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Match day thread Sheff Wednesday away.


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6 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

Yep. Once I saw the team sheet I suggested it would be Lansbury alongside Bakinson and that's what Pearson went with. The reason I thought Massengo should be more advanced is for some mobility around Sam Pearson and Semenyo with Diedhiou being up top in the lone role.

It didn't look great. But the only real big problem we had before the sending off was being asleep on their first corner.

I think we should now go with this Bakinson and Massengo partnership. Who is played in front of them is a bit of a trickier one.

I think if you were to go:

Vyner | Mariappa (Moore) | Kalas | Sessegnon

With Massengo and Bakinson in front, you get passes back and forth from full-back into midfield - which we don’t currently do.  We would also have more pace, athleticism in our back 6, and you could then “perm” the front 4 however you wanted.

Lot of responsibility in a 19 and 22 year old, but it’s better than the other options imho.

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Re Vyner and comments above. He is now now almost 24 so no youngster and should be established in a suitable position. Don't get me wron I don't think he is a bad player just not good enough for a team trying to finish towards the top half of the Championship. He is a very good League one defender or bottom half Championship. Yes he can play midfield, but we need better quality than him in that position and as others have pointed out we need a dominant ball winning central defender alongside Kalas.

Sorry but I could say similar about Semenyo playing wide. If he can can improve (and he has age on his side) his distribution, stop running into blind alleys and start adding assists and goals to his game then he may come good. For my money I would only be using him as an impact sub next season. We need better numbers from a wide attacking player if we are going for play offs next season.

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1 minute ago, Davefevs said:

I think if you were to go:

Vyner | Mariappa (Moore) | Kalas | Sessegnon

With Massengo and Bakinson in front, you get passes back and forth from full-back into midfield - which we don’t currently do.  We would also have more pace, athleticism in our back 6, and you could then “perm” the front 4 however you wanted.

Lot of responsibility in a 19 and 22 year old, but it’s better than the other options imho.

Agree. I guess that's what the managers have to consider when setting up a team. Many different things to consider.

I would probably go Mapps at right back. I think Vyner and Kalas have looked a bit better, though Kalas had a few strange bad moments today. 

Forward areas are very difficult to find a solution. Semenyo can be very good though was quiet today. Still not sure how we get the best out of Wells with our current available players.

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15 minutes ago, Sir Geoff said:

Re Vyner and comments above. He is now now almost 24 so no youngster and should be established in a suitable position. Don't get me wron I don't think he is a bad player just not good enough for a team trying to finish towards the top half of the Championship. He is a very good League one defender or bottom half Championship. Yes he can play midfield, but we need better quality than him in that position and as others have pointed out we need a dominant ball winning central defender alongside Kalas.

Sorry but I could say similar about Semenyo playing wide. If he can can improve (and he has age on his side) his distribution, stop running into blind alleys and start adding assists and goals to his game then he may come good. For my money I would only be using him as an impact sub next season. We need better numbers from a wide attacking player if we are going for play offs next season.

Good points about Vyner and Semenyo. But remember that this season they are the pegs on which we are hanging the others. Whereas, it should be the other way around with the experienced pros in a team who are providing the solidity instead. A good season of learning for both and let's hope we see more benefit from them next season.

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34 minutes ago, cidered abroad said:

Good comment. Bakinson and Massengo are for midfield. Will need three or four more  to give us the strength in depth in midfield. A fit Williams would be nice.

However, I'm wondering where we will use the talents of Zak Vyner.

Let me explain. I think central defender is his best position. But he is not the type of central defender that we are so badly missing and that is the dominant, first ball winning, organising, leader of our back line.

Kalas comes within the same style defenders as Vyner who are there to pick up the scraps rather than being the dominant ball winner. Kalas's main failing, imo, is that he does rather than leads. Vyner a bit the same. The only "leader" type we have is Taylor Moore but he again is the "second central defender" and not a first ball winner.

A quandry for NP or another if he is not here. So, we need a leader, first ball winning central defender as our first signing in the close season. Add to them, at least two or three proper full backs. Dasilva, Pring, maybe and two right sided ones. My be worth trying to develop Moore as a right back. Good pace, uses the ball well and able to go forward as and when.

Build stability from the back (*), which will give more chance for midfield to be more offensive.

I'll leave midfield and strikers to other contributors.

(*) Gibbo, Ford, Connor, Low, Briggs ably aided by Bush and Parr. All big guys and defenders first and foremost.

Pretty sure he played there for his previous club, but said that it wasn't his preferred position (could be wrong on that would need to check).

He does seem to have too many mistakes in him to play centre back though, so either a move to RB or sell on in the summer whilst he still has a bit of value.

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25 minutes ago, Superjack said:

"A one-sided game that the Owls controlled from start to finish, even without the sending off of Lansbury in the first half".

In what way does that make any sense in any universe??

Ah well. Atleast they can enjoy League 1 and some lovely away trips for their bitterness. 😂

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36 minutes ago, Sir Geoff said:

Re Vyner and comments above. He is now now almost 24 so no youngster and should be established in a suitable position. Don't get me wron I don't think he is a bad player just not good enough for a team trying to finish towards the top half of the Championship. He is a very good League one defender or bottom half Championship. Yes he can play midfield, but we need better quality than him in that position and as others have pointed out we need a dominant ball winning central defender alongside Kalas.

Sorry but I could say similar about Semenyo playing wide. If he can can improve (and he has age on his side) his distribution, stop running into blind alleys and start adding assists and goals to his game then he may come good. For my money I would only be using him as an impact sub next season. We need better numbers from a wide attacking player if we are going for play offs next season.

We won’t be converted from the pile of shit we currently are to play off contenders in 1-2 windows. Not a chance of that happening.

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45 minutes ago, Sir Geoff said:

Re Vyner and comments above. He is now now almost 24 so no youngster and should be established in a suitable position. Don't get me wron I don't think he is a bad player just not good enough for a team trying to finish towards the top half of the Championship. He is a very good League one defender or bottom half Championship. Yes he can play midfield, but we need better quality than him in that position and as others have pointed out we need a dominant ball winning central defender alongside Kalas.

Sorry but I could say similar about Semenyo playing wide. If he can can improve (and he has age on his side) his distribution, stop running into blind alleys and start adding assists and goals to his game then he may come good. For my money I would only be using him as an impact sub next season. We need better numbers from a wide attacking player if we are going for play offs next season.

I was critical of ZV at the start of the season , concentration was poor, really had lapses. He was the one you were waiting to make a mistake or drift off and lose his man. Gradually he improved, so much so I think at one time he was our best player, definitely most improved. He though, like others, suffered from our injury problems and started getting moved around. He was very good when he moved into MF and has been as good as anyone bringing the ball out. Can't blame him for our non moving MF, and our tactic of going long because of it. Next year , with a full squad & hopefully a new RB , I would be happy to see Vyner as a starter as I don't see how we can spend too much and we will need a striker and a RB.

Semenyo is a different one. Still shows flashes, but the final ball & decision is still lacking. TBH not seen many signs of improvement, but has time and may improve with experience.

I think the rebuild will have to be long term, we will need to be very clever this summer and I think it will be hard getting the players we need.

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1 hour ago, Fernando said:

Looks like we'll not be seeing each other for a while. 

Look at the positives.  There will be some interesting away trips - eg Accrington Stanley. Forest Green, should they gain promotion, is a nice place to visit. A small ground perched on top of a hill in the village of Nailsworth with vegan food. 

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1 hour ago, JonDolman said:

Full backs were terrible today. Need to improve there for sure. Well, Dasilva is class imo. Hopefully Pring is good enough too. Right back maybe the bigger problem.

I’ve always said decent full backs are key, you need at least one that can overlap regularly and get crosses in, as well as defend 

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1 minute ago, Rossi the Robin said:

I’ve always said decent full backs are key, you need at least one that can overlap regularly and get crosses in, as well as defend 

Agree, Hunt was of form again and Rowe put a shift in as always, it's a massive area we need to improve on. Desilva for me is class and would fit the role but its a worry about his injury record for the last two seasons..

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6 minutes ago, M.D said:

Agree, Hunt was of form again and Rowe put a shift in as always, it's a massive area we need to improve on. Desilva for me is class and would fit the role but its a worry about his injury record for the last two seasons..

Let’s hope shin splints that turned into a fracture is now behind him.

Agree with @Rossi the Robin, good full-backs are important / imperative.  We have one in Jay.  I’d like to see Vyner play 5 or 6 there, but if nothing else Vyner is important for his versatility.

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5 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Let’s hope shin splints that turned into a fracture is now behind him.

Agree with @Rossi the Robin, good full-backs are important / imperative.  We have one in Jay.  I’d like to see Vyner play 5 or 6 there, but if nothing else Vyner is important for his versatility.

We need to recruit a quality right back in the close season assuming Dasilva will be over his injury issues at left back or we may need a left back too

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35 minutes ago, pongo88 said:

 Forest Green, should they gain promotion, is a nice place to visit. A small ground perched on top of a hill in the village of Nailsworth with vegan food. 

I`m sure you`ve cheered up a lot of dour Yorkshiremen from industrial Sheffield with that prospect!

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3 minutes ago, Offside said:

I didn’t watch the game, just kept up with the scores, and I feared the worst at 1-0 down with a player sent off. So I’m very pleased that we got a point in the end. 

Same here, first time this season I haven’t listened or watched as was out watching local football and ko was moved 

Well chuffed with a point - feels like a win 😀

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2 hours ago, Davefevs said:

What did I say pre-game in my suggested line-up?

Wanted to see Bakinson, but not alongside Lansbury.  Well, at least we only suffered 20 mins of it!  I don’t mind Lansbury, he’s done a bit better of late, but we need someone VERY different to him next year.

What did I say about Bakinson with Paterson and Weimann at start of season, when I wasn’t going overboard on Bakinson?

He needs runners around him?  Nagy is a runner but an ill-disciplined one, Vyner found that out v Coventry.  So did NP by hauling him off at h-t.

You can evaluate players much better when the team isn’t playing well, hence my caution re Bakinson.  Lots of things I like about him, but weaknesses too.  But as it’s a team game it’s about combinations, partnerships, etc.

I said at h-t, Wednesday were lazy pressers.  We saw that last 15-20 when we created a bit of pressure, without creating much.  They didn’t work hard enough when we win it back.  It was whether we could fashion a chance....we did.  Unexpected, absolutely, but who cares!! 🤣

I’m starting to like Lansbury, he’s a tidy player looking better even game.  Unlucky to be sent off.  But if I were NP I’d be thinking of signing him.  Would really help the young players move forward. 

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2 hours ago, Superjack said:

"A one-sided game that the Owls controlled from start to finish, even without the sending off of Lansbury in the first half".

In what way does that make any sense in any universe??

Exactly what I thought. I thought the substitutions made a difference and I would agree that they had control of a lot of the game but as the game wore on you couldn't tell we had 10 players (9 when Diedhiou was on the pitch) A bit blue tinted spectacles I think.

Should they have won? Yes.

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Anyone spot Janneh getting in L.Palmer’s face because he wouldn’t give the ball back.  I liked that.  We allow opposition to take the pi$$ too much.  Give the ref something to think about next time he offends.

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24 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Not that I'm especially fussed if Lansbury plays again, but if we get it overturned on appeal that'll at least be something- prove a little point.

If it does get overturned, it would also suggest it wasn't a pen.

Thing is Mike Jones, the guy in charge of refereeing, should be phoning up Nige tomorrow to apologies for such a poor decision....................but he's got his weekly half day Zoom meeting arranged with Joey to discuss every decision made in three or four matches that affected the Fewers today.

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5 hours ago, italian dave said:

It could just be! And that defeat enough to send the gas down. Perhaps today is that champagne moment we were all looking for this morning 😄 It would be a fitting way to sum up this season! 

That’s more like it Dave. Chin up. Now let’s rid of as many of these players as we can and let Nige start fresh for next season in the   Championship.😉

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21 minutes ago, HappyClapper said:

That’s more like it Dave. Chin up. Now let’s rid of as many of these players as we can and let Nige start fresh for next season in the   Championship.😉

Ha ha! Indeed! There’s certainly going to be a fair few departures, maybe not quite the clear out some expect. I think the biggest challenge for NP (or whoever!) is not so much the quantity that he needs, but that he needs a whole spine of the side. A big, dominant ball winning centre half, an experienced midfield general, and a 20 goal striker. Tall order in one window. If we had that then I think existing players like Vyner, Dasilva, Massengo, Bakinson, Semenyo, possibly also some of Weimann, COD, Williams, Palmer, fit in around that much more effectively than now. Going to be interesting for sure.

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6 minutes ago, italian dave said:

Ha ha! Indeed! There’s certainly going to be a fair few departures, maybe not quite the clear out some expect. I think the biggest challenge for NP (or whoever!) is not so much the quantity that he needs, but that he needs a whole spine of the side. A big, dominant ball winning centre half, an experienced midfield general, and a 20 goal striker. Tall order in one window. If we had that then I think existing players like Vyner, Dasilva, Massengo, Bakinson, Semenyo, possibly also some of Weimann, COD, Williams, Palmer, fit in around that much more effectively than now. Going to be interesting for sure.

What he needs more than anything else is a CAPTAIN. He needs eyes and ears out on the pitch that he simply doesn't have in Kalas and nobody else in our squad shows any signs that they could do that job either.

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7 hours ago, JonDolman said:

Full backs were terrible today. Need to improve there for sure. Well, Dasilva is class imo. Hopefully Pring is good enough too. Right back maybe the bigger problem.

It's been a recurring theme. Arguably it's been our Achilles heel all season. Before the likes of Weimann and O'Dowda got injured (& especially Weimann) they backed up and help cover those deficiencies.

It stands to reason if you have quick fulbacks in defence as well as attack they offer a lot of security as well as a threat moving forward. They can recover ground quickly and can be touch tight to the opposition. When you don't have pace it's natural to back off defensively and concede ground. Likewise going forward you're never going to beat the opposition for pace so you cross the ball early or pass it sideways.

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2 hours ago, Numero Uno said:

What he needs more than anything else is a CAPTAIN. He needs eyes and ears out on the pitch that he simply doesn't have in Kalas and nobody else in our squad shows any signs that they could do that job either.

Spot on! Not Kalas's fault that he's not that sort of character, but we badly need one. I think HNM will be that sort of leader - but in 5 years time

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