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European Super League


MC RISK77

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1 hour ago, red panda said:

Disagree, it's the clubs that have offered higher and higher wages to try to attract the best players they can.  If someone offers you a bucket full of cash, would you refuse it?  The Premier League is a hugely lucrative product, and it's only right that the people that create that product - the players - get a fair share of the value they create.  Or should we go back to the old days when BBC and ITV collude to keep down the price of television rights?

I never suggested some return to the old days but personally found it a bit galling to be  lectured on greed by people who have done very nicely out of the greed of the top football clubs. In spite of the vast sums they receive in TV payouts they never seem able to reduce prices to the supporters but pay ever more obscene wages to players who already earn more in a month than many earn in a year.

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16 hours ago, Port Said Red said:

It will only work for a brief period, like the Kerry Packer cricket series, there will be insufficient variety to maintain the interest of the public. 

Well that's me right then, although in all honesty I thought they might play a few games first before the novelty wore off. :)

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Thoughts have probably already been said in this thread.

These owners are a disgrace and have brought the game into disrepute. They know nothing about Football fans and are only interested in self gain.

Lets not stop at this, ticket prices needs to be slashed across the Country, transport links to clubs improved, the lot. This could be the turning point to real pivotal change 

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Okay this is great news, all the English clubs- fair play to Man City seemingly being the first...no great lover of Abu Dhabi owners but credit where it's due!

Now, how to move forward? This is probably fairly utopian so a non-starter but a few thoughts:

  1. BAN all 12 from European competition for the remainder of this and the whole of next season.
  2. Further to that, accept them back into the fold if and only if they sign a massive break-clause if they ever try it again. A massive break-clause that would in total be payable to both UEFA and domestic Leagues, how it's split unsure but would be redistributed back down the respective pyramids and indeed in European football to lesser and middling Leagues and nations.
  3. CL reform in the bin. Actually bring in reforms but in another direction, ie none of this 4 or in the event of side from Country x winning from outside top 4, 5 from one nation nonsense- 3 at most, with remaining places going to Champions of Leagues that need to qualify- as far as practicably possible all nations should have at least one side in the CL- once you exceed a certain UEFA coefficent, then indeed qualifiers can kick in.
  4. Maybe do away with seedings or water them down?

Like I say it won't happen I'm sure but it would be nice.

Domestically, significantly more of a say for fans- and yeah here and in Europe I'd like to see some sustainability and FFP regs enforced better- maybe running a better type of Business Model could see ticket prices fall over time. Germany a good example though our tickets can be notably expensive in general.

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Still probably on my own with this one, but it's notable that Infantino seems to be approving of an African Super League according to some Tweets- also saw a joint US-Mexican one floated as an idea.

Not that I say that him and FIFA now report it, but I wonder if they encouraged it at some point- them and UEFA have been competitors/rivals in the past, would certainly have disrupted UEFA's power base. That would fit with their rather more circumspect reaction than UEFA, PL, FA's, Governments etc. Like I say compare and contrast both the statements, but also Blatter's statements on it when he ran the show. When it came up in Blatter's time, he tended to fire straight in- didn't mention 'within the law' or 'cool heads prevail' but went straight in with threats of bans for clubs and players.

The initial FIFA statement or Blatter's stance/reaction in his time to this kinda thing? I know which I prefer! Also prefer his opposition to VAR, no 48 team WC etc.

Not a fan but he had a few half-decent points.

 

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Levy's statements are a disgrace, if I was a Spurs fan I would be fuming. 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/56823501

'Regret the anxiety and upset'

'Thank the supporters for their considered opinion'

How much more passive aggressive could that be. The thoughts of a chairman who knows the next attempt at a 'Super League' won't include his non entity of a club.

 

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So no English clubs remain, is it now a case of will the last one out lock the door!?

I seriously doubt this is the last we'll hear of this again, however what this has proved is that the supporters, and wider football community has more clout then they (and by they I mean the suits) had ever given people credit for.

Supporters have made clubs what they are today (yes even those North of Bristol I suppose in some way), and without the supporters the clubs are nothing. That has now been realised.

How many of these "super" clubs will now go up for sale I wonder?

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6 hours ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Okay this is great news, all the English clubs- fair play to Man City seemingly being the first...no great lover of Abu Dhabi owners but credit where it's due!

Now, how to move forward? This is probably fairly utopian so a non-starter but a few thoughts:

  1. BAN all 12 from European competition for the remainder of this and the whole of next season.
  2. Further to that, accept them back into the fold if and only if they sign a massive break-clause if they ever try it again. A massive break-clause that would in total be payable to both UEFA and domestic Leagues, how it's split unsure but would be redistributed back down the respective pyramids and indeed in European football to lesser and middling Leagues and nations.
  3. CL reform in the bin. Actually bring in reforms but in another direction, ie none of this 4 or in the event of side from Country x winning from outside top 4, 5 from one nation nonsense- 3 at most, with remaining places going to Champions of Leagues that need to qualify- as far as practicably possible all nations should have at least one side in the CL- once you exceed a certain UEFA coefficent, then indeed qualifiers can kick in.
  4. Maybe do away with seedings or water them down?

Like I say it won't happen I'm sure but it would be nice.

Domestically, significantly more of a say for fans- and yeah here and in Europe I'd like to see some sustainability and FFP regs enforced better- maybe running a better type of Business Model could see ticket prices fall over time. Germany a good example though our tickets can be notably expensive in general.

Absolutely get rid of the 2 best performing teams automatically get entry, to the new CL proposal. The 12 have basically massively misjudged their ability to go it alone, so deserve nothing without competitive entry.

And re your first point, nobody deserves any credit for backing down - they made their own bed. Least of all the human rights abusers in charge of Man City.

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2 hours ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

A lot of those types in football at management/boardroom level. CEOs, etc.

More broadly, this shit has been building for a while as we all know- check the dates on these articles.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/4434976.stm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/4051543.stm

Well whilst it might not go ahead just now the idea has been put out there and no doubt will return maybe in a slightly more palatable format.

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9 hours ago, Redrascal2 said:

Sorry if it has been mentioned but I find a bit rich when ex premiership footballers on Sky get on their high horse and talk about football being for the fans and that it is just greed that motivated this super League idea. Well I thought with most premiership clubs and players that greed  is what motivated them already. What's new. This is just a new version of it. Squeeze as much out of the football supporter as possible through ticket prices, costs at the game , replica shirts etc, etc.

Rubbish, frankly. It's not their fault that they were paid ridiculous money. And their opinion is as valid as anyone else's - just because they have money, means they don't count? How would that sound if they were poor?

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22 minutes ago, BigTone said:

Well whilst it might not go ahead just now the idea has been put out there and no doubt will return maybe in a slightly more palatable format.

“”The Super League said it would reconsider "the most appropriate steps" to reshape the project.””

from BBC ?

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6 hours ago, 2015 said:

Thoughts have probably already been said in this thread.

These owners are a disgrace and have brought the game into disrepute. They know nothing about Football fans and are only interested in self gain.

Lets not stop at this, ticket prices needs to be slashed across the Country, transport links to clubs improved, the lot. This could be the turning point to real pivotal change 

Agreed, I'd also like to see us use a German model towards fan ownership. 

If there ever was an opportunity to drastically reform, it's now.

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Knowing UEFA, they will smuggly assume that all this is down to the average fan’s love and appreciation for the work they do. Whereas, in England at least, the feeling is that they’re as corrupt and self-serving as the people in charge of these football clubs.

Reform needs to take place at all levels and I would suggest UEFA, FIFA and probably all the other governing bodies should be included in that. For a start they absolutely do not require the revenues they demand to administer the game and should have less say over sponsorship.

The most crucial thing about all of this is that hopefully UEFA and the clubs involved begin to understand that, despite the fans desire to win, this cannot be achieved at any cost and there are some boundaries that can never be crossed.

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7 hours ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Okay this is great news, all the English clubs- fair play to Man City seemingly being the first...no great lover of Abu Dhabi owners but credit where it's due!

Now, how to move forward? This is probably fairly utopian so a non-starter but a few thoughts:

  1. BAN all 12 from European competition for the remainder of this and the whole of next season.
  2. Further to that, accept them back into the fold if and only if they sign a massive break-clause if they ever try it again. A massive break-clause that would in total be payable to both UEFA and domestic Leagues, how it's split unsure but would be redistributed back down the respective pyramids and indeed in European football to lesser and middling Leagues and nations.
  3. CL reform in the bin. Actually bring in reforms but in another direction, ie none of this 4 or in the event of side from Country x winning from outside top 4, 5 from one nation nonsense- 3 at most, with remaining places going to Champions of Leagues that need to qualify- as far as practicably possible all nations should have at least one side in the CL- once you exceed a certain UEFA coefficent, then indeed qualifiers can kick in.
  4. Maybe do away with seedings or water them down?

Like I say it won't happen I'm sure but it would be nice.

Domestically, significantly more of a say for fans- and yeah here and in Europe I'd like to see some sustainability and FFP regs enforced better- maybe running a better type of Business Model could see ticket prices fall over time. Germany a good example though our tickets can be notably expensive in general.

Fair play to Man City?!! They signed up to the damn thing. They don't get any credit.

6 hours ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Football needs big reform but would it be fair to say Fan Power is a big factor in this failed breakaway?

I don't think so. It was just a PR disaster and they announced it before working out the technicalities.

34 minutes ago, Phileas Fogg said:

Agreed, I'd also like to see us use a German model towards fan ownership. 

If there ever was an opportunity to drastically reform, it's now.

Yeah if SL wanted to sell City to dodgy investors, I'd want the fans to have a veto option.

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1 minute ago, mozo said:

Fair play to Man City?!! They signed up to the damn thing. They don't get any credit.

I don't think so. It was just a PR disaster and they announced it before working out the technicalities.

Yeah if SL wanted to sell City to dodgy investors, I'd want the fans to have a veto option.

Before working out the technicalities?

It was years in the making and the contract hundreds of pages long. 

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9 minutes ago, CotswoldRed said:

Before working out the technicalities?

It was years in the making and the contract hundreds of pages long. 

Fair enough. There have been a few comments in the press that the 12 hadn't thought a lot of it through. 

From the Athletic:

Woodward is on his knees because United, and their conspirators, fundamentally misunderstood the challenge of breaking away. The strategy of the Super League, astonishingly amateur in its execution, contrived to alienate every possible stakeholder. They even lost the faith of sponsors, as Liverpool’s timing sponsor has now pulled out.

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18 minutes ago, mozo said:

I don't think so. It was just a PR disaster and they announced it before working out the technicalities.

I think actually in this instance there was fan power. They clearly drastically underestimated the backlash. I don't really know how, all it would've taken is a few focus groups of supporters to understand the strength of feeling. As you say, a total PR disaster.

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Just now, Phileas Fogg said:

I think actually in this instance there was fan power. They clearly drastically underestimated the backlash. I don't really know how, all it would've taken is a few focus groups of supporters to understand the strength of feeling. As you say, a total PR disaster.

How do you think fans turned this around?

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11 minutes ago, mozo said:

Fair enough. There have been a few comments in the press that the 12 hadn't thought a lot of it through. 

From the Athletic:

Woodward is on his knees because United, and their conspirators, fundamentally misunderstood the challenge of breaking away. The strategy of the Super League, astonishingly amateur in its execution, contrived to alienate every possible stakeholder. They even lost the faith of sponsors, as Liverpool’s timing sponsor has now pulled out.

I think they'd worked out every last detail. But their sociopathic and narcissistic arrogance assumed the plebs of the world would roll over and accept it, whether they liked it or not. 

To a degree I can understand that. The modern world is famous for its apathy. Homelessness and social injustice won't get much of a whimper, but rip the heart from football and people get upset. Rich and poor. 

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