The Players.

[Mr Popodopolous]

11 minutes ago, Dan Robin said:

Clearly injuries have affected not only Holden's selection but also the performance levels of some players...but it doesn't fully explain why some performances were so poor.

Maybe a new manager will set-up the team in a better way, but if defenders will gift goals and strikers won't find the net, it won't be enough. Surely players have to take responsability and respond both on the training ground and on the pitch.

Let's hope that a change will bring improvements, results and confidence back. 

It's what we need and they should- but otoh it'll leave a sour taste as it'll show that they can do it, could have been doing it but didn't for whatever reason.

[Cowshed]

11 hours ago, MarcusX said:

This is said far too often and such a lazy argument. Professional sport is nothing like yours or my job. For starters there's 11 other players trying to stop them doing their job.

Experiencing physical and psychological factors I will not experience in my employment and played by people who are divergent characters. 

11 hours ago, Maesknoll Red said:

There always is eleven players trying to counter their efforts every week, you still have to have a measure of performance, the players always seem immune to all critique in these circumstances, the Manger get vilified, the owners / CEO’s of clubs have no way to get rid of a large quantity of players, even if they are troublesome and underperforming, so the Manager goes.  
 

Do you honestly think these players were performing at 100% to salvage some professional pride and to fulfil their contract, which must surely have something about responsibility to the club in it.

No and it should be examined why so many players are performing so below their potential.  It is BCFC buying, developing and maintaining these players. What is it at BCFC that is making such a very large number of players fail? 

Sporting environments should optimise performance. Bristol City's players we are led to believe are recruited via a rigorous recruitment process. Clearly there is something seriously wrong with the aptitude of the players BCFC are recruiting, or there is something equally wrong with the environment that supports them.   

[Clutton Caveman]

12 hours ago, ciderwithtommy said:

You know what, I just can’t stand watching their lack of effort. I have been, along with probably a vast majority on this forum, locked away from my colleagues, working long hours on zoom without as much as a beer in real life with my mates from work. This shower of xxxx get to go in every day, play football, travel, get tested frequently and basically live a better version of life then most, and that is what they serve up. 
 

hang your heads in shame, charlatans. 

One answer. New contracts where earnings are totally based on the teams performance. Low base huge incentives. If you don't play you earn a lot less. People will say you wont get players to accept this but if the potential earnings when the team is successful are high enough (higher than a normal contract) you will attract players and they will be hungry.

[Mr Popodopolous]

On 16/02/2021 at 22:09, Andy082005 said:

Said it before, and I'll say it again....they are spoilt . 

What motivation do they have to push on? They come here, earn between £10k-£25k a week, play and train in the best facilities, in a fantastic City, have the best cars, watches and tattoos etc 

The minute they all came out in support of 'Deano' last summer you just knew it was because they knew with him in charge their gravy train would continue 

Get down the Gate Saturday and let them know it I say....

Yep, you're not wrong.

On 16/02/2021 at 22:36, Maesknoll Red said:

There always is eleven players trying to counter their efforts every week, you still have to have a measure of performance, the players always seem immune to all critique in these circumstances, the Manger get vilified, the owners / CEO’s of clubs have no way to get rid of a large quantity of players, even if they are troublesome and underperforming, so the Manager goes.  
 

Do you honestly think these players were performing at 100% to salvage some professional pride and to fulfil their contract, which must surely have something about responsibility to the club in it.

Don't disagree. Definitely not 100%, totally not. Dunno how troublesome they are though others might, but definitely underperforming.

The problem is it's an Industrial Hazard of modern football at a decent level isn't it. Probably exacerbated by what you state but players on good money might not always go at it as they should when they know it's a watertight contract such as they (footballers) have. I say watertight, as in salary guaranteed if sacked for underperforming/lack of effort.

[Davefevs]

On 16/02/2021 at 21:48, LondonBristolian said:

We've 12 players out of contract in the summer, including five who started tonight. Reckon that clear out is happening and the players already know it. 

Ashton’s interview on 20Man was awful.  Hey, I’m offering Fam a massive contract but I can’t offer you anything (yet), nor have I ever put an offer in front of Liam Walsh.....followed by welcome Henri.

I know we weren’t playing well, but I sense this was a key moment in effort levels.

[LondonBristolian]

1 hour ago, Davefevs said:

Ashton’s interview on 20Man was awful.  Hey, I’m offering Fam a massive contract but I can’t offer you anything (yet), nor have I ever put an offer in front of Liam Walsh.....followed by welcome Henri.

I know we weren’t playing well, but I sense this was a key moment in effort levels.

Agreed. Players are ultimately human beings and a public declaration you don’t massively value them is likely to affect application, confidence or both. It is also likely to mean paying more to make them feel valued if we do offer contracts later. 

[Cowshed]

On 17/02/2021 at 10:23, Clutton Caveman said:

One answer. New contracts where earnings are totally based on the teams performance. Low base huge incentives. If you don't play you earn a lot less. People will say you wont get players to accept this but if the potential earnings when the team is successful are high enough (higher than a normal contract) you will attract players and they will be hungry.

Punishing people is a awful way of motivating them. 

Incentives (?) like that have existed, maybe they still do and clubs and Managers abused them.  This makes an assumption that players are motivated solely by money which is entirely untrue.  Being in an XI is an opinion. Players play well, do their best and don't get selected ... Frequently. Play well and not get picked and paid less under this incentive? No clubs wont attract players that way.

[Clutton Caveman]

18 hours ago, Cowshed said:

Punishing people is a awful way of motivating them. 

Incentives (?) like that have existed, maybe they still do and clubs and Managers abused them.  This makes an assumption that players are motivated solely by money which is entirely untrue.  Being in an XI is an opinion. Players play well, do their best and don't get selected ... Frequently. Play well and not get picked and paid less under this incentive? No clubs wont attract players that way.

What are our players motivated by then.

How you somehow get from incentive to punishment baffles me

[Guest]

On 16/02/2021 at 22:02, Red Exile said:

I don't blame the players. They'd be fine with competent leadership.

The whole club is going down the pan at the moment, bound to rub off on them.

 

Its ALL about the money, Steve needs to re-think his plan and realise you cant make a silk purse from a cows ear.

Out of contract players should either have a contract on the table, if we want them, or be not playing for us. Why should they bust a gut if they know they are going to likely be out the door in a few months.

Leaving everything till the last minute will cost us more in the long run player and manager wise.Steve could sort it all this week, tomorrow if he wanted to........ will be waiting till May if he waits for golden boy Ashton to advise him, will be too late then.

 

[Maesknoll Red]

Not sure what’s changed from my OP, apart from the Manager, the players still look as if they are non-league.  Bereft of ability, guile and nous, lacking in determination, seeming unable to control and hold a ball, to pass or shoot accurately.

I put in today’s match thread that maybe Barton hasn’t got it wrong calling out the sag players, maybe some home truths were aired about the shower that are stealing a living from us.

What would the atmosphere be like if we had crowds, although, I doubt it would be the pre-pandemic numbers as we’d be down to the diehards watching this dross every week.  Are the players getting an easy rise, no fans to get on their backs, no pressure and certainly no passion from them.

This is going to be a huge job to turn this round and the end of this season just can’t come soon enough.

[Reigate Red]

I'm a little surprised that there have not been bed sheets at the training ground calling out the players to be honest.

[Maesknoll Red]

1 hour ago, Reigate Red said:

I'm a little surprised that there have not been bed sheets at the training ground calling out the players to be honest.

There were still people saying it was the Managers fault, I doubt SAF would get this lot playing.