Derby County

[ExiledAjax]

5 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Only going off the rumours that MLS might be after Wells.

Inter Miami under Fizzer? Maybe Atlanta? Just thinking of easy flights to Bermuda.

On Jozwiak going, you'd think that's what gets them to season end. My reading of this is that selling him, and telling Rooney "we need the fee", that tells us there's still months to go here. Why do you "need the fee" to keep the lights on if a buyer is imminent?

Starting next season on -15 is looking increasingly likely. 

And they're running out of assets to sell.

Surely Lawrence goes next, presumably as soon as relegation is mathematically confirmed.

Edited March 4, 2022 by ExiledAjax

[Mr Popodopolous]

26 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Only going off the rumours that MLS might be after Wells.

Perhaps a job lot. Useful for Palmer on International duty as he plays for Jamaica.

However yeah Wells feels much more likely.

As for Jozwiak, Nixon seemingly said that the fee or  a chunk of it, an instalment dunno is Poznan bound as an instalment or a chunk of it was still due.

[ExiledAjax]

10 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Perhaps a job lot. Useful for Palmer on International duty as he plays for Jamaica.

However yeah Wells feels much more likely.

As for Jozwiak, Nixon seemingly said that the fee or  a chunk of it, an instalment dunno is Poznan bound as an instalment or a chunk of it was still due.

So it clears a liability as well providing some cash. Perfect for them, and you can see why he has to go.

[Davefevs]

42 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

Inter Miami under Fizzer? Maybe Atlanta? Just thinking of easy flights to Bermuda.

On Jozwiak going, you'd think that's what gets them to season end. My reading of this is that selling him, and telling Rooney "we need the fee", that tells us there's still months to go here. Why do you "need the fee" to keep the lights on if a buyer is imminent?

Starting next season on -15 is looking increasingly likely. 

And they're running out of assets to sell.

Surely Lawrence goes next, presumably as soon as relegation is mathematically confirmed.

It probably contributes to the total sum needed to get them through the season.  Suspect it was part of the proof that the money they have matched the forecast, e.g. the forecast was lower because Joswiak has been sold.

[ExiledAjax]

1 minute ago, Davefevs said:

It probably contributes to the total sum needed to get them through the season.  Suspect it was part of the proof that the money they have matched the forecast, e.g. the forecast was lower because Joswiak has been sold.

Yes, exactly. But if a buyer is truly only weeks away, you don't fret about that. At the very least I think it suggests that they don't think the sale will be approved in March.

[REDOXO]

8 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

Yes, exactly. But if a buyer is truly only weeks away, you don't fret about that. At the very least I think it suggests that they don't think the sale will be approved in March.

I suspect it was the EFL doing the fretting! If the apparent ultimatum has been made regarding a preferred bidder by next weekend then it would appear major pressure is being applied on Quantuma!

[Waconda]

56 minutes ago, REDOXO said:

I suspect it was the EFL doing the fretting! If the apparent ultimatum has been made regarding a preferred bidder by next weekend then it would appear major pressure is being applied on Quantuma!

There is no real deadline from the EFL and the administrators know this.

The main priority for the EFL is to get Derby to finish the season at any cost.

[REDOXO]

11 minutes ago, VT05763 said:

There is no real deadline from the EFL and the administrators know this.

The main priority for the EFL is to get Derby to finish the season at any cost.

Yes interesting isn’t it. Q can be as crap as they like if they believe the consequences of their failure are even greater for the regulator. 
 

A dangerous game for the clubs administrators to play, particularly as they have blamed the EFL and allowed the idiots to believe and repeat the EFL are all useless bastards with an axe to grind with poor little Derby. 
 

 

[Waconda]

2 minutes ago, REDOXO said:

Yes interesting isn’t it. Q can be as crap as they like if they believe the consequences of their failure are even greater for the regulator. 
 

A dangerous game for the clubs administrators to play, particularly as they have blamed the EFL and allowed the idiots to believe and repeat the EFL are all useless bastards with an axe to grind with poor little Derby. 
 

 

It might well change in the Summer though !

Derby shouldn't get too excited.

[Unan]

1 hour ago, Davefevs said:

It probably contributes to the total sum needed to get them through the season.  Suspect it was part of the proof that the money they have matched the forecast, e.g. the forecast was lower because Joswiak has been sold.

Amortisation wise they must be 3m down(?)

[Davefevs]

30 minutes ago, Marcus Aurelius said:

Amortisation wise they must be 3m down(?)

According to google…£4m on a 4 year deal. So about 18 months into it…so value about £2.5m.  If they get £1m from him, then that’s a £1.5m impairment.  Oh dear.

[Unan]

17 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

According to google…£4m on a 4 year deal. So about 18 months into it…so value about £2.5m.  If they get £1m from him, then that’s a £1.5m impairment.  Oh dear.

Forgot to include the 1m selling fee, whoops.. sub 2m though. That doesn’t sound healthy.

[Hxj]

15 minutes ago, Marcus Aurelius said:

That doesn’t sound healthy.

I doubt that FFP is the primary concern at this time!

[Mr Popodopolous]

Ironically- although they've not released consolidated accounts for 3 long years- I don't think Derby have an FFP issue this season.

The cash outgoings looked relatively low although are allowables still £7m per season, what is amortisation- but they will have a target of £13m plus allowables plus £2.5m- fall below that or even hit that, could be £20-25m in an accounting loss, I don't think they fail to 2022- hopefully the EFL will have all of the relevant information though.

[Monkeh]

1 hour ago, Davefevs said:

According to google…£4m on a 4 year deal. So about 18 months into it…so value about £2.5m.  If they get £1m from him, then that’s a £1.5m impairment.  Oh dear.

Derby get none of the fee due to not paying the installments to his previous club,

All this has done is get his wages off the wage bill, nothing more

[Davefevs]

28 minutes ago, Monkeh said:

Derby get none of the fee due to not paying the installments to his previous club,

All this has done is get his wages off the wage bill, nothing more

You’re talking “cash”, I’m talking “profit and loss”…or loss / impairment in this case!

[semblar]

9 hours ago, Monkeh said:

Derby get none of the fee due to not paying the installments to his previous club,

All this has done is get his wages off the wage bill, nothing more

 

True but it does two things

 

Reduce cashflow - help the "funds to get to end of season" criteria

Reduce total debt - reduces the minimum sale price needed to meet the various restrictions (such as minimum 25%), especially since the debt wopuld have been a football creditor

Edited March 5, 2022 by semblar

[Mr Popodopolous]

Quote

There's a rumour that Derby County will be banned from the EFL but an "Independent Football Club from Derby" will be allowed to play all fixtrures, with the same playing squad, staff and ground but a slightlry different badge.

No idea of the veracity, but that would be a disgrace if so.

[Rich]

18 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

No idea of the veracity, but that would be a disgrace if so.

Think that's a whoosh. Reference to individual Russian sportsmen.

[REDOXO]

Quantuma update via MP. 
 

Quantuma is urgently clarifying all of the current bids! 
 

My thought is that Quantuma will need administrators themselves after they have spent all the wedge Derby County owe them. The damage they are inflicting on their own business must be massive!

[Davefevs]

I don’t see how Quantuma could have issued guarantees about no 15 point penalty next season.  It looks a given imho.  No way are HMRC accepting 25p in the pound.

Edited March 10, 2022 by Davefevs

[ExiledAjax]

9 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

 

Fascinating.

Binnie's bid was submitted "..in the belief there were no other bids on the table." How did they reach that understanding I wonder. Is it true? If it is then which bids are Q currently evaluating?

10 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I don’t see how Quantuma could have issued guarantees about no 15 point penalty next season.  It looks a given imho.  No way are HMRC accepting 25p in the pound.

Doesn't the article effectively say that the Binnies bid assumed they would get a -15 deduction next season? "...the bid was submitted on the understanding the sum would not prevent the club being hit with a 15-point deduction next season for failing to pay creditors 25% of what they are owed." So they were accepting that, as you say, creditors wouldn't accept 25p in the pound, and so next season would be started on -15. The article is odd to write it in the negative but I think I am reading that correctly?

Interesting as well that the Binnies say they've been working since June last year, 3 months before Derby went into Administration, and prior to the start of this season.

Ultimately I think that this is very revealing, shows us just how messy this all is, shows how terrible the comms have been - both public and private, and shows us there's still a huge gap between Quantuma's valuation of a club that could in just 4 months' time be in League 1 with 7 professional players on its books and the valuation of prospective buyers of said club.

[Davefevs]

14 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

Fascinating.

Binnie's bid was submitted "..in the belief there were no other bids on the table." How did they reach that understanding I wonder. Is it true? If it is then which bids are Q currently evaluating?

Doesn't the article effectively say that the Binnies bid assumed they would get a -15 deduction next season? "...the bid was submitted on the understanding the sum would not prevent the club being hit with a 15-point deduction next season for failing to pay creditors 25% of what they are owed." So they were accepting that, as you say, creditors wouldn't accept 25p in the pound, and so next season would be started on -15. The article is odd to write it in the negative but I think I am reading that correctly?

Interesting as well that the Binnies say they've been working since June last year, 3 months before Derby went into Administration, and prior to the start of this season.

Ultimately I think that this is very revealing, shows us just how messy this all is, shows how terrible the comms have been - both public and private, and shows us there's still a huge gap between Quantuma's valuation of a club that could in just 4 months' time be in League 1 with 7 professional players on its books and the valuation of prospective buyers of said club.

Ah, yes, misread it…ta

[Sleepy1968]

1 hour ago, REDOXO said:

My thought is that Quantuma will need administrators themselves after they have spent all the wedge Derby County owe them. The damage they are inflicting on their own business must be massive!

I agree with you.

I had a look at them a few weeks ago (website, companies house check, etc.). Certainly they've been shown up for what they are: a young insubstantial company, unprepared and inexperienced for the task they have undertaken. Obviously they were approached by MM, so he's at least partially at fault for this debacle.

 

[Davefevs]

16 minutes ago, Sleepy1968 said:

I agree with you.

I had a look at them a few weeks ago (website, companies house check, etc.). Certainly they've been shown up for what they are: a young insubstantial company, unprepared and inexperienced for the task they have undertaken. Obviously they were approached by MM, so he's at least partially at fault for this debacle.

 

Weren’t they the Admin for Portsmouth too?

[ExiledAjax]

18 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Weren’t they the Admin for Portsmouth too?

Andronikou was personally, but I don't think he was with Q at the time.

[Mr Popodopolous]

There are some familiar themes- Andronikou also looked to appeal everything at Portsmouth and used unusual tactics, think he queried the Football Creditors rule and its validity in 2010!

Yes I hope Derby get relegated but taking a non-biased approach, Mike Ashley would surely be their best bet by far of the potential bidders- they won't go bust under him, chances are but you never know they won't look at breaching FFP and he probably would look to build up some firepower and then go for it in Year 3 from an FFP perspective- spend and save cycle. He would also definitively and without doubt have the cash to pay a sufficient amount to avoid -15.

[Lanterne Rouge]

4 hours ago, Davefevs said:

I don’t see how Quantuma could have issued guarantees about no 15 point penalty next season.  It looks a given imho.  No way are HMRC accepting 25p in the pound.

At the risk of banging my drum yet again, nor should they/

[chinapig]

So, on the one hand the Binnies believe there are no other bids on the table and on the other Rooney seems to have been told something might happen in the next 4 or 5 days.

Don't hold your breath Wayne.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/60694665

[Ska Junkie]

2 hours ago, chinapig said:

So, on the one hand the Binnies believe there are no other bids on the table and on the other Rooney seems to have been told something might happen in the next 4 or 5 days.

Don't hold your breath Wayne.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/60694665

I'll give Rooney some credit for that, quite an honest and well meaning statement. 

If anyone has come out of this situation with reputation improved, for me it's Rooney.

Edited March 11, 2022 by Ska Junkie