Qpr’s 1st goal

[1960maaan]

I'm probably not explaining myself.

The movement of Willock would have given the option of the pass, all Nagy does by pressing is making the CB pass the other side of Nagy to (I think) Austin who has dropped in.

He lays the ball off to Willock who can carry on as if it was a direct pass. He lays the ball out to Kane, who seems to just wander forward.

This is where you can probably lay some blame on Kasey, as I said , if it's COD he would have tracked the run and there would be no easy option for a pass.
TBF still a lot to do from there. @JonDolman this is the first time I can find Kane in the videos, may have attracted more attention if he sprinted 

 

[Harry]

23 minutes ago, 1960maaan said:

I'm probably not explaining myself.

The movement of Willock would have given the option of the pass, all Nagy does by pressing is making the CB pass the other side of Nagy to (I think) Austin who has dropped in.

He lays the ball off to Willock who can carry on as if it was a direct pass. He lays the ball out to Kane, who seems to just wander forward.

This is where you can probably lay some blame on Kasey, as I said , if it's COD he would have tracked the run and there would be no easy option for a pass.
TBF still a lot to do from there. @JonDolman this is the first time I can find Kane in the videos, may have attracted more attention if he sprinted 

 

It’s ok mate, I do get what your saying

But I just think that the pass into Willock is easily cut off by Nagy just screening. If Nagy, Vyner & Baks are in a nice solid line of 3 (like they were a split-second before your first pic), then the shape and tightness prevents any passes in between them. Hold and screen, hold and screen etc, all whilst shifting shifting shifting as a 3. 
We actually did that pretty well in the 1st half vs Bournemouth - we let their CB’s have it, we even let Pearson have it deep, without closing them down, but just kept the shape tight in the middle and forced them to really work for an opening. 
 

I agree that Palmer doesn’t do anything to effect this phase too, but it’s Nagy’s loss of discipline, which causes 4 other players to lose their shape too. 
I wouldn’t have minded so much had he just engaged the CB more slowly - ie just shifting forward 5 yards but keeping aware of the passing lane. But it’s the way he hares off, like the only important thing right now is to close that centre back as quickly as possible and forget any structure. 

[Cowshed]

1 hour ago, JonDolman said:

I always think pictures are not ideal in seeing the detail of good or bad things. There's no doubt we need to be more like what QPR were in making it hard to play it into such dangerous areas, and then making it much harder to score from a delivery once in those areas. I think of Semenyo getting the ball second half of the left near the box and having a crowd of QPR players around him. Fantastic organisation and aggression by them.

These are some of the things I love about the game. The fine little details that make a good or bad team performance. It really is so much down to preparation, team cohesion and making the right decisions than it is the very simple view some have at times (imo) of players being rather sheeit.

In highlights a player can be seen walking as the move progresses.  

Its a case of what is the response here to here. City first goal don't get into a position where they can squeeze the possession. They are open because its not a team  working in unison. Its not apparent what Palmer was doing. He is not marking if that was the intent. He is not screening and attempting to help trap possession either. 

Its an area where City have lacked cohesion frequently. Is it a whole team defending or some? Nagy is attempting to affect the opposition and he attempts to get back in.. He was attempting to defend. That can be reframed as good honest intention - That is a team centred player.  Something that can be encouraged.

[Davefevs]

37 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

I think goals are often more than one players fault. Like if player A simply does that then goal might nothappen, but also player B or C could have done that and it might not happen. There's often numerous little mistakes I think.

Someone has to engage with the player on the ball and Palmer in that instance didnt really do anything at all other than being in a position to break if we had defended their attack.

It's probably too attacking a set up when we haven't got the ball to have Palmer, Fam and Wells as a front 3. And doesn't look particularly cohesive when we do have it. 

Of course I was well up for us going with it again having done well overall in 1 and a half games of it since changing at half time from 352 at Swansea. But in an ideal world its probably not the best set up that front 3 on and off the ball.

I don't actually like Nagy that much in the role he is now playing. He's got great energy, but for me it doesn't really suit his game. It's interesting when in the deeper role how much better he is, even though he does run around a lot and is not physically very strong. Quite surprised by those earlier season performances in the role Vyner now has.

You are right that unless it’s an individual clanger, goals comes from more than one player not doing what they should do, or sometimes just a moment of brilliance.

As mentioned by others, we didn’t have to actually press / engage the man on the ball.  That was the mistake!  If that weakens your structure, then stay as you are and perhaps let him pass wide then squeeze.  We don’t do that.  We allowed ourselves to get sucked out of shape.  Ooh, look, shiny object, must have it!

By our post is a perfect example of getting too hooked up on formations and players in those formations rather than looking at how players and systems transition in the flow of a game....as opponents move you around.  The set up was fine when Wells and Palmer forced throw-ins through making Dickie and Barbet play loose passes early on.  What we don’t do is understand when to press and when not to, when we are in good shape to do so, when we are not.  If we don’t form our team shape without the ball well, it doesn’t matter who you play and in what formation.  There are so many dynamics to getting it right, e.g. distances back to front, position of ball on pitch, etc.

How many times do we see someone like Nagy (others too), go to close down / engage and a pass popped off before he gets there?  To me, it highlights we weren’t in the right position to start with.

You watched the Chelsea / Barnsley game the other week, look how they did it....as a team.  They didn’t always do it either.  Sometimes they accepted they weren’t in great shape to press, so they dropped in, got their shape and then pressed again in a different phase and position on the pitch.

As Cowshed said earlier, we don’t dictate where we wanted QPR to pass, we got dictated to.

There was a brilliant post by Forest Boffin on twitter about Lamouchi and how Grabban made the CBs pass to the full-back rather than into midfield, so they could them overload / squeeze that side of the pitch.  They took a risk of a big diag to their unprotected side, but as a team they were well-drilled that they were already proactively closing the full-back.

Pearson has got a lot of work to do.  We haven’t looked well-drilled very often over the past 2 and a bit seasons.

[Harry]

8 minutes ago, Cowshed said:

 Nagy is attempting to affect the opposition and he attempts to get back in.. He was attempting to defend. That can be reframed as good honest intention - That is a team centred player.  Something that can be encouraged.

I 100% agree that Nagy is making an attempt at defending / winning the ball back. 
But I 100% disagree that this action was ‘team centered’. 
The action was well-intended, no doubt, and the one thing you can’t fault Nagy on is his energy and work rate. But the action was unnecessary and forced 4 other players into reactions that they didn’t need to make, thus disrupting the whole shape of the team. 
Well-intended, yes. Team centered, no. 

[Cowshed]

4 minutes ago, Harry said:

I 100% agree that Nagy is making an attempt at defending / winning the ball back. 
But I 100% disagree that this action was ‘team centered’. 
The action was well-intended, no doubt, and the one thing you can’t fault Nagy on is his energy and work rate. But the action was unnecessary and forced 4 other players into reactions that they didn’t need to make, thus disrupting the whole shape of the team. 
Well-intended, yes. Team centered, no. 

That is team centred. 

It is your view the action was not necessary. 

We cannot Tardis like look at differing scenarios but it is my view he was going to get played through because of a team mate not tucking in and opening up a clear and simple  passing option. Nagy made his decision to attempt to prevent the inevitable successful simple pass being made. This player made that decision in a fraction of second due to the team already losing shape - QPR were going to break that line.

I would not berate a player for honesty and being team centred. 

 

 

[Davefevs]

3 minutes ago, Cowshed said:

That is team centred. 

It is your view the action was not necessary. 

We cannot Tardis like look at differing scenarios but it is my view he was going to get played through because of a team mate not tucking in and opening up a clear and simple  passing option. Nagy made his decision to attempt to prevent the inevitable successful simple pass being made. This player made that decision in a fraction of second due to the team already losing shape - QPR were going to break that line.

I would not berate a player for honesty and being team centred. 

 

 

I don’t think anyone is saying he needs to be berated, but you can question why he “hared” forward from a reasonable position shape-wise?  Maybe he got a bad shout?  But his action weakened us.  Palmer doesn’t cover himself in glory either from that point on.  I don’t think the pass into Austin was inevitable.  Maybe Willock gets it instead.

You don’t have to berate a player for honesty, but you can educate and coach them to think about their movements and actions where they’ve played a part in losing your team any shape we had.

AN - Sorry gaffer, I was just doing what “I” thought the team needed “me” to do

NP - that’s ok Nodge, you were just being honest in your action

To me, that’s a “carry on Nagy, you keep doing that, don’t worry if we keep getting broken down, you’re only being honest”.

Wouldn’t you rather Pearson educates him and makes him think more “intelligently” than “honestly”?  Explain to him what the impact of his action was.  Explain to Palmer that perhaps he’s not reacted to Nagy and therefore made it doubly worse, etc.

Using honest to me sounds like it’s an excuse for not being good enough / clever enough.  We need to be better.  The momentum of yesterday’s reasonable start was undone by this sequence of events.  It was all a bit easy for QPR wasn’t it?  NP recognised that.

[Cowshed]

32 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I don’t think anyone is saying he needs to be berated, but you can question why he “hared” forward from a reasonable position shape-wise?  Maybe he got a bad shout?  But his action weakened us.  Palmer doesn’t cover himself in glory either from that point on.  I don’t think the pass into Austin was inevitable.  Maybe Willock gets it instead.

You don’t have to berate a player for honesty, but you can educate and coach them to think about their movements and actions where they’ve played a part in losing your team any shape we had.

AN - Sorry gaffer, I was just doing what “I” thought the team needed “me” to do

NP - that’s ok Nodge, you were just being honest in your action

To me, that’s a “carry on Nagy, you keep doing that, don’t worry if we keep getting broken down, you’re only being honest”.

Wouldn’t you rather Pearson educates him and makes him think more “intelligently” than “honestly”?  Explain to him what the impact of his action was.  Explain to Palmer that perhaps he’s not reacted to Nagy and therefore made it doubly worse, etc.

Using honest to me sounds like it’s an excuse for not being good enough / clever enough.  We need to be better.  The momentum of yesterday’s reasonable start was undone by this sequence of events.  It was all a bit easy for QPR wasn’t it?  NP recognised that.

Because he felt in that millisecond the team was not in a good shape. I would agree. A pass Breaking the line was inevitable. His decision is made on that picture in front of him. 

AN - Sorry gaffer, I was just doing what “I” thought the team needed “me” to do

NP - that’s ok Nodge. See that lads great attitude, We need more of that. Have a look at yourselves had we all tucked in? Were we screening? 

And in private KP a word come on mate look what at your effort here, your better than that, 5% more and what player you will be. 

Different picture. 

[Harry]

1 hour ago, Cowshed said:

That is team centred. 

It is your view the action was not necessary. 

We cannot Tardis like look at differing scenarios but it is my view he was going to get played through because of a team mate not tucking in and opening up a clear and simple  passing option. Nagy made his decision to attempt to prevent the inevitable successful simple pass being made. This player made that decision in a fraction of second due to the team already losing shape - QPR were going to break that line.

I would not berate a player for honesty and being team centred. 

 

 

Yep. As I say mate, Palmer is ‘passive’ in this phase and certainly not doing what he’s supposed to be doing. But just because 1 member of the team is not performing his task at that given time, doesn’t mean you have to compound that by sprinting out of position toward a player of no danger or ability, by which it disrupts the whole team shape. 
If Nagy holds and screens Willock, then Dickie has to become De Bruyne to be able to execute a threatening pass. 
There was no immediate danger. Hold your shape. Screen. Don’t go chasing into the oppo half. 

[Cowshed]

36 minutes ago, Harry said:

Yep. As I say mate, Palmer is ‘passive’ in this phase and certainly not doing what he’s supposed to be doing. 

Thus having an affect on what (I think) the team is intending to do - Screen and block passing options. 

37 minutes ago, Harry said:

 But just because 1 member of the team is not performing his task at that given time

  But because one member of the team is not performing his task the team cannot do as it intends.

39 minutes ago, Harry said:

 But just because 1 member of the team is not performing his task at that given time
 

Nagy response has to alter. 

40 minutes ago, Harry said:

doesn’t mean you have to compound that by sprinting out of position toward a player of no danger or ability, by which it disrupts the whole team shape. 
 

Technical pedantic point. You can't reach sprinting speed (actualisation) in that short a distance.

The clearly was danger. Easy options due to Palmer is ‘passive’ in this phase are open. A player of modest ability could break the line easily. The teams shape was going to allow this to happen. 

Nagys response has to follow linearly. Defensive D's. Nagy chose Deny in attempt to an opponent the time and space to take advantage of those easy options (two). He could have angled his approach attempting to force ( D - dictate) the play outside but that was unlikely to cut off the options.

54 minutes ago, Harry said:

If Nagy holds and screens 

There was no screening as a unit. Nagy left side was that Palmer is ‘passive’. 

Decision drop off to provide depth (D again) or deny. 

55 minutes ago, Harry said:

 then Dickie has to become De Bruyne to be able to execute a threatening pass. 
 

A player of modest ability could break the line easily. No screen. Open options.

1 hour ago, Harry said:

There was no immediate danger. 

Like panto ...Yes there was. Palmer is ‘passive’ in this phase leaving a simple passing lane open. 

1 hour ago, Harry said:

 Hold your shape. 

When you are out of shape you frequently will not hold. Its alter shape. Get up (that deny) or drop to delay (D's) to regroup into shape. 

1 hour ago, Harry said:

Screen. 

Already mentioned. Palmer is ‘passive’ there was no screen. If Palmer is tucked in the ball can be forced outside. The team slides with the ball and maybe goes off a trigger .. 

1 hour ago, Harry said:

. Don’t go chasing into the oppo half. 

With a passive team mate. And is still passive when Nagy passes him chasing back the other way. The player was walking. The player was marking nobody. The player was not screening. The passive player was not taking any part in defending. 

For screening to work effectively the team must perform as a unit. The above behaviours undermine what the team was attempting. 

[pongo88]

There are too many people trying to over analyse the first goal and blame Nagy, Palmer and Uncle Tom Cobley and all. The fact is a player who is 5’ 2” tall scored with a header from close to the penalty area, from a cross that was telegraphed. Awful  / non existent marking by Mariappa was the problem. A decent central defender should be able to deal with that sort of situation all day long 

[Davefevs]

44 minutes ago, pongo88 said:

There are too many people trying to over analyse the first goal and blame Nagy, Palmer and Uncle Tom Cobley and all. The fact is a player who is 5’ 2” tall scored with a header from close to the penalty area, from a cross that was telegraphed. Awful  / non existent marking by Mariappa was the problem 

Surely by your reckoning it’s Bentley’s fault for not positioning himself to save it?  

[Trueredsupporter]

Like the tactical analysis. Nagy goes to press because Palmer wasnt really doing anything for the first goal. 4231 to make sure Palmer is covered?

[pongo88]

48 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Surely by your reckoning it’s Bentley’s fault for not positioning himself to save it?  

Definitely not Bentley’s fault. If you’ve got a central defender who only has one player to mark, who just happens to be the shortest player on the pitch, you leave it to the defender to clear the ball. With a good defence goalkeepers trust their defenders. If you are a half decent, tall, defender, and you’ve only got to mark a 5’ 2” forward, all you’ve got to do is stand next to the forward and he won’t score. I’m not sure Mariappa even knew where Chair was. He was ball watching and not aware of who was around him 

[Davefevs]

33 minutes ago, pongo88 said:

Definitely not Bentley’s fault. If you’ve got a central defender who only has one player to mark, who just happens to be the shortest player on the pitch, you leave it to the defender to clear the ball. With a good defence goalkeepers trust their defenders. If you are a half decent, tall, defender, and you’ve only got to mark a 5’ 2” forward, all you’ve got to do is stand next to the forward and he won’t score. I’m not sure Mariappa even knew where Chair was. He was ball watching and not aware of who was around him 

I was joking

[Sir Geoff]

6 hours ago, JonDolman said:

I think goals are often more than one players fault. Like if player A simply does that then goal might nothappen, but also player B or C could have done that and it might not happen. There's often numerous little mistakes I think.

Someone has to engage with the player on the ball and Palmer in that instance didnt really do anything at all other than being in a position to break if we had defended their attack.

It's probably too attacking a set up when we haven't got the ball to have Palmer, Fam and Wells as a front 3. And doesn't look particularly cohesive when we do have it. 

Of course I was well up for us going with it again having done well overall in 1 and a half games of it since changing at half time from 352 at Swansea. But in an ideal world its probably not the best set up that front 3 on and off the ball.

I don't actually like Nagy that much in the role he is now playing. He's got great energy, but for me it doesn't really suit his game. It's interesting when in the deeper role how much better he is, even though he does run around a lot and is not physically very strong. Quite surprised by those earlier season performances in the role Vyner now has.

Totally agree with this. The Nagy incident is the initial trigger, but things weren't happening on the far side of the pitch that should have. They have a runner that starts in his own half and when the ball is being swung over is totally free on the edge of our 18 yard box. He should have been tracked by either Fam or a midfielder on that side. Instead he is totally unmarked leaving Hunt with a decision to make. In that split second Hunt decides to leave him and help Mariappa out in the middle. That split second cost him a yard or two which could have meant he was able to get closer to and put pressure on Chair. Anyone tracking the far side runner should have been screaming at Hunt that he was covered and tell Hunt get in the middle to help Mariappa. Basic Saturday afternoon parks stuff, help your mate and cover his position / marker.

Also looking at those pictures Chair runs a long way to get on the end of that cross, straight through the middle of our midfield. He should have been blocked off before going into the box.

[Offside]

To me (and I’m not an expert on tactics), this pic from this thread exposes our frailties. 

Their player with the ball has acres of space to cross. Palmer is jogging back and should have been racing back to close him down. Sessegnon should be moving out to him more quickly. It’s all too easy for him to receive the ball, control it, look up and pick his cross. 

Their midfielders are moving between our midfield line and their players are goal side of Bakinson and Vyner. 

Their strikers have already found space between our defenders. 

They have a spare man on their left side at the top of the pic. This shows how we allow teams to stretch the space. 

All too easy. 

[Harry]

53 minutes ago, Offside said:

To me (and I’m not an expert on tactics), this pic from this thread exposes our frailties. 

Their player with the ball has acres of space to cross. Palmer is jogging back and should have been racing back to close him down. Sessegnon should be moving out to him more quickly. It’s all too easy for him to receive the ball, control it, look up and pick his cross. 

Their midfielders are moving between our midfield line and their players are goal side of Bakinson and Vyner. 

Their strikers have already found space between our defenders. 

They have a spare man on their left side at the top of the pic. This shows how we allow teams to stretch the space. 

All too easy. 

All that is 100%. But that’s the symptom, not the cause. 
We are in that position due to Palmer being too passive and Nagy too aggressive. 
 

That one sprint from Nagy is the cause. The symptoms are then :

Kalas had to come high. 
Sessengnon had to tuck in to cover the hole made by Kalas, leaving space wide. 
Mariappa had to shift left to cover Kalas, leaving space behind him for Chair. 
Vyner had to shift across to what was Nagy’s man. 
Bakinson had to shift across to cover Vyners man. 
Palmer came inside to cover for Nagy’s press. 
 

All unnecessary symptoms caused by one stupid sprint. 

[Three Lions]

Nagy goes because Palmer did not press. Palmer could have covered Nagy. Palmer could have tracked back. Ended up being a body doing nada.

[Cowshed]

13 hours ago, Offside said:

To me (and I’m not an expert on tactics), this pic from this thread exposes our frailties. 

Their player with the ball has acres of space to cross. Palmer is jogging back and should have been racing back to close him down. Sessegnon should be moving out to him more quickly. It’s all too easy for him to receive the ball, control it, look up and pick his cross. 

Their midfielders are moving between our midfield line and their players are goal side of Bakinson and Vyner. 

Their strikers have already found space between our defenders. 

They have a spare man on their left side at the top of the pic. This shows how we allow teams to stretch the space. 

All too easy. 

I will give it a go on what the team may have been intending. 

In the seconds prior to this City are attempting to screen the possession. This should mean that there will be space outside the compact shape but the opponents should not be able to play through the defensive line (screen) because it is blocking the passing options and lanes. 

I hope this tactical tool makes sense but using a bog standard screening drill the teams midfield shape should look a little like this. 

In theory that shape cannot be played through. A player if he is Scholes or Beckham hits the wide players but the defensive lines response is to shift accordingly and move as a unit. 

The above is a very rough representation of one of the what should not happen when screening. The shape is compromised by the wide player not tucking in to the shape. The team shape as a midfield unit is not screening all options. It is not blocking the options due to one player moving out or not moving into the shape. 

The above is not dissimilar to the topic. Nagy opts to press the ball because the screen is not going to block the options. If he holds he will get bypassed. If he drops the screen still does not block all options.

The player you mention jogging back is the one who was not in line. He is the one opening up options for the opponent. He is the one not busting a gut to get back and support. Screening really is collective. If one player is jogging, is the topical passive, the unit fails and its responses to what happen next can become poor.

 

[Davefevs]

But if Nagy doesn’t go, Austin doesn’t get a pass into him with all the time in the world to get it under and lay it off to Willock either

How many times do our strikers lose possession off of a poor touch falling to a close-by / retreating Midfielders.  Look at how better in-touch Nagy could’ve been even if the “inevitable” pass happened.

The next pic shows that several moments after Austin got the ball, Austin is now looking to run off of Kalas’s shoulder, and Willock has the ball.  Nagy is still trying to get back, Palmer is “passively” engaging and Vyner has been dragged in.  There is still not enough pressure on Willock, who spins and plays it out to Kane.  The rest is history.

 

So an inevitable pass into Austin whether he goes or not in your opinion....ok, I’ll live with that.  But good sides deny the space between midfield and defence lines for strikers to get it into feet and pop lit off under no pressure.  By Nagy going to Dickie he’s allowed Austin to get it into feet, lay it off to Willock.  Don’t get me wrong, Palmer doesn’t cover himself in glory either, but I still think we are better off if Nagy stays and keeps us compact.

 

[Super]

Of course you can find fault in any goal defensively but the bottom line is if you deliver a ball like that and you get people into the box it's always going to cause problems. I don't think we did too much wrong with the goal tbh.

[Cowshed]

15 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

But if Nagy doesn’t go

 

 

There is a picture in the thread!

I with respect did not answer all your post as everything follows the above picture highlighting - 

If Nagy stays the ball is slid through into that very simple option. That is not a midfield screening. That is not a working unit. Its not a line. Its not cohesive.  If Palmer retreats and tucks in the option closes. That is then screening. It would be a midfield unit, coordinated and what follows should also be.  

[Sixtyseconds]

Had a good look at that.

In a distant time when pubs were open.

Palmer is the one who is tired and has to go home when its his round.

Not keen there.

Not at all.

[Davefevs]

28 minutes ago, Sixtyseconds said:

Had a good look at that.

In a distant time when pubs were open.

Palmer is the one who is tired and has to go home when its his round.

Not keen there.

Not at all.

But when he does pay his way, you get Stella, a tequila chaser, and a bag of scampi fries.  It’s worth the wait!

[Sixtyseconds]

No this time Dave.

Korey was minding your jacket.

Where's me jacket Korey?

Just seen a bloke walk out the door with a jacket just like yours Dave thought it was strange ..

[Sixtyseconds]

Whose Korey?

Kasey?

Korey?

Lazy bugger.

Call him what you want there.

[Davefevs]

You saying Palmer pinched my wallet to get the round in.  Cheeky blighter.

[Mr Popodopolous]

6 hours ago, Cowshed said:

There is a picture in the thread!

I with respect did not answer all your post as everything follows the above picture highlighting - 

If Nagy stays the ball is slid through into that very simple option. That is not a midfield screening. That is not a working unit. Its not a line. Its not cohesive.  If Palmer retreats and tucks in the option closes. That is then screening. It would be a midfield unit, coordinated and what follows should also be.  

Palmer. He has his attributes but he isn't a natural fit- not his fault but having him in and around the 3rd man or even a 4th man when we need people to pull wide to help, someone like Johansen between the midfield and attack would be excellent. Palmer? Just doesn't seem suitable tactically- maybe if Wells and Weimann, or Wells and Semenyo in the absence of Weimann maybe this would mesh better and help stop us being outnumbered/outmaneuvered in key areas but Palmer and then a front 2 of Diedhou and Wells can leave too many holes IMO.

@Offside Spare man on the left? Partly due to maybe, to Sessegnon playing as a right footer on the left? Wholly out of necessity of course but I wonder if that arises so easily if we have Rowe or DaSilva available with maybe Paterson LM/Left attacking midfielder something like that.

[Cowshed]

1 hour ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Palmer. He has his attributes but he isn't a natural fit- not his fault but having him in and around the 3rd man or even a 4th man when we need people to pull wide to help, someone like Johansen between the midfield and attack would be excellent. Palmer? Just doesn't seem suitable tactically- maybe if Wells and Weimann, or Wells and Semenyo in the absence of Weimann maybe this would mesh better and help stop us being outnumbered/outmaneuvered in key areas but Palmer and then a front 2 of Diedhou and Wells can leave too many holes IMO.

@Offside Spare man on the left? Partly due to maybe, to Sessegnon playing as a right footer on the left? Wholly out of necessity of course but I wonder if that arises so easily if we have Rowe or DaSilva available with maybe Paterson LM/Left attacking midfielder something like that.

Its a point I have made when City drop off what are the expectations?  Due to the limitations of the underlined my expectations are that they consistently will not get into shape. The block as it is flawed. It's lines are too easily bypassed.