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Weimann's contract


NcnsBcfc

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42 minutes ago, ncnsbcfc said:

Weird wasn't it, the approach taken by MA?

Pre-Christmas, we're talking to people (Walsh, Fammy etc). Post Christmas, we're not having any discussions at all.

Then out of the blue, "We've offered Fammy one the biggest contracts in the history of the club". When saying that basically everyone else will have to take lower offers, or no contract at all.

Then when NP is appointed, SL does an interview saying he will be supported in building a new squad. We get rid/release 11 of our first team squad, many on high wages. We then turn around, and evidenced through the saga of AW, that we are really really cutting our cloth.

So many mixed messages from City over the last 6 months; that have just caused confusion no doubt amongst the players, and supporters alike.

Moving forward, our communication has got to improve. 

 

Mark Ashton is a charlatan and liar.  Anything he said must therefore be ignored.

If you disregard what came out of Mark Ashton's mouth, the messages have been consistent.

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49 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said:

Are you going to be telling your boss on Monday that you aren’t in it for the money and will accept a pay cut? If not, don’t expect principles of others that you do not hold of yourself. 

That aside, there is a subtle but important distinction between money and value. If someone offered you £50, 000 a year to do a job then most people would see that as a very good salary but you’d feel differently if you were currently being paid £60, 000 a year to do the exact same thing and you’d feel differently again if you are getting £50, 000 and a mate doing the exact same job at the exact same company told you they were getting £55, 000.

If Weimann is being offered less money to do a job he is already doing for us - and his colleagues, who are not out of contract, are not getting a wage cut - the issue may be about not feeling valued rather than only caring about the money. The two are different things.

I've taken pay cuts to stay in work, twice.  Took a 60% cut for four months last year due to COVID, too.  

There are many factors at play here that you haven't considered.  

Weimann is a contractor. Contractors and their contracts are subject to market forces.  Weimann is contracted by an organisation that hasn't had customers for over a year. Probably won't have a full quota of customers for another year.  That organisation is losing money hand over fist and will continue to lose money hand over fist.  Any organisation in those shoes would be looking, when contracts come up for renewal, to start making efforts to cut costs. This is what is occurring here.  Doesn't matter what others are getting paid - they have longer on their contracts so aren't subject to renegotiation at this point.  When they come up for renewal - much like Fams - others will probably see similar moves by the club.   

Add in that Weimann hasn't played for a year, is getting older (and by consequence will suffer a drop in performance levels) then it should be blatantly obvious why the club is seeking to pay less.

If Weimann thinks he's being unfairly treated or worth more he should find somewhere else to play.

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1 hour ago, cityloyal473 said:

I've taken pay cuts to stay in work, twice.  Took a 60% cut for four months last year due to COVID, too.  

There are many factors at play here that you haven't considered.  

Weimann is a contractor. Contractors and their contracts are subject to market forces.  Weimann is contracted by an organisation that hasn't had customers for over a year. Probably won't have a full quota of customers for another year.  That organisation is losing money hand over fist and will continue to lose money hand over fist.  Any organisation in those shoes would be looking, when contracts come up for renewal, to start making efforts to cut costs. This is what is occurring here.  Doesn't matter what others are getting paid - they have longer on their contracts so aren't subject to renegotiation at this point.  When they come up for renewal - much like Fams - others will probably see similar moves by the club.   

Add in that Weimann hasn't played for a year, is getting older (and by consequence will suffer a drop in performance levels) then it should be blatantly obvious why the club is seeking to pay less.

If Weimann thinks he's being unfairly treated or worth more he should find somewhere else to play.

I am mystified why so few people seem to have grasped this.  

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Weimann was our biggest miss.

The bloke runs and runs, this ups our tempo (a serious problem for us without him as we have ome pace deceptively slow), he closes defenders and reduced there ability to hit long balls unchallenged (again a huge problem last season that we suffere from week after week) and gets goals wherever he plays upfront. (Tombola boy never had a scooby how or where, just enough to know his team where worse without him)
 

Pearson will do a lot to keep him and if they come to an agreement don’t be surprised if he is given more responsibility around the team. 

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19 minutes ago, The Bard said:

I am mystified why so few people seem to have grasped this.  

Not picking on Weimann here, but as he’s the subject of this thread - a business with no customers has paid him in the region of one million Pounds in the past year. 

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1 hour ago, cityloyal473 said:

I've taken pay cuts to stay in work, twice.  Took a 60% cut for four months last year due to COVID, too.  

There are many factors at play here that you haven't considered.  

Weimann is a contractor. Contractors and their contracts are subject to market forces.  Weimann is contracted by an organisation that hasn't had customers for over a year. Probably won't have a full quota of customers for another year.  That organisation is losing money hand over fist and will continue to lose money hand over fist.  Any organisation in those shoes would be looking, when contracts come up for renewal, to start making efforts to cut costs. This is what is occurring here.  Doesn't matter what others are getting paid - they have longer on their contracts so aren't subject to renegotiation at this point.  When they come up for renewal - much like Fams - others will probably see similar moves by the club.   

Add in that Weimann hasn't played for a year, is getting older (and by consequence will suffer a drop in performance levels) then it should be blatantly obvious why the club is seeking to pay less.

If Weimann thinks he's being unfairly treated or worth more he should find somewhere else to play.

Totally agree.

I would imagine that a number of options across the football world have either not been activated or have been altered due to Covid.

AW is not in the strongest of positions here and I really doubt he will be inundated with offers on anything like the wage we’re are allegedly prepared to offer.

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Can we please stop talking like 20k a week for a senior championship player is a lot, its average.  With all the parachute payments the 2019/2020 Average was close to 29K obviously that's an average and the teams who have yoyo can pay more, but 20K is not huge its the bottom middle end of the pay bands.  Obviously people are looking to cut back salaries to claw back some lost revenue, but Fulham, West Brom & Sheffield Utd will all still have decent cash reserves.  If you take a realists view we can't possibly compete on wages for senior players so we have to retain our good young players and hope to get out of this league that way.

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11 minutes ago, Lorenzos Only Goal said:

Can we please stop talking like 20k a week for a senior championship player is a lot, its average.  With all the parachute payments the 2019/2020 Average was close to 29K obviously that's an average and the teams who have yoyo can pay more, but 20K is not huge its the bottom middle end of the pay bands.  Obviously people are looking to cut back salaries to claw back some lost revenue, but Fulham, West Brom & Sheffield Utd will all still have decent cash reserves.  If you take a realists view we can't possibly compete on wages for senior players so we have to retain our good young players and hope to get out of this league that way.

Average Champ salary was around £15k pw.  But if you take the PP clubs out, it would push that down.  I agree re your point about how much a senior player gets though.  Just one big range of wages from the lowest to the highes.

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6 hours ago, cityloyal473 said:

I've taken pay cuts to stay in work, twice.  Took a 60% cut for four months last year due to COVID, too.  

There are many factors at play here that you haven't considered.  

Weimann is a contractor. Contractors and their contracts are subject to market forces.  Weimann is contracted by an organisation that hasn't had customers for over a year. Probably won't have a full quota of customers for another year.  That organisation is losing money hand over fist and will continue to lose money hand over fist.  Any organisation in those shoes would be looking, when contracts come up for renewal, to start making efforts to cut costs. This is what is occurring here.  Doesn't matter what others are getting paid - they have longer on their contracts so aren't subject to renegotiation at this point.  When they come up for renewal - much like Fams - others will probably see similar moves by the club.   

Add in that Weimann hasn't played for a year, is getting older (and by consequence will suffer a drop in performance levels) then it should be blatantly obvious why the club is seeking to pay less.

If Weimann thinks he's being unfairly treated or worth more he should find somewhere else to play.

Absolutely spot on. Look at some of the younger players coming through doing an equally decent job for a fraction of the money. To use your example of contractors-why pay someone four times more to pave your drive way for the same quality. Maybe the cause of some of the trouble in dressing room.

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3 minutes ago, Berkshire Red said:

Any news on this one? Is he another free agent to leave the club then?

I was just thinking it's odd we've had no updates on Weimann or Danny Simpson. I'd like both to stay on. Without Simpson, we wouldn't even have a right back. 

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19 minutes ago, BOSRed said:

Question is, who out there can offer similar to Weimann but possibly more return in terms of goals/assists that would cost less of a wage? There’s a challenge for all you statos to find....

Sammy Szmodics ??‍♂️

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Just now, Selred said:

15 goals in 42 League One games.

Last season Weimann had 9 in 45 in Championship.

Not the same quality really.

But those stats from attacking midfield are still very decent, and if he hadn't already had a stint at the club would be enough to give him a look. Should've been given a proper run before being binned.

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On 22/05/2021 at 14:30, Rudolf Hucker said:

I wonder whether the arrival of Rennie and his review of AW’s injury/recovery has caused NP to decide against the  extension of his contract? 

I suspect the revised contract offer we have made will continue elements to cover us in the event of him getting another long term injury (which I think is likely with his age and the nature of the issue). I dont know how they will word it, but something along the lines of a smaller basic and a bigger appearance fee I think.

It would be a wise move on the clubs side and also a risk for AW, hence the delay in signing.

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I wonder if we are too negative about Weimann not being here in future.

He has played for Pearson so is well known to NP. Do I remember that NP mentioned Weimann specifically not long after he arrived in February, as his type of player. Pace, hard work, takes responsibility/leader?

All this tells me AW will be here next season. As for the money side. Easy enough and all legal, a basic salary in line with others but add ones like signing on lump and pension contributions. Where there is a will there's a way.

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1 minute ago, cidered abroad said:

I wonder if we are too negative about Weimann not being here in future.

He has played for Pearson so is well known to NP. Do I remember that NP mentioned Weizmann specifically not long after he arrived in February, as his type of player. Pace, hard work, takes responsibility/leader?

All this tells me AW will be here next season. As for the money side. Easy enough and all legal, a basic salary in line with others but add ones like signing on lump and pension contributions. Where there is a will there's a way.

It depends what he is offered elsewhere though. 

Being honest, if I knew an employer could have extended my contract but has chosen not to do so in order to try and negotiate to pay me less instead, I'd politely enter into discussions whilst putting feelers out for other opportunities in the hope that I could go back and politely advise them where they might wish to place their new contract offer. 

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39 minutes ago, cidered abroad said:

I wonder if we are too negative about Weimann not being here in future.

He has played for Pearson so is well known to NP. Do I remember that NP mentioned Weimann specifically not long after he arrived in February, as his type of player. Pace, hard work, takes responsibility/leader?

and that is all evidenced by the fact the club / NP has offered him a contract…and Weimann is deciding whether to accept or not.

All this tells me AW will be here next season. As for the money side. Easy enough and all legal, a basic salary in line with others but add ones like signing on lump and pension contributions. Where there is a will there's a way.

What it tells me is that NP was not willing to exercise the club option at circa £1m p.a. and be left in a situation where the player walks for zilch next summer.  He was willing to offer a longer term deal and lower wages (how much lower we don’t know) as this is 1) better value for City, 2) provides some continuity and 3) would bring Weimann’s wages more into line with other members of the squad (something he desires).

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37 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said:

It depends what he is offered elsewhere though. 

Being honest, if I knew an employer could have extended my contract but has chosen not to do so in order to try and negotiate to pay me less instead, I'd politely enter into discussions whilst putting feelers out for other opportunities in the hope that I could go back and politely advise them where they might wish to place their new contract offer. 

And I suspect this is exactly what’s happening.  Weimann may get plenty of offers / better offers, or on the back of an ACL he might find nobody wants to touch him with a barge pole.  We are just waiting to see.  My gut feel is that Weimann will get a better offer elsewhere and he will be off.

I really rate Weimann, but I also like Pearson’s prudence too.  It would’ve been all too easy to exercise the option.  I thought they would, but I believe they are doing the right thing.  From the players released it seem like Pearson won’t waste money Willy-nilly.  We should support that.

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13 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

⬆️⬆️⬆️

And I suspect this is exactly what’s happening.  Weimann may get plenty of offers / better offers, or on the back of an ACL he might find nobody wants to touch him with a barge pole.  We are just waiting to see.  My gut feel is that Weimann will get a better offer elsewhere and he will be off.

I really rate Weimann, but I also like Pearson’s prudence too.  It would’ve been all too easy to exercise the option.  I thought they would, but I believe they are doing the right thing.  From the players released it seem like Pearson won’t waste money Willy-nilly.  We should support that.

Agree we should support not wasting money, so long as we can replace those not being kept on with similar or better ability, otherwise we are just going backwards

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