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Holden in or out // Meltdown thread // Faint hearted stay away


Holden in or out // Meltdown thread // Faint hearted stay away  

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10 minutes ago, Robbored said:

Yep......exactly the same as under GJ - the difference being GJ was somehow getting results and to most fans that clouds their judgement on what they’re actually seeing.

City are 19 games in. A long way to go yet.

The football under Johnson, up until the last couple of years, was generally pretty good. That playoff final season we were exciting to watch and were able to grind out results. I know you've got history with Johnson, but it's immensely unfair to tar him with that criticism imo. He remains our most successful manager in terms of league finishes for many many years and it's sad you can't see beyond your personal grudge. 

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Another limp and abject performance by the entire team.

Wimped out of every tackle... again. Gutless.

Not one of them able to take their man on and go past them with any purpose or direction. Is the art of dribbling with the ball dead?

Everyone of them appeared to be afraid of having the ball under their possession for longer than a few seconds.

Sideways, backwards, sideways mentality that acheived feg all, except giving us higher possession stats (big deal !) and helping Millwall run down the clock.

No urgency in getting a goal back. Pedestrian, robotic and predictable.

Massengo caught in possession again - leading to their second goal.

Lead-boots Martin made Brunt look like Usain Bolt.

Moore has suddenly become less.

From what I've seen in the last two games, the players seem to be getting a lot worse. What the hell are the coaching team doing? Former England coaches? More like Poundland.

We are the team that every team on a losing streak looks forward to playing. Guaranteed to win against us.

Holden's promise of attacking football is never going to be fulfilled by the pile of sh"te we have wearing our shirts at present.

And let's not have any bleeding hearts on here using the injury list to excuse our pathetic performances.

Time for Holden to stop the rot.

We were told we were getting a breath of fresh air, but what we've got stinks.

 

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16 hours ago, Harry said:

Holden won’t be choosing the players to sign anyway. 

How is Chris Brunt an Ashton signing?

Why would we sell Joe Morrell who Johnson said was good on analytics and bring in Brunt?

It doesn't stack up unless it's a cooperative effort where coaches and transfer team work together.

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24 minutes ago, Prinny said:

How is Chris Brunt an Ashton signing?

Why would we sell Joe Morrell who Johnson said was good on analytics and bring in Brunt?

It doesn't stack up unless it's a cooperative effort where coaches and transfer team work together.

I would ask “how is Brunt NOT an Ashton signing?”

Which club does Ashton have THE most links with, including his own short playing career? 
Which Agency does Ashton do the majority of his business through? 
 

The answer to both leads you to Brunt. 

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16 minutes ago, Harry said:

I would ask “how is Brunt NOT an Ashton signing?”

Which club does Ashton have THE most links with, including his own short playing career? 
Which Agency does Ashton do the majority of his business through? 
 

The answer to both leads you to Brunt. 

Coaches are also linked to that and more recently.

No overlap between Brunt and Ashton.

The most links? After 16 years away? I'm not sure about that.

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1 minute ago, Prinny said:

Coaches are also linked to that and more recently.

No overlap between Brunt and Ashton.

The most links? After 16 years away? I'm not sure about that.

It’s not a link between Brunt & Ashton. 
It’s a link between Ashton and a club where he has a large network, plus an agent with whom he conducts the majority of his business. 

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7 minutes ago, Harry said:

It’s not a link between Brunt & Ashton. 
It’s a link between Ashton and a club where he has a large network, plus an agent with whom he conducts the majority of his business. 

Ok, I put it wrong. How is Chris Brunt ONLY an Ashton signing?

You said Holden won't be choosing the players.

What you've given are great reasons why Ashton is involved, but not why Holden isn't.

So I'm asking for proof of that.

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12 minutes ago, Prinny said:

Ok, I put it wrong. How is Chris Brunt ONLY an Ashton signing?

You said Holden won't be choosing the players.

What you've given are great reasons why Ashton is involved, but not why Holden isn't.

So I'm asking for proof of that.

There will never be outright proof. The football club aren’t going to operate in a 100% transparent manner with the fans on the clubs recruitment policy. 
So I’m afraid I can’t give you what you’re looking for in terms of cold, hard evidence. But there is plenty of reading between the lines, along with my own knowledge of the man and his operation, together with testimony of many who have and still work with him (to which quite obviously I can’t name names). 

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Lurked for ages, first time posting.

 

I haven't found Holden convincing at any point this season, including when we were getting results. I don't think we ever looked convincing or deserving of 3 points, with the exception of short spells where we played the ball nicely and ended up actually testing the keeper. I don't think (although there may well be stats that say otherwise) that we have dominated a game all season. As in, from minute 1 to minute 90 looked the better side. It's been smash and grab performances all season as far as I'm concerned.

What I find worrying is the inability of almost every player to do the basics. To play a 10 yard pass. To be strong in the tackle. To make a good forward run. This is something that must come from the coaching, not really a surprise when so many talented players appear to have regressed under Lee and now Holden after arriving at the club. The dire performances that saw Lee lose his job have for the most part continued under Holden, so what's the common factor? Whilst the players have to take some responsibility, the fact they've collectively lost the ability to play football suggests the blame lies elsewhere. Whilst Holden comes across as a great guy who clearly wants the best for the club (much like his predecessor) I think he ultimately can't get the best out of this squad. 

That being said, I can't see anything changing even if Holden was sacked. A breath of fresh air is needed, which the club decided not to go for by choosing Holden over Hughton or any other candidate. Does anyone trust the current setup to get the next managerial appointment right? I don't.

Fingers can be pointed at Ashton and the other higher ups but ultimately the fans don't know the ins and outs of how transfers work etc, however I would like to see changes in how the club is run. A Director of Football, ideally anyone who's actually been a part of a club that's got promotion to the Premier League, would probably be a step in the right direction. It would give the club a better focus and ideally a tangible plan of how to get promoted. That doesn't mean spunk money up the wall, but an actual plan other than the apparent 'buy young players and hopefully fluke promotion before they're sold on for a profit'. Whilst football is a business, we have to live within our means etc etc, it's impossible to build a solid platform to give us the extra 10% that's required for promotion if core members of the squad leave every summer. We currently have to rebuild each year just to maintain mid table football as we currently operate.

In my view, there's more simple changes, such as a new coach with fresh ideas and a new way of doing things and also more complex changes, like adjusting how we as a club operate, that are required if we're to push on. I'm not convinced these will happen any time soon, and following city is starting to feel almost pointless if we're going to keep going round in circles as we have done for the last few years. Regardless of club size or history, it's starting to feel like the club will settle for profitable mediocrity rather than have a proper stab at promotion.

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I voted for Dean Holden to stay in for now.  Its so easy to say out (or leave) at anything these days.  I believe the problem does lies higher up and all around.  

There is a sterile culture around the club that I strongly dislike these days.  There is an autocrat (who would be very hard to remove) who sells to the club (us) that the players brought in are the best thing since sliced bread.  However many are already damaged and don't actually play.  Good at wheeling and dealing for a bit of profit for the club and no doubt lining his own too, but what is left on the playing staff isn't really good enough for what we want as fans.

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With 10 players injuried we dont have so many players left to play. Think its about the players not DH. When we got a full squad and players fit and still dont take any points then DH maybe goes. COD, Bakinson are starting most games, they are not good but we dont have any others. To blame DH that the players are not good enough, a new manager should have the same players as vs Rotherham and Millwall.

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Where has it all gone wrong for City?

Three months ago City were doing well and many of us were quietly confident; remember that  90 goals this season thread?

Every team has a run of disappointing results, but for City the actual performances have deteriorated. Have the oppos sussed City's tactics and negate them? Maybe one or two players, but not a team deteriorates overnight.

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None of this is Holdens fault.

This was a lottery win.

Where else would he even get a first interview at a Championship Club?

Or L1 or L2 for that matter?

 

He was LJ's assistant for years, so he either:

Totally agreed with Lee, then stabbed him in the back (and looking at JMac being throw under the bus, that's my guess)

Totally disagreed, in which case he was piss weak, said nothing and was a nodding dog 'yes man' (which I also think was the case.)

 

So SL thinks Hmm...

Nice and cheap, won't get a job anywhere else, happy to screw over his workmates to get this one, and is a yes man.

Lansdowns wet-dream.

 

Of course Holden would accept - he also knew he would be out of his depth.

But that was all totally irrelevant, as the boss-man didn't want promotion anyway, and could throw the blame onto Ashton and his own son.

 

The problem is Stephen Lansdown, not Dean Holden.

 

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Not sure if it’s been said but Holden wasn’t given the remit to finish in the top 6. Some couldn’t understand it as it looks like a step back. A lot of players are out of contract at the end of the season so I think MA/SL are giving Dean the chance to rebuild. In my opinion he’ll probably be given until this time next season.  It made sense to bring in a good coaching setup to try and fill any gaps with “homegrown” talent. 
 

That said if performances and results carry on he won’t last the season. But right now I think he should be given the season and the start of next. We’ve had two losses on the spin before and no doubt we will again. If we win on Friday he’ll still be employed this time next month.

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