14million debt written off by SL in shares

[Dunc]

7 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

The current climate has been very tough for us ordinary folk. It hasn't been tough for billionaires like Steve. In fact the number of UK billionaires has increased over the past 12 months. Steve's wealth has increased.

Steve authorises the spending of the football club which he owns in its near entirety (99%). He his paying some of that debt off, which he has authorised because he knows he can comfortably afford it, and put into shares in the club. The one he owns. 

Bristol City FC has been a wonderful asset to him over the years, that's why billionaires from all over the club buy football clubs. It's doubtless opened many doors and been good for his family and other business interests. 

I'm not feeling particularly "grateful" towards him right now as he has fallen asleep at the wheel of running the FC, again. 

We are currently closer to L1 than we are the Premier League, as the almighty Brentford, become the 50th club in English football to play in the Prem. We are the biggest club in England not to have played in it after being owned by Steve for 20 years in which time he has spent circa £150m.

On the footballing side he's made too many mistakes, and repeated them. I've said before, that if he was in a position where his "job" of being in charge was subject to a performance review of sorts (like the first team manager), he'd have been sacked many years ago. 

So, in conclusion the £14m of accounting is fairly insignificant to Steve and no I am not feeling "grateful" in the round. 

Hey KITR. Not having a go as regularly read and appreciate your comments and insights, which are invariably high standard. I also think Lansdown has made many mistakes. But I'd love your thoughts on what alternative (and improved) ownership might be? I personally really appreciate Lansdown, not because he is above much deserved criticism, but because in my view he is far better than the alternatives. 

[TonyTonyTony]

17 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

The current climate has been very tough for us ordinary folk. It hasn't been tough for billionaires like Steve. In fact the number of UK billionaires has increased over the past 12 months. Steve's wealth has increased.

Steve authorises the spending of the football club which he owns in its near entirety (99%). He his paying some of that debt off, which he has authorised because he knows he can comfortably afford it, and put into shares in the club. The one he owns. 

Bristol City FC has been a wonderful asset to him over the years, that's why billionaires from all over the club buy football clubs. It's doubtless opened many doors and been good for his family and other business interests. 

I'm not feeling particularly "grateful" towards him right now as he has fallen asleep at the wheel of running the FC, again. 

We are currently closer to L1 than we are the Premier League, as the almighty Brentford, become the 50th club in English football to play in the Prem. We are the biggest club in England not to have played in it after being owned by Steve for 20 years in which time he has spent circa £150m.

On the footballing side he's made too many mistakes, and repeated them. I've said before, that if he was in a position where his "job" of being in charge was subject to a performance review of sorts (like the first team manager), he'd have been sacked many years ago. 

So, in conclusion the £14m of accounting is fairly insignificant to Steve and no I am not feeling "grateful" in the round. 

It’s for you to judge that 14 M of someone else’s money is insignificant? How entitled do you want to sound? Jesus

[2015]

20 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

The current climate has been very tough for us ordinary folk. It hasn't been tough for billionaires like Steve. In fact the number of UK billionaires has increased over the past 12 months. Steve's wealth has increased.

Steve authorises the spending of the football club which he owns in its near entirety (99%). He his paying some of that debt off, which he has authorised because he knows he can comfortably afford it, and put into shares in the club. The one he owns. 

Bristol City FC has been a wonderful asset to him over the years, that's why billionaires from all over the club buy football clubs. It's doubtless opened many doors and been good for his family and other business interests. 

I'm not feeling particularly "grateful" towards him right now as he has fallen asleep at the wheel of running the FC, again. 

We are currently closer to L1 than we are the Premier League, as the almighty Brentford, become the 50th club in English football to play in the Prem. We are the biggest club in England not to have played in it after being owned by Steve for 20 years in which time he has spent circa £150m.

On the footballing side he's made too many mistakes, and repeated them. I've said before, that if he was in a position where his "job" of being in charge was subject to a performance review of sorts (like the first team manager), he'd have been sacked many years ago. 

So, in conclusion the £14m of accounting is fairly insignificant to Steve and no I am not feeling "grateful" in the round. 

Entitled and ungrateful attitude towards Mr Lansdown. He owes the club nothing and the fans nothing.

[Kid in the Riot]

23 minutes ago, TonyTonyTony said:

It’s for you to judge that 14 M of someone else’s money is insignificant? How entitled do you want to sound? Jesus

 

20 minutes ago, 2015 said:

Entitled and ungrateful attitude towards Mr Lansdown. He owes the club nothing and the fans nothing.

You chaps keep on kneeling before him. Doff cap, tug forelock, all cus you're impressed at the size of his wallet

If you want an ungrateful attitude then listen a bit more carefully to some of Steve's views on our fans over the years... you might not like what you hear. 

[2015]

2 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

 

You chaps keep on kneeling before him. Doff cap, tug forelock, all cus you're impressed at the size of his wallet

If you want an ungrateful attitude then listen a bit more carefully to some of Steve's views on our fans over the years... you might not like what you hear. 

No one is kneeling to him, I have been critical of his decisions over the years but he doesn't have to write off £14 Million but he does and has done time after time.

Any quotes on what he has said or nothing?

[TonyTonyTony]

2 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

 

You chaps keep on kneeling before him. Doff cap, tug forelock, all cus you're impressed at the size of his wallet

Kneeling before him? Grow up. Yes - he has made huge mistakes running the club, but to be so blinded to dismiss the writing off of 14 Million quid is poor. Would you rather he hadn’t? 

[Davefevs]

Is he really writing off £14m?  It’s his football club, debt in the P&L or Shares in the Balance Sheet?  It’s all his.

[Kid in the Riot]

35 minutes ago, Dunc said:

Hey KITR. Not having a go as regularly read and appreciate your comments and insights, which are invariably high standard. I also think Lansdown has made many mistakes. But I'd love your thoughts on what alternative (and improved) ownership might be? I personally really appreciate Lansdown, not because he is above much deserved criticism, but because in my view he is far better than the alternatives. 

Thanks for the only sensible and mature reply thus far.

I do respect Steve and believe he would have the best interests of the club at heart in any future transaction. Really, it is down to him as the club's custodian to do due diligence when he agrees to further investment or sale. 

I believe there are groups/consortiums out there that have the financial clout and expertise in sport that would be able to take the club forward. In the podcast he did when he revealed he was looking for investment, he all but admitted he felt he'd taken the club as far as he could. Is that somebody we really want at the helm for the next 5-10 years? We will continue to tread water. 

He clearly wants/needs that investment so I am afraid the sale is inevitable at some point this decade, and yes, it's 90% likely it'll be a foreign based owner. 

There's been plenty of successful owners from abroad in English football. Many have taken their clubs onto the next level. Just have to hope we are next in line... 

[YGBjammy]

31 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

The current climate has been very tough for us ordinary folk. It hasn't been tough for billionaires like Steve. In fact the number of UK billionaires has increased over the past 12 months. Steve's wealth has increased.

Steve authorises the spending of the football club which he owns in its near entirety (99%). He his paying some of that debt off, which he has authorised because he knows he can comfortably afford it, and put into shares in the club. The one he owns. 

Bristol City FC has been a wonderful asset to him over the years, that's why billionaires from all over the club buy football clubs. It's doubtless opened many doors and been good for his family and other business interests. 

I'm not feeling particularly "grateful" towards him right now as he has fallen asleep at the wheel of running the FC, again. 

We are currently closer to L1 than we are the Premier League, as the almighty Brentford, become the 50th club in English football to play in the Prem. We are the biggest club in England not to have played in it after being owned by Steve for 20 years in which time he has spent circa £150m.

On the footballing side he's made too many mistakes, and repeated them. I've said before, that if he was in a position where his "job" of being in charge was subject to a performance review of sorts (like the first team manager), he'd have been sacked many years ago. 

So, in conclusion the £14m of accounting is fairly insignificant to Steve and no I am not feeling "grateful" in the round. 

You're right, and I agree with all your criticisms. But I can still be appreciative of him wiping off debt. Could be a hell of a lot worse. Don't have to look far.

[Kid in the Riot]

4 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Is he really writing off £14m?  It’s his football club, debt in the P&L or Shares in the Balance Sheet?  It’s all his.

It's all his own money that he has spent, via the football club. It's a bit of accounting that helps the football club balance sheet. 

3 minutes ago, YGBjammy said:

You're right, and I agree with all your criticisms. But I can still be appreciative of him wiping off debt. Could be a hell of a lot worse. Don't have to look far.

See above. "Writing off" is a little misleading. I agree, it could be worse. However, it could also be a lot better. 

[TonyTonyTony]

9 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

It's all his own money that he has spent, via the football club. It's a bit of accounting that helps the football club balance sheet. 

So he spent his own money and it helps the club? .....

You are so blinded by your dislike of him to even admit any positives. Weird tbh

[AshtonGreat]

8 hours ago, Major Isewater said:

Other than that, what has Steve Lansdown ever done for us?

Well, the last three seasons have been shite tbf

[Mr Popodopolous]

@Kid in the Riot

Helps the Balance Sheet AND the FFP position. Without it we could have a lower Upper Limit.

Potentially could reduce Interest Payments on loans too but that's less clearcut.

While I don't think SL is a flawless owner let's say, (IMO) we're in safer hands with him than with many others. Yes it's writing down existing debt but that means we owe him less than we otherwise would.

Grass isn't always greener. For a start without stereotyping, American owners like the sort you are possibly referring to, quite like leveraged buyouts. Glazers, Burnley to name two- Man United can absorb it but with difficulty, Burnley time will tell but they were debt free with money in the bank at time of takeover, will be interesting to see how that plays out.

Foreign owners have a pretty mixed record at our level. Chansiri came to Sheffield Wednesday with big plans, Promotion in 2, at a push 3 years.

Extreme example? Maybe, but the problem is that if we roll the dice big, don't succeed we could be in a right mess as clubs have found out and will continue to find out.

I don't know the best way forward but what would your way forward assuming new owners were to join in Summer 2021.

Costs, Benefits, Pros, Cons. That kinda thing. Would be interesting.

[spudski]

I'd love to be in SLs position and just say **** it because I can.

Literally walk away, pay up every contract and let the club fold.

Then watch from afar, on a beach, someone else take up the reigns and take all the flak.

I wouldn't have such a thick skin as him for all his 'faults'.

Why the hell would you run a football club and have all that money, when you could be doing better things in life?

I always question that.

Imo...life has changed and it's no longer about the normal guy on the street and his family. It's now purely about privileged.

So what's the point?

You've earnt your millions, nobody is going to recognise the legacy you wish to leave. Life expectancy has changed so fast in his lifetime.

He's judging legacy from his perspective. No one will give a shit in the future.

I've grown up with two owners in place...I'd love to see a third and be the old bloke saying SL wasn't so bad. 

We all think we'd do better...but in reality it's pretty funny.

[Mr Popodopolous]

41 minutes ago, YGBjammy said:

You're right, and I agree with all your criticisms. But I can still be appreciative of him wiping off debt. Could be a hell of a lot worse. Don't have to look far.

It's universal tbh. Not saying SL should be above or beyond any valid and legitimate criticism whatsoever but I read the Stoke forum, cannot believe the flak their hierarchy get, especially the CEO. Clearly can't be complacent or live on past glories much but...

Delivered 10 years in the PL, FA Cup final, a season in Europe, Carling Cup semi final which contained a 2nd leg win at Anfield.

That decade contained plenty of competition with and a decent amount of victories over the Big 6, and then under Hughes until it started to go wrong, Shaqiri-Bojan-Arnautovic front 3 players they couldn't have dreamed of in League One 20 years ago when alongside us.

I have them down as very good owners on balance but recency bias to an extent? Universal as I say.

[Mr Popodopolous]

15 minutes ago, spudski said:

I'd love to be in SLs position and just say **** it because I can.

Literally walk away, pay up every contract and let the club fold.

Then watch from afar, on a beach, someone else take up the reigns and take all the flak.

I wouldn't have such a thick skin as him for all his 'faults'.

Why the hell would you run a football club and have all that money, when you could be doing better things in life?

I always question that.

Imo...life has changed and it's no longer about the normal guy on the street and his family. It's now purely about privileged.

So what's the point?

You've earnt your millions, nobody is going to recognise the legacy you wish to leave. Life expectancy has changed so fast in his lifetime.

He's judging legacy from his perspective. No one will give a shit in the future.

I've grown up with two owners in place...I'd love to see a third and be the old bloke saying SL wasn't so bad. 

We all think we'd do better...but in reality it's pretty funny.

Tbh cultural capital as well. There are certainly non footballing reasons why people may get involved. Talking in general here.

KITR alludes to it, business and all that. Think it's more applicable at higher levels though. Abramovich at Chelsea a good example, some say it was the most expensive insurance policy in history and even then it's not a cast iron guarantee.

Why were the Abu Dhabi lot into Man City, Qataris at PSG too? Saudi interest at Newcastle...we can but speculate.

In 2016, Aston Villa, Birmingham, West Brom and Wolves all were purchased by Chinese owners.

Bit of a coincidence? Just leading up to and around Brexit but more importantly the West Midlands. HS2? In at least some cases. Two could feed in.

I forget when SL took us over exactly but don't believe this could have played as big a role here as the above examples. Had we been in the Premier League then perhaps.

Alternatively, people might buy it as a hobby. A highly expensive hobby but a hobby nonetheless.

Myriad of reasons but at the time SL purchased us/became majority shareholder how far would that have advanced his wider business interests. Would be interesting to know- if we were an underachieving third tier, reputation of yoyoing between the middle two divisions club at the time which we may well have been, then not that far IMO.

[spudski]

2 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Tbh cultural capital as well. There are certainly non footballing reasons why people may get involved. Talking in general here.

KITR alludes to it, business and all that. Think it's more applicable at higher levels though. Abramovich at Chelsea a good example, some say it was the most expensive insurance policy in history and even then it's not a cast iron guarantee.

Why were the Abu Dhabi lot into Man City, Qataris at PSG too? Saudi interest at Newcastle...we can but speculate.

I forget when SL took us over exactly but don't believe this could have played as big a role here as the above examples. Had we been in the Premier League then perhaps.

Alternatively, people might buy it as a hobby. A highly expensive hobby but a hobby nonetheless.

Myriad of reasons but at the time SL purchased us/became majority shareholder how far would that have advanced his wider business interests. Would be interesting to know- if we were an underachieving third tier, reputation of yoyoing between the middle two divisions club at the time which we may well have been, then not that far IMO.

It is an interesting thought...as to why...and when to fold so to speak.

If I was in his position I'd be out of here.

Seriously...if you had millions would any of us be interested in following the Club?

I wouldn't. I'd be traveling the world and experiencing everything this world has to offer in my short time on the planet.

Why the hell would you spend your life worrying about a bunch of blokes kicking a bag of air about?

Seriously...wtf...

[lenred]

58 minutes ago, spudski said:

It is an interesting thought...as to why...and when to fold so to speak.

If I was in his position I'd be out of here.

Seriously...if you had millions would any of us be interested in following the Club?

I wouldn't. I'd be traveling the world and experiencing everything this world has to offer in my short time on the planet.

Why the hell would you spend your life worrying about a bunch of blokes kicking a bag of air about?

Seriously...wtf...

Ego and (in his mind) a legacy, at a guess. And I doubt very much he’s worrying a great deal about any of it. 

[fgrsimon]

Financially would he have gained any anything from Bristol City so far? You know what they say; best way to become a millionaire is to become a billionaire and buy a football club.....

[Mr Popodopolous]

1 hour ago, lenred said:

Ego and (in his mind) a legacy, at a guess. And I doubt very much he’s worrying a great deal about any of it. 

Bit of a hobby too?

As for bigger clubs, I listed in a number of examples, there can be significantly different reasons for them to get involved- in Autumn 2003, a good few months after he swept into Chelsea from nowhere, media reports suggested Abramovich was being investigated in Russia- being a popular owner of a successful side can offer some degree of protection while also walking the line somewhat to further insure...( that 2nd bit is important, if Putin ultimately and deep down wants to get someone, he will).

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2003/nov/02/football.russia

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2003/nov/19/oil.russia

Worth noting in this specific case, that when Abramovich decided he would stand down from Governor of his Region in 2007, Putin refused his resignation- and Abramovich decided he'd quite like to run for one more term after all.

That aside, ego, legacy, hobby?

Though not so sure, would we say Peter Coates is about ego? Doubtful- Legacy perhaps moreso, but I've often considered SL in a similar bracket.

50 minutes ago, fgrsimon said:

Financially would he have gained any anything from Bristol City so far? You know what they say; best way to become a millionaire is to become a billionaire and buy a football club.....

Not yet...but all those Fixed Assets, all that land- Conferencing and Hotel, Sports Group potential- he potentially could though I suspect Covid will have put a significant spanner.

Depends what people think his motives are- I personally think they're sound but in the wrong hands...could yield significant wealth for the Owner. As for the Club? All a bit meh for them.

[zippycar]

Financially I’m a follower of Mr Hargreaves and have made money by following him and in particular, Bluewhale and we all could have done this, if were fortunate to have/had the capital.

So I am lucky and the majority of other people on this site have many other financial commitments and can’t invest in Mr Lansdown’s partner.

The point I am making is that Steve would have been a far richer individual if he had never got involved in BCFC.

But and the big but is, that he did and for all his alleged faults, BCFC is in a far greater place than if Mr Lansdown had never pursued the folly of football club ownership and before you all shout me down, outside of possibly the top six in the Premiership, what individual has ever made money from owning an English football club?
 

[BTRFTG]

On 02/06/2021 at 13:47, ExiledAjax said:

that's value in the company

Remind, what are the present net liabilities?

Very decent of SL to keep City afloat but makes a mockery of the supposed aims of FFP. There also comes a point where if the Club is no longer a going concern that flipping debt for equity is not permitted. 

[Oh Louie louie]

Roman, was flying in to buy spurs.

He saw stamford bridge, and thought. oh il buy that 1 instead!

Dont think that much planning went into that.

[Red_Alligator]

I know the feeling Steve. Every time Mrs Gator goes out Cribbs......