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Nathan Baker


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Not for me, we suffer in possession with Baker in the side, it’s either a 10 yard pass to FB, CB or GK or more likely a 40 yard lump upfield losing possession usually. I’ve only ever seen him have one game in a city shirt where you’d think he was good with the ball at his feet. 
 

it makes it too easy for the opposition, block other passing options, encourage him to come out with the ball a bit, press, wait for long ball and recollect possession 

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Was a very good performance yesterday in his defensive work. Looked really up for it.

I'd let him go. He's been out all season and when he does start you never know if he will walk off the pitch in the first half. We can't be building a defence with someone who does that imo.

He is so poor on the ball, which isn't the end of the world but other options out there offer so much more in bringing the ball out.

And he's performed badly and made lots of mistakes in spells for us. In many ways he isn't at all reliable.

It's not that he's not got the ability, so if Nige does give him a new deal then he must believe he can get the best out of Baker. If that's the case then fair enough.

 

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5 minutes ago, Hampshire reds said:

with the right medical team in place then i think Nathan is worth another contract or be it on reduced terms. we need  him over the likes of  Zac. i hope Zac proves me wrong but i dont think he is a championship defender. 

Pearson said in the post match interview yesterday that Vyner needs to play in one position. And he knows what position that is.

I don't think that will be at centre back.

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I like Vyner and agree he needs to nail down one position, but he’s no Championship centre-back and we have better options in midfield. Maybe right-back. He’s 24 next week, to not know your best position at that age at this level is pretty odd IMO (not necessarily his fault either).

As for Baker, it’s a no from me. 

Edited by tin
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53 minutes ago, Hampshire reds said:

with the right medical team in place then i think Nathan is worth another contract or be it on reduced terms. 

Baker had the same injury issues at Villa and eventually they felt he had psychological issues but refused to accept that kind of help.

Its not the right medical team he needs................:cool2:

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He’s an old fashioned type of centre half that we are crying out for . Felt sorry for Kalas having to play as a first ball winner and out of his comfort zone . 
Our best pairing but surely we have to let him go or do a pay per game deal, someone will offer him a two or three year deal . 

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36 minutes ago, Robbored said:

Baker had the same injury issues at Villa and eventually they felt he had psychological issues but refused to accept that kind of help.

Its not the right medical team he needs................:cool2:

Agree. His actual injury record before this season is fine. It's him walking off the pitch so many times which is the problem.

It disrupts our defence having to bring someone on for him. And it means we can only make 2 subs late in games.

The amount of times he's done it is ridiculous, and LJ even said he doesn't know why he keeps coming off in one post match interview.

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Still trying to understand the logic of him & Mariappa both starting yesterday if we are then going to release both of them this week.

Up until then I was convinced both would be let go, but that makes a bit less sense now.

Mariappa is 35, on very low wages apparently & had a decent availability record this season.

Baker is 30, on top 4 wages & was only available 3 times.

I’m struggling to work out the plan here, maybe we will take the gamble (because that’s what it would be) on offering Baker a contract on half his current amount, but I would be looking elsewhere myself. 

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Baker is a solid and physical Champ centre back and we may struggle to find a better like for like left sided alternative.

The injury problems are obviously the main issue, however that would now rule out half our squad based on what we have seen this season!

I appreciate he's not Adam Webster in posession of the ball but Webster is a 20 million pound plus footballer and a class above us.

I think Nige may offer him a new reduced contract and still look to bring in another experienced defender.

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3 hours ago, JonDolman said:

Was a very good performance yesterday in his defensive work. Looked really up for it.

I'd let him go. He's been out all season and when he does start you never know if he will walk off the pitch in the first half. We can't be building a defence with someone who does that imo.

He is so poor on the ball, which isn't the end of the world but other options out there offer so much more in bringing the ball out.

And he's performed badly and made lots of mistakes in spells for us. In many ways he isn't at all reliable.

It's not that he's not got the ability, so if Nige does give him a new deal then he must believe he can get the best out of Baker. If that's the case then fair enough.

 

I hoped he would return to fitness 2 months ago, get 10-12 games under his belt and then there’d be a decision to make.  Although I think he’s a good defender, now is the time to let him go.  Too big a risk for a 30 year old.

2 hours ago, JonDolman said:

Pearson said in the post match interview yesterday that Vyner needs to play in one position. And he knows what position that is.

I don't think that will be at centre back.

Yet that’s where he’s played him 

 

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3 minutes ago, Edgy Red said:

Baker is a solid and physical Champ centre back and we may struggle to find a better like for like left sided alternative.

The injury problems are obviously the main issue, however that would now rule out half our squad based on what we have seen this season!

I appreciate he's not Adam Webster in posession of the ball but Webster is a 20 million pound plus footballer and a class above us.

I think Nige may offer him a new reduced contract and still look to bring in another experienced defender.

Loads of potential alternatives.

Not sure which of these we would manage to get but here's some:

Cathcart - 32 now, Nige worked with him at Watford. Maybe a loan as I can't see him being needed by Watford in the prem.

Iorfa - Okay he has been out injured a lot. But a proven championship player and looked real quality at centre back start of the season. Being injured for much of the season might put Nige off.

Matt Clarke - I don't agree with those that say we need a left footer to play left centre back. But he is one of those. Back to Brighton, surely they'll be looking to sell. They have loads in that position.

Ostigard - Another Brighton centre back. Think he is out of contract in the summer. Think he will be gone.

Josh Knight - Another out of contract I think. Pearson probably knows him from his Leicester days. Wycombe fans love him.

Urhoghide - Probably better to be brought in as a full back for now, but he's supposed to be a centre back. Huge potential.

Tom McIntyre - left footer, very young, Reading fans love him. Out of contract in the summer.

Hyam - He is out of contract in the summer but Coventry apparently have a year option. Assuming it is triggered he might still be an option to buy. They'll want money rather than losing him for nothing the following summer. I know they finished higher but we obviously have a bigger budget than Coventry.

Matty Pearson - I'd want better than him ideally. But wouldn't be the worst free transfer. Played nearly every minute this season. Minutes played this season could be a big factor in Nigel's decision. He's a solid enough defender from what I've seen of him.

So those are centre backs who played  championship football all season. All fairly realistic imo. There's probably more than that I haven't thought of.

We can also look at centre backs who have played league one football all season:

Elliott Moore, Rob Atkinson, Jacob Greaves, Frankie Kent, Dion Sanderson, Jack Tucker.

And then there's probably some good prem loans we can get. Loads of options. Not saying they're all better options than Baker, but some certainly are better imo and some others I know less about might be too. But all down to good recruitment.

 

 

 

 

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36 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I hoped he would return to fitness 2 months ago, get 10-12 games under his belt and then there’d be a decision to make.  Although I think he’s a good defender, now is the time to let him go.  Too big a risk for a 30 year old.

Yet that’s where he’s played him 

 

Yeah he's played him at centre back mainly. But we've been so short of options in that position. Mapps was really looking dodgy and there was no one else to play alongside Kalas.

 

 

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4 hours ago, JonDolman said:

Was a very good performance yesterday in his defensive work. Looked really up for it.

I'd let him go. He's been out all season and when he does start you never know if he will walk off the pitch in the first half. We can't be building a defence with someone who does that imo.

He is so poor on the ball, which isn't the end of the world but other options out there offer so much more in bringing the ball out.

And he's performed badly and made lots of mistakes in spells for us. In many ways he isn't at all reliable.

It's not that he's not got the ability, so if Nige does give him a new deal then he must believe he can get the best out of Baker. If that's the case then fair enough.

 

I agree about his distribution. It’s either kick it into touch, pass it ten yards to another spare defender or hoof it down the field. Add that to his fitness record.

He needs to be a superb defender to make up for it...

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6 hours ago, JonDolman said:

Loads of potential alternatives.

Not sure which of these we would manage to get but here's some:

Cathcart - 32 now, Nige worked with him at Watford. Maybe a loan as I can't see him being needed by Watford in the prem.

Iorfa - Okay he has been out injured a lot. But a proven championship player and looked real quality at centre back start of the season. Being injured for much of the season might put Nige off.

Matt Clarke - I don't agree with those that say we need a left footer to play left centre back. But he is one of those. Back to Brighton, surely they'll be looking to sell. They have loads in that position.

Ostigard - Another Brighton centre back. Think he is out of contract in the summer. Think he will be gone.

Josh Knight - Another out of contract I think. Pearson probably knows him from his Leicester days. Wycombe fans love him.

Urhoghide - Probably better to be brought in as a full back for now, but he's supposed to be a centre back. Huge potential.

Tom McIntyre - left footer, very young, Reading fans love him. Out of contract in the summer.

Hyam - He is out of contract in the summer but Coventry apparently have a year option. Assuming it is triggered he might still be an option to buy. They'll want money rather than losing him for nothing the following summer. I know they finished higher but we obviously have a bigger budget than Coventry.

Matty Pearson - I'd want better than him ideally. But wouldn't be the worst free transfer. Played nearly every minute this season. Minutes played this season could be a big factor in Nigel's decision. He's a solid enough defender from what I've seen of him.

So those are centre backs who played  championship football all season. All fairly realistic imo. There's probably more than that I haven't thought of.

We can also look at centre backs who have played league one football all season:

Elliott Moore, Rob Atkinson, Jacob Greaves, Frankie Kent, Dion Sanderson, Jack Tucker.

And then there's probably some good prem loans we can get. Loads of options. Not saying they're all better options than Baker, but some certainly are better imo and some others I know less about might be too. But all down to good recruitment.

 

 

 

 

Good list.

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Baker is a strange one! I get the impression Pearson wants to like him, but his injury record, not just here, is awful. 

He has Vyner, Kalas and Moore no matter what! Although if rumors are true Kalas might be one sacrificed. We will see their. 

I would expect a minimum of two CBs.....The Goalkeeper is going I have no doubt. So the question is, is Max good enough and is their competition enough...?

Midfield I expect an utter revamp....Weimann I think is nailed on for an extension, then its all up for grabs!! 

Another forward is inevitable, the wild card is what we have that will be part of the squad next season.

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9 hours ago, JonDolman said:

Pearson said in the post match interview yesterday that Vyner needs to play in one position. And he knows what position that is.

I don't think that will be at centre back.

I thought it was the most interesting answer he gave yesterday, he actually said; 

“One of the things next season is to let Zak have a run, either in the side or at least have the understanding of the position he’s working at”. “That will be clearer next season, I know what position that is, but at the moment I don’t want to share that”.

There are 3 realistic options, RB, CB or CM, even though he has played the majority of the season at CB, I agree, it doesn’t necessarily follow that it will be there.

The retained list & then those that arrive over the summer will give us a clue, my hunch is he sees him as a RB, but we’ll see.

Edited by GrahamC
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1 minute ago, GrahamC said:

I thought it was the most interesting answer he gave yesterday, he actually said; 

“One of the things next season is to let Zak have a run, either in the side or at least have the understanding of the position he’s working at”. “That will be clearer next season, I know what position that is, but at the moment I don’t want to share that”.

There are 3 realistic options, RB, CB or CM, even though he has played the majority of the season at CB, I agree, it doesn’t necessarily follow that it will be there.

The retained list & then those that arrive over the summer will give us a clue, my hunch is he sees him as a RB, but we’ll see.

RB is his best position IMO followed by DM/CM at last of all CB (unless he can cut out the switching off he does all too often)

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2 minutes ago, robin_unreliant said:

Not arguing with the overall sentiment but if he sees him as a RB why hasn't he picked him there and why did we need Simpson? 

We can’t have a squad of 15, it is pretty obvious Hunt will be released now & that Sessegnon will go back to Fulham, so even if he does see Vyner as a RB (which is just my guess) we still need an alternative/cover there.

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13 minutes ago, REDOXO said:

Baker is a strange one! I get the impression Pearson wants to like him, but his injury record, not just here, is awful. 

He has Vyner, Kalas and Moore no matter what! Although if rumors are true Kalas might be one sacrificed. We will see their. 

 

Not sure about that - I wouldn't be surprised if Moore is moved on if possible.

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Just now, Nogbad the Bad said:

Not sure about that - I wouldn't be surprised if Moore is moved on if possible.

I guess we will see Nogbad. However he is as good as anything out there for the last three months....I guess they all need to show some form in pre season....Will be a big one for a few Thats for sure!!

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