Ziderarmy Posted January 23, 2021 Report Share Posted January 23, 2021 50 minutes ago, Bassomylord said: This sums it up nicely, some fans are obviously blinkered by the fact he is young and local. Not good enough yet for championship football and definitely not our next number 1. Nothing like giving a bloke a chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddoh Posted January 23, 2021 Report Share Posted January 23, 2021 4 hours ago, Bassomylord said: A good league 1 goalkeeper. If we are looking for prem football then realistically we need to think about moving him. Deceng enough champ number 2. the time is right not to move him on on he'll be our number one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YorkshireSection Posted January 23, 2021 Report Share Posted January 23, 2021 5 hours ago, Prinny said: Didn't really change my mind on him today. Very good shot stopper though I think the saves today weren't special, everything was dealt with really well. Fine distribution, nothing stood out as bad, no terrible decisions. He does flap. (Flaps O'Leary) Every time I've seen him he's been weak in the air. So overall the performance I thought we'd see. Are you comfortable with him as a first choice championship goalkeeper? No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dullmoan Tone Posted January 23, 2021 Report Share Posted January 23, 2021 He had a much better game today than Frankie F - that’s good enough for me and an excellent benchmark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassomylord Posted January 23, 2021 Report Share Posted January 23, 2021 42 minutes ago, Dullmoan Tone said: He had a much better game today than Frankie F - that’s good enough for me and an excellent benchmark. Frankie is well past it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonBristolian Posted January 23, 2021 Report Share Posted January 23, 2021 42 minutes ago, Dullmoan Tone said: He had a much better game today than Frankie F - that’s good enough for me and an excellent benchmark. Exactly. Bottom line is O'Leary kept a clean sheet today and did not let us down. Moreover, he did not let us down when he was chucked in at the deep end the season before last. The reality is that the subject of "Is O'Leary good enough for Championship football?" was settled at the end of the 2018/2019 season. We know he is, we know he showed it then and we know that anyone claiming O'Leary is not good enough for the Championship is talking out of their hat. Of course, there are areas he needs to improve to be a top end Championship keeper but anyone who cannot see that where he is, as a 24 year old, is indicative of someone who has what it takes to make it in the Championship is only making themselves look foolish each time they post. We are very fortunate to have a goalkeeper like Bentley who has been superlative this season and, for sure, O'Leary is not at his level yet. But where O'Leary is, for a 24 year old, is more than enough to show that he has a future at Championship level, irrespective of whether he makes it as our number one. 3 minutes ago, Bassomylord said: Frankie is well past it. And there we have it. A case in point. Someone who thinks a 24 year old Goalkeeper has reached their full potential and that a 32 year old goalkeeper is "well past it" really needs to go away and do more research into the age at which goalkeepers peak. What makes me really sad is that it is very clear from posts on these forms from certain posters about O'Leary, about Semenyo, about Vyner, about Bakinson and others is that there are posters on these boards who have very clearly made a decision that anyone who comes through our youth system cannot possibly ever be good enough, simply because they have come through our youth system. Anyone being objective can see that O'Leary is a highly capable goalkeeper who has some areas he needs to improve if he wants to reach his full potential. But certain fans seem to equate "areas he needs to improve" with being shit whilst willfully ignoring all the moments where he has shown the ability he has. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassomylord Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 23 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said: Exactly. Bottom line is O'Leary kept a clean sheet today and did not let us down. Moreover, he did not let us down when he was chucked in at the deep end the season before last. The reality is that the subject of "Is O'Leary good enough for Championship football?" was settled at the end of the 2018/2019 season. We know he is, we know he showed it then and we know that anyone claiming O'Leary is not good enough for the Championship is talking out of their hat. Of course, there are areas he needs to improve to be a top end Championship keeper but anyone who cannot see that where he is, as a 24 year old, is indicative of someone who has what it takes to make it in the Championship is only making themselves look foolish each time they post. We are very fortunate to have a goalkeeper like Bentley who has been superlative this season and, for sure, O'Leary is not at his level yet. But where O'Leary is, for a 24 year old, is more than enough to show that he has a future at Championship level, irrespective of whether he makes it as our number one. And there we have it. A case in point. Someone who thinks a 24 year old Goalkeeper has reached their full potential and that a 32 year old goalkeeper is "well past it" really needs to go away and do more research into the age at which goalkeepers peak. What makes me really sad is that it is very clear from posts on these forms from certain posters about O'Leary, about Semenyo, about Vyner, about Bakinson and others is that there are posters on these boards who have very clearly made a decision that anyone who comes through our youth system cannot possibly ever be good enough, simply because they have come through our youth system. Anyone being objective can see that O'Leary is a highly capable goalkeeper who has some areas he needs to improve if he wants to reach his full potential. But certain fans seem to equate "areas he needs to improve" with being shit whilst willfully ignoring all the moments where he has shown the ability he has. You're right there are areas he must improve in.....and Fielding is crap there is a reason he kept losing his place time and time again at Championship level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcofisher Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 Everyone knows goalkeepers peak in their early 20s. Sell him, he’s washed up and done for! Same as Semenyo, 21 and not an exceptional finisher?! SELL!! (Wasn’t Ian Wright still either in jail or playing semi-professional at this age and still became an exceptional striker and one of the most inspirational English strikers and equally exceptional role models?!) Massengo, 19 years old and not built like a s*** brick house? SELL! People need to stop watching players like Sancho, Foden and Greenwood and realise that only some talents are so exceptional and have been lucky enough to develop early that they will be a cut above the rest as such a young age. The rest of them, funnily enough, will still need time to develop a fully rounded game! Maybe Max, despite him being an equally exceptional shot stopper, isn’t as good in the air as Bentley. But have you seen some of Bentleys clangers for Brentford?! He has certainly done some development of his own in his career to get to where he is now... Maybe Semenyo isn’t a fantastic finisher, but who was the last player who could so effortlessly move past players like he does? The last player I can think of is JET, and Antoine already has a far more rounded game that JET when we consider his defensive contribution, which was non-existent in the case of JET. Really boring how sections of OTIB will write off certain youngsters who show some exceptional attributes for not being a fully rounded player in their teens or early 20s. Neither do the same section realise that all players won’t necessarily develop at the same rate. Just because one talent develops at a certain age doesn’t mean it is the same for the next one. Post bottle of Bordeaux rant over! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassomylord Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 1 minute ago, marcofisher said: Everyone knows goalkeepers peak in their early 20s. Sell him, he’s washed up and done for! Same as Semenyo, 21 and not an exceptional finisher?! SELL!! (Wasn’t Ian Wright still either in jail or playing semi-professional at this age and still became an exceptional striker and one of the most inspirational English strikers and equally exceptional role models?!) Massengo, 19 years old and not built like a s*** brick house? SELL! People need to stop watching players like Sancho, Foden and Greenwood and realise that only some talents are so exceptional and have been lucky enough to develop early that they will be a cut above the rest as such a young age. The rest of them, funnily enough, will still need time to develop a fully rounded game! Maybe Max, despite him being an equally exceptional shot stopper, isn’t as good in the air as Bentley. But have you seen some of Bentleys clangers for Brentford?! He has certainly done some development of his own in his career to get to where he is now... Maybe Semenyo isn’t a fantastic finisher, but who was the last player who could so effortlessly move past players like he does? The last player I can think of is JET, and Antoine already has a far more rounded game that JET when we consider his defensive contribution which was non-existent in the case of JET. Really boring how sections of OTIB will write off certain youngsters who show some exceptional attributes for not being a fully rounded player in their teens or early 20s. Neither do the same section realise that all players won’t necessarily develop at the same rate. Just because one talent develops at a certain age doesn’t mean it is the same for the next one. Post bottle of Bordeaux rant over! I have no idea what Max O'Learys "exceptional attributes" are, what are they? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcofisher Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 Just now, Bassomylord said: I have no idea what Max O'Learys "exceptional attributes" are, what are they? He is one of the best shot stoppers I have seen play for Bristol City. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 31 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said: Exactly. Bottom line is O'Leary kept a clean sheet today and did not let us down. Moreover, he did not let us down when he was chucked in at the deep end the season before last. The reality is that the subject of "Is O'Leary good enough for Championship football?" was settled at the end of the 2018/2019 season. We know he is, we know he showed it then and we know that anyone claiming O'Leary is not good enough for the Championship is talking out of their hat. Of course, there are areas he needs to improve to be a top end Championship keeper but anyone who cannot see that where he is, as a 24 year old, is indicative of someone who has what it takes to make it in the Championship is only making themselves look foolish each time they post. We are very fortunate to have a goalkeeper like Bentley who has been superlative this season and, for sure, O'Leary is not at his level yet. But where O'Leary is, for a 24 year old, is more than enough to show that he has a future at Championship level, irrespective of whether he makes it as our number one. And there we have it. A case in point. Someone who thinks a 24 year old Goalkeeper has reached their full potential and that a 32 year old goalkeeper is "well past it" really needs to go away and do more research into the age at which goalkeepers peak. What makes me really sad is that it is very clear from posts on these forms from certain posters about O'Leary, about Semenyo, about Vyner, about Bakinson and others is that there are posters on these boards who have very clearly made a decision that anyone who comes through our youth system cannot possibly ever be good enough, simply because they have come through our youth system. Anyone being objective can see that O'Leary is a highly capable goalkeeper who has some areas he needs to improve if he wants to reach his full potential. But certain fans seem to equate "areas he needs to improve" with being shit whilst willfully ignoring all the moments where he has shown the ability he has. Your problem is trying to have a logical debate with posters who don’t want to have a decent debate! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassomylord Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 Just now, marcofisher said: He is one of the best shot stoppers I have seen play for Bristol City. Shame he is crap in the air and weak. Needs to put some muscle on. Wont make it otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcofisher Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 Just now, Bassomylord said: Shame he is crap in the air and weak. Needs to put some muscle on. Wont make it otherwise. Shame he’s 24, past his peak as a goalkeeper, and will never develop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 Just now, marcofisher said: Shame he’s 24, past his peak as a goalkeeper, and will never develop. I present Edwin van der Sar versus the over-muscled / loss of agility David James. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassomylord Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 Just now, Davefevs said: I present Edwin van der Sar versus the over-muscled / loss of agility David James. I'm not sure what your trying to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassomylord Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 2 minutes ago, marcofisher said: Shame he’s 24, past his peak as a goalkeeper, and will never develop. Won't develop with us as he won't get the game time. Chuck him in when Bentley leaves sorry ain't getting promotion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcofisher Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 Just now, Bassomylord said: Won't develop with us as he won't get the game time. Chuck him in when Bentley leaves sorry ain't getting promotion. How are you developing these players then, by selling them to other high end L1/Championship clubs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassomylord Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 Just now, marcofisher said: How are you developing these players then, by selling them to other high end L1/Championship clubs? You're not. That's the point. Not your problem anymore. Thanks for your service good luck and goodbye. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcofisher Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 Just now, Bassomylord said: You're not. That's the point. Not your problem anymore. Thanks for your service good luck and goodbye. So scrap the academy and bringing players through that would be on lower salaries and could break into the first team, in your opinion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassomylord Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 Just now, marcofisher said: So scrap the academy and bringing players through that would be on lower salaries and could break into the first team, in your opinion? No keep the academy and see if they progress and go from there....but the goalposts move we aren't a league 1 club anymore we want prem football. For a GK need to be well rounded....O Leary ain't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcofisher Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 1 minute ago, Bassomylord said: No keep the academy and see if they progress and go from there....but the goalposts move we aren't a league 1 club anymore we want prem football. For a GK need to be well rounded....O Leary ain't. So keep the academy going but not give them an opportunity to develop into rounded players basically? Makes little sense imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassomylord Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 Just now, marcofisher said: So keep the academy going but not give them an opportunity to develop into rounded players basically? Makes little sense imo. Academy players are at different levels in different positions, some are better than others. That dictates game time which impacts on their development......easier to give game time and experience to a right winger than a goalkeeper.....for obvious reasons. Compare it to other champ sides..... Norwich Krul, Swansea Woodman Brentford Raya Bmouth Begovic Watford Foster......Bristol City O'Leary? No chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcofisher Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 11 minutes ago, Bassomylord said: Academy players are at different levels in different positions, some are better than others. That dictates game time which impacts on their development......easier to give game time and experience to a right winger than a goalkeeper.....for obvious reasons. Compare it to other champ sides..... Norwich Krul, Swansea Woodman Brentford Raya Bmouth Begovic Watford Foster......Bristol City O'Leary? No chance. So you would sell off a potential top championship talent, at someone else’s benefit, just cause they haven’t made it as a keeper at 24? Krul: Top player and probably on at least 4x what even Bentley is on and around 10x O’Leary if not more Woodman: Doesnt even belong to Swansea. He is a Newcastle player. Raya Only became first choice after being relegated to L1 with Blackburn Begovic Same as Krul Foster Same again Has O’Leary ever let us down in one match that he has played in? Tom Heston was backup keeper for Cardiff and only signed for us aged 25... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassomylord Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 5 minutes ago, marcofisher said: So you would sell off a potential top championship talent, at someone else’s benefit, just cause they haven’t made it as a keeper at 24? Krul: Top player and probably on at least 4x what even Bentley is on and around 10x O’Leary if not more Woodman: Doesnt even belong to Swansea. He is a Newcastle player. Raya Only became first choice after being relegated to L1 with Blackburn Begovic Same as Krul Foster Same again Has O’Leary ever let us down in one match that he has played in? He is a cheap number 2 no issue with that. Barnsley this season in his only league game....glued to his line (shock) Barnsley score from a corner.....Wigan other season, he was dreadful. Sorry, being a decent shot stopper isn't enough to be a top keeper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcofisher Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 5 minutes ago, Bassomylord said: He is a cheap number 2 no issue with that. Barnsley this season in his only league game....glued to his line (shock) Barnsley score from a corner.....Wigan other season, he was dreadful. Sorry, being a decent shot stopper isn't enough to be a top keeper. I would say he is a far more Rounded keeper that that, and he is also very good with the ball at his feet. The area he needs to work on is his command of the box, but our own Daniel Bentley was flapping at far more and making far more mistakes at MOL’s age... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassomylord Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 2 minutes ago, marcofisher said: I would say he is a far more Rounded keeper that that, and he is also very good with the ball at his feet. The area he needs to work on is his command of the box, but our own Daniel Bentley was flapping at far more and making far more mistakes at MOL’s age... Well that's not true. At 24 he was Brentfords number 1 in the championship. It wasn't until his 3rd season when he lost his form......number 1 keeper at the age of 22 in this league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcofisher Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 Just now, Bassomylord said: Well that's not true. At 24 he was Brentfords number 1 in the championship. It wasn't until his 3rd season when he lost his form. And they were delighted to be rid of him, and delighted with the fact that they had replaced him with Raya. He had been dropping clangers left, right and centre for them, the many compilations showed it. It is hard to hide from your mistakes as a goalie! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pillred Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 1 hour ago, Bassomylord said: Frankie is well past it. At 32!! he should be in his prime as a keeper. Exactly how old did you think he was? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassomylord Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 1 minute ago, marcofisher said: And they were delighted to be rid of him, and delighted with the fact that they had replaced him with Raya. He had been dropping clangers left, right and centre for them, the many compilations showed it. It is hard to hide from your mistakes as a goalie! Which isn't relevant to the point you were making. At the same age Bentley had over 100 appearances at this level and had been a no1 in the champiomship for 3 seasons....this is compared to O'Learys, what, 10 games? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassomylord Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 2 minutes ago, pillred said: At 32!! he should be in his prime as a keeper. Exactly how old did you think he was? He should be, but he isn't.....injuries haven't helped but regressed since his days at Derby. FYI I thought he was 32 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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