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Mark Ashton is taking the piss out of us.


DaveInSA

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3 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

I’m sure people will point out we pay a very small proportion of it but regardless of that if the guy was delivering something special you would accept the money he is being paid as necessary expenditure to get results. If he’s delivering results I sure don’t want to see what happens when he’s failing!!

Agreed, but it is highly likely it will be the same 10 years from now unless something is done at the strategic level, the top and we spend money meaningfully instead of just wasting it as a poor performing company i.e. a tax write-off.

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Ashton very clearly told us that basically no other manager was willing to work within our setup. Do we honestly think our setup is better than all the other clubs those successful managers have worked for? If the only manager who will say yes is one who can't believe his luck, then maybe we should look at why that is?

What is our recruitment policy? We clearly laid it out a few years ago; signing young players and developing and selling. That simply hasn't happened last 2 seasons. Why are we buying "experienced" 30+ year olds? Last time we made a habit of that we went back to league one pretty sharpish. Some of our recent signings (particularly Lansbury and Downing) have been lauded as having "promotion experience" when it's actually 1) in name only, and 2) why are we acting like you need to have done it before? It's not important.

Ashton is clearly more ego than man. A prime bullshit-er.

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3 hours ago, Sheltons Army said:

 

Ashtons a puppet , with Lansdown the puppet master

He does what the boss wants , and picks up his £500k


Holden was a Jon and Steve Lansdown appointment 

You don’t pay a patsy or a puppet 500k per year. Unless it’s Patsy Kensit or Kermit the Frog.

Ashton has a lot of influence.

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3 hours ago, LoyalRed said:

How do you know this ? Jon looked very awkward when asked about why they appointed him, almost as if he didn’t want him 

Ive always thought this, Jon didn't want to appoint DH but Dad and uncle Mark said no..

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Sack Ashton. 
Sack the 2 pointless ex-England coaches. 
Remove Holden from Head Coach. 
Hire a proper manager. One with managerial experience and a CV that says “I know how to recruit footballers and I know how to put a team together”. I don’t know, Paul Cook as an example. 
If Holden is happy to do so, he can stay as a coach or assistant. 
The new manager has a say in bringing in a Chief Scout / Head of Recruitment. Working as a team to bring the best possible players to the club. 
Sack off half the recruitment analysts. Hire some proper scouts, all across the country, doing the hard yards. 

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8 minutes ago, Harry said:

Sack Ashton. 
Sack the 2 pointless ex-England coaches. 
Remove Holden from Head Coach. 
Hire a proper manager. One with managerial experience and a CV that says “I know how to recruit footballers and I know how to put a team together”. I don’t know, Paul Cook as an example. 
If Holden is happy to do so, he can stay as a coach or assistant. 
The new manager has a say in bringing in a Chief Scout / Head of Recruitment. Working as a team to bring the best possible players to the club. 
Sack off half the recruitment analysts. Hire some proper scouts, all across the country, doing the hard yards. 

Unfortunately that is just a dream, one that seems a long way off.

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11 minutes ago, Harry said:

Sack Ashton. 
Sack the 2 pointless ex-England coaches. 
Remove Holden from Head Coach. 
Hire a proper manager. One with managerial experience and a CV that says “I know how to recruit footballers and I know how to put a team together”. I don’t know, Paul Cook as an example. 
If Holden is happy to do so, he can stay as a coach or assistant. 
The new manager has a say in bringing in a Chief Scout / Head of Recruitment. Working as a team to bring the best possible players to the club. 
Sack off half the recruitment analysts. Hire some proper scouts, all across the country, doing the hard yards. 

The £1m dollar question though that answers so many of all our debates...

Was Holden SL or MA?

SL? Holden will, eventually go, MA will stay, and we go again.

MA? Maybe, just maybe MA goes to, along with some of the people who are seemingly holding the club back.

That’s the question for me..because our chairman, JL, is seemingly powerless in this whole equation and he’s the one who at least is around a bit more than the owner.

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45 minutes ago, Harry said:

Sack Ashton. 
Sack the 2 pointless ex-England coaches. 
Remove Holden from Head Coach. 
Hire a proper manager. One with managerial experience and a CV that says “I know how to recruit footballers and I know how to put a team together”. I don’t know, Paul Cook as an example. 
If Holden is happy to do so, he can stay as a coach or assistant. 
The new manager has a say in bringing in a Chief Scout / Head of Recruitment. Working as a team to bring the best possible players to the club. 
Sack off half the recruitment analysts. Hire some proper scouts, all across the country, doing the hard yards. 

The problem with that, one of the problems with that obviously no appointment is a guarantee but say we recruit Cook, or another experienced manager, he hires a load of players on 3 year contracts. This summer could be crucial btw, a fork in the road- many out of contract, transition from Covid football to a bit of normality hopefully.

Anyway, say we do that- and they don't mesh. We sack Cook because we're down in the bottom 3, new manager comes in...and is stuck with a load of players he doesn't want or who don't fit his approach! Players we can't get rid of. What then?

Karanka at Birmingham had a 3 year deal- they're in the Bottom 3 tonight, suspect he had a heavy input into the recruitment? I know that club will take some turning round but...Experienced manager- backed him within financial constraints- stagnated or got worse!

What's the Brentford model with respect to that? They're quite heavily into Recruitment Analysis...?

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3 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

The problem with that, one of the problems with that obviously no appointment is a guarantee but say we recruit Cook, or another experienced manager, he hires a load of players on 3 year contracts. This summer could be crucial btw, a fork in the road- many out of contract, transition from Covid football to a bit of normality hopefully.

Anyway, say we do that- and they don't mesh. We sack Cook because we're down in the bottom 3, new manager comes in...and is stuck with a load of players he doesn't want or who don't fit his approach! Players we can't get rid of. What then?

Karanka at Birmingham had a 3 year deal- they're in the Bottom 3 tonight, suspect he had a heavy input into the recruitment? I know that club will take some turning round but...Experienced manager- backed him within financial constraints- stagnated or got worse!

What's the Brentford model with respect to that? They're quite heavily into Recruitment Analysis...?

What’s the difference with letting Holden & Ashton do the big rebuild (God help us) ??

- We’d still have a squad of players that another coach / manager probably won’t fancy much of when Holden inevitably gets the bullet ?

Now - with the imminent summer rebuild is the time to get the right man in so good decisions about current and targets can be made 

 

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10 minutes ago, Sheltons Army said:

What’s the difference with letting Holden & Ashton do the big rebuild (God help us) ??

- We’d still have a squad of players that another coach / manager probably won’t fancy much of when Holden inevitably gets the bullet ?

Now - with the imminent summer rebuild is the time to get the right man in so good decisions about current and targets can be made 

 

This is fair- I'm hoping they are scouring good free agents at this level and have been since well a while, as a lot will be out of contract in the summer. If there is scope to utlilse contacts, or intermediaries all the better.

Holden I have sympathy with over the injury issues- surely 100% not his fault that bit of it- wonder what he could have done with a consistently, fully fit squad. Ideally I wouldn't mind seeing him with a, well not quite fully fit but say strongly fit squad. Could he have built on a promising start- could he have gained a consistent rhythm with 4-3-3? More fit players means more scope for rotation in busy periods and keeping fresh etc.

Don't get me wrong, Cook would be a fine appointment IMO. Adkins was mentioned on another thread could be interesting- but wary of giving a manager carte blanche too.

A certain Big Mick is or might well be out of contract in the summer too. ;)

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Ashton has sucked the life out of the club, and destroyed any feeling the club has for the fans, and now the fans have had enough, the club has never been great at PR, but it’s at an all time low now, soulless, no direction and one that doesn’t seem to care about the people that matter. How did pantsdown even let this happen,? Can he not see what’s happening? Does he even care?

Smug git springs to mind.

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4 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

This is fair- I'm hoping they are scouring good free agents at this level and have been since well a while, as a lot will be out of contract in the summer. If there is scope to utlilse contacts, or intermediaries all the better.

Holden I have sympathy with over the injury issues- surely 100% not his fault that bit of it- wonder what he could have done with a consistently, fully fit squad. Ideally I wouldn't mind seeing him with a, well not quite fully fit but say strongly fit squad. Could he have built on a promising start- could he have gained a consistent rhythm with 4-3-3? More fit players means more scope for rotation in busy periods and keeping fresh etc.

Don't get me wrong, Cook would be a fine appointment IMO. Adkins was mentioned on another thread could be interesting- but wary of giving a manager carte blanche too.

Adkins doesn't rock my boat and against popular opinion I’m far from convinced by Cook 

 

Id have a few quid Who it’s could well be (NOT my want or suggestion )

Michael Appleton

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1 minute ago, Sheltons Army said:

Adkins doesn't rock my boat and against popular opinion I’m far from convinced by Cook 

 

Id have a few quid Who it’s could well be (NOT my want or suggestion )

Michael Appleton

If Holden is the fall guy and Teflon’s doing the interviews again lump everything you’ve got on it.

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3 minutes ago, sludge said:

No experienced manager would. That’s part of the reason why we have the current (previously tried) cycle of appointing inexperienced head coaches. 

I agree , other (decent) candidates wouldn’t have been interested and a few of them probably turned down or didn’t want the job, that’s how we ended up with nodding dog Holden.

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The most depressing thing about this whole debacle is the sense of powerlessness us paying punters have; without SL’s money we’d be a financial basket case so we have to endure his limitless patience with that obsequious so-and-so Ashton despite his obvious rank incompetence.

No prospect of anything changing unless things get so dire the status quo is untenable - and that’s a horrible prospect.

Unsurprising given that and fans not allowed at games that the reaction is one of lethargy and resignation rather than blind fury.

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1 minute ago, mossey said:

I agree , other (decent) candidates wouldn’t have been interested and a few of them probably turned down or didn’t want the job, that’s how we ended up with nodding dog Holden.

Yep. Ashton + inexperienced manger + financial sustainability is not going to equal premier league football. Something has to give!

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This might sound ridiculous I don’t know , if Ashton did go. 

go all out for city fan & proper CEO  Richard Scudamore . Get him to hire a DOF and the best recruitment & scouting team affordable. With his contacts in the game it should be very profitable. I have no idea what he’s doing now or even if it’s feasible though 

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1 hour ago, Harry said:

Sack Ashton. 
Sack the 2 pointless ex-England coaches. 
Remove Holden from Head Coach. 
Hire a proper manager. One with managerial experience and a CV that says “I know how to recruit footballers and I know how to put a team together”. I don’t know, Paul Cook as an example. 
If Holden is happy to do so, he can stay as a coach or assistant. 
The new manager has a say in bringing in a Chief Scout / Head of Recruitment. Working as a team to bring the best possible players to the club. 
Sack off half the recruitment analysts. Hire some proper scouts, all across the country, doing the hard yards. 

Surely it’s possible to do a bit of both in a recruitment set up to cover off all areas. You can’t ignore data, but equally old school scouting experience on the ground is still valuable. More about getting the right people in to put a plan together. It looks to me that Brentford have had a plan and identified the right staff, coaches and players to compete more successfully on a consistent basis than we have.

Our general philosophy of bringing good youngsters through, style of play, DNA and such stuff is all nice in theory, but for ****’s, why can’t we identify and invest in the right staff through out the club to manage the process. I’ve heard Lansdown did this with Hargreaves to make his business a success. There’s no guarantees in football, but surely you got to be able to get some of this senior recruitment right at sometime. Unless of course Lansdown believes he has done this, but I seriously can’t believe that such an apparently and visibly successful businessman can be happy with the obvious lack of real progress compared with the investment of clubs who appear to have spent far less, since we came up under Cotterill.

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