Bentley

[Rich]

2 hours ago, Cowshed said:

The defenders drop deep because the team gets compact v crosses v pressing the cross and being high. Its madness to not work the cross then ignore basic defending principles and also stay high. 

 

We've been through this before. I refer mainly to set pieces, where the defenders are almost on top of Bentley. If they held a slightly higher line, rather than in or around the six yard line, he'd have more freedom of movement to claim or punch a cross into that danger area. I realise it's not possible on corners but, in those instances unless blocked/fouled, he has the advantage of using his hands.

[Roger Red Hat]

On 02/05/2021 at 12:33, YorkshireSection said:

Maenpaa was a fantastic keeper, bad decision to let him leave. 

We should have offered him a good enough deal to make him stay.

 

Didn't he go to Stoke, and was injured again virtually straight away? I liked Nikki but his injury record was poor, which is why I imagine he wasn't offered another deal.

[Rich]

1 hour ago, BigTone said:

The keeper commanding his area isn't going to make one iota of a difference if defenders have to drop deep to deal with a situation caused normally by deficiencies further up the pitch. It is a team game. Its a no win situation for them. "He came off his line too early" or "he didn't come off his line" and so on. The term "commanding his area (or box)" makes it sound like he should be prowling every extremity when the obvious conclusion is that he cannot and neither would it make any sense. A keepers job is very simply to be the last man to try and prevent anyone scoring whilst relying on his defence to protect him from such a situation. If a keeper is constantly under pressure then this is a deficiency of the rest of the team and not himself.

"A keepers job is very simply to be the last man to try and prevent anyone scoring whilst relying on his defence to protect him from such a situation". Really?

So, he isn't involved in cutting out a cross to the man at the far post or to prevent an attempt on goal, or telling his full back that there's someone behind him, or, telling the defence to push up, or offering any assistance whatsoever, just "save shots on goal", that's it? No offering an outlet to a defender under pressure, no being a pinball distributing the ball around the back line, or setting up an attack with a quick throw or kick out.  Being commanding is about instilling confidence in your teamates, with them having confidence that you can deal with a certain situation, just as a commanding center half will deal with the threat of the forward. 

If the defenders don't have the  confidence that a keeper will come and claim a ball delivered into a dangerous area, they will try to cover that eventuality themselves, meaning they'll get closer to the goal by dropping back, along with allowing the attackers to also get closer to the goal or space being created as a result. If the keeper is confident and commanding enough that they know it's "keepers ball" they won't drop so deep and the attacking side know that they won't get any success by putting the ball into those areas. That happens so often that the opposition know this is a problem for BCFC.

I agree that there are deficiencies in our defending as a whole, that subject has been discussed on numerous other posts, this topic is about our keeper. I know that too often we' are cut open or allow crosses from wide positions and, I'm not saying that Bentley is solely responsible for our goals against column but, there must be a reason why we've conceded more goals from set pieces than any other team in this division, I am firmly of the belief that if Bentley were better at dealing with crosses, we wouldn't be the worst team in that respect. Equally if he were a better keeper, he'd probably be in the premiership now instead of in a "team" struggling at the bottom of the championship

[BigTone]

10 minutes ago, Rich said:

"A keepers job is very simply to be the last man to try and prevent anyone scoring whilst relying on his defence to protect him from such a situation". Really?

So, he isn't involved in cutting out a cross to the man at the far post or to prevent an attempt on goal, or telling his full back that there's someone behind him, or, telling the defence to push up, or offering any assistance whatsoever, just "save shots on goal", that's it? No offering an outlet to a defender under pressure, no being a pinball distributing the ball around the back line, or setting up an attack with a quick throw or kick out.  Being commanding is about instilling confidence in your teamates, with them having confidence that you can deal with a certain situation, just as a commanding center half will deal with the threat of the forward. 

If the defenders don't have the  confidence that a keeper will come and claim a ball delivered into a dangerous area, they will try to cover that eventuality themselves, meaning they'll get closer to the goal by dropping back, along with allowing the attackers to also get closer to the goal or space being created as a result. If the keeper is confident and commanding enough that they know it's "keepers ball" they won't drop so deep and the attacking side know that they won't get any success by putting the ball into those areas. That happens so often that the opposition know this is a problem for BCFC.

I agree that there are deficiencies in our defending as a whole, that subject has been discussed on numerous other posts, this topic is about our keeper. I know that too often we' are cut open or allow crosses from wide positions and, I'm not saying that Bentley is solely responsible for our goals against column but, there must be a reason why we've conceded more goals from set pieces than any other team in this division, I am firmly of the belief that if Bentley were better at dealing with crosses, we wouldn't be the worst team in that respect. Equally if he were a better keeper, he'd probably be in the premiership now instead of in a "team" struggling at the bottom of the championship

Hence the reason it seems a Prem club is interested in him with all his obvious failings.

[Rich]

1 minute ago, BigTone said:

Hence the reason it seems a Prem club is interested in him with all his obvious failings.

As I stated before, sometimes his attributes might just suit a certain teams style of play. If they have commanding defenders, he could be used just for shot stopping or as the pinball. 

I also stated that not everyone is a good judge of keepers, Fergie reputedly one of the best managers ever, stumbled through years of keeper buying until he settled on Schmiechel.

[BigTone]

7 minutes ago, Rich said:

As I stated before, sometimes his attributes might just suit a certain teams style of play. If they have commanding defenders, he could be used just for shot stopping or as the pinball. 

I also stated that not everyone is a good judge of keepers, Fergie reputedly one of the best managers ever, stumbled through years of keeper buying until he settled on Schmiechel.

Of course

[New Dazzler]

42 minutes ago, Rich said:

"A keepers job is very simply to be the last man to try and prevent anyone scoring whilst relying on his defence to protect him from such a situation". Really?

If the defenders don't have the  confidence that a keeper will come and claim a ball delivered into a dangerous area, they will try to cover that eventuality themselves, meaning they'll get closer to the goal by dropping back, along with allowing the attackers to also get closer to the goal or space being created as a result. If the keeper is confident and commanding enough that they know it's "keepers ball" they won't drop so deep and the attacking side know that they won't get any success by putting the ball into those areas. That happens so often that the opposition know this is a problem for BCFC.

 

This is so true, as i alluded to earlier he has been targetted by most teams we have played lately, he got away with that early one against Luton when the ref gave a free kick, but not all refs will give those.  I think there was almost an identical incident in another match that day when the goal was given.  Any manager worth his salt will be insisting that all corners/set pieces are right in DB's discomfort zone ie right on or as near as possible to the goal line and just under the crossbar.  The common wisdom (apart from us!) at a set piece just outside the box is to keep it away from the keeper as he will comfortably catch it.  Our opponents know that if they do the opposite and ask a question of Bents by slinging it into the 6 yard box and heaping pressure on him, there is a great chance that a scoring opportunity will be created in ensuing chaos..

[RedEd73]

Stefan Marinovic is OOC at the end of the season......

[Cowshed]

4 hours ago, Rich said:

We've been through this before. I refer mainly to set pieces, where the defenders are almost on top of Bentley. If they held a slightly higher line, rather than in or around the six yard line, he'd have more freedom of movement to claim or punch a cross into that danger area. I realise it's not possible on corners but, in those instances unless blocked/fouled, he has the advantage of using his hands.

It not a case of slightly. City defenders are deep at set pieces. For a Keeper to control the space behind his CB's they have to be far beyond the six yard box. 

[Rich]

22 hours ago, Cowshed said:

It not a case of slightly. City defenders are deep at set pieces. For a Keeper to control the space behind his CB's they have to be far beyond the six yard box. 

 

22 hours ago, Cowshed said:

It not a case of slightly. City defenders are deep at set pieces. For a Keeper to control the space behind his CB's they have to be far beyond the six yard box. 

Slightly as in respect of the 18yard line. If they were 8 or 10 yards out, there wouldn't be as much confusion and there'd be more time and space to allow Bentley to decide either come and claim the ball, punch it, or leave it to go out. That extra 2 to 4 yards is what I'd consider slightly.

[Cowshed]

1 hour ago, Rich said:

 

Slightly as in respect of the 18yard line. If they were 8 or 10 yards out, there wouldn't be as much confusion and there'd be more time and space to allow Bentley to decide either come and claim the ball, punch it, or leave it to go out. That extra 2 to 4 yards is what I'd consider slightly.

Your posts of from around the six yard line to the 18 yard line. That is not a slight adjustment of two or four yards.  For a keeper to control space in the box the centre backs will have to be consistently past the penalty spot.

[Kashmir]

On 03/05/2021 at 14:47, Fuber said:

They all but want him back another year (Lincoln Fans), done very well this year, good shot stopper. He's a WBA player however, not So'ton. Issue will be if WBA sell Johnstone, their other two keepers are Button and Lonergan, who both will defo not be first choice in the Championship Imo.

Loves a penalty save, also.

That's probably the worst trophy I've ever seen!

[Bodiesaffer]

On 02/05/2021 at 13:16, BigTone said:

It does make me laugh that everyone's criticism of Bentley or O'Leary is that they don't command their area. It's almost a stock standard statement to try and sound intelligent. If we had anything resembling a half decent defence then surely that would aid our deficiencies. Their job is surely to protect the same said area. DB has done a great job considering the crap he's playing behind. Max when needed has done the same. There are 10 players in our team who have performed well below par rather than our keepers. Perhaps some of these 10 need to command their own territory on the pitch also.

I get that.

[Rich]

21 hours ago, Cowshed said:

Your posts of from around the six yard line to the 18 yard line. That is not a slight adjustment of two or four yards.  For a keeper to control space in the box the centre backs will have to be consistently past the penalty spot.

Not sure I understand your first statement. I stated that I'd like to see a higher line held at free kicks. With a slight adjustment made, rather than lining up on the 6 yard line, an extra 2 to 4 yards is a slight adjustment. If they could hold an even higher line then great but just giving the keeper an extra 2 or 4 yards from the goal would in my opinion allow him more vision and more time to decide what he's going to do, whether that's to come and deal with a ball closer to goal or, prepare himself for an attempt on goal 24ft or 30ft from the goal. Obviously this all depends on where the set piece is being taken from and whether the opposition actually then target the area around the six yard line.

I see other teams and goalkeepers deal with this sort of regular event much more successfully than ours do, so there appears to be something wrong. You appear to be saying we can't do anything about it, I disagree.

Let me reiterate, I think Bentley is a relatively competent goalkeeper who's shot saving and reactions have proven to be excellent but, being that he's been exposed to more attempts on goal, that in itself has allowed him the stage to show off his abilities to the full. While saying that I firmly believe that there's room for improvement in other aspects of his game. That being organising/helping out the defence with information/instructions, and being more confident in dealing with balls into the box.

Of course this could all be down to the brilliant delivery of every ball into our box, by the superior skilled opposition that we've met an a weekly basis and, it has nothing to do with the goalkeeper or defence, that are put into the panic mode followed by the ensuing mayhem, just because of that brilliance.