Simon79 Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 Not sure on people putting it solely at the managers door. Yes he made a few baffling decisions, Foden off ( could of been a knock ), 2 holding midfielders etc. But for me, they aren’t as good as they are made out to be in my opinion. Players nowadays seem to be like robots, they cannot think for themselves, they seemingly cannot problem solve ( something I think O’driscoll identified ). I think the stat was 2 shots on target last night, that in itself baffles me. Move the bloody ball, move it with some tempo, beat your opponent, all of that is not tactics etc. The lack of movement staggers me & that for me is the problem, these players at club level have multiple options when on the ball, but does that coincide with playing with foreign players? I was not impressed with the Croatia game, yes it was a clean sheet & a win, but did it mask over the problem? Because again, I cannot remember us creating a lot in that game either. Hopefully we will grow into the competition, because ultimately it’s about getting through the group stages I suppose. COYR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red-Robbo Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 1 hour ago, Will Rollason said: As for the rest of it....soooooo slow ... Meaningless possession... And the one player with a bit of spark gets hooked? A City fan on Facebook summed it up. We were as slow as Evolution. 60% possession but fewer shots than a side ranked by Fifa as 44th in the world. No wonder the Scots celebrated. If you can be said to "win" a draw, they did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BanburyRed Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 I think we can safely say that the change of full backs did nothing to influence the game. This obsession with 2 holding midfielders is mad. Foden was wasted out on the right wing, Sterling and Kane completely anonymous but Southgate's answer was to sub Kane for Rashford, like for like in formation. Grealish made no discernible difference when he came on. I think we fluked the win against Croatia, not the team they were, and now struggled badly against (let's be fair) a bang average Scotland side. For all of the talk of 'these players have no fear', 'freedom to express themselves....' blah blah blah.....I didn't see any of that last night, the team played with absolute fear. Scotland raised their game and fair play to them, but they have no goalscorer and will leave the competition at the group stage, their highlight being this tedious 0-0 draw and David Marshall caught in the net like a landed salmon. Southgate has some serious thinking to do for the Czech game. If we get through, then I fully expect us to get knocked out against the 1st decent team we play. And ever it was..... .....a waste of another so called 'golden generation'..? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
City oz Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 1 hour ago, Redpool said: Same as me, and as said. Still woke up fuming. I went to bed thinking same again. I got over it now watching England play. Its like sex always waiting and ready but when the time comes its a total waste of time and the best bits of high performance are over in 30 seconds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frenchred Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 In response to the original question......SOUTHGATE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coppello Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 6 minutes ago, BanburyRed said: I think we can safely say that the change of full backs did nothing to influence the game. This obsession with 2 holding midfielders is mad. Foden was wasted out on the right wing, Sterling and Kane completely anonymous but Southgate's answer was to sub Kane for Rashford, like for like in formation. Grealish made no discernible difference when he came on. I think we fluked the win against Croatia, not the team they were, and now struggled badly against (let's be fair) a bang average Scotland side. For all of the talk of 'these players have no fear', 'freedom to express themselves....' blah blah blah.....I didn't see any of that last night, the team played with absolute fear. Scotland raised their game and fair play to them, but they have no goalscorer and will leave the competition at the group stage, their highlight being this tedious 0-0 draw and David Marshall caught in the net like a landed salmon. Southgate has some serious thinking to do for the Czech game. If we get through, then I fully expect us to get knocked out against the 1st decent team we play. And ever it was..... .....a waste of another so called 'golden generation'..? I disagree, we were comfortable against Croatia and there was only one team that was going to win that game. When Stones missed the free header last night, it felt like it was going to be one of those nights. If that goes in, I'm confident we would've dominated the game. As many have already mentioned, the substitutions were baffling and with all of the attacking talent we have on the bench, it was pretty criminal to not make more changes. Southgate deserves more credit than he receives on here, he took us to a World Cup semi final and has done far more than the last 11 managers to create a harmonious squad and remove the fan's ill feelings towards the national team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Army 75 Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 People I have spoken to this morning ( City fans) all said the same. It was just like watching Bristol City. Fair assessment Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oh Louie louie Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 Ex city goalie ian leigh...... won free pizza for life from his local italian for shutting out man utd. Sadly harry rednapp bought the place, and welched on the deal! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red-Robbo Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 "We were too frantic and not patient in the right areas of the field" - when Southgate says things like that, you know nothing is going to change under his stewardship. The urgency, passion and flair of the side is sucked right out in favour of sterile possession football with no threat posed whatsoever to the opponent. O'Driscoll must be orgasmic watching it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BanburyRed Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 22 minutes ago, Coppello said: I disagree, we were comfortable against Croatia and there was only one team that was going to win that game. When Stones missed the free header last night, it felt like it was going to be one of those nights. If that goes in, I'm confident we would've dominated the game. As many have already mentioned, the substitutions were baffling and with all of the attacking talent we have on the bench, it was pretty criminal to not make more changes. Southgate deserves more credit than he receives on here, he took us to a World Cup semi final and has done far more than the last 11 managers to create a harmonious squad and remove the fan's ill feelings towards the national team. Re reaching a WC semi final having beaten Tunisia, Panama, Columbia on pens and Sweden - hardly inspiring is it? Whilst losing to Belgium in both group stage and 3th/4th play off and Croatia in semi final.....3 losses to 3 decent teams. He might have built up some good will has Gareth but it can all be undone in the blink of an eye. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Billy Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 With the constant chopping and changing of the starting line up I’d be surprised if the players even know each other’s names let alone how to play together as a team. Lack of cohesion for me. Might get better if we keep a steady team but would love to see the shackles come off and try and win some games instead of spending 90 minutes trying not to lose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Geoff Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 35 minutes ago, Coppello said: I disagree, we were comfortable against Croatia and there was only one team that was going to win that game. When Stones missed the free header last night, it felt like it was going to be one of those nights. If that goes in, I'm confident we would've dominated the game. As many have already mentioned, the substitutions were baffling and with all of the attacking talent we have on the bench, it was pretty criminal to not make more changes. Southgate deserves more credit than he receives on here, he took us to a World Cup semi final and has done far more than the last 11 managers to create a harmonious squad and remove the fan's ill feelings towards the national team. More than Terry Venables or Bobby Robson.....don't think so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SecretSam Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 It's Mark Ashton's fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SecretSam Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 47 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said: "We were too frantic and not patient in the right areas of the field" When the hell were we "frantic"? That would have involved effort. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E.G.Red Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 44 minutes ago, Red Billy said: With the constant chopping and changing of the starting line up I’d be surprised if the players even know each other’s names let alone how to play together as a team. Lack of cohesion for me. Might get better if we keep a steady team but would love to see the shackles come off and try and win some games instead of spending 90 minutes trying not to lose. Part of the problem in getting a fixed starting lineup was that many of the 1st choice players were involved in the Champions league and Europa Cup. Last night I would have bought on Calvert Lewin to play alongside Harry Kane . What was needed was a goal (didn't matter to whom) to kick-start the game and put some intensity into it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southport Red Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 Perhaps it’s just me, but I cannot see what Declan Rice adds to that team. Rich man’s Neil Kilkenny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phileas Fogg Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 5 minutes ago, Southport Red said: Perhaps it’s just me, but I cannot see what Declan Rice adds to that team. Rich man’s Neil Kilkenny. He does an important and unsung role very solidly, but ideally perhaps last night we needed Henderson’s experience and leadership. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robin_unreliant Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 We can all see England's weakness is the CBs in defence. Southgate seems fixated on the answer being to play two holding midfielders as a shield. The alternative would be to play to our strengths and play an attacking lineup. It seems the only chance of seeing that will be a change of manager. Unfortunately I can't see an obvious English alternative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snufflelufagus Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 How many games did Portugal win when they one Euro 2016? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phileas Fogg Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 1 hour ago, Coppello said: I disagree, we were comfortable against Croatia and there was only one team that was going to win that game. When Stones missed the free header last night, it felt like it was going to be one of those nights. If that goes in, I'm confident we would've dominated the game. As many have already mentioned, the substitutions were baffling and with all of the attacking talent we have on the bench, it was pretty criminal to not make more changes. Southgate deserves more credit than he receives on here, he took us to a World Cup semi final and has done far more than the last 11 managers to create a harmonious squad and remove the fan's ill feelings towards the national team. Agreed. We played well vs Croatia and I agree had Stones scored it would've been a different game. Scotland had a few half chances but don't have the attacking quality to really threaten. It's disappointing how little invention we had to negate a 5 man defence. I think we probably needed to go 2 up front. Kane and then Rashford were both isolated and ineffective. Grealish made a difference when he came on and won 4-5 free kicks. He has to start for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcfcchampions2015 Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 1 hour ago, Red Army 75 said: People I have spoken to this morning ( City fans) all said the same. It was just like watching Bristol City. Fair assessment Totally agree, Makes you wonder how much influence Downing & Simpson (both ex England coaches) had on our style of play last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Army 75 Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 3 minutes ago, bcfcchampions2015 said: Totally agree, Makes you wonder how much influence Downing & Simpson (both ex England coaches) had on our style of play last season. Personally I don’t think we can relate the two situations. But we can agree we were both negatively shit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyTonyTony Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 19 minutes ago, Phileas Fogg said: Grealish made a difference when he came on and won 4-5 free kicks. He has to start for me. It has been a trait of English teams that our stand out and form players don’t start or a played out of position. Playing a right back at left back despite we have a champions league winning left back in the squad. Stupid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midlands Robin Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 Walking the ball towards a high defensive line was about as pointless as trying to juggle jelly. The Scottish CBs just waited for the inevitable fluff and off they went. Kane needs to be in the box. He can stick the ball in the back of the net for fun but it clearly showed last night he has no pace and couldn't create anything. I thought they'd brought Rashford on to at least run at them and try and break their line but he just stood around. There was one bizarre moment where Stirling received the ball and, instead of running off him, Rashford stood absolutely still forcing Stirling to run around him and try and make a bit of space. It's all about the movement or in our case, the total lack of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coppello Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 1 hour ago, Sir Geoff said: More than Terry Venables or Bobby Robson.....don't think so. That’s where I stopped. We’ve had 11 managers including caretakers since then who have all failed. That’s another reason why Southgate deserves a bit more respect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phileas Fogg Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 7 minutes ago, TonyTonyTony said: It has been a trait of English teams that our stand out and form players don’t start or a played out of position. Playing a right back at left back despite we have a champions league winning left back in the squad. Stupid Weirdly we could've used Trippier last night, his set piece delivery may have made a difference in such a tight niggly game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dolman Pragmatist Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 2 hours ago, frenchred said: In response to the original question......SOUTHGATE So if you put eleven top professionals on a pitch and they don’t play well, it’s the manager’s fault? Hmmm. Whatever you think of the selection, that team was good enough to beat Scotland if they played well. The fact is that the on-field decision-making was very poor and you can hardly hold the manager responsible for that. I remember Shaun O’Driscoll once saying that you could prepare players to make right decisions on the field, but that when the whistle went, it was down to the players. I understand Southgate’s comment about it being important not to lose, so the result is hardly a disaster, and the time to hit form is when you get out of the qualifying group. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swanker Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 Boring manager, boring football. How on earth did he get to manage the national team? I wouldn’t want him at Ashton Gate! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exAtyeoMax Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 Too frantic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atticus Posted June 19, 2021 Report Share Posted June 19, 2021 Its Southgate. And the FA. Thats the issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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