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IGNORED

Harris sacked, replaced by McCarthy at Cardiff


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29 minutes ago, Bristol Rob said:

You are calling out excuses to fit your narrative, the reality is that different things have been tried.

He has been hands on, hands off and somewhere in between, reality is we were am average league one side (in reality) when he got involved and we are now an established Championship side competing without parachute payments.

Have mistakes been made? Yes.

Has he had value for money? No.

Should he shoulder some of the blame for some of the money wasted? Absolutely.

But to say he doesn't want promotion, when 2 or 3 years top flight football could - in theory - give him a positive return on investment....

 

Back to you as to why he doesn't want promotion.

So I’m calling out excuses, and your misquoting me to suit your narrative.

I haven’t said he doesn’t want promotion, reread my original post.

I don’t think SL has ever been hands off when the really important decisions have been made, and that is the crux of the problem for me.

SL makes the final call on ALL the important matters, and I don’t think he really understands what is required to get out of this league, I don’t claim to either, but I’m not calling the shots.

We have become a selling club under his plan, which is OK, but if he really wanted too he could have rebuffed all offers for the likes of Webster, Brownhill etc and we may well have had a better chance of getting promotion.

Have we replaced any of the players sold with the same or better? I don’t think so.

I really can’t see us getting promoted with the way the club is currently run, if you can then fair play to you.

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44 minutes ago, Redwhitepurple said:

When you sign players like MARLON Pack, you know things are going to go back... And sideways.. And then back again... 

Weird comment given they made the play offs last season with Marlon playing in 38 league games

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7 hours ago, steviestevieneville said:

Watch them appoint paul cook now and get promoted next season 

I am petrified this will happen. In fact I’m petrified any time a championship manager is sacked, because waiting on Paul Cook to serve a no employment period is all I’ve got left to cling onto as to why we appointed Holden. 

Why oh why can’t Lansdown see? He’ll happily let LJ/DH sign a dozen players on 20k a week, but he just can’t do the same on a manager! FFS!

Edited by Fordy62
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1 hour ago, Countryfile said:

So I’m calling out excuses, and your misquoting me to suit your narrative.

I haven’t said he doesn’t want promotion, reread my original post.

I don’t think SL has ever been hands off when the really important decisions have been made, and that is the crux of the problem for me.

SL makes the final call on ALL the important matters, and I don’t think he really understands what is required to get out of this league, I don’t claim to either, but I’m not calling the shots.

We have become a selling club under his plan, which is OK, but if he really wanted too he could have rebuffed all offers for the likes of Webster, Brownhill etc and we may well have had a better chance of getting promotion.

Have we replaced any of the players sold with the same or better? I don’t think so.

I really can’t see us getting promoted with the way the club is currently run, if you can then fair play to you.

He could have rebuffed the offers for those two player, you're right.

But good luck getting a tune out of two lads who have influence on and off the pitch who will doubtless be aware that generous offers have come in for them, offering life changing wages because the owner in wealthy.

That sounds a bit 'Colston' to me.

As for replacing them with better... if better players were available for the same or less money, do you not think they clubs who made these bids wouldn't have looked?

Do I think we'll get promoted under the current model? I do actually. It won't be by dominating the division, it won't be by spending a fortune, and it won't be by renewing contracts at a stupid weekly rate.

It'll be one of those random things that just happens. I never though Tammy would get much game time with JK ahead of him in the pecking order, JK downed tools. Neither did I see Reid as a striker, like a lot of others, I saw Reid as a player who had been with us since the year dot and was a drain on wages, and then we get one season out of him in a new position and wow! Personally, if that hadn't worked, I'd have let him go when his contract expired if it hadn't been for his switch where he found his game.

It won't be easy getting promoted and finishing in the play offs would be more than welcome (and overdue), but if sustainable status is what SL wants, I won't argue. I want City to be here for years to come, not turn in to a Doncaster, Bradford or Stockport.

Get shot of parachute payments and we aren't too far away from being well run.

Remember that only 3 clubs taste success every season, and we are far from a big fish in this pond.

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8 hours ago, steviestevieneville said:

Watch them appoint paul cook now and get promoted next season 

That might happen.

However next season if they don't scramble up somehow, will be the first time since 2012/13 that they had neither Parachute Payments or PL cash.

It's entirely possible that reality might hit, FFP barely existed back in 2012/13, when they first went up. Without Parachute Payments in a typical Championship season, similar turnover to us- possibly less! Covid of course has thrown all such calculations up in the air.

Cliff edge, £30-35m this year, to £0 next.

2013/14- PL revenue

2014/15- Parachute Payments, Season 1, the first lot.

2015/16- Parachute Payments Season 2. First lot

2016/17- Parachute Payments Season 3. First lot.

2017/18- Parachute Payments Season 4. First lot- Promoted! In the nick of time, as this was the last year.

2018/19- PL revenue.

2019/20- Parachute Payments Season 1. Second lot.

2020/21- Parachute Payments Season 2. Second lot- Season 2 is the last season as they yoyoed. One hit wonders only get two seasons now!

2021/22- ZERO. PL cash if a late surge to promotion, or the relatively low Championship and solidarity payments if not.

Might not be as good a gig as it sounds...

Also you might be interested @Fordy62 in Cardiff and their impending hit to revenue. Forget how much for this season it is but it could be a £30-35m fall from Parachute Payments to zero! Mind you Cook didn't (I think) have big money at Wigan.

Edited by Mr Popodopolous
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2 hours ago, Bristol Rob said:

He could have rebuffed the offers for those two player, you're right.

But good luck getting a tune out of two lads who have influence on and off the pitch who will doubtless be aware that generous offers have come in for them, offering life changing wages because the owner in wealthy.

That sounds a bit 'Colston' to me.

As for replacing them with better... if better players were available for the same or less money, do you not think they clubs who made these bids wouldn't have looked?

Do I think we'll get promoted under the current model? I do actually. It won't be by dominating the division, it won't be by spending a fortune, and it won't be by renewing contracts at a stupid weekly rate.

It'll be one of those random things that just happens. I never though Tammy would get much game time with JK ahead of him in the pecking order, JK downed tools. Neither did I see Reid as a striker, like a lot of others, I saw Reid as a player who had been with us since the year dot and was a drain on wages, and then we get one season out of him in a new position and wow! Personally, if that hadn't worked, I'd have let him go when his contract expired if it hadn't been for his switch where he found his game.

It won't be easy getting promoted and finishing in the play offs would be more than welcome (and overdue), but if sustainable status is what SL wants, I won't argue. I want City to be here for years to come, not turn in to a Doncaster, Bradford or Stockport.

Get shot of parachute payments and we aren't too far away from being well run.

Remember that only 3 clubs taste success every season, and we are far from a big fish in this pond.

Do you not mean Darlington? though I know Doncaster have had their ups and downs they have enjoyed success fairy recently and are doing ok at the moment.

Edited by pillred
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6 hours ago, Fordy62 said:

I am petrified this will happen. In fact I’m petrified any time a championship manager is sacked, because waiting on Paul Cook to serve a no employment period is all I’ve got left to cling onto as to why we appointed Holden. 

Why oh why can’t Lansdown see? He’ll happily let LJ/DH sign a dozen players on 20k a week, but he just can’t do the same on a manager! FFS!

Think you will find Cook didn't get, or even want, the job once the full extent of what working 'with' Ashton would mean was explained. IF that's true we will not get a strong manager whilst Ashton is here... 

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3 hours ago, old_eastender said:

Think you will find Cook didn't get, or even want, the job once the full extent of what working 'with' Ashton would mean was explained. IF that's true we will not get a strong manager whilst Ashton is here... 

If that's the case, wouldn't your energies be better focused on Ashton instead of squealing for the manager's head every time he does something you don't like?

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11 hours ago, Countryfile said:

 but if he really wanted too he could have rebuffed all offers for the likes of Webster, Brownhill etc and we may well have had a better chance of getting promotion.

Nonsense. Have you seen our accounts ? We need to sell players to stay afloat. Also, you cannot just say no (nowadays) to players who want Premier league football and a higher wage. They would lose motivation, and leave for free at the end of their contract whilst at the same time you would become a pariah. 

With the exception perhaps of Real Madrid and Barcelona, EVERY club is a selling club.

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1 hour ago, TonyTonyTony said:

Nonsense. Have you seen our accounts ? We need to sell players to stay afloat. Also, you cannot just say no (nowadays) to players who want Premier league football and a higher wage. They would lose motivation, and leave for free at the end of their contract whilst at the same time you would become a pariah. 

With the exception perhaps of Real Madrid and Barcelona, EVERY club is a selling club.

I’m amazed how many times this needs to be explained.

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Just now, And Its Smith said:

Why would you care?

Wonder why they keep appointing managers who produce dire football 

Warnock took them up, left them in a good place financially I expect what with parachute payments. 

As I said earlier in the thread, and on several in the summer. I’d have liked McCarthy here, someone who’s been promoted out of this league and knows what he’s doing.

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Just now, And Its Smith said:

Why would you care?

Wonder why they keep appointing managers who produce dire football 

Because he was my first choice post-LJ.

Quote

Wonder why they keep appointing managers who produce dire football 

You could say exactly the same about us.

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8 minutes ago, And Its Smith said:

Wonder why they keep appointing managers who produce dire football 

I don't think that's part of their calculation. They just select who they believe has the best chance of gaining them promotion

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Would have been one on my shortlist.

Another one gets away! 

So that’s Warnock at Boro who’s now doing better than us and, we shall see whether Mad Mick, can sort that basket case Club out.

Meanwhile Ashton fiddles around with his empire at The Gate, going backwards fast and losing us £millions.

 

Edited by RedRock
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44 minutes ago, Northern Red said:

Because, as we know, if there's one thing that's a guarantee of a managerial appointment happening it's the bookies' odds...

In fairness Skysports saying he is close to being appointed.

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44 minutes ago, RedRock said:

 

Meanwhile Ashton fiddles around with his empire at The Gate, going backwards fast and losing us £millions.

 

Are we going backwards? 

Last season, after 24 games, we were (with this season in brackets):

10th (9th); 35 points (36); 0 GD (-1); 4 points behind 6th (6 points behind 6th, with a game in hand); 16 points behind the leaders (17 behind Norwich, with a game in hand); 14 points above 22nd (16 points above 22nd, but played twice more).

 

The standard of football is poor but it looks to me like we are treading water, not going backwards. It might be that we do go backwards from here, but right now, as I see it, Deano has us where we were last season, a few points off the play-offs and a few points off the bottom half of the table; stinking the place out a bit, struggling to get shots on goal, but going around in circles somewhat, and pretty much where we were last season.

Not bad going with an injury crisis even Johnson did not face here (and he had a few)!

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1 hour ago, And Its Smith said:

Why would you care?

Wonder why they keep appointing managers who produce dire football 

Good track record and forced to play crap stuff to scrap for every point they could.

Ipswich relegated themselves the second he left the building.

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45 minutes ago, Moments of Pleasure said:

Are we going backwards? 

Last season, after 24 games, we were (with this season in brackets):

10th (9th); 35 points (36); 0 GD (-1); 4 points behind 6th (6 points behind 6th, with a game in hand); 16 points behind the leaders (17 behind Norwich, with a game in hand); 14 points above 22nd (16 points above 22nd, but played twice more).

 

The standard of football is poor but it looks to me like we are treading water, not going backwards. It might be that we do go backwards from here, but right now, as I see it, Deano has us where we were last season, a few points off the play-offs and a few points off the bottom half of the table; stinking the place out a bit, struggling to get shots on goal, but going around in circles somewhat, and pretty much where we were last season.

Not bad going with an injury crisis even Johnson did not face here (and he had a few)!

What about the seasons before that?

3rd, 47 points, +14 GD?

Sounds like backwards to me!

I think people would say considering the huge increase in expenditure and the increase in the wage budget that gaining the same points total is going backwards in meaningful terms.

Edited by IAmNick
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2 hours ago, And Its Smith said:

Why would you care?

Wonder why they keep appointing managers who produce dire football 

Well you proudly announced how you will be following one who produces dire football and has yet to achieve anything in the game , and has major responsibility for our large squad of misfits 

if you had watched over his career McCarthy is pragmatic , give him a reasonable squad and he produces efficient winning sides 

Vastly experienced , including at International level , not a whiff of bull**** or bluff , knows the game inside out

Somewhat if  a completely different level  from the one you have so much interest in 

 

As for appointing managers who produce dire football .... look a bit closer to home 

Just the two  recent visits to Premier League and a Cup Final apoearance In recent years for them

 

And they will get back up before we do 

Bizzare post 

Edited by Sheltons Army
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14 hours ago, Fordy62 said:

I am petrified this will happen. In fact I’m petrified any time a championship manager is sacked, because waiting on Paul Cook to serve a no employment period is all I’ve got left to cling onto as to why we appointed Holden. 

Why oh why can’t Lansdown see? He’ll happily let LJ/DH sign a dozen players on 20k a week, but he just can’t do the same on a manager! FFS!

Think we all know the answer to that. A manager like cook would challenge Ashtons ways of recruitment , scouting and be opinionated . Ashton and the lansdowns can’t have their ways challenged and be shown up to know bugger all about football. No, North Korea fc will keep peddling the myth that they’re visionaries and try baffle us with bullshit.  

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  • phantom changed the title to Harris sacked, replaced by McCarthy at Cardiff

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