"I’m not a believer in collecting players"

[headhunter]

So said Nigel Pearson in yesterday's press briefing. How refreshing it was to hear that when you look at the clubs in the bag approach adopted by the Gruesome Twosome: Lee Johnson / Mark Ashton.

The list of players that most on OTIB would regard as no better than what we already had  is immense and I'm not going to construct it here but I have to question those who say Johnson was personally accepting of ALL who came through the door during his tenure when you look at how many of them he gave a run in the side to to show what they could do.

In Pearson I trust [even if we lose tomorrow and after 5 games have just 4 points!]

[Sturny]

Feels like he's collecting old Leicester players a bit though doesnt it. 

But I agree, it's refreshing to hear a transfer approach that doesn't feel like a shotgun tactic and there's somewhat a bit of logic behind them. 

[Nogbad the Bad]

5 minutes ago, headhunter said:

So said Nigel Pearson in yesterday's press briefing. How refreshing it was to hear that when you look at the clubs in the bag approach adopted by the Gruesome Twosome: Lee Johnson / Mark Ashton.

The list of players that most on OTIB would regard as no better than what we already had  is immense and I'm not going to construct it here but I have to question those who say Johnson was personally accepting of ALL who came through the door during his tenure when you look at how many of them he gave a run in the side to to show what they could do.

In Pearson I trust [even if we lose tomorrow and after 5 games have just 4 points!]

Not being ITK in any way, I personally would have to take at face value what LJ said several times, that he had the final yes/no say on all signings.

Not sure why he would reiterate this point if it was not the case?

[Fordy62]

Definitely a little bit of a dig at the mess he’s having to sort out. 

[DaveF]

8 minutes ago, Sturny said:

Feels like he's collecting old Leicester players a bit though doesnt it. 

Not really, they've all made decent contributions already.

[Sturny]

Just now, DaveF said:

Not really, they've all made decent contributions already.

Didn't say they haven't, but hes only brought in 1 non ex Leicester player so far.  Feels a bit like it to me 

[Phileas Fogg]

9 minutes ago, Nogbad the Bad said:

Not being ITK in any way, I personally would have to take at face value what LJ said several times, that he had the final yes/no say on all signings.

Not sure why he would reiterate this point if it was not the case?

Probably so as not to rock the boat. He had a very favourable situation here - plenty of backing, time and a very forgiving owner. 

Credit to him for taking the Sunderland challenge, but he had it very good here. Would be foolish to cause a public stir needlessly.

[Fordy62]

1 minute ago, Sturny said:

Didn't say they haven't, but hes only brought in 1 non ex Leicester player so far.  Feels a bit like it to me 

When you need to steady a sinking ship and you have no resources then you need to go with what you know. Who can blame him. 

[DaveF]

4 minutes ago, Sturny said:

Didn't say they haven't, but hes only brought in 1 non ex Leicester player so far.  Feels a bit like it to me 

'Collecting' suggests they're being signed for the sake of it though. 

[Sturny]

Just now, Fordy62 said:

When you need to steady a sinking ship and you have no resources then you need to go with what you know. Who can blame him. 

I don't blame him it all, it's been good so far 

[Sturny]

1 minute ago, DaveF said:

'Collecting' suggests they're being signed for the sake of it though. 

He's collecting them because he knows they'll work in his system that he's implementing here 

[Phileas Fogg]

3 minutes ago, lukebcfc1989 said:

Hate to seem like im backing Johnson in every reply but I must speak what I believe to be facts, did Johnson not use regularly in 2 top 10 finishes or sell for a profit every player he purchased? I mean it wasn’t a disaster was it you’d think he destroyed the club the way some of you go on…get a grip

I think history will probably look back on him relatively kindly - although there are some that’ll never give him any credit.

He didn’t sell every single player he purchased for profit though. 

[Sturny]

2 minutes ago, lukebcfc1989 said:

Hate to seem like im backing Johnson in every reply but I must speak what I believe to be facts, did Johnson not use regularly in 2 top 10 finishes or sell for a profit every player he purchased? I mean it wasn’t a disaster was it you’d think he destroyed the club the way some of you go on…get a grip

I agree that some people are quite dramatic about it, but the damage LJ/MA have done is going to last for a years becasue of FFP and how hard it will be to recover. We're going to have to make some crazy sales. It's not as black an white as looking at our league postion. 

But its like you say, maybe without spending like we did we never would've had some of those good memories 

[One Team]

37 minutes ago, headhunter said:

So said Nigel Pearson in yesterday's press briefing. How refreshing it was to hear that when you look at the clubs in the bag approach adopted by the Gruesome Twosome: Lee Johnson / Mark Ashton.

The list of players that most on OTIB would regard as no better than what we already had  is immense and I'm not going to construct it here but I have to question those who say Johnson was personally accepting of ALL who came through the door during his tenure when you look at how many of them he gave a run in the side to to show what they could do.

In Pearson I trust [even if we lose tomorrow and after 5 games have just 4 points!]

Well said.

In the Johnson/Holden/Ashton era we not only had too many players but also too many who were mediocre. It was also frustrating to see many of them keep some clearly competent youth players out of the team. 

Fortunately NP clearly spotted this quickly and has addressed it in part although will need a couple more windows to build the squad he wants I would think.

This season for me is all about laying foundations. I’d take staying up and that right now, anything else is a bonus. 

[pl00peh91]

20 minutes ago, Sturny said:

Didn't say they haven't, but hes only brought in 1 non ex Leicester player so far.  Feels a bit like it to me 

You’re not collecting players if they’re actually playing. You’re collecting players like Engvall and Hegeler and Eisa who get signed to sit on the bench 

[glynriley]

5 minutes ago, lukebcfc1989 said:

Hate to seem like im backing Johnson in every reply but I must speak what I believe to be facts, did Johnson not use regularly in 2 top 10 finishes or sell for a profit every player he purchased? I mean it wasn’t a disaster was it you’d think he destroyed the club the way some of you go on…get a grip

A) 1 top 10 finish

B) you must be ******* joking....

[2015]

Gustav Engvall, Milan Djuric, Jens Hegeler, Niclas Eliasson, Famara Diedhiou, Hörður Magnússon just the few players that were sold or gone at a far less profit than what we got them in for. 

The successes that LJ got were Webster and Brownhill. The majority of his good players in 17/18 and 18/19 were from the Cotts era (Reid, Bryan, Pack, Smith, Flint, Fielding). 
He did a good job but he spent far more money than any other Manager we have had at this club. We should have at least got into the playoffs in 18/19, we didn't.

[Fordy62]

Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t this an exhaustive list of players that LJ bought and then sold at a profit:

Josh Brownhill

Adam Webster

[Rob k]

1 minute ago, 2015 said:

Gustav Engvall, Milan Djuric, Jens Hegeler, Niclas Eliasson, Famara Diedhiou, Hörður Magnússon just the few players that were sold or gone at a far less profit than what we got them in for. 

The successes that LJ got were Webster and Brownhill. The majority of his good players in 17/18 and 18/19 were from the Cotts era (Reid, Bryan, Pack, Smith, Flint, Fielding). 
He did a good job but he spent far more money than any other Manager we have had at this club. We should have at least got into the playoffs in 18/19, we didn't.

I think LJ has to get credit for coaching these players, we weren’t getting regular fees like we did for our players before he came and haven’t since. Cotta can’t take any credit for Reid either in my opinion 
 

[2015]

Just now, lukebcfc1989 said:

Yes but he used these players regularly got his money worth and some wins which is what they were purchased for… 

He did not use Engvall, Djuric and Hegeler regularly and certainly did not get his money worth for any of them in my opinion. His best players were the players who were already at the club..

[2015]

Just now, Rob k said:

I think LJ has to get credit for coaching these players, we weren’t getting regular fees like we did for our players before he came and haven’t since. Cotta can’t take any credit for Reid either in my opinion 
 

Oh certainly, I'd agree with that, but I was pointing out LJ was pretty poor in the transfer market really. It was quite a scattergun approach. 

[2015]

Just now, lukebcfc1989 said:

Magnuson profit others purchased were used and contributed to some exciting but failed seasons IMO again not DISASTROUS as drama queens go on about 

I wouldn't have said it was exciting, aside from the first half of 17/18 season. Each to their own, LJ did a good job, but he left us with a lot of crap and should have made the playoffs in 18/19. We were good enough

[Rob k]

5 minutes ago, 2015 said:

Oh certainly, I'd agree with that, but I was pointing out LJ was pretty poor in the transfer market really. It was quite a scattergun approach. 

There were certainly signings made from those 2 i will never understand, Engvell, szmodics, aduken, eisa to name a few 

[GrahamC]

20 minutes ago, lukebcfc1989 said:

No your missing the point, Mo Elisa profit, Sammy Szmodics profit , Engval was sold for 1.5 m, Hegeler and Duric were short term fixes 

Dream on, we only got £200k for Engvall, source? Adam Baker.

As dud signings go he’s right up there, people continually take the piss out of Diony, but at least he was never our player & so fortunately we didn’t pay a fee for him.

As for the comment about “only signing ex-Leicester players” NP chose to offer Weimann a deal & to renegotiate with Baker after him being initially released, so that is simplistic.

Based on the games so far it is hard to think he’s wasted any money seeing where we found ourselves.

[Phileas Fogg]

Just now, GrahamC said:

Dream on, we only got £200k for Engvall, source? Adam Baker.

As dud signings go he’s right up there, people continually take the piss out of Diony, but at least he was never our player & so fortunately we didn’t pay a fee for him.

As for the comment about “only signing ex-Leicester players” NP chose to offer Weimann a deal & to renegotiate with Baker after him being initially released, so that is simplistic.

Based on the games so far it is hard to think he’s wasted any money seeing where we found ourselves.

I noticed also that King and James (admittedly didn’t check Simpson) featured regularly in Leicester’s championship promotion side. He obviously wanted players that know what it takes to be in a successful side to change the culture here.

All his signings thus far have made an impact. I appreciate there’s a time and a place for adding extra bodies to a squad, but this window wasn’t that time. He needed first team quality signings and he’s made them.

[2015]

8 minutes ago, Phileas Fogg said:

I noticed also that King and James (admittedly didn’t check Simpson) featured regularly in Leicester’s championship promotion side. He obviously wanted players that know what it takes to be in a successful side to change the culture here.

All his signings thus far have made an impact. I appreciate there’s a time and a place for adding extra bodies to a squad, but this window wasn’t that time. He needed first team quality signings and he’s made them.

I think the key takeaway I have taken from NP in the last few weeks is he will only play players he trusts will do a good job for him. He won't take many risks.

[Phileas Fogg]

Just now, 2015 said:

I think the key takeaway I have taken from NP in the last few weeks is he will only play players he trusts will do a good job for him. He won't take many risks.

I think once he has the spine of the squad he wants and he’s confident we’re competitive at Championship level he’ll then look to sign a few ‘game changers’ to get us to the next level.

In that Leicester squad he has Vardy and Mahrez but I can’t imagine him signing riskier players like that until he’s assured the nucleus of our squad is adequate.

[Fordy62]

1 minute ago, lukebcfc1989 said:

Kodjia, Magnuson I’m sure there are more

You said he turned a profit on every player he purchased. Now you’re coming up with loads he didn’t.  

[Phileas Fogg]

1 minute ago, lukebcfc1989 said:

Kodjia, Magnuson I’m sure there are more

If you’re going to make this argument you need to be 100% sure of your facts and have done more research. It can be proven wrong within about 30 seconds after a Google search.

I agree with the principle that Johnson wasn’t as bad as some think - but to make that point effectively you need to do more research.

[Davefevs]

46 minutes ago, Fordy62 said:

When you need to steady a sinking ship and you have no resources then you need to go with what you know. Who can blame him. 

You buy yourself a bit of time to analyse what you really need too.

44 minutes ago, DaveF said:

'Collecting' suggests they're being signed for the sake of it though. 

I’m just using League minutes, but so far his signings:

• James - 360 mins (100%)
• Atkinson - 360 mins (100%)
• King - 236 mins (66%)

plus:

• Weimann - 360 mins (100%)
• Simpson - 175 mins (49%)
• Baker - 193 mins (54%)

Total - 76% usage.

32 minutes ago, lukebcfc1989 said:

Hate to seem like im backing Johnson in every reply as I’m far from his biggest fan he bottled some key games, but I must speak what I believe to be facts, did Johnson not use regularly in 2 top 10 finishes or sell for a profit every player he purchased? I mean it wasn’t a disaster was it you’d think he destroyed the club the way some of you go on…get a grip.

We had some very memorable league and cup results in his tenure and had hope and something to play for at all times.

Perspective is a miss with most.

Here’s a list of every player signed permanently by Johnson from 16/17…I’ve not included 15/16 as it was only an emergency loan window by the time he signed.

18 minutes ago, lukebcfc1989 said:

No your missing the point, Mo Elisa profit, Sammy Szmodics profit , Engval was sold for 1.5 m, Hegeler and Duric were short term fixes 

Depends whether you factor in signing on fees, agent fees, wages, etc.

Ive not included loans, where there would’ve been loan fees, penalty clauses, wage contributions.

You can of course look at it simplistically (we’ve had this debate before) via net spend….and there were great deals, e.g. Webster, Brownhill and Bentley.  Engvall was not sold for £1.5m either.  Not sure Hegeler or Djuric were short term fixes.  Just because they didn’t work out doesn’t make that the signing strategy.

If you do want to look at net spend, then as it stands he’s £22m down on what he spent.  But of course he still has sellable assets in the players left, how much do you think we will get for:

Moore, O’Dowda, Baker, Bakinson, Weimann, Kalas, Massengo, Wells, Palmer, Dasilva, Bentley and Cundy?

Its a recruitment mixed bag, it’s not good, it’s not awful.  In financial terms, an inflationary market has saved his (LJ, MA and SL) arse with a few great deals.  Taylor, Hegeler, Lukic, Diedhiou, Walsh, Paterson, Hunt, Watkins, Adelakun and Nagy all arrived for fees and left for free.  That’s not adhering to a sustainable recruitment strategy.

I wish LJ had been reined in and solved problems on the training ground than by signing players.  SL and MA facilitated that….they should’ve been applying a hand-brake.