Port Said Red Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 There seems to be a consensus on here that Simpson and Downing are equally to blame for the downturn as Holden, but I am not so sure. The Dumb and Dumber tag is hugely unfair, they were brought in with the remit to develop our youngsters to the next level on the back of excellent records with English youth teams and initially that was looking a good move. There were comments on the threads from the Failand training, remarking on the refreshing "heads up, looking to play the ball forward as a first option" instructions from Simpson in particular, and a general positive air. The first few teams picked had a youthful look, young players coming of the bench and a general good feeling. Then Holden seemed to get cautious, the average age of the team got older and older and the younger players became rooted to the bench. The only exceptions were those forced upon him by injuries. He also got more and more defensive in his mindset until the team just became immobilised. The comments that have come out since Holden left have alluded to that, Kalas saying we can't just defend for 90 minutes, Simpsons comments about taking the shackles off as examples. As with LJ, I am sure the coaches try to steer the team in certain directions, but ultimately the man at the top makes the decisions. Last night's team was almost a perfect mix of youth and experience and the young players were placed in positions where they could expect support from their senior colleagues. It was also more like the sort of team "Dumb and Dumber" would have been hoping to be coaching. The shackles did come off, it took two matches which is not really surprising, but I think as much credit should be given to them as the arrival of Pearson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phileas Fogg Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 Simpson did a pretty candid interview pre-match, worth a watch - fairly revealing I felt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveybadger Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 Said in another topic that some of the stick these guys have been getting is OTT, given DH was ultimately responsible for the team. Their track record (especially Simpson) demands a little more respect (2 promotions and a youth World Cup win for PS). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mozo Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 It’s obviously rude and harsh that label two experienced coaches like that, but hey it’s a football forum and we get a bit of poetic licence. I personally avoided it but never bothered when other people did. Ultimately we’ve got no idea what the coaches each do or don’t contribute but I do get good vibes from Simpson and his interviews are really honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exAtyeoMax Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 I liked Paul Simpson’s interview after the game on Saturday, where he said they need to sort the situation out ASAP. He’s been totally honest and upfront with his evaluation of what needed to be done. I think both him and Keith could be worthy of their roles in the coming months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fordy62 Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 I really liked the bit where he said “I feel lucky to still be working.” Thats a good level of honesty to have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phileas Fogg Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 5 minutes ago, Fordy62 said: I really liked the bit where he said “I feel lucky to still be working.” Thats a good level of honesty to have. I also picked up on that. What he's saying is true, but to me it didn't indicate a great deal of confidence in his own ability. He genuinely seems to feel partly culpable for the Holden situations o perhaps that is a factor. What I did like was his honesty that we did probably need someone like Pearson to come in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevedon Red Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 7 minutes ago, Fordy62 said: I really liked the bit where he said “I feel lucky to still be working.” Thats a good level of honesty to have. Agreed he seemed to be casting out his demons and being....well...a good human. I like Paul and hope he stays on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the1stknowle Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 32 minutes ago, Phileas Fogg said: Simpson did a pretty candid interview pre-match, worth a watch - fairly revealing I felt. Yeah - was a really good interview. He came across really well and as very thoughtful. To the original point, I hate the D&D tag and hope people using it maybe think about it a bit more (and then stop). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phileas Fogg Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 1 minute ago, Clevedon Red said: Agreed he seemed to be casting out his demons and being....well...a good human. I like Paul and hope he stays on. I wouldn't want the existing coaching staff to stay on at the expense of Pearson being allowed to appoint who he wants. If he's happy to work in the existing structure then fine, but there's no point bringing in Pearson then limiting him through keeping on existing staff for sentiment's sake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cidered abroad Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 When I saw the team selection just before kick off, I thought that we had picked a side of square pegs in square holes. I have only just listened to Paul Simpson's pre match thoughts and he said round pegs in round holes. Not necessarily the best players at the club from those not injured, but the best for their position on the field. By doing so, we created a fairly solid defence, a midfield that worked extremely hard in defence and attack to provide us with the chances up front that were eagerly taken by Fan and Nakhi. We had bits of luck as Boro' were not able to make the most of their chances but a thoroughly deserved win. I don't normally like to single out any one player from a good team effort, but what a performance from Kasey Palmer. He surprised me and probably most of our fans with the sort of effort that is needed in modern midfield football. COYREDS!!!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniro Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 4 minutes ago, Phileas Fogg said: I wouldn't want the existing coaching staff to stay on at the expense of Pearson being allowed to appoint who he wants. If he's happy to work in the existing structure then fine, but there's no point bringing in Pearson then limiting him through keeping on existing staff for sentiment's sake. Agreed. Simpson is honest and likeable, talks some sense and clearly takes some credit for tactical tweaking last night. I certainly don't blame him (or Holden really) for the last 6 months. It was MA's decision and a shockingly bad one as we now know. However, if Nige has long term plans to be with us, he must be allowed to bring his own team in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1960maaan Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 It's been said by the club that they haven't been able to coach as normal, not been able to use the new facilities but not to be able to get the squads together as they'd like due to the situation. I do wonder who's idea it was to be so direct in the previous 2 games, it did look like a plan, a shit one , but a plan. Last night was polar opposite, played quickly through midfield, runners and with Palmer & Bakinson in there, players able to see and find those runs. Little more care and we could have had a couple more. Be an interesting run in , Pearson has a chance to see what they are made of, might be a good fit. Time will tell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cityloyal473 Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 55 minutes ago, Phileas Fogg said: Simpson did a pretty candid interview pre-match, worth a watch - fairly revealing I felt. I was going to write about PSs interview but seem to have been beaten to it. From that interview, and he put it in diplomatic terms, I think PD and Downing are equally glad to see the back of Holden. Not because of any malicious reasons, but clearly because he was not up to the job and perhaps this was rubbing off on all others including those two. They get a fresh start for me now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lrrr Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 Notable the level of blame attached to PS and KD vs DH and JM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 59 minutes ago, steveybadger said: Said in another topic that some of the stick these guys have been getting is OTT, given DH was ultimately responsible for the team. Their track record (especially Simpson) demands a little more respect (2 promotions and a youth World Cup win for PS). I like Simpson, he’s bloody honest, but ultimately on Saturday, having talked about shackles and all that, they set us up awfully. Simpson’s post-match interview was awful, like he couldn’t wait to get out of here. So they did deserve stick on Saturday imho. So, good news in many respects that last night’s pre-match presser was enthusiastic. Maybe him and Downing had been dragged down. It rubbed off on the players too last night. Maybe work had become a “chore”. Fingers crossed its onwards and upwards from this point onwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alessandro Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 Yes for me they've had some unfair abuse, as has almost everyone at the club at some point this season. Think Simpson has interview very well - enjoyed the 'real' honesty from him. Big credit for last night. I said after Barnsley what can they do in 2 days training. Well they were on top of it last night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sh1t_ref_again Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 There were so many changes in player positions and style of football last night I am not convinced it was down to them. Although NP was watching from the stands, it does not mean he had not given some suggestions to set up and play, after watching old matches or talking with Mariappa. Of course its possible its down to the coaches if do fair dos. They will be under review by NP like everyone else but seem excited to work with them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prinny Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 1 hour ago, Port Said Red said: There seems to be a consensus on here that Simpson and Downing are equally to blame for the downturn as Holden, but I am not so sure. Can you show some (any) quotes of people saying that? I think they did things in the Barnsley game that were dumber than dumb with the team selection. They had their opportunity to show they weren't dumb and dumber against Barnsley, picked Lansbury, Moore at LCB and isolated Fam up front. They deserved that tag then IMO. Much better yesterday of course, but a much different line up, tactics and a much different person watching on. Do you get credit for putting round pegs in round holes? Do you get credit for not eating crayons? That's as managers though, maybe they are great coaches, we'll see, or they get fired and we won't. They weren't equally responsible, but they were partly responsible, and Barnsley proved it IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phileas Fogg Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 2 minutes ago, Prinny said: Can you show some (any) quotes of people saying that? I think they did things in the Barnsley game that were dumber than dumb with the team selection. They had their opportunity to show they weren't dumb and dumber against Barnsley, picked Lansbury, Moore at LCB and isolated Fam up front. They deserved that tag then IMO. Much better yesterday of course, but a much different line up, tactics and a much different person watching on. Do you get credit for putting round pegs in round holes? Do you get credit for not eating crayons? That's as managers though, maybe they are great coaches, we'll see, or they get fired and we won't. They weren't equally responsible, but they were partly responsible, and Barnsley proved it IMO. I don't think you need to be so pernickety - the general mood seemed to be that they all needed to go. Any regular poster or reader over the last week knows that, doesn't need people to back up everything they say with verbatim quotes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prinny Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 Just now, Phileas Fogg said: I don't think you need to be so pernickety - the general mood seemed to be that they all needed to go. Any regular poster or reader over the last week knows that, doesn't need people to back up everything they say with verbatim quotes. It's not the same thing though is it? It likes me saying something is Tuesday when it's Saturday. But it's definitely not worth being "pernickety" about such things..right? Of course it is, because stating untrue things is unhelpful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SecretSam Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 Strong and honest interview. We have to recognise the difference between a coach - a middle manager, who implements strategy and manages performance - and managers (etc.), who set strategy and direction, make key decisions. And lead. Set the tone, the example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fat Controller Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 11 minutes ago, Prinny said: I think they did things in the Barnsley game that were dumber than dumb with the team selection. They had their opportunity to show they weren't dumb and dumber against Barnsley, picked Lansbury, Moore at LCB and isolated Fam up front. They deserved that tag then IMO. Much better yesterday of course, but a much different line up, tactics and a much different person watching on. Do you get credit for putting round pegs in round holes? Do you get credit for not eating crayons? So they get the blame when they take charge and things don't work, but you imply the credit should go to someone else when things go well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phileas Fogg Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 4 minutes ago, Prinny said: It's not the same thing though is it? It likes me saying something is Tuesday when it's Saturday. But it's definitely not worth being "pernickety" about such things..right? Of course it is, because stating untrue things is unhelpful. Hahaha! The thing is, we already have @BS4 on Tour... as chief fact checker and pedant on here - this forum is NOT big enough for the both of you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedZepperin Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 PS seems to be suggesting that DH lacks leadership qualities. A box that might have been missing during the 6-week rigorous/vigorous selection process last summer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prinny Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 4 minutes ago, sinenomine said: So they get the blame when they take charge and things don't work, but you imply the credit should go to someone else when things go well? There's question marks there for a reason. I don't know how to apportion credit in this case. How much of it was them do you think? It's not they get none, and for me it's not they get all. So what amount is it? I think they should have some. And I should clarify, I don't think that Barnsley was ALL their fault either, there's the legacy of Holden (and Johnson) there still, you can throw in Ashton and Lansdown too. My point is, when they had control vs Barnsley they did wrong things, IMO, so I don't think they're great, caus that's them in as much isolation (as a duo which makes it even harder) as you can get. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRock Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 Thought I was sticking my head over the parapet with last night’s posting about Simpson and was expecting to be shot down. Pleasantly surprised by the tone of this morning thread. Tell you what though, and it’s a very, very minor point in the wider scheme of things -as my Mum would say - he does look like he’s been dragged through a hedge backwards sometimes. Shows how ‘old school’ I am maybes, but he turned up in jeans for the press conference when everyone else was suited and booted. Then every subsequent interview, well, some people can carry unshaven look, he’s one who can’t. Clearly, he hasn’t received Steve’s ‘dress and appearances’ email. Seems a nice bloke though (or good human), and better still and, most importantly, talks a lot of football sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrisbc Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 I like the fact they speak so openly. They probably realise that Holden was just out of his depth, and now they can speak freely knowing they will probably be leaving at the end of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS4 on Tour... Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 8 minutes ago, Phileas Fogg said: Hahaha! The thing is, we already have @BS4 on Tour... as chief fact checker and pedant on here - this forum is NOT big enough for the both of you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fat Controller Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 2 minutes ago, Prinny said: There's question marks there for a reason. I don't know how to apportion credit in this case. How much of it was them do you think? It's not they get none, and for me it's not they get all. So what amount is it? I think they should have some. It seemed to me that your questions were rhetorical. I agree with you. It is difficult to apportion credit. I also think it should be much more difficult to apportion blame. How much of Saturday's performance was a hangover from how Holden was instructing? How much of it is down to the players? What were Downing & Simpson's instructions and were they followed? Like you, I don't have the answers, just more questions. I will admit I find it frustrating on here that blame is apportioned so easily. It is unbalanced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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