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The Talent is There. Largely.


S_C

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First things first, where's that tin hat..

There can be little doubt that there will be significant changes to the playing squad in the summer, some of it much needed, but this attitude that our squad is hopeless seems to have just seeped into fact. To some, of course, it is fact. For me, quite simply, it isn't.

There are surplus elements of course, players who are no longer required more through evolution than their lack of ability - Hunt, Watkins and Paterson are three examples of this, for me. Wells has increasingly become a worry, one that on current form id hope we move on from, if possible, in the summer. Decent players but wages that can be shed. However our squad on the whole actually possess a great deal of talent, the issue is that the talent isn't showing and, subsequently, the question must be why it isn't showing.

Injuries have hugely hindered us this season, that is not news to anyone. They continue to. But I like to think the recent resurgence of Massengo is an excellent example of the talent within the squad that, for whatever reason, is not coming to the fore. A few months ago Massengo was being linked with a loan move to Birmingham, if it had been suggested then that he could be a key feature for us going forward it would have been greeted with scoffs aplenty. Fast forward and he's the current shining light, showing that deployed and motivated correctly he can be a hugely influential player.

Now let's be clear, i'm not saying that Moore, Bakinson and O'Dowda (to pick three names) are going to lead us to the league title next season. Nor am I suggesting we're the finished article who simply need an injection of confidence. As all squads do, we have areas of need. Going into next season, working to assumption of a fully fit squad (I know, I know..), id suggest, primarily, we need a right back (presuming Simpson doesn't extend), centre back and replacement for Diedhiou. If Paterson leaves we could do with some more trickery. Prerequisites for those recruits must be character because it is character we are lacking, not talent. The only signing Pearson has made in Simpson was an odd one in some respects. It courted controversy and, much like Lansbury, just seemed unnecessary, a waste of a wage at a time when we could blood younger players or utilise what we had. But it perhaps makes more sense than meets the eye when considering the deflated, uninspired and, ultimately, rudderless squad. We need presence. Players who will stand up and drag others with them. Fans understandably fell in love with Kalas after *that* interview and he remains a massively important figure in both the squad and team but the last few games have shown up a lifeless side going through the motions. It's TV, it's hard to tell, maybe he's screaming in-between the encouragement, but we look like a team in desperate need of leaders and, as the captain, the finger will inevitably get pointed at you.

At a time when people were saying how bad our squad was we could have fielded a back four of Dasilva, Mawson, Kalas, Sessegnon. Bentley could clearly play for a successful team at this level. It's easy to forget Joe Williams but the thought of him and Massengo patrolling the middle of the park must surely bring a hint of cheer. Palmer is an excellent football player. To be honest he's probably too good for {some of} the players around him and can often look worse for it. Fingers crossed that Walsh signs a new deal, the hype seems justified. Semenyo has come on leaps. Diedhiou and Martin are strong options leading the line. Weimann, O'Dowda and Paterson are more than capable of creating match winning moments. Some of those players may not be here next season and some have of course been injured, but you cant have two top 10 starting XI's and criticism of the squad hasn't come overnight, it's been a feature for some time.

Others will disagree, in-fact most will probably disagree, but some stability off the field and a handful of the right 'sort' of recruits in the summer should see us once more looking up rather than down.

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2 minutes ago, markcarter said:

Our squad is absolutely bang average for the Championship.  We don’t have players of sufficient quality to compete at the top.  Teams who do well have 2 or 3 or more players who are outstanding and stick out whenever you play them.  We don’t.  Massive gap and big overhaul needed.

Many of us have been saying just that since Nige joined us and he’s fully aware of just how light City are in pretty much every area of the team.

However most of the injured players will hopefully be available next season and if Nige is appointed he’d be the ideal man to rebuild the squad.

Nige will have players in mind that he’s worked with before and knows the type he’s looking for. The obvious one is the need for more leaders on the pitch judging by his post match interviews.

 

 

 

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41 minutes ago, markcarter said:

Our squad is absolutely bang average for the Championship.  We don’t have players of sufficient quality to compete at the top.  Teams who do well have 2 or 3 or more players who are outstanding and stick out whenever you play them.  We don’t.  Massive gap and big overhaul needed.

Yet you expect our current manager to be pulling up trees already.

Unbelievable.

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The backbone of the squad is already here albeit not performing atm. But imagine some of our squad playing against us. Many would be drooling over the likes on Nagy, Massengo, Palmer, Walsh in midfield. We would be dreaming of a striker like Wells and the power of Semenyo. The strength of Kalas at cb. The agility of Bents in goal. The youngsters on the bench just waiting for their chance.  Its here already and it just needs a catalyst to bring it together. I hope that is NP for my money. I'm fed up with the annual rebuild scenario at City. Lets add to the best this window not sell them. I live in hope, again!

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1 hour ago, markcarter said:

Our squad is absolutely bang average for the Championship.  We don’t have players of sufficient quality to compete at the top.  Teams who do well have 2 or 3 or more players who are outstanding and stick out whenever you play them.  We don’t.  Massive gap and big overhaul needed.

Contradicting yourself then. You expect More  from NP but admit the squad isn’t very good . As I’ve said before he’s inherited a shitshow. Klopp would struggle to get a tune of these frauds 

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21 minutes ago, steviestevieneville said:

Contradicting yourself then. You expect More  from NP but admit the squad isn’t very good . As I’ve said before he’s inherited a shitshow. Klopp would struggle to get a tune of these frauds 

Rumbled!

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All the players are decent as individuals.

The problem is, we are a squad of all-sorts. There is no balance.

It started under LJ...and its continued...shuffling the pack, different formations etc, trying to find a formula that will work.

It's so disjointed...it's like oil on water.

We went from a pressing team and then introduced Fam. Imo...it's gone backwards ever since. We played narrow...then introduced Eliasson. Aimless balls into the box to no one.

One minute a flack back four, next a five and wing backs.

We bought players in a scatter gun approach.

LJ liked his Clubs in the bag for every situation. Instead of clubs that suited the course so to speak. It was like playing a pitch and putt with a bag of woods and long irons.

It's all over the shop.

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8 minutes ago, spudski said:

All the players are decent as individuals.

The problem is, we are a squad of all-sorts. There is no balance.

It started under LJ...and its continued...shuffling the pack, different formations etc, trying to find a formula that will work.

It's so disjointed...it's like oil on water.

We went from a pressing team and then introduced Fam. Imo...it's gone backwards ever since. We played narrow...then introduced Eliasson. Aimless balls into the box to no one.

One minute a flack back four, next a five and wing backs.

We bought players in a scatter gun approach.

LJ liked his Clubs in the bag for every situation. Instead of clubs that suited the course so to speak. It was like playing a pitch and putt with a bag of woods and long irons.

It's all over the shop.

Bang on 

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1 hour ago, Sarumred said:

Listen to NP's interviews. There wont be such a massive overhaul as you are suggesting. 

Sorry not sure if this is aimed at my post or MarkCarter.

I think we'll see quite a few leave and some come in. Not suggesting an exodus or influx, but I guess something like 6-8 to leave with 3-4 coming in.

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21 minutes ago, spudski said:

All the players are decent as individuals.

The problem is, we are a squad of all-sorts. There is no balance.

It started under LJ...and its continued...shuffling the pack, different formations etc, trying to find a formula that will work.

It's so disjointed...it's like oil on water.

We went from a pressing team and then introduced Fam. Imo...it's gone backwards ever since. We played narrow...then introduced Eliasson. Aimless balls into the box to no one.

One minute a flack back four, next a five and wing backs.

We bought players in a scatter gun approach.

LJ liked his Clubs in the bag for every situation. Instead of clubs that suited the course so to speak. It was like playing a pitch and putt with a bag of woods and long irons.

It's all over the shop.

Good post, I do agree but think it's there to be moulded into a cohesive unit with a few additions and the right instruction.

Interesting that we're apparently so concerned as a club with the right DNA, 'good people' etc yet, from my point of view, we have a talented squad which lacks character..

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1 hour ago, S_C said:

First things first, where's that tin hat..

There can be little doubt that there will be significant changes to the playing squad in the summer, some of it much needed, but this attitude that our squad is hopeless seems to have just seeped into fact. To some, of course, it is fact. For me, quite simply, it isn't.

There are surplus elements of course, players who are no longer required more through evolution than their lack of ability - Hunt, Watkins and Paterson are three examples of this, for me. Wells has increasingly become a worry, one that on current form id hope we move on from, if possible, in the summer. Decent players but wages that can be shed. However our squad on the whole actually possess a great deal of talent, the issue is that the talent isn't showing and, subsequently, the question must be why it isn't showing.

Injuries have hugely hindered us this season, that is not news to anyone. They continue to. But I like to think the recent resurgence of Massengo is an excellent example of the talent within the squad that, for whatever reason, is not coming to the fore. A few months ago Massengo was being linked with a loan move to Birmingham, if it had been suggested then that he could be a key feature for us going forward it would have been greeted with scoffs aplenty. Fast forward and he's the current shining light, showing that deployed and motivated correctly he can be a hugely influential player.

Now let's be clear, i'm not saying that Moore, Bakinson and O'Dowda (to pick three names) are going to lead us to the league title next season. Nor am I suggesting we're the finished article who simply need an injection of confidence. As all squads do, we have areas of need. Going into next season, working to assumption of a fully fit squad (I know, I know..), id suggest, primarily, we need a right back (presuming Simpson doesn't extend), centre back and replacement for Diedhiou. If Paterson leaves we could do with some more trickery. Prerequisites for those recruits must be character because it is character we are lacking, not talent. The only signing Pearson has made in Simpson was an odd one in some respects. It courted controversy and, much like Lansbury, just seemed unnecessary, a waste of a wage at a time when we could blood younger players or utilise what we had. But it perhaps makes more sense than meets the eye when considering the deflated, uninspired and, ultimately, rudderless squad. We need presence. Players who will stand up and drag others with them. Fans understandably fell in love with Kalas after *that* interview and he remains a massively important figure in both the squad and team but the last few games have shown up a lifeless side going through the motions. It's TV, it's hard to tell, maybe he's screaming in-between the encouragement, but we look like a team in desperate need of leaders and, as the captain, the finger will inevitably get pointed at you.

At a time when people were saying how bad our squad was we could have fielded a back four of Dasilva, Mawson, Kalas, Sessegnon. Bentley could clearly play for a successful team at this level. It's easy to forget Joe Williams but the thought of him and Massengo patrolling the middle of the park must surely bring a hint of cheer. Palmer is an excellent football player. To be honest he's probably too good for {some of} the players around him and can often look worse for it. Fingers crossed that Walsh signs a new deal, the hype seems justified. Semenyo has come on leaps. Diedhiou and Martin are strong options leading the line. Weimann, O'Dowda and Paterson are more than capable of creating match winning moments. Some of those players may not be here next season and some have of course been injured, but you cant have two top 10 starting XI's and criticism of the squad hasn't come overnight, it's been a feature for some time.

Others will disagree, in-fact most will probably disagree, but some stability off the field and a handful of the right 'sort' of recruits in the summer should see us once more looking up rather than down.

If Bakinson COD and Moore is in the starting eleven next season we are in deep trouble. COD Dont score or assist, Moore is unlucky, owngoals and errors in defensive, Bakinson errors in defensive, more like a habbit. We have big problems after Christmas, think only Wycombe have take less points then we after Christmas. One goal in five games. Ages sins we won at the gate, eight games ago. No wingers, not using the pitch area. People moans on Fam and Wells, he he, they got no passes to work with. To play without natural wingers have not been a sucsess. Almost every team we met have had tricky wingers that caus us problems. Not to play Eliasson, LJ and DH was a big misstake. He were our best assistplayer and We dont play him, he he. People hoping for COD, he is not half the player Eliasson, think that says it all How poor we are. If not good players coming in we have to rely on Bentley and the defence to stay in this division. For months we had not played football and Im really worried. Have always been optimistic, but now, no. Anyway: COYR!!!

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5 minutes ago, S_C said:

Good post, I do agree but think it's there to be moulded into a cohesive unit with a few additions and the right instruction.

Interesting that we're apparently so concerned as a club with the right DNA, 'good people' etc yet, from my point of view, we have a talented squad which lacks character..

It lacks leaders on the pitch. No one takes command of the situation.

I personally don't think Kalas makes a good captain on the pitch. Off it...in interviews...fine, but on it, I don't see him as a leader. I actually think he was a better player when he didn't have the responsibility.

I'm not talking about people who shout a lot and point...but people who take a grip of a situation. Body language speaks a thousand words. Some of the worst body language can be found at Hunt, Wells and Fams feet. Awful. Head always down when not going well.

We've had two natural leaders. Webster was one...and Taylor Moore is another. 

HNM shows character...as does Nagy. Weimann also. They never give up. 

As NP has noted...we have too many going through the motions and feeling comfortable.

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4 minutes ago, spudski said:

It lacks leaders on the pitch. No one takes command of the situation.

I personally don't think Kalas makes a good captain on the pitch. Off it...in interviews...fine, but on it, I don't see him as a leader. I actually think he was a better player when he didn't have the responsibility.

I'm not talking about people who shout a lot and point...but people who take a grip of a situation. Body language speaks a thousand words. Some of the worst body language can be found at Hunt, Wells and Fams feet. Awful. Head always down when not going well.

We've had two natural leaders. Webster was one...and Taylor Moore is another. 

HNM shows character...as does Nagy. Weimann also. They never give up. 

As NP has noted...we have too many going through the motions and feeling comfortable.

Yeah, agree. I don’t see Kalas as captain material , think he’s better alongside a leader. It seems theres less  & less leaders in the modern game . If you looked at the current squad including the injured players I can’t really think of a natural captain. You mention Moore but unfortunately I think his career is destined for league 1. Maybe wiemann who would lead by example but no one really stands out. 

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I can see what the OP is getting at although I respectfully disagree.

I think we're a mid to lower Championship team both on paper and in actuality, with a couple of potential star performers. The squad for me needs a near total clear out if we're ever going to be serious about a promotion challenge. There are too many mediocre and flattering to deceive players in this squad; and some who have been here too long and have got too comfortable. 

Ask yourself this question: how many players in our squad would get in the starting team of a Norwich, Watford, Bournemouth, Swansea or even Brentford side?

Yes, some of those teams have the benefit (and downside) of having Premier League talent, but even so, could you really argue the case for many, if any, of our players to be in those teams? 

Even if playing at the top of their game you could perhaps make a case for Bentley and Kalas; but beyond that I don't see it. Maybe a couple of the up and coming youngsters? Some of the players in the teams I mention are a completely different class. 

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Balance is the word that crops up again and again, and in my view that’s the issue. That and ‘backbone’ and ‘leader’. Backbone not in the sense of resolve (although we could do with that ) but just that strong spine. At the back (Kalas), defensive midfield (?) and strong striker (?). Agree @spudski that in Massengo we have someone who’ll be that leader in 5 years. He shows all the attributes already, but he’s only 19. We need someone until then. 

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37 minutes ago, S_C said:

Sorry not sure if this is aimed at my post or MarkCarter.

I think we'll see quite a few leave and some come in. Not suggesting an exodus or influx, but I guess something like 6-8 to leave with 3-4 coming in.

It was aimed at Mark Carter.

I agree with you re numbers of outgoings and incoming which is much more realistic. 

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4 minutes ago, One Team said:

I can see what the OP is getting at although I respectfully disagree.

I think we're a mid to lower Championship team both on paper and in actuality, with a couple of potential star performers. The squad for me needs a near total clear out if we're ever going to be serious about a promotion challenge. There are too many mediocre and flattering to deceive players in this squad; and some who have been here too long and have got too comfortable. 

Ask yourself this question: how may players in our squad would get in the starting team of a Norwich, Watford, Bournemouth, Swansea or even Brentford side?

Yes, some of those teams have the benefit (and downside) of having Premier League talent, but even so, could you really argue the case for many, if any, of our players to be in those teams? 

Even if playing at the top of their game you could perhaps make a case for Bentley and Kalas; but beyond that I don't see it. Maybe a couple of the up and coming youngsters? Some of the players in the teams I mention are a completely different class. 

Respectfully disagree?

Blimey this place isn’t what I remember.. 

An additional consideration for me is what our expectations are going into next season. Are we really going to blag a promotion charge to sell season tickets after the shambles of this year. If Pearson stays I think that has an ounce of credibility, if he doesn’t (or to be fair even if he does in reality) I think we have to see top 10 as success with a view to playoffs 22-23.

To suggest right now, being probably but not definitely safe, that we are aiming for top 6 next season is delusional, whoever the manager is. That isn’t to say we couldn’t make the playoffs, simply that to state that as our aim is pure fantasy. The Holden appointment set us back a few years, we need to be realistic in our aims. In my opinion we have a strongest XI capable of top 10, maybe more, but to suggest anything else would be largely baseless.

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5 hours ago, S_C said:

Sorry not sure if this is aimed at my post or MarkCarter.

I think we'll see quite a few leave and some come in. Not suggesting an exodus or influx, but I guess something like 6-8 to leave with 3-4 coming in.

I think it will definitely be nearer to 6 in, as for those dozen out of contract with just 5 games left it seems highly unlikely to me that the following will get an offer or in one case he would reject it anyway;

Wollacott, Baker, Watkins, Adelakun, Paterson & Diedhiou, as the latter is clearly not interested in anything we offer.

Of the rest it seems very unlikely we will keep on both Simpson & Hunt, so that is 7 gone. Sessegnon presumably won’t be coming back, that’s 8. My hunch now is Mariappa will go too, that’s 9. I can’t see both Lansbury & Walsh staying, so if one of them goes that means 10 out the door.

On that basis we are keeping either Hunt or Simpson, Rowe, Walsh or Lansbury & offering Weimann an extension.

Don’t think 10 out, 6 in will be too far off.

 

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5 hours ago, spudski said:

We've had two natural leaders. Webster was one...and Taylor Moore is another. 

Rubbish, this is the bloke who gave up on multiple occasions at Reading away because he wasn’t having a good game. If he’s one of our leaders then god help us. Absolutely pathetic.

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Who knows, we’ll start next season with whoever is appointed, and will find out in due course of the right decision has been made. The love-in with NP seems to be more blind optimism and ‘groupthink’ than actual results/ performances. 
See what happens and support the manager, whoever it may be.

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