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England vs Italy. Is it coming home?


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Just now, Northern Red said:

Manna from heaven for the people who've hated every minute of Southgate getting it spot on over the last few weeks, prove them 'right' and all that.

Exactly, the ones who said every decent team we play were going to put 5 past us……miserable bastards 😂

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4 minutes ago, Mihai said:

Superbly is too much. Spain was better, Portugal could be better. That two teams were very unlucky. 

Italy and England most of the time had luck. I wanted the Trophy to come home but that is the life. The better team won, better manager won in fact.

That last phrase. The better manager won it tonight. I can't fault the players, all very brave and let's be honest, a great tournament. Tonight it was Mancini 1 Southgate 0. Hopefully he'll learn for the future and encourage a more positive mindset.

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3 minutes ago, italian dave said:

Penalties aside, have to say that for all the talk before the game about Chiellini and Bonucci being to old, never properly tested, vulnerable if you run at them and so on, they were superb yet again. 

Hard to say when you factor in how completely negative we were . Italy deserves the cup tonight but I think that is on us not the Italian cbs 

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10 minutes ago, Harry said:

That’s what I mean mate. I know he was subbed. I’m saying he shouldn’t have been. He should’ve been one the names, given his experience, captaincy and the fact he stole a penalty 3 weeks ago - he stepped up then, he should’ve been a taker. 

Ah yeah - get you. Can’t have 2 kids going up to take pens ahead of some of the others 

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4 minutes ago, BCFC Grim said:

And there it is. People continually  shot down on here for criticising his negative tactics. Was always going to catch up with us in the end.

People were called out on here for just sending abuse when it was selections they don't agree with.

Criticism alone was never "shot down".

 

But your ultimate point is completely flawed anyway. If you criticise every selection you'll be right eventually. So criticise every selection, when a game is lost "told you so" blah blah, usual negative stuff from the same people.

 

Southgate got some things wrong in the final, but got a young team to the final and we lost on penalties to the side who performed the best throughout the tournament. It happens.

He's in credit for his England tenure.

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First final in 55 years and only 2 goals conceded in 7 games, yes on the other hand you can say there were no real chances created after the goal, a lack of subs and what was done backfired in the pens but overall we have made progress. Disappointing when you consider the great opportunity we had but I think the best side just about won the tournament. After watching England through so many shite tournaments I can't moan with the outcome, so close and the wait goes on. 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿

.

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2 minutes ago, Cowshed said:

 

The tactics were poor. Overly conservative, sterile timid. Englands U shape with Mount disappearing conceded midfield for two thirds of the game. Italy sat in England's half. It was elements of Croatia 2018 again.  

Saka made poor decision after poor decision during the game. His performance looked like he was over awed by the occasion. The man management behind having a stressed nineteen year old to take a penalty in England's biggest game for five decades was abysmal. 

Bringing cold players on to take penalty's is not efficient .. 

The better team and coach won.

You and I often disagree, but for me this sums up perfectly.

All I’ve heard from friends in Italy is ‘why did England stop playing after going 1 up?’.

Agree: Saka looked like he was on a different wavelength to other players from the moment he came on til the end. To be fair, his wasn’t the worst penalty: it was a good save.

That double substitution on 119 mins has to go down as one of the worst decisions in history. 

But good tournament, really enjoyed it, and we’ve got plenty of players who’ve done well and will be around for some time into the future. 

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1 minute ago, Red Alert said:

Southgate outclassed by Mancini. That’s how I saw it.

Yep. Southgate spoilt for choice with the attacking flair he has in the squad. I think Italy have worse players on paper but a much better manager

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5 minutes ago, cityexile said:

In fairness I thought the whole of the first half we carried a threat. Second half was ‘bet you cannot score with 75% possession in a half’. As we find out time and time again the better teams can. No one is saying at a goal up it should be charge of the light brigade stuff, but we should be able to continue to carry some threat. 

Southgate is a safety first manager. We can all see the momentum of a game change, and if we are still a goal up he does nothing...until we aren’t. 

As for three little more than kids taking the last three penalties, the senior players have to step up there.

I thought the first half was spot on. The error was not reacting to the shift in momentum at the beginning of the second half and waiting until we had already lost control of the game before making change.

Re the last three penalties, I don’t buy into the senior players not stepping up. It had been made clear we had planned for penalties and Southgate will have made a call in advance about who he did and did not want to take them. In hindsight, it was obviously not the right call but I do not believe for a second that the penalty takers were decided on the night and players chose whether or not to take them. Southgate literally brought two players on for that specific purpose.

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4 minutes ago, JamesBCFC said:

People were called out on here for just sending abuse when it was selections they don't agree with.

Criticism alone was never "shot down".

 

But your ultimate point is completely flawed anyway. If you criticise every selection you'll be right eventually. So criticise every selection, when a game is lost "told you so" blah blah, usual negative stuff from the same people.

 

Southgate got some things wrong in the final, but got a young team to the final and we lost on penalties to the side who performed the best throughout the tournament. It happens.

He's in credit for his England tenure.

Happy Clapper comes to mind, Southgate was clueless from the 2nd half, Mancini showed what a class manager can do.

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What a fantastic run!

I’ve had the best time in years!

I’m not a happy clapper and issues with not just playing style but also some players, but overall it’s been great, 5 wins, 1 draw, a couple of nail biters, a glorious night in Rome. 

Ive loved it.

For the first time in ages, we exceeded expectations.

Only won team can ever win it. If your enjoyment is centered solely on that, then yes disappointment will probably be your constant companion.

For me it’s been great.

Roll on Qatar and watching with the decs up 🎄🎁

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Just got home from pub so I haven’t read a single comment here but for what it’s worth i’ll say that the best team on the night and the tournament won, I got stick earlier on saying that Southgate was way out of his depth and I stand by that, in the last two tournaments he couldn’t of hand-picked easier routes to the final, in seven games in this tournament he did not start our most creative midfielder once, tonight he preferred to play seven defenders against two centre halves with an average age of 35 and Chelsea’s third choice left back, unfortunately people, including pundits, got blinded by results.

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11 minutes ago, And Its Smith said:

Never gonna win it with Southgate in charge 

We've never won it with anyone else in charge, what's  your point?

Southgate has got us further in the competition than any previous manager. 

Edited by Arsene's Wanger
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Just now, Red said:

Happy Clapper comes to mind, Southgate was clueless from the 2nd half, Mancini showed what a class manager can do.

You're literally celebrating a defeat because it means you can moan.

Pathetic doesn't even come close.

 

Southgate got some things wrong, absolutely, but overall the team exceeded expectations and that should also be said.

 

Being able to say both things isn't "happy clapping" it's acknowledging reality.

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Gutted. I thought we played well first half and caused them plenty of problems. In the second half they changed things and over-ran us. We completely lost our way for most of that second half.  

When Grealish came on we played too many long balls instead of playing it to his feet.  

I thought we brought our subs on far too late. Why not freshen things up earlier?

I don’t like the idea of bringing players on with seconds left just to take pens. 

Overall we did well and finally got to a final, but it felt like a missed opportunity tonight after that brilliant start. 
 

 

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8 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

Italy currently a better side than us is how I saw it but still didn’t beat us over 120.

Italy definitely a better team, we’re my pick from the start - a solid unit & all their subs in every game enhanced the overall performance 

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Sorry I disagree,not that it will make any difference.

If Southgate remains as negative as he has most of this tournament,we could potentially waste the best squad of England players we ever had.

He will undoubtably retain his very well paid position,so for the sake of us mere supporters ,I hope he learns to play a far more positive game ,otherwise further frustration and disappointment beckons.

 

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5 minutes ago, JamesBCFC said:

Laughable

England squad is actually quite clearly better on paper. Otherwise maybe someone should tell some of Europe's richest clubs to stop buying English players as there's better Italian ones out there for far cheaper.

3 minutes ago, Arsene's Wanger said:

We've never won it with anyone else in charge, what's  your point?

Southgate has got us further in the competition than any previous manager. 

With amazing players. Helps a lot imo

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