Mr Popodopolous Posted February 9, 2021 Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 1 minute ago, Moments of Pleasure said: It was from the Derby game, 16 September (4:1) to about the, well, let's say Man City at home, 23 January. No, let's be fair: QPR at home (2:0), 27 January. About 16 weeks. First half vs Sunderland was quite good, so too was first half vs Leeds away- Sheffield Wednesday 4-0 also showed characteristics and phases of the Hull 5-5 extravaganza- all IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheltons Army Posted February 9, 2021 Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 5 minutes ago, Robbored said: Imagine what Danny Wilson could do with this squad. About 473 pints and shots between them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Out of his pie crust Posted February 9, 2021 Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 Imagine what Steve copp...nah probably not Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red-Robbo Posted February 9, 2021 Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 Might play them in the same formation week after week when it clearly isn't working.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superjack Posted February 9, 2021 Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 5 minutes ago, Robbored said: At least if DW was in charge we’d see some thrilling football.. We'd never go up though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomo Posted February 9, 2021 Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 23 minutes ago, 2015 said: It wasn't his tactics though, it was the fact they didn't bring their USP out in tonight's match or enough POMO https://www.readytogo.net/smb/threads/mr-johnson-post-shrewsbury-defeat-video.1541667/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted February 9, 2021 Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 1 hour ago, Out of his pie crust said: Imagine what Steve copp...nah probably not Such a professional club (at that time) that he retired after 2 games! Not just quit- retired (in his words?) What a mark we made!? Quote Steve Coppell has resigned as Bristol City manager with immediate effect after just one league game in charge. The 55-year-old informed his chairman, Steve Lansdown, of his decision yesterday and released a statement through the League Mangers Association today which confirmed that not only had he left the club, but stated he has retired from football management. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted February 9, 2021 Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 What would Cotts do? Interesting counterfactual. He might for the first few months have honed and perfected the 3-5-2/3-4-3 that we utilised under him, he might have done what Holden did and built on it with more attacking play still. I say the first few months, this being say September-late November before all the injuries really started kicking in. Also possible though that he might have reached this point and sulked at varying points between 2015-2019 as we had to trade players- how would he have brought into that model? The need to trade wouldn't have gone away, unless we'd gone up under him. It's impossible to say on balance, but he might well have got the 3-5-2 we had in the Autumn really firing on all cylinders. If though he threw a sulk every time a key player had to go as part of the model then it would have been untenable- either been or become- as well as the ongoing requirements of FFP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted February 9, 2021 Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 20 minutes ago, Superjack said: We'd never go up though. A minor detail............that season with Bell, Tinnion, Murray, Thorpe, Peacock et el was the most attractive football I’ve seen at AG in decades. Every manager since then has served up boring, dreary and paint drying stuff and that doesn’t look as if it’s going change under Deano. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex_BCFC Posted February 9, 2021 Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 He had us in a complete mess and we were heading straight back to league 1 until SL intervened. Thankfully LJ came in and kept us up - then improved us every year except his last. Certainly wouldn’t want him back anymore than I want Holden to last beyond this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex_BCFC Posted February 9, 2021 Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 1 minute ago, Robbored said: A minor detail............that season with Bell, Tinnion, Murray, Thorpe, Peacock et el was the most attractive football I’ve seen at AG in decades. Every manager since then has served up boring, dreary and paint drying stuff and that doesn’t look as if it’s going change under Deano. ? Under CotteriL in league one we played some great stuff. And it was effective too. Wilson was a huge failure despite playing some good football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superjack Posted February 9, 2021 Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 11 minutes ago, Robbored said: A minor detail............that season with Bell, Tinnion, Murray, Thorpe, Peacock et el was the most attractive football I’ve seen at AG in decades. Every manager since then has served up boring, dreary and paint drying stuff and that doesn’t look as if it’s going change under Deano. I'm not biting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fordy62 Posted February 9, 2021 Author Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 5 minutes ago, Superjack said: I'm not biting. It’s just an out and out lie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CheddarReds Posted February 9, 2021 Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 Cotts needed to go. Can talk all we want about wage bills, Lansdown 'backing him', would he do any worse than Holden etc etc but there are flaws in that thinking. Reality is we were in trouble due to his stubbornness to move away from his 3-5-2 which wasn't working. I miss the good football from the L1 days, I miss the group of players we had at that time and it's a shame it didn't work but we were right to move on when we did. I agree I can't see him coming back either. Hope Cotts is making progress in his recovery, he's always a legend in my eyes and I expect to see him and Wilbs doing well with Shrewsbury next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red_Alligator Posted February 9, 2021 Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 59 minutes ago, Robbored said: At least if DW was in charge we’d see some thrilling football.. Stop it Robbo!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wayne allisons tongues Posted February 9, 2021 Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 34 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said: What would Cotts do? Interesting counterfactual. He might for the first few months have honed and perfected the 3-5-2/3-4-3 that we utilised under him, he might have done what Holden did and built on it with more attacking play still. I say the first few months, this being say September-late November before all the injuries really started kicking in. Also possible though that he might have reached this point and sulked at varying points between 2015-2019 as we had to trade players- how would he have brought into that model? The need to trade wouldn't have gone away, unless we'd gone up under him. It's impossible to say on balance, but he might well have got the 3-5-2 we had in the Autumn really firing on all cylinders. If though he threw a sulk every time a key player had to go as part of the model then it would have been untenable- either been or become- as well as the ongoing requirements of FFP. Question for @Finley_Smith10 once more. Cotts- Would he/could he have strengthed as he liked while accepting the reality of FFP requirements for 2015-16? Then- Would/could he have brought into a need to sell some of his better players to reinvest some and cover losses/higher wages in other aspects? The club had agreed to sign Gray and Maguire with SC Then decided to try and get the fees down lower and when SC came back from holiday the deals were off. Money was there to sign them. Instead we signed Kodja LJ came in he signed Matthews, Tomlin and Odemwingie on loan so there was money available and week before LJ came we loaned in o donnell, Gladwin and Pearce . If we had no money where did all those loan fees and wages become available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted February 9, 2021 Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 5 minutes ago, wayne allisons tongues said: The club had agreed to sign Gray and Maguire with SC Then decided to try and get the fees down lower and when SC came back from holiday the deals were off. Money was there to sign them. Instead we signed Kodja LJ came in he signed Matthews, Tomlin and Odemwingie on loan so there was money available and week before LJ came we loaned in o donnell, Gladwin and Pearce . If we had no money where did all those loan fees and wages become available. We would have had quite a thin squad. Remember we could only lose £13m + Allowable Costs that season- do we know the fees and the wages for those 2- if they took us over FFP for that year then there was arguably a necessity. Loans are often cheaper than permanent deals. Whoever the manager is they still have to work within the budgetary or FFP constraints- would signing of Maguire and Gray have done this? I've read for Gray the fee alone was £8m, dunno about Maguire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wayne allisons tongues Posted February 9, 2021 Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 3 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said: We would have had quite a thin squad. Remember we could only lose £13m + Allowable Costs that season- do we know the fees and the wages for those 2- if they took us over FFP for that year then there was arguably a necessity. Loans are often cheaper than permanent deals. Would there wages been as much as Gladwin, Tomlin, Odemwingie, Matthews. O donnell and Pearce together. SC wasn’t allowed Maguire but then we sign Baker on loan from Villa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexukhc Posted February 9, 2021 Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 Ryan Fredericks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted February 9, 2021 Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 7 minutes ago, wayne allisons tongues said: Would there wages been as much as Gladwin, Tomlin, Odemwingie, Matthews. O donnell and Pearce together. I've read £8m for Gray alone fee wise- dunno the accuracy. The thing is, Tomlin and Matthews were a half season give or take, so was O'Donnell- actually so were Pearce and Gladwin half season loans. Odemwingie was short term- that feels accurate? Some of these were young players, if we were paying those 2 say £25k a week over a season, £25k a week each I mean it all starts to stack up...then there's the amortisation, before you know it millions are being added onto the cost base. Don't get me wrong, from a football POV- just imagine! Fielding Ayling Flint Maguire Little Pack Smith Bryan Freeman Kodjia Gray With player such as Williams as first reserve for CB, Reid- would we have still signed Baker, Robinson and players like this? The first team though, could've been great! Maybe it could've worked...I'm just ubercautious football wise financially tbh. I still wonder what Cotts could have done with that squad. ie the one we had...really think we shouldn't have been in the bottom 3 in January considering the success of 2015/16 and the subsequent success of a similar Sheffield United side a few years on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wayne allisons tongues Posted February 9, 2021 Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 1 minute ago, Mr Popodopolous said: I've read £8m for Gray alone fee wise- dunno the accuracy. The thing is, Tomlin and Matthews were a half season give or take, so was O'Donnell- Pearce and Gladwin were full season loans. Odemwingie was short term- that feels accurate? Some of these were young players, if we were paying those 2 say £25k a week over a season, £25k a week each I mean it all starts to stack up...then there's the amortisation, before you know it millions are being added onto the cost base. Don't get me wrong, from a football POV- jsut imagine! Fielding Ayling Flint Maguire Little Pack Smith Bryan Freeman Kodjia Gray With player such as Williams as first reserve for CB- would we have still signed Baker, Robinson and players like this? The first team though, could've been great! He went to Burnley for £6m and paid more than we had agreed for him. Was told by my Burnley mate that we had agreed around £4m for him. Don’t think we were paying anything near £25k a week when we joined the championship. How much was Baker on a week? Seems daft to try and undercut on Maguire and then pay a loan fee and wages for Baker. If we had signed gray would we of signed Kodja? The whole transfer policy that summer from the club seemed very weird. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickJ Posted February 9, 2021 Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 1 hour ago, Finley_Smith10 said: I wish Lansdown backed him right off the back of our promotion season Shame on Lansdown that he wouldn’t back the manager that had just given us the most successful season in our entire history, that after taking over when we were bottom of the 3rd division, yet gave millions and millions and millions to his vanity project. Absolutely shameful, really, allowing personal dislike of Cotterill and infatuation with Johnson override the interests of Bristol City and it’s fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted February 9, 2021 Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 13 minutes ago, NickJ said: Shame on Lansdown that he wouldn’t back the manager that had just given us the most successful season in our entire history, that after taking over when we were bottom of the 3rd division, yet gave millions and millions and millions to his vanity project. Absolutely shameful, really, allowing personal dislike of Cotterill and infatuation with Johnson override the interests of Bristol City and it’s fans. Ah yes, a jaundiced view indeed. You neglect to acknowledge the other side of the coin- could we have signed those two and remained compliant with FFP for that season? You also neglect to mention that the rules in terms of spreading risk, became less restrictive after 2015/16 and that our Income rose at the same time. In your view, were the signings of Maguire and Gray e.g. compatible with point 1 at that time? If so, fair enough but I have to wonder otherwise why wouldn't they go through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted February 9, 2021 Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 20 minutes ago, wayne allisons tongues said: He went to Burnley for £6m and paid more than we had agreed for him. Was told by my Burnley mate that we had agreed around £4m for him. Don’t think we were paying anything near £25k a week when we joined the championship. How much was Baker on a week? Seems daft to try and undercut on Maguire and then pay a loan fee and wages for Baker. If we had signed gray would we of signed Kodja? The whole transfer policy that summer from the club seemed very weird. £8m was cited on here of all places- I'd be interested to know if fees are in the public domain? Although your Burnley mate might know more than paper talk- £4m seems reasonable. Guessing- big players come with big wages, would have been a problem with e.g. Gayle at that time. Kodjia was fairly cheap wasn't he, imagine a Gray and Kodjia partnership in a 3-5-2? Got caught out maybe, by the way the Championship had inflated- agents. Seem to recall SL mentioning agents. Yet a bit of a balancing act needed with Revenue Streams vs Rules vs Costs for that specific season? As for Maguire, links I can find suggested that Hull had rejected a £2.5m bid by us? For the record, according to this in 3015/16 we were £1m within it. We sign Gray and Maguire, who do we not sign instead? If you look specifically in isolation at 2015/16. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted February 10, 2021 Report Share Posted February 10, 2021 27 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said: We would have had quite a thin squad. Remember we could only lose £13m + Allowable Costs that season- do we know the fees and the wages for those 2- if they took us over FFP for that year then there was arguably a necessity. Loans are often cheaper than permanent deals. Whoever the manager is they still have to work within the budgetary or FFP constraints- would signing of Maguire and Gray have done this? I've read for Gray the fee alone was £8m, dunno about Maguire. We’ve done this before Mr P. 14 minutes ago, wayne allisons tongues said: He went to Burnley for £6m and paid more than we had agreed for him. Was told by my Burnley mate that we had agreed around £4m for him. Don’t think we were paying anything near £25k a week when we joined the championship. How much was Baker on a week? Seems daft to try and undercut on Maguire and then pay a loan fee and wages for Baker. If we had signed gray would we of signed Kodja? The whole transfer policy that summer from the club seemed very weird. Gray £4m - £14k wages Maguire £2.5m - not sure of wages, but less than Gray you’d imagine. Say 4 year contract, FFP, not an issue. Fredericks £250k, 3 year contract, say £10k. So for the 3 of them cost year 1. Gray £1.75m Maguire £1.25m Fredericks £580k Even add Kodjia £1.5m 1st year cost. We are talking £5m playing budget. I think the money was there. As above you wouldn’t then need Baker. You wouldn’t need Simon Cox. Eliiott Bennett (who I rated) probably cost as much on loan as Fredericks did as a transfer. Hamer would’ve been a cheap loan. Liam Moore mid-range. Callum Robinson cheap. Forget the Gayle move....even that wasn’t allegedly £9m, but £6m plus add-ons. Forget Gray at £6m, that was after Pelling stuffed up and he paid for it with his job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted February 10, 2021 Report Share Posted February 10, 2021 1 minute ago, Davefevs said: We’ve done this before Mr P. Gray £4m - £14k wages Maguire £2.5m - not sure of wages, but less than Gray you’d imagine. Say 4 year contract, FFP, not an issue. Fredericks £250k, 3 year contract, say £10k. So for the 3 of them cost year 1. Gray £1.75m Maguire £1.25m Fredericks £580k Even add Kodjia £1.5m 1st year cost. We are talking £5m playing budget. I think the money was there. As above you wouldn’t then need Baker. You wouldn’t need Simon Cox. Eliiott Bennett (who I rated) probably cost as much on loan as Fredericks did as a transfer. Hamer would’ve been a cheap loan. Liam Moore mid-range. Callum Robinson cheap. Forget the Gayle move....even that wasn’t allegedly £9m, but £6m plus add-ons. Forget Gray at £6m, that was after Pelling stuffed up and he paid for it with his job. Okay thanks Dave- yeah that seems alright then- thinner squad but maybe quality over quanity. Did read on here £8m Gray fee but that maybe was wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted February 10, 2021 Report Share Posted February 10, 2021 Just now, Mr Popodopolous said: Okay thanks Dave- yeah that seems alright then- thinner squad but maybe quality over quanity. Did read on here £8m Gray fee but that maybe was wrong. Nah, initially £4m (all allegedly). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wayne allisons tongues Posted February 10, 2021 Report Share Posted February 10, 2021 4 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said: £8m was cited on here of all places- I'd be interested to know if fees are in the public domain? Although your Burnley mate might know more than paper talk- £4m seems reasonable. Guessing- big players come with big wages, would have been a problem with e.g. Gayle at that time. Kodjia was fairly cheap wasn't he, imagine a Gray and Kodjia partnership in a 3-5-2? Got caught out maybe, by the way the Championship had inflated- agents. Seem to recall SL mentioning agents. Yet a bit of a balancing act needed with Revenue Streams vs Rules vs Costs for that specific season? As for Maguire, links I can find suggested that Hull had rejected a £2.5m bid by us? Gray and Maguire £6.5m plus wages if £20k a week 1 year £8.5m Kodja £2m plus £10k a week £2.5m Baker £15k a week at Villa? plus loan fee £1m Tomlin, matthews, odemwingie wouldn’t of been cheap pus loan fees for 4 months if each was on £10k a week that’s £30k over 4 months another £500k plus loan fees on top. There is a difference of £4.0m roughly. Not including signing Simon Cox, Richard o Donnell, Callum Robinson, Ben Gladwin, Liam Moore, Elliot Bennett and Alex Pearce. we wouldn’t of signed most of those if we had got the 2 he wanted. must be close to an outlay of only £2.5m in the end could of been less. All those loan fees and wages seem mad to spend when you could of got 2 players originally. (Bennett o Donnell only 2 not cb or forward) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
havanatopia Posted February 10, 2021 Report Share Posted February 10, 2021 Grass was too long tonight for Lee; he couldn't see over it to command his players I suppose will be his excuse. Dear oh dear Lee, how very dare you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted February 10, 2021 Report Share Posted February 10, 2021 23 minutes ago, wayne allisons tongues said: Gray and Maguire £6.5m plus wages if £20k a week 1 year £8.5m Kodja £2m plus £10k a week £2.5m Baker £15k a week at Villa? plus loan fee £1m Tomlin, matthews, odemwingie wouldn’t of been cheap pus loan fees for 4 months if each was on £10k a week that’s £30k over 4 months another £500k plus loan fees on top. There is a difference of £4.0m roughly. Not including signing Simon Cox, Richard o Donnell, Callum Robinson, Ben Gladwin, Liam Moore, Elliot Bennett and Alex Pearce. we wouldn’t of signed most of those if we had got the 2 he wanted. must be close to an outlay of only £2.5m in the end could of been less. All those loan fees and wages seem mad to spend when you could of got 2 players originally. (Bennett o Donnell only 2 not cb or forward) If there was a chance we fail FFP I have to offer some level of defence for the club. Dave did figures above though which suggest otherwise. Some decent players amongst those loanees- could Cotts have got more out of them. The squad size would have been...well I'll have a look. Fielding, O'Leary- O'Donnell? Ayling, Williams, Flint, Maguire Who out of Matthews, Pearce, Baker, Golbourne do we sign? Smith, Wagstaff, Pack, Bryan, Freeman, Reid Agard, Wilbraham, Kodjia, Gray, Burns Who out of Tomlin, Garita, Odemwingie do we sign? Didn't El Abd and Osborne- and even Burns despite the winner v Middlesbrough- leave through the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.