Sunderland fans loving POMO’s and USP’s

[Bazooka Joe]

21 minutes ago, dREDful said:

He'd probably need a whole new personality too. I liked him as a player, thought he received a massive amount of necessary stick.

 

That seems fair enough to me.

[2015]

10 hours ago, Davefevs said:

Accrington Stanley jumped over them into 6th tonight.  Jon Coleman, what a job he’s doing.  Really like like their owner too.

If they make it to the Championship, I think that is a bigger achievement than Leicester title win. That's been years and years of good management, good decisions being made on and off the pitch by Accrington Stanley, let alone the fact they truly are a Community football club, some real Roy of the Rovers stuff really

[Fordy62]

37 minutes ago, 2015 said:

If they make it to the Championship, I think that is a bigger achievement than Leicester title win. That's been years and years of good management, good decisions being made on and off the pitch by Accrington Stanley, let alone the fact they truly are a Community football club, some real Roy of the Rovers stuff really

Equivalent to us being in Europe in 5 years!

[2015]

Just now, Fordy62 said:

Equivalent to us being in Europe in 5 years!

We just didn't apply enough USP during LJ's 4 years in charge 

[Galway Red]

52 minutes ago, 2015 said:

If they make it to the Championship, I think that is a bigger achievement than Leicester title win. That's been years and years of good management, good decisions being made on and off the pitch by Accrington Stanley, let alone the fact they truly are a Community football club, some real Roy of the Rovers stuff really

Would love to see them go up as that would be one relegation spot sewn up next season (should we still be in this division) 

[Phileas Fogg]

I get the impression some people are a bit miffed that LJ had the balls to take the Sunderland job.

People who dislike him were fond of the idea that he benefitted from his relationship with the Lansdown family  (true) and wouldn’t get another ‘big job’ from his own merit.

I find it a bit odd how there are some who’d love him to fail at Sunderland.  I appreciate his personality is a bit grating, but he gave his all for us and ultimately left the club in a stronger position than he found it.

In my opinion we should be happy for him to do well - same way we should be for Cotterill. Both good men who gave this job their all and improved the club’s situation.

Edited February 18, 2021 by Phileas Fogg

[RedLionLad]

7 minutes ago, Phileas Fogg said:

I get the impression some people are a bit miffed that LJ had the balls to take the Sunderland job.

People who dislike him were fond of the idea that he benefitted from his relationship with the Lansdown (true) and wouldn’t get another ‘big job’ from his own merit.

I find it a bit odd how there are some who’d love him to fail at Sunderland.  I appreciate his personality is a bit grating, but he gave his all for us and ultimately left the club in a stronger position than he found it.

In my opinion we should be happy for him to do well - same way we should be for Cotterill. Both good men who gave this job their all and improved the club’s situation.

Some will hate him even more if he’s successful up there.

[BetterRedthanBlue]

46 minutes ago, Phileas Fogg said:

I get the impression some people are a bit miffed that LJ had the balls to take the Sunderland job.

People who dislike him were fond of the idea that he benefitted from his relationship with the Lansdown family  (true) and wouldn’t get another ‘big job’ from his own merit.

I find it a bit odd how there are some who’d love him to fail at Sunderland.  I appreciate his personality is a bit grating, but he gave his all for us and ultimately left the club in a stronger position than he found it.

In my opinion we should be happy for him to do well - same way we should be for Cotterill. Both good men who gave this job their all and improved the club’s situation.

I wish him well at Sunderland, he helped us improve and was truly committed to this club. 

It didn't work out for one reason or another and he moved on. I thank him for everything he did for our club, put us in good standing, constantly improving positoon, that carabao Cup run beating Man Utd at Ashton Gate and giving Man City 2 really good games. 

[Phileas Fogg]

9 minutes ago, BetterRedthenBlue said:

I wish him well at Sunderland, he helped us improve and was truly committed to this club. 

It didn't work out for one reason or another and he moved on. I thank him for everything he did for our club, put us in good standing, constantly improving positoon, that carabao Cup run beating Man Utd at Ashton Gate and giving Man City 2 really good games. 

Exactly, me too. There’s plenty to criticise about him - and it was right to sack him. But I cannot fathom the stick he still gets and some people hoping he fails at Sunderland, just seems odd and personal.

[Kid in the Riot]

 

[Sheltons Army]

7 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

 

I get that personal connection vibe again Kid

[Phileas Fogg]

13 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

 

That’s great. Regardless whether they’re punching below their weight for a club of their size, you can see how delighted the Sunderland fans are after the time they’ve had over the last few years. 

They’d definitely sell their end of Wembley and more if fans were able to go.

[Will Rollason]

31 minutes ago, Phileas Fogg said:

Exactly, me too. There’s plenty to criticise about him - and it was right to sack him. But I cannot fathom the stick he still gets and some people hoping he fails at Sunderland, just seems odd and personal.

"just seems odd and personal"

really is. for a vocal few at least. just hated him from day one that he signed as a player to when he left as manager. 

I liked him. not as a player so much but as a coach. 

[Phileas Fogg]

17 minutes ago, Will Rollason said:

"just seems odd and personal"

really is. for a vocal few at least. just hated him from day one that he signed as a player to when he left as manager. 

I liked him. not as a player so much but as a coach. 

I think there’s a lot of bitterness about how LJ was backed and SC wasn’t to the same extent - especially when you factor in the rumours of Cotterill’s negotiated deals being scuppered in 2015.

I have sympathy with that point of view, but do not understand how it extends to a bizarre personal dislike of LJ. He couldn’t help that situation and had no involvement in it.

Was he backed inordinately? Probably.

Should he have been sacked earlier? Yes.

Did he give his all and ultimately leave us stronger? Yes. 

Unless the manager has an impact like Pulis, I don’t see why you wouldn’t want our former managers to do well in the future. Same as our former players - it’s great to see Reid, Bryan, Brownhill and Webster doing well.

Edited February 18, 2021 by Phileas Fogg

[Sheltons Army]

13 minutes ago, Phileas Fogg said:

I think there’s a lot of bitterness about how LJ was backed and SC wasn’t to the same extent - especially when you factor in the rumours of Cotterill’s negotiated deals being scuppered in 2015.

I have sympathy with that point of view, but do not understand how it extends to a bizarre personal dislike of LJ. He couldn’t help that situation and had no involvement in it.

Was he backed inordinately? Probably.

Should he have been sacked earlier? Yes.

Did he give his all and ultimately leave us stronger? Yes. 

Unless the manager has an impact like Pulis, I don’t see why you wouldn’t want our former managers to do well in the future. Same as our former players - it’s great to see Reid, Bryan, Brownhill and Webster doing well.

I’ll put my hands up

Defended him as a player 

As a coach , clearly had some qualities but has a lot to learn as a Head Coach / ‘Manager of a side’

What I couldn’t abide was his bull*** , and particularly his ego, arrogance and over inflated opinion of himself , way above his actual capability

I met him and was privy to, and part of a couple of conversations , discussions with him , and he came across as a nice enough bloke but some of his comments made me cringe

[Phileas Fogg]

3 minutes ago, Sheltons Army said:

I’ll put my hands up

Defended him as a player 

As a coach , clearly had some qualities but has a lot to learn as a Head Coach / ‘Manager of a side’

What I couldn’t abide was his bull*** , and particularly his ego, arrogance and over inflated opinion of himself , way above his actual capability

I met him and was privy to, and part of a couple of conversations , discussions with him , and he came across as a nice enough bloke but some of his comments made me cringe

Yeah he could be quite grating sometimes. I think he’s learning on the job and finding his feet. We were a big learning opportunity for him and his future clubs will benefit from the time (and lots of it!) he had here.

The thing I really didn’t like was his tendency to throw young players under the bus. I remember this happening with Magnússon and Moore amongst others. If you think back to being a new employee in any organisation - getting publicly criticised by your boss would wreck the confidence of most people. I thought this went beyond grating and was quite nasty. I appreciate in the heat of the moment people say the wrong thing.. but part of management is controlling your emotions. 

Edited February 18, 2021 by Phileas Fogg

[italian dave]

7 hours ago, Sheltons Army said:

I’ll put my hands up

Defended him as a player 

As a coach , clearly had some qualities but has a lot to learn as a Head Coach / ‘Manager of a side’

What I couldn’t abide was his bull*** , and particularly his ego, arrogance and over inflated opinion of himself , way above his actual capability

I met him and was privy to, and part of a couple of conversations , discussions with him , and he came across as a nice enough bloke but some of his comments made me cringe

I was never his greatest fan as a player, but felt he got unfair stick, maybe in part for being his Dad's son. 

Yes, the things he said and did sometimes were a bit cringe-making, but I wonder whether the ego and the arrogance - not a million miles from self-confidence and self belief - are qualities that a football manager needs. A bit like strikers needing to be greedy because hey have the same self confidence.

At the end of the day that's maybe what enabled him to manage his way through those poor runs in a way that DH never looked likely to do. And why those poor runs never, I think, saw 3-4 successively more gutless performances in the way we've seen recently.

Not always an attractive trait but maybe something a manager needs to have.

I always felt that towards the end he slightly lost that: I don't know whether it was the self belief that went, or his belief that the club believed in him: I think the departures of Webster and of Brownhill really dented him - timing wise as much as anything, and he lost a bit of that confidence in his ability to bounce back from that.

But overall I still think he's one of the minority of managers in recent years who've left us in a better place than when he arrived. And he certainly doesn't deserve some of the vitriol he got at the time, not the weird delight some still take every time he loses.

[Mr Popodopolous]

8 hours ago, Phileas Fogg said:

I think there’s a lot of bitterness about how LJ was backed and SC wasn’t to the same extent - especially when you factor in the rumours of Cotterill’s negotiated deals being scuppered in 2015.

I have sympathy with that point of view, but do not understand how it extends to a bizarre personal dislike of LJ. He couldn’t help that situation and had no involvement in it.

Was he backed inordinately? Probably.

Should he have been sacked earlier? Yes.

Did he give his all and ultimately leave us stronger? Yes. 

Unless the manager has an impact like Pulis, I don’t see why you wouldn’t want our former managers to do well in the future. Same as our former players - it’s great to see Reid, Bryan, Brownhill and Webster doing well.

There were accidents of timing tbh- had LJ came in first and Cotts 2nd, Cotts would have benefited from the increased attendances, commercial revenue- still a case to be made that Cotts should perhaps have held firm and patient a bit in 2015/16 and started to build from a stronger base in 2016/17 as finances rose.

Edited February 18, 2021 by Mr Popodopolous

[Dr Balls]

I was neither a great fan of his as a player, and there was always the whiff of nepotism when playing for GJ. Likewise if he hadn’t had the relationship with people around the club, I don’t think he would have been appointed and backed as Head Coach so early in his managerial career. He could be frustrating, streaky, talk management-speak BS, and seemed to employ a tombola to pick the team but his record at Championship level was ok, without actually being successful.

I don’t wish him ill and he’s certainly taken on a big club with huge expectations, which will be a challenge to achieve. But he has got them to Wembley in the EFL Trophy (the Papa John’s cup? Oh purlease!) which is the only way that they could realistically achieve that at present so that’s something, but the real expectation is promotion back to the Championship. Anything less will be regarded as failure by their fans and probably their new owner.

[TedsHeadIs Red]

Let’s assume both City and Sunderland are in the Championship next season.

Imagine City home to Sunderland early in the season and assume spectators are allowed back in the stadium.

The players are out and the game is soon to start.

LJ walks out of the tunnel to take his place on the bench,

What reaction does he get from the AG faithful?

Score it on a scale from 1 to 100:

1 = vitriolic abuse and rotten tomatoes thrown at him 

100 = rapturous applause and a rendition of “for he’s a jolly good fellow”

I reckon a 65.

[Red Army 75]

5 minutes ago, TedsHeadIs Red said:

Let’s assume both City and Sunderland are in the Championship next season.

Imagine City home to Sunderland early in the season and assume spectators are allowed back in the stadium.

The players are out and the game is soon to start.

LJ walks out of the tunnel to take his place on the bench,

What reaction does he get from the AG faithful?

Score it on a scale from 1 to 100:

1 = vitriolic abuse and rotten tomatoes thrown at him 

100 = rapturous applause and a rendition of “for he’s a jolly good fellow”

I reckon a 65.

He would get a good ovation IMO and he should. Not as good if Cotterill came back with another club. Everyone in the ground would have pointy things in their backs. 

[Simon79]

People obviously bring up the losing streak, but to my memory, we were never getting d**ked like we have recently, we were never out of the game. I never got the feeling that the players had gone. We were scoring goals & having shots. So I thought I’d check, during the record losing streak, we never lost by more than one. 0 points none the less, but nothing like what we’ve seen recently. COYR 

[StGeorge]

8 minutes ago, TedsHeadIs Red said:

Score it on a scale from 1 to 100:

1 = vitriolic abuse and rotten tomatoes thrown at him 

100 = rapturous applause and a rendition of “for he’s a jolly good fellow”

I reckon a 65.

I'll  take "Johnson says "Bounce around the ground"  when we go three up 

[cidercity1987]

12 minutes ago, TedsHeadIs Red said:

Let’s assume both City and Sunderland are in the Championship next season.

Imagine City home to Sunderland early in the season and assume spectators are allowed back in the stadium.

The players are out and the game is soon to start.

LJ walks out of the tunnel to take his place on the bench,

What reaction does he get from the AG faithful?

Score it on a scale from 1 to 100:

1 = vitriolic abuse and rotten tomatoes thrown at him 

100 = rapturous applause and a rendition of “for he’s a jolly good fellow”

I reckon a 65.

Given that he got dogs abuse down the Gate when he took Barnsley there after a very successful playing career with us, I'll say 10 max.

[RedRaw]

4 minutes ago, cidercity1987 said:

Given that he got dogs abuse down the Gate when he took Barnsley there after a very successful playing career with us, I'll say 10 max.

I must have blinked when that happened

[cidercity1987]

7 minutes ago, RedRaw said:

I must have blinked when that happened

Yeah sureeeeee.....

From midtable League One to almost the Prem. 

[SecretSam]

On 10/02/2021 at 00:11, NickJ said:

Sunderland fans have worked out that David Brent talks bollocks after 12 games. It took Lansdown almost 5 years. It should be laughable but actually angers me to think we replaced a top bloke and great man manager and motivator with that cretin. 

Top bloke, sure

Motivator? Possibly

But we were in the process of being relegated. Cotts refused to change his strategy and adapt to the fact that our formation and style were being caught out. He was also pig-headed about transfers - a lot on here complain about Ashton's role, but IMHO it can be directly linked back to the summer after promotion - when Cotts demanded players X, Y and Z, but then disengaged when they turned out not to be feasible, meaning we signed no-one.

[SecretSam]

On 10/02/2021 at 12:45, Alan Dicks' Barmy Army said:

I had forgotten the blind love in that a few posters had with Cotts

Amazing how some people can only see the good in one boss, and then only see the bad in another

I recall at the time in the 2015/16 season, plenty were screaming for him to go. He was pig-headed over signings that summer, our squad was terrible and too thin.

I suspect some of the love is because many on here don't have that much history - younger fans would possible remember GJ's time, but that's it.

I've seen us come up from the third tier under Jordan, Ward, GJ and Cotts. All wonderful seasons but 3 of those 4 managers got binned within a short time.

 

[SecretSam]

On 10/02/2021 at 12:27, Davefevs said:

Sorry, but those accounts are for the whole club, are they? Not just playing staff.  

And for a realistic comparison, you'd need to benchmark them against what other teams in the same league were spending. Year-on-year comparisons aren't valid as the spending needed to be competitive in the Championship has risen ahead of inflation.

[Red Exile]

32 minutes ago, SecretSam said:

I recall at the time in the 2015/16 season, plenty were screaming for him to go. He was pig-headed over signings that summer, our squad was terrible and too thin.

I suspect some of the love is because many on here don't have that much history - younger fans would possible remember GJ's time, but that's it.

I've seen us come up from the third tier under Jordan, Ward, GJ and Cotts. All wonderful seasons but 3 of those 4 managers got binned within a short time.

 

Thinking back over the past 40 years I'd say that Cotts managed the club through one of it most joyous seasons, just wonderful. Week in, week out, home and away, great players, great action, great spirit about the place. 6-0 to secure promotion, what a night! 8 goals on the last day of the season...come on, it's hardly surprising people remember him fondly! 

Of course it always ends in tears. My wife was recently reminding me that at the end I was calling for TC to go.