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Derby Deserve Relegation; Are the Football League going to bungle this one too?


havanatopia
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I see Dylan Williams is reported to have been sold for decent money despite having played few first team matches 

I wonder if that's to do with him being on a second year scholar's contract out of the Academy such if they go bust he immediately goes on a free?

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1 hour ago, Hxj said:

I think you need to show an actual restraint for there to be a case, plus I suspect that in all cases it is cheaper to pay a sum to the EFL than fight matters through the courts.  After all players and, more importantly, agents need to get paid!

The pfa not the efl pick up that tab don't they

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6 minutes ago, Monkeh said:

The pfa not the efl pick up that tab don't they

I think at lower levels they do but there's no binding obligation on them so to do, it's hardship payments. But in those cases most players are given their contracts to work elsewhere. Wonder what would happen for somebody on £30k per week?

Edited by BTRFTG
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3 minutes ago, BTRFTG said:

I think at lower levels they do but there's no binding obligation on them so to do, it's hardship payments. But in those cases most players are given their contracts to work elsewhere. Wonder what would happen for somebody on £30k per week?

We are lower level ie not a prem club,

And the pfa is the players union same rules apply to Salford players as it does to Chelsea players who happen to be members of the pfa, 

That's not to say there isn't a threshold ie the players pay the first 5k of the wage I guess

Edited by Monkeh
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3 minutes ago, Monkeh said:

We are lower level ie not a prem club,

And the pfa is the players union same rules apply to Salford players as it does to Chelsea players who happen to be members of the pfa, 

That's not to say there isn't a threshold ie the players pay the first 5k of the wage I guess

I doubt few amongst the £30+ million on our wage bill could be described as requiring 'hardship' payments.

That said, if the players here ever needed use of a food bank there's a two decades out of date tin of mixed fruit with CoDs name on it at the back of one of my cupboards.

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4 minutes ago, BTRFTG said:

I doubt few amongst the £30+ million on our wage bill could be described as requiring 'hardship' payments.

That said, if the players here ever needed use of a food bank there's a two decades out of date tin of mixed fruit with CoDs name on it at the back of one of my cupboards.

You individually name you tins of mixed fruit?

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5 minutes ago, Hxj said:

Looks like a resolution is on the table - Binnie family have bid - they are the family behind Carlisle Capital - £30 odd million - excluding Pride Park

Not yet, its just a bid at this stage 

It's got to be accepted,

They have to prove they have the funds

They have to pass the owners test

Hopefully good news for the club but 30 million?

It was only yesterday they were talking about 50 and 60 million bids

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Just now, Ska Junkie said:

£28M doesn't even cover the HMRC debt does it?

Could feasibly cover an initial payment to HMRC, with subsequent payments to be paid by other means. Not that we have heard of a definite deal with HMRC on those terms. This is just my speculation.

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7 minutes ago, Ska Junkie said:

£28M doesn't even cover the HMRC debt does it?

It appears to be the minimum amount needed to cover the MSD Administration Loan (say £5m), Administrators Fees and Costs (say £3m), Football Creditors in full (say £10m), 25% to everyone else (£10m out of £40m).

Still needs a CVA or a reconstruction.  If HMRC say 'no' it won't happen.

Edited by Hxj
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7 minutes ago, Hxj said:

It appears to be the minimum amount needed to cover the MSD Administration Loan (say £5m), Administrators Fees and Costs (say £3m), Football Creditors in full (say £10m), 25% to everyone else (£10m out of £40m).

Still needs a CVA or a reconstruction.  If HMRC say 'no' it won't happen.

Why, with all possible respect, would the HMRC accept 25% Hxj? It's a very dangerous precedent isn't it?

I guess, if, god forbid, you did liquidate, they would get nothing but wouldn't it leave every club the possibility of doing the same thing i.e. not pay the tax man?

That said, I wish Derby well.

Edited by Ska Junkie
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1 minute ago, Ska Junkie said:

would the HMRC accept 25% Hxj?

If they follow their published position they will vote 'no' in a CVA and they are owed more than enough to stop any CVA happening.  They fought long and hard to get their 'Preferential' status back so I doubt that they will want to roll over at the first hurdle.  That said MPs will be all over HMRC's senior management.

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32 minutes ago, Hxj said:

It appears to be the minimum amount needed to cover the MSD Administration Loan (say £5m), Administrators Fees and Costs (say £3m), Football Creditors in full (say £10m), 25% to everyone else (£10m out of £40m).

Still needs a CVA or a reconstruction.  If HMRC say 'no' it won't happen.

I thought MSD were owed £20m (£15m + recent loans) and other football creditors around £10m. HMRC was around £28m and Morris himself around £124m.

Is there any suggestion that MSD take the ground in lieu of debt with Morris writing off all his debt? If so, I suppose an injection of around £30 could be a starting point but that's a massive 'if' and still assumes HMRC will cut a deal. That said I guess HMRC would recoup more by taking 50% than they would becoming a preferential creditor. But £30m is a lot for a Div 1 outfit with no ground.

Edited by BTRFTG
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3 hours ago, Hxj said:

If they follow their published position they will vote 'no' in a CVA and they are owed more than enough to stop any CVA happening.  They fought long and hard to get their 'Preferential' status back so I doubt that they will want to roll over at the first hurdle.  That said MPs will be all over HMRC's senior management.

Isn`t the 25% to HMRC up front the only way they will agree to a payment plan?

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3 hours ago, BTRFTG said:

I thought MSD were owed £20m (£15m + recent loans) and other football creditors around £10m. HMRC was around £28m and Morris himself around £124m.

After a short break 🤣

MSD is £20m in the Statement of Affairs for the Administration, plus the loan since then.  Morris is owed nothing by the Football Club, his debt comes in at the ultimate parent.

I'd assume that any transaction is at the Football Club level.

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7 hours ago, BTRFTG said:

I see Dylan Williams is reported to have been sold for decent money despite having played few first team matches 

I wonder if that's to do with him being on a second year scholar's contract out of the Academy such if they go bust he immediately goes on a free?

Decent money isn't £500k.

Stuck on a scholarship contract as a professional contract would have meant he was unavailable for the first team. Crazy rules. It basically left the club with the choice of accepting an offer now or letting it go to tribunal.

That takes us to 6 youngsters who have left to join Man City, Man Utd, Liverpool and Chelsea over the past 3 seasons for a combined £3m.

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1 hour ago, AnotherDerbyFan said:

Decent money isn't £500k.

Stuck on a scholarship contract as a professional contract would have meant he was unavailable for the first team. Crazy rules. It basically left the club with the choice of accepting an offer now or letting it go to tribunal.

That takes us to 6 youngsters who have left to join Man City, Man Utd, Liverpool and Chelsea over the past 3 seasons for a combined £3m.

That’s actually quite sad, I have to say. Being able to develop and possibly sell homegrown players is huge for clubs like ours. All the early years investment without reaping the rewards of first team appearances and or decent transfer fees. 

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