Every club in every league bemoans injuries, and if some of your better players are among them you just have to get on with it. This is more or less what DH himslef was saying before. Do you have to change mentality to a don't lose one with pretty much nothing going forward? Nope. He had been getting on with it. We’ve won half our games. Do that over a season and you’re close to the play offs. I can accept that performances could be better but the points return is acceptable isn’t it? You talk as though he’s “given up” whereas it’s our “supporters” who throw a total wobbler every single time something goes against us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid in the Riot Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 18 minutes ago, Phileas Fogg said: I've always had this nagging feeling that it's going to go horribly wrong with Holden. I hope that's incorrect because he seems a genuinely great guy.. just can't shake this feeling that sooner or later it's all going to go wrong. Holden was the "continuity candidate" so it's hardly surprising that performances and results are so similar to the last couple of seasons. And let's be fair, that's not necessarily a negative, because in terms of results Lee Johnson delivered very respectable results and league positions at City. The problem is, although he and MA have said he has his own ideas, does he? We haven't seen much evidence of it yet. Maybe he is a better and more natural leader than LJ? That would certainly help, but he needs to be tactically adept too. The whole situation just reminds me of when Millen took over. He also did well during his caretaker spell, and had a decent first season. But after that he was found wanting because he didn't have the experience or leadership abilities to progress the club. Things went rapidly downhill and similar to you, I could see the same happening with Holden. I think he'll be OK this season but next season will be the real test. It's a huge ask for a managerial novice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 Deano is referring to the lack of creativity in midfield which was so obvious today. With Walsh and Williams back in the frame in the NY the squad will have mote midfield depth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numero Uno Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 2 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said: Holden was the "continuity candidate" so it's hardly surprising that performances and results and so similar to the last couple of seasons. And let's be fair, that's not necessarily a negative, because in terms of results Lee Johnson delivered very respectable results and league positions at City. The problem is, although he and MA have said he has his own ideas, does he? We haven't seen much evidence of it yet. Maybe he is a better and more natural leader than LJ? That would certainly help, but he needs to be tactically adept too. The whole situation just reminds me of when Millen took over. He also did well during his caretaker spell, and had a decent first season. But after that he was found wanting because he didn't have the experience or leadership abilities to progress the club. Things went rapidly downhill and similar to you, I could see the same happening with Holden. I think he'll be OK this season but next season will be the real test. It's a huge ask for a managerial novice. Agree on the last bit. Will Holden have the balls to go into Ashton’s office and tell him what he really thinks and ask for the funds to do what is really needed to move things forward or does he keep quiet because he’s landed a great job and doesn’t want to upset the apple cart. Time will tell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northern Red Posted December 5, 2020 Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 6 minutes ago, Robin Wood said: Didn't do a lot right today did we You're here posting so obviously we didn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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