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O’Dowda


Henry

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8 minutes ago, And Its Smith said:

Looks like the new scapegoat is secured everyone. 

No, read countless posts…..several of us are saying he was very poor yesterday….but qualifying that others were  poor too and it was a poor team performance.  Most posters are trying to reason why a couple of you are trying to big up his performance yesterday.  Most of us recognise he did a couple of decent things, but the lack of work going back the other way far outweighed that.

What us your response to the bits he didn’t do well?  

It seems Nige agreed.

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Just now, Davefevs said:

No, read countless posts…..several of us are saying he was very poor yesterday….but qualifying that others were  poor too and it was a poor team performance.  Most posters are trying to reason why a couple of you are trying to big up his performance yesterday.  Most of us recognise he did a couple of decent things, but the lack of work going back the other way far outweighed that.

What us your response to the bits he didn’t do well?  

It seems Nige agreed.

A poor team performance and only one thread targeting an individual player. And the thread contains stuff like wishing he would ‘**** off’.  Classic scapegoating.  Not you, but many others. 

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Just now, And Its Smith said:

A poor team performance and only one thread targeting an individual player. And the thread contains stuff like wishing he would ‘**** off’.  Classic scapegoating.  Not you, but many others. 

Because fans don’t like a lack of effort.  Quite simple.

This team has won fans back a bit this season with its commitment and work ethic, even if not great football.  And yesterday we had a player who didn’t do that basic requirement.  I’d say Pring didn’t either, both didn’t work anywhere near hard enough to cause their opponents an uncomfortable afternoon.

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5 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Because fans don’t like a lack of effort.  Quite simple.

This team has won fans back a bit this season with its commitment and work ethic, even if not great football.  And yesterday we had a player who didn’t do that basic requirement.  I’d say Pring didn’t either, both didn’t work anywhere near hard enough to cause their opponents an uncomfortable afternoon.

For a lot of fans I think it goes back to the contract business.

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I've always said that O'Dowda has ability and i'll stick by that.

This is one of the most offensively inept City teams i have ever seen and has been for the past couple of seasons. It ranks closely to the Russell Osman side of the early 90's when we had the likes of Liam Robinson and Ian Baird upfront. I appreciate we have managed to score goals away from home but we never look convincing and generally they are created by endeavor rather than free flowing inventive play.

If O'Dowda was to move to Forest, Swansea, Sheff Utd etc i think you'd see a different player. Having just seen Pato score a worldie for Swansea he is another player that is technically superior to anything we have left now.

I'll await the "you're talking rubbish" replies, but i'm going to stick with my opinion on this one.

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1 hour ago, Davefevs said:

Because fans don’t like a lack of effort.  Quite simple.

This team has won fans back a bit this season with its commitment and work ethic, even if not great football.  And yesterday we had a player who didn’t do that basic requirement.  I’d say Pring didn’t either, both didn’t work anywhere near hard enough to cause their opponents an uncomfortable afternoon.

I agree. If you can’t outplay the opposition then don’t make it easy for them. Bournemouth won’t have an easier game than yesterday and that is embarrassing on our part, and unacceptable. 

Will be interesting to see who is picked on a Tuesday. I am expecting CoD to keep his place on the pure fact that we have nobody else. Either that or he will be suffering from that knock he took and ruled out. 

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1 minute ago, RedM said:

I agree. If you can’t outplay the opposition then don’t make it easy for them. Bournemouth won’t have an easier game than yesterday and that is embarrassing on our part, and unacceptable. 

Will be interesting to see who is picked on a Tuesday. I am expecting CoD to keep his place on the pure fact that we have nobody else. Either that or he will be suffering from that knock he took and ruled out. 

No injury reported by Nige, wanted to change system and personnel.

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1 hour ago, petehinton said:

Has averaged 0.06 goals and 0.07 assists per 90 minutes over his time here. You read that right. 

Absolutely shocking statistics.  I cannot believe that people stick up for him so strongly.  He’s a symptom of our performances over the last few years - weak.  Hopefully someone will come in for him in January, but cannot see who would.  Maybe over the bridge at Cardiff or Swansea as they seem to like having our ex players. 

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2 hours ago, petehinton said:

Has averaged 0.06 goals and 0.07 assists per 90 minutes over his time here. You read that right. 

This is the legacy of the “clubs in the bag” mantra adopted by both Johnson’s. Instead of appreciating good player’s who consistently do it on a Saturday and Tuesday supporters seem content with players who do something brilliant every now and again and flatter to deceive the rest of the time. O’Dowda is a perfect example and his stats are cast iron proof of his overall level of ability at our level.

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Think in general the issue is that we're very reliant on a ball playing centre half to play us up the pitch to create an overload. We have too many players who simply cannot carry the ball up the pitch reliably - O'Dowda is one of the only few that can.

Wells, Martin Weimann, James - none of them are going to beat a man. 

The second we started the game without Atkinson added to Williams getting injured, with no Massengo available as cover, it was game over. Shame Nagy left as with Massengo and Williams injured he'd be the perfect player to replace or play alongside but that ship has long sailed - issue is nobody else aside from those two really has the legs to cover the same ground.

'Muff were likely the best team I've seen down AG since Norwich, easily. Very organised, physical, fast, and great interchange down the channels each time they came forward to isolate our full back and get a run our centre backs.

Either way, major aim for January looks to be getting a winger and forward in, whether that's loan etc.

Do we know what's happening with Sam Pearson?

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A player who is made for a certain style of play and system. I would suggest he would suit the current Swansea manager and team for instance.

When we have been in good form, winning games and playing on the front foot he can look unplayable but in our current state with the current coaching, tactics and manager, he is wasted, ineffective and often exposed as a weak link defensively.

Should be nowhere near the First team under this regime.

 

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3 hours ago, And Its Smith said:

A poor team performance and only one thread targeting an individual player. And the thread contains stuff like wishing he would ‘**** off’.  Classic scapegoating.  Not you, but many others. 

Not sure about scapegoating, but lots of balanced views as to why he was pulled at Half Time. Only one person knows the real answer and I would guess it was because he wasn't doing the job that NP asked him to do. The same thing happened to Vyner and he hasnt been seen since.

NP is on record as saying that if players do their own thing and don't follow their game instructions then they won't be playing.

 

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Problem is Jon, is that I’m not using Weimann’s position for one flick to justify Weimann’s match performance v Peterborough.  Weimann’s performance wasn’t the feature of my “the little things”, so you’re taking that completely out of context.  The feature was how we attacked in numbers….not trying to find one-off things to justify an opinion on a player.

I don’t really have any allegiance to any players, i call out Weimann for poor performances likes anyone else….in fact the other week I said I thought he had one of his worst (if not the worst) in a City shirt.  I think some players are better than others, but I evaluate agnostic of this.

I don’t see why you necessarily need to bring another player into the argument really.  You keep picking out one-off bad things for example in a game 2 months ago (credit to your memory ??) to justify player x being worse at something than O’Dowda, in the same way you focus on odd things he does to justify he’s better than player y at something else.

Why does the ball from O’Dowda to James have to be James fault?  Can it neither - just one of those things, can it be shared responsibility?  Could he have just held onto the ball?

Most of my posts on this thread are about his overall performance yesterday, which seem to align to most people’s that it was poor, a couple of bright spots outweighed by numerous not very good moments….and part of a poor left side team effort in the first half.  It’s not a general review of his career so far / ability, or something he did last week, last month, last year.

Overall, Callum is an okay player at this level in this team.  He should be a consistent member of the 18 man squad.

I thought quite a few players were poor yesterday, and only Kalas and Baker of the outfield starters came through the game with real credit.  Tanner stuck to his task admirably and improved as the game went on, but Williams aside as he went off after 15 minutes, everyone else was below par.  James was awful first half, remedied it a bit second half through sheer effort.

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35 minutes ago, VT05763 said:

A player who is made for a certain style of play and system. I would suggest he would suit the current Swansea manager and team for instance.

When we have been in good form, winning games and playing on the front foot he can look unplayable but in our current state with the current coaching, tactics and manager, he is wasted, ineffective and often exposed as a weak link defensively.

Should be nowhere near the First team under this regime.

 

Have a look at his career record. What has he actually produced under ANY regime?

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1 minute ago, Numero Uno said:

Yes, he was for a while, but the question still remains. What has he actually PRODUCED that wins football matches?

I agree with you, not his biggest fan and he wouldn't be a signing of mine BUT put him in the right side with the correct type of manager he could be a very decent player. He does not and will not ever fit into a NP type of team or system and therefore (IMO) should not be in the squad let alone the team.

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1 hour ago, Sir Geoff said:

Not sure about scapegoating, but lots of balanced views as to why he was pulled at Half Time. Only one person knows the real answer and I would guess it was because he wasn't doing the job that NP asked him to do. The same thing happened to Vyner and he hasnt been seen since.

NP is on record as saying that if players do their own thing and don't follow their game instructions then they won't be playing.

 

He was pulled off because the shape was wasn't working. Although he still got rated a 7 in today's press which was the top nark for a City player (alongside Dan B)  compared to King  & Martin who stayed on the pitch and only rated a 4.

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11 minutes ago, E.G.Red said:

He was pulled off because the shape was wasn't working. Although he still got rated a 7 in today's press which was the top nark for a City player (alongside Dan B)  compared to King  & Martin who stayed on the pitch and only rated a 4.

Clearly the person doing the ratings in the press only watched the ball. O’Dowda could easily have been accommodated in our change of shape if the management thought he was playing well and doing his job. I’ll stick to what I saw not what a journo reckons. Anyway, 7 goals in 141 appearances or TWO goals per season if you like from an “attacking” player is a reasonable indicator of his overall contribution to Bristol City.

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23 minutes ago, VT05763 said:

I agree with you, not his biggest fan and he wouldn't be a signing of mine BUT put him in the right side with the correct type of manager he could be a very decent player. He does not and will not ever fit into a NP type of team or system and therefore (IMO) should not be in the squad let alone the team.

It’s all ifs and buts though. He’s had 3 different managers to find a system that suits him and none of them have been able to do it. The common denominator is COD.

I don’t really know what his strengths are, aside from occasional flashes there’s not been a whole lot to shout about from his performances throughout his time here.

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9 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

That wasn't a video to justify O'Dowda having what I'd call a 6 out of 10 performance. Just thought it was a class pass on the volley. A bit like when we used to see the odd Pato clip or when I made that Tanner tackle clip that was an impressive bit of play.

The Weimann comments is because I disagree slightly on how you evaluate him but that's just a different opinion, a bit like how we see O'Dowda a bit differently but that's all fine. Sure we generally agree on quite a number of others. I much more share your point of view on Bakinson now for example, having been very hopeful after the occasional good performance last season. Not suited to how we play at all.

The pass to James was fine imo and James was too slow to get on to it. In fact he didn't really move. Maybe a 'man on' was needed. But it was a bit like that all game in that midfield. I thought that was a mistake but the main mistake then was the team not dealing with their break and cross in the box.

Going back to Weimann I actually thought he was more effective 2nd half in general, much more involved and his quick releasing of the ball and constant pressing suited the team much more.

Agree James was poor and King really struggled and looked way off the pace. Tactically I think Pearson got it wrong, but I wouldn't say there was an obvious thing he should have done that would beat Bournemouth as they're so good, but Peterborough showed it is possible to get a point and they're one of the lower teams in the division. No doubt some other managers would have taken a very different approach that may have worked.

2 of the subs made no sense to me at all, and that's not the O'Dowda one which I did at least understand.

Agree Kalas was brilliant as usual, Baker was a pretty solid performance. Although I think centre mid is a strong position when everyone is fit, we look like we can depend most on whichever 2 play at the back at the moment. Really need Massengo back mid week. Dasilva surely has a good chance of starting too after a pretty decent performance.

Ta. Healthy debate.  Can’t agree on all things.  We Keep it civil(ish) though….I think

The positives (there weren’t many) for me Saturday was in confirming the status of a couple of players.

Bakinson - pretty much played himself out of contention

Dasilva - showing he’s really getting back on form after injury issues last 2 seasons.  A little ankle turn v QPR is gonna happen.

Re Jay, that means we now have options down the left with Pring and O’Dowda, and even Baker at LB where horses for courses is required.

I’d like Antoine back fit too, Saturday showed that we missed some power and pace, even if it’s a bit uncontrolled / raw.  I still think he could be a threat starting down the middle, but with license to roam.  Need to pair him with someone though.  I think the last time he played there was v Reading away last season where him and Fam looked like they had no idea how to play together.  Not sure it will happen, but I’d like to see it.

Right midfield is more of a prob now Williams injured, but we should be able to get a tune out of Palmer or Scott there if required.  Palmer could play that role  narrow too.

Think we will see Atkinson back tomorrow, if Massengo isn’t then I think Vyner will partner James.  I can think of worse options.

Would rest one of Weimann or Martin tomorrow night.

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