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England vs Italy. Is it coming home?


freezer
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I'd never criticise a player for missing a pen in a shootout. Takes a lot of bottle to step up to be one of the first 5. 

I always said that the best takers should go 4th and 5th as they're most crucial. But maybe I'm just too old school now. 

 

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1 minute ago, italian dave said:

Rashfords technique reminded me of JET. It’s a good technique, always worked for JET - but it’s pretty fundamental to it that you get it on target!

Yeah - you do that and don’t get it on target and you look like an absolute arse, as we saw tonight.

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Just now, Rob k said:

Henderson had been subbed / Southgate just saying it was his call for the penalty order 

 

That’s what I mean mate. I know he was subbed. I’m saying he shouldn’t have been. He should’ve been one the names, given his experience, captaincy and the fact he stole a penalty 3 weeks ago - he stepped up then, he should’ve been a taker. 

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11 minutes ago, robin_unreliant said:

Forget the penalties. Italy dominated the second half and Southgate didn't have the balls to use our subs until it was too late. He totally blew that tactically. 

The 4141 with Saka in CM was pathetic, would have been better having Bellingham on the pitch playing in the middle. The whole success early against Italy was getting at the full backs with quick switches of play and playing in between the CB/FB channel which we stopped doing even before the end of the 1st half. Southgate just didn't adapt to Mancini's changes and then we looked leggy in extra time with Southgate's refusal to get fresh legs on, he subbed off the only player who didn't start Wednesday when we went to extra time then as well.

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Gareth is an FA suit ,after we scored ,we reverted to a defensive mode and let the Italians play.Highly unlikely a good Italian team wouldn’t score in nearly 88 minutes!!
I think it’s centrally coached into them LJ used to behave very similarly,and they can all talk a good game.
Massive opportunity lost ,oh well  nothing new being a City and England fan.Just annoyed how many people blowing smoke up Southgate’s arse .
He was poor as Middlesbrough manager and with the talent available to him should have done much better tonight, if we’d lost giving it a go I’d be far less disappointed.

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9 minutes ago, Curr Avon said:

We've lost a Cup Final on penalties, but this England team have done the country proud, with a young, talented team led superbly by Gareth Southgate. Well done to Italy, but England's time will come.

Superbly is too much. Spain was better, Portugal could be better. That two teams were very unlucky. 

Italy and England most of the time had luck. I wanted the Trophy to come home but that is the life. The better team won, better manager won in fact.

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Just now, petehinton said:

But if he misses, everyone says “he missed one in 2018 what was Southgate thinking !!!!!”

Of course. But the reality is that everyone is going to decide the players who missed should never have taken one and the ones who didn’t take one were obvious choices, no matter who they are.

What I find weird is how many people seem to think players did not step up. I’m pretty certain Southgate will have decided, rightly or wrongly, who he wanted taking them long in advance. Football has moved a long way past the days when penalty takers were chosen on the night.

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2 minutes ago, petehinton said:

But if he misses, everyone says “he missed one in 2018 what was Southgate thinking !!!!!”

But it would’ve been an easier decision to justify and certainly more in line with Southgate’s pragmatic approach. 
Given Southgate’s tendency for caution, I’d have thought Henderson would’ve been nailed on ahead of the youngest player in the squad! 

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At that level I don't think pens come down to records or how good you are at taking them, it comes down to your nerve. Getting 60% or whatever at PL level is nothing compared to that walk tonight from the centre circle.

I'd have the more experienced players ahead of most of the kids personally

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3 minutes ago, RedRock said:

Better team won.

Southgate had the stronger hand after 10 minutes, one goal up and a fresher squad. 
 

Continued his negative philosophy, that got us far. …... but fell short against a top team.

 

And there it is. People continually  shot down on here for criticising his negative tactics. Was always going to catch up with us in the end.

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5 minutes ago, Redtrojan said:

Gareth is an FA suit ,after we scored ,we reverted to a defensive mode and let the Italians play.Highly unlikely a good Italian team wouldn’t score in nearly 88 minutes!!
I think it’s centrally coached into them LJ used to behave very similarly,and they can all talk a good game.
Massive opportunity lost ,oh well  nothing new being a City and England fan.Just annoyed how many people blowing smoke up Southgate’s arse .
He was poor as Middlesbrough manager and with the talent available to him should have done much better tonight, if we’d lost giving it a go I’d be far less disappointed.

In fairness I thought the whole of the first half we carried a threat. Second half was ‘bet you cannot score with 75% possession in a half’. As we find out time and time again the better teams can. No one is saying at a goal up it should be charge of the light brigade stuff, but we should be able to continue to carry some threat. 

Southgate is a safety first manager. We can all see the momentum of a game change, and if we are still a goal up he does nothing...until we aren’t. 

As for three little more than kids taking the last three penalties, the senior players have to step up there.

Edited by cityexile
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3 minutes ago, BCFC Grim said:

And there it is. People continually  shot down on here for criticising his negative tactics. Was always going to catch up with us in the end.

If you mean that, if you keep complaining long enough, you’ll eventually find a justifiable cause for complaint then I agree.

Back in the logical world, we have had our best tournament finish in 55 years and finished where we should have done as the second best team in the tournament.

Edited by LondonBristolian
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The tactics were poor. Overly conservative, sterile timid. Englands U shape with Mount disappearing conceded midfield for two thirds of the game. Italy sat in England's half. It was elements of Croatia 2018 again.  

Saka made poor decision after poor decision during the game. His performance looked like he was over awed by the occasion. The man management behind having a stressed nineteen year old to take a penalty in England's biggest game for five decades was abysmal. 

Bringing cold players on to take penalty's is not efficient .. 

The better team and coach won.

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2 minutes ago, The Gasbuster said:

Change the lyrics of Three Lions to “Sixty years of hurt”.

How much ******* longer are we going to have to wait ? 🙄

I always get confused about this xx years amount of hurt, did everybody around then hurt straight after they won it in 1966, surely the hurt was when they went out in 1970

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1 minute ago, LondonBristolian said:

If you mean that, if you keep complaining long enough, you’ll eventually find a justifiable cause for complaint then I agree.

Back in the logical world, we have had our best tournament finish in 55 years and finished where we should have done as the second best team in the tournament.

Agree with that overall. Italy deserved it.

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