Cool colours yeh

[Always Believesham]

Thank you to anyone that's helped bring this to the attention of people that matter.

I am colourblind, red-green and have had more trouble with watching games on TV - but it did get worse on Saturday for me as the game wore on. I don't know if that was because the ball spent more time in the air or if there was less natural light.

Personally I wouldn't have known how to raise it or whether it mattered to anyone that this was a problem.

Ultimately the referee should have the final say, if Bournemouth had forgotten their kit and we'd pulled a snazzy white number out of lost property for them to wear, that would not have been approved weeks in advance & probably wouldn't have been an issue (I'm sure someone quite famously won a game in their opposition's youth team strip?!). They should be able to override the decisions on the kit.

Another thing, remember all the threats from the league that went to Huddersfield after they unveiled their Paddy Power kit? Where's that energy when it comes to some folks not being able to follow the match?

[The Constant Rabbit]

On 17/10/2021 at 17:57, GTFABM said:

Do all people affected with colour blindness have the same colour clashes? 

No, but it is worth noting in some countries it is actually regarded as a genuine disability.

It certainly precludes you from becoming an electrician, plumber, pilot, Police Officer, Armed forces, train / bus driver amongst many many professions. Indeed anything that relies on any form of colour coding.

Some games are unwatchable for the colour blind.

[ExiledAjax]

10 hours ago, Steve Watts said:

The issue I have with this comment is that the Bournemouth players had to deal with this as well but seemed to get on just fine.  It would be slightly odd for our players to therefore be affected (unless they do suffer colour blindness) and Bournemouth's to not be affected. 

The affect on players is a subtly different one to the affect on fans. I know that if a player does suffer then he/she may have their own reasons for not "coming out" (to borrow a phrase). Public knowledge of a genetic defect such as colourblindness could, for fairly obvious reasons, have a negative affect on a players' career. On the recent episode of the Price of Football podcast, the CEO of Colourblind Awareness said that she had spoken to a couple of players who had privately admitted this to her. 

For what it is worth I personally suspect that the difficulties of playing football with colourblindness (of which I have experience) naturally filters people with the condition off of the pitch. Some will have enough talent to enable them to compromise and "make do", but most will find that the extra split second they need to recognise players or officials is enough to be detrimental to the point that they do not make it. Just my theory, but plausible I think.

7 hours ago, Always Believesham said:

Personally I wouldn't have known how to raise it or whether it mattered to anyone that this was a problem.

Please email the SC&T to add your experiences to their body of evidence. 

info@bristolcitysupporters.org>

6 hours ago, The Constant Rabbit said:

No, but it is worth noting in some countries it is actually regarded as a genuine disability.

It certainly precludes you from becoming an electrician, plumber, pilot, Police Officer, Armed forces, train / bus driver amongst many many professions. Indeed anything that relies on any form of colour coding.

Is it truly classed as a disability in some places? I hadn't heard that. Whereabouts?

It does preclude some careers, but many have become more accommodating. Electrical wiring switched from brown to the green/yellow earth wire because of colourblindenss, and I believe the RAF softened their eye test a little in recent years thanks to some lobbying and improvements in the colours used in cockpits. I'd still never sign up for the bomb disposal squad though!

13 hours ago, Keepers Ball said:

Clubs can choose whatever colour scheme they want. Jesus

You'd be happy for Forest to wear their home kit tonight then?

[1960maaan]

11 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

Please email the SC&T to add your experiences to their body of evidence. 

I emailed last night, sounds like a few have. 
One thing, I sent the link below. Seems although there was an international awareness day, it was so poorly advertised no one seems aware. Certainly didn't see a follow up this year. 

https://www.tacbis.eu/news/uefa-nations-league-matches-promote-colour-blind-awareness-day-2020/

[Davefevs]

2 hours ago, 1960maaan said:

I emailed last night, sounds like a few have. 
One thing, I sent the link below. Seems although there was an international awareness day, it was so poorly advertised no one seems aware. Certainly didn't see a follow up this year. 

https://www.tacbis.eu/news/uefa-nations-league-matches-promote-colour-blind-awareness-day-2020/

Problem was the billboard poster was green words on a red background.

[BasSavage88]

 

 

 

[MarcusX]

12 hours ago, Enter Sandman said:

Seen a load more kit clashes this year than ever before. Clearly the league aren’t as bothered as they used to be. 
worst one I saw was Scunthorpe against Exeter - see this :

 

 

 

Eww that's two horrible kits as well.

My current team wear Green and Yellow stripes, not too bad but the ref allowed the other team to wear all green kit because ours was slightly more yellow than green. It was so bad trying to pick out a player in your peripheral so you could pass first time or marking etc.

like others I'd not really considered colourblindness and the effects it might have but the greyscale photo on this thread really highlights it

16 hours ago, Keepers Ball said:

Clubs can choose whatever colour scheme they want. Jesus

I never understand what drives a person to come on a thread like this and make such a comment. Clearly there is an issue here for a significant amount of people so it's worth discussing and improving.

I'm sure you wouldn't go on a post about someone with a "physical" (maybe visible is a better word) disability and make such a comment.

[ExiledAjax]

40 minutes ago, BasSavage88 said:

 

 

 

Excellent. 

[City oz]

13 hours ago, Enter Sandman said:

Seen a load more kit clashes this year than ever before. Clearly the league aren’t as bothered as they used to be. 
worst one I saw was Scunthorpe against Exeter - see this :

 

 

 

I just had two beers and 3 reds. This looks good to me. I never new Exeter ever scored four goals in one match

[Hamdon Mart]

On 18/10/2021 at 13:50, ExiledAjax said:

@Hamdon Mart very interesting to hear from someone that works in the industry and is directly affected. I've had some minor issues in my own job but I've not heard from someone in football before.

Do your employers know about the issues? Do you know any colleagues that sometimes struggle? Is it something you'd even feel comfortable admitting to your employer? Ever had it mentioned by a player? Honestly I've got so many questions for you - please answer only those you are comfortable with, and of course DM if you don't want to answer on this thread.

Have you had to deal with Man Utd's away kit this season? Dreadful thing. Can't imagine the sponsor is happy that their logo fades into the shirt for about 9% of the population!

@Davefevs I think the American sports have it sorted as those leagues were created in the era of black and white TV as a TV product. In greyscale you have to have light v dark. Just look at the greyscale version of Wales v Ireland in @1960maaan's post above to see why green v red doesn't work. This was a decision driven by TV, and the side effect is that it's also pretty reliably good for those with colourblindness. 

EA, have not long got back from the match and have a 6am start tomorrow so wll compose a longer reply tomorrow if that's okay.

We were talking about this in the press room tonight, not spcifically the red/green issue but more the numbers being unreadable at certain clubs. I think Saturday's problem with the numbers got worse as the game went on; as the players were sweating, their dark green shirts got darker still and the numbers then almost disappeared in some cases.

I doubt very much I have any influence in getting anything done, I'm only an in-stadium analyst but I will mention it and see if anyone else has reported similar. FWIW, I watched EFL on Quest this morning and think I spotted at least three other green/red matches too; there may not be many teams that have a green first kit but there are more than a few that have a grreen 2nd/3rd kit.

[ExiledAjax]

7 hours ago, Hamdon Mart said:

EA, have not long got back from the match and have a 6am start tomorrow so wll compose a longer reply tomorrow if that's okay.

We were talking about this in the press room tonight, not spcifically the red/green issue but more the numbers being unreadable at certain clubs. I think Saturday's problem with the numbers got worse as the game went on; as the players were sweating, their dark green shirts got darker still and the numbers then almost disappeared in some cases.

I doubt very much I have any influence in getting anything done, I'm only an in-stadium analyst but I will mention it and see if anyone else has reported similar. FWIW, I watched EFL on Quest this morning and think I spotted at least three other green/red matches too; there may not be many teams that have a green first kit but there are more than a few that have a grreen 2nd/3rd kit.

No worries mate.

I sat at pitch level last night, right down in row 2. Had no issues at all seeing the Forest players as that kit would work in place of the floodlights. From a colourblind perspective last night should have been fine for most people.

But picking out our players against the red seats and crowd of the other three stands was trickier, especially as the rain darkened the red to near black.

Now, that's not a colourblind issue, that's just an issue caused by having your seats the same colour as your shirts. Silly, but neither home kit colour nor seat colour is changing in a hurry.

[Welcome To The Jungle]

I always trivialised colour blindness as someone not afflicted, until I listened to the price of football podcast a month or two ago that was dedicated to it. I'm a pretty hard lined traditionalist when it come to sport. For example, I've watched hundreds of Bristol Rugby matches, but never once been to the Bristol Bears, which I see as franchise nonsense that has no place in British sport. 

However, I pretty much instantly was on board with us wearing the best colour we can, home and away to aid those with red-green (the most common kind) colour blindness, through a combination of patterns and colour choices. If that means we don't wear red at home, so be it. I'd rather the club was inclusive than traditional.

[ExiledAjax]

57 minutes ago, Welcome To The Jungle said:

I always trivialised colour blindness as someone not afflicted, until I listened to the price of football podcast a month or two ago that was dedicated to it. I'm a pretty hard lined traditionalist when it come to sport. For example, I've watched hundreds of Bristol Rugby matches, but never once been to the Bristol Bears, which I see as franchise nonsense that has no place in British sport. 

However, I pretty much instantly was on board with us wearing the best colour we can, home and away to aid those with red-green (the most common kind) colour blindness, through a combination of patterns and colour choices. If that means we don't wear red at home, so be it. I'd rather the club was inclusive than traditional.

Thank you very much. If you feel like it then please email your thoughts to the SC&T. They'd be delighted to hear from you.

[Lanterne Rouge]

I see Bournemouth wore that kit at Stoke last night - fair enough though given Stoke`s home kit I suppose.

[ExiledAjax]

1 hour ago, Lanterne Rouge said:

I see Bournemouth wore that kit at Stoke last night - fair enough though given Stoke`s home kit I suppose.

Yeh from a Kit v Kit perspective this is fine. Bournemouth still blend into the pitch though, and the numbers are hard to distinguish on either kit.

[Lanterne Rouge]

10 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

Yeh from a Kit v Kit perspective this is fine. Bournemouth still blend into the pitch though, and the numbers are hard to distinguish on either kit.

Oh I agree, it`s just a crap choice for a third kit. With their home kit red and away white they`ll always have to wear it when a side has red and white stripes but they could certainly have picked something else. 

Even without the issues you have it just looks bloody horrible!

[Hamdon Mart]

On 20/10/2021 at 06:33, ExiledAjax said:

No worries mate.

I sat at pitch level last night, right down in row 2. Had no issues at all seeing the Forest players as that kit would work in place of the floodlights. From a colourblind perspective last night should have been fine for most people.

But picking out our players against the red seats and crowd of the other three stands was trickier, especially as the rain darkened the red to near black.

Now, that's not a colourblind issue, that's just an issue caused by having your seats the same colour as your shirts. Silly, but neither home kit colour nor seat colour is changing in a hurry.

Upon reading this again with more awake eyes, I can't really add too much more to what I typed the other night. I will send in some feedback to my immediate bosses but how much weight they carry in an area that is quite commercially sensitive is questionable. They are able to get me moved to a better position to collect data during the game but getting a club to change kit is a whole lot more difficult, I assume. 

The talk in the press room on Tuesday night was about the difficulties faced by all of us with the AFCB kit. In the room were analysts, journalists, the ball tracking guys, commentators, club media and summarisers so a wide range of people and from my admittedly small "survey", everyone had the same problems with player identification. We as Opta analysts are trained to look for other attributes in players in order to make positive identifications of players such as hair style/colour, boot colour etc which is going to be little or no help with the colour blindness issue of course.

At the end of the day, it boils down to the fact that all supporters have the right to enjoy watching the game (even if there's two goals for the opposition in stoppage time!). 

[TBW]

On 18/10/2021 at 11:50, Davefevs said:

Yes, agree….the back of shirts should contain a single colour panel with a contrasting colour number

You've been watching too much rugby, Dave!

17 hours ago, Lanterne Rouge said:

I see Bournemouth wore that kit at Stoke last night - fair enough though given Stoke`s home kit I suppose.

Personally think stripes should be gotten rid of too in favour of an obviously dominant colour. Pinstripes fine but regular stripes are ugly and always make numbers difficult to identify... and cause away teams more issues in picking out a kit that doesn't clash as per this game and being forced to not wear white.

[ExiledAjax]

2 hours ago, Hamdon Mart said:

Upon reading this again with more awake eyes, I can't really add too much more to what I typed the other night. I will send in some feedback to my immediate bosses but how much weight they carry in an area that is quite commercially sensitive is questionable. They are able to get me moved to a better position to collect data during the game but getting a club to change kit is a whole lot more difficult, I assume. 

Of course, I understand that you aren't the CEO of Opta. Honestly, I am not necessarily looking to get any club or team to change their kit. I think we can eradicate 99% of issues in this season and in future by simply making sure that every team has proper away and third kits that they then use at appropriate times. Had Bournemouth used their white away kit in our match you and your colleagues in the press box would have been better off. 

The talk in the press room on Tuesday night was about the difficulties faced by all of us with the AFCB kit. In the room were analysts, journalists, the ball tracking guys, commentators, club media and summarisers so a wide range of people and from my admittedly small "survey", everyone had the same problems with player identification. We as Opta analysts are trained to look for other attributes in players in order to make positive identifications of players such as hair style/colour, boot colour etc which is going to be little or no help with the colour blindness issue of course.

If it takes a kit like Bournemouth's green 3rd kit to get everyone talking about the issue then so be it. I know the Post are looking to do a piece on this subject so there is some traction happening.

At the end of the day, it boils down to the fact that all supporters have the right to enjoy watching the game (even if there's two goals for the opposition in stoppage time!). 

We have to keep talking about it.

Look at this from Boro v Barnsley last night. Again, Barnsley have a white third kit this season, and Boro have a white away kit. This Red v Green match up could have been so easily avoided. Our game v Barnsley in 9 days time has serious potential to look like this one if Barnsley do not wear their white alternative. If you can add your voice in any way to make sure they do that, we'd all appreciate it.

Barnsley's third kit.

@NIGHTMARE has there been any discussion amongst the Barnsley fanbase regarding your green kit and people struggling to distinguish it?

Edited October 21, 2021 by ExiledAjax

[GreedyHarry]

4 hours ago, ExiledAjax said:

We have to keep talking about it.

Look at this from Boro v Barnsley last night. Again, Barnsley have a white third kit this season, and Boro have a white away kit. This Red v Green match up could have been so easily avoided. Our game v Barnsley in 9 days time has serious potential to look like this one if Barnsley do not wear their white alternative. If you can add your voice in any way to make sure they do that, we'd all appreciate it.

Barnsley's third kit.

@NIGHTMARE has there been any discussion amongst the Barnsley fanbase regarding your green kit and people struggling to distinguish it?

If Barnsley do agree, and I hope they are asked, wouldn’t it be great if both clubs issued a joint statement prior to explain why Barnsley wore their 3rd kit. It might start fans of other clubs talking more loudly about the issue.

[ExiledAjax]

5 minutes ago, GreedyHarry said:

If Barnsley do agree, and I hope they are asked, wouldn’t it be great if both clubs issued a joint statement prior to explain why Barnsley wore their 3rd kit. It might start fans of other clubs talking more loudly about the issue.

Absolutely. The club(s) could both generate some good PR and goodwill from such an event. Huddersfield did so earlier after comments made regarding the kits used in their opening day match.

Honestly, if we ask them to wear white and they refuse, I'd like us to make a statement on that as well. Possibly we do that by wearing Purple at home - and then explain why we are doing such and odd thing.

[Hamdon Mart]

8 hours ago, ExiledAjax said:

We have to keep talking about it.

Look at this from Boro v Barnsley last night. Again, Barnsley have a white third kit this season, and Boro have a white away kit. This Red v Green match up could have been so easily avoided. Our game v Barnsley in 9 days time has serious potential to look like this one if Barnsley do not wear their white alternative. If you can add your voice in any way to make sure they do that, we'd all appreciate it.

Barnsley's third kit.

@NIGHTMARE has there been any discussion amongst the Barnsley fanbase regarding your green kit and people struggling to distinguish it?

Sorry, EA, when I said about getting teams to "change" their kit, I meant change as in which one they play other teams in on a set day to avoid this red/green confrontation. That, fed through the right channels in the right way, should be achievable. 

[ExiledAjax]

Checking on Barnsley's kit plans for tomorrow. Nothing confirmed but from this tweet it looks like they're planning on wearing their green (I think it's green)* away kit. This is stupid.

*Yes, confirmed as green on their website - I thought it might be brown - but the press release from launch says "Our PUMA shirt features red and white pin stripes on a deep green backing, complemented by a monocoloured white crest and white ‘The Investment Room’ branding. The kit will be completed with matching green shorts and socks." 

Also, they can keep the green shorts and socks and just wear the white shirt. That avoids a blend with our white shorts. Far from perfect but honestly the decision (if made) to wear an all green kit away to a team in red is absolutely, unequivocally, ******* shambolic.

I don't actually use Twitter - I can see this tweet but don't have an account. Could anyone that uses Twitter possibly reply to the tweet linked here? Maybe copy in Bristol City and just mention that wearing the green away kit will be terrible for colourblind fans. If you can copy in Kieran Maguire, the Colourblind Awareness Org, Scott Murray etc as ell that might possibly help.

I'll be emailing the SC&T as well.

Either Barnsley need to switch to their white third kit, or we should roll out the purple kit at home and use the questions that come from that to highlight the issue and show how mad it is for teams with green kits to wear them at the home stadium of a team with red.

Should the picture above prove indicative only I reserve my right to continue complaining about it anyway. No one should have an all green kit.

@Hamdon Mart @Davefevs @GreedyHarry @1960maaan

Edited October 29, 2021 by ExiledAjax

[stortfordred]

Yes. Madness!

 

Let's get Scotty to put the purple out if nothing is done!!!

[Davefevs]

 

[GreedyHarry]

34 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

Checking on Barnsley's kit plans for tomorrow. Nothing confirmed but from this tweet it looks like they're planning on wearing their green (I think it's green)* away kit. This is stupid.

*Yes, confirmed as green on their website - I thought it might be brown - but the press release from launch says "Our PUMA shirt features red and white pin stripes on a deep green backing, complemented by a monocoloured white crest and white ‘The Investment Room’ branding. The kit will be completed with matching green shorts and socks." 

Also, they can keep the green shorts and socks and just wear the white shirt. That avoids a blend with our white shorts. Far from perfect but honestly the decision (if made) to wear an all green kit away to a team in red is absolutely, unequivocally, ******* shambolic.

I don't actually use Twitter - I can see this tweet but don't have an account. Could anyone that uses Twitter possibly reply to the tweet linked here? Maybe copy in Bristol City and just mention that wearing the green away kit will be terrible for colourblind fans. If you can copy in Kieran Maguire, the Colourblind Awareness Org, Scott Murray etc as ell that might possibly help.

I'll be emailing the SC&T as well.

Either Barnsley need to switch to their white third kit, or we should roll out the purple kit at home and use the questions that come from that to highlight the issue and show how mad it is for teams with green kits to wear them at the home stadium of a team with red.

Should the picture above prove indicative only I reserve my right to continue complaining about it anyway. No one should have an all green kit.

@Hamdon Mart @Davefevs @GreedyHarry @1960maaan

Ah, I’m not on Twitter but that photograph if correct means I have another match where it’s very difficult to differentiate. 
I’ll email the Supporters Club & Trust though as I have to do something.

[ExiledAjax]

8 minutes ago, stortfordred said:

Yes. Madness!

 

Let's get Scotty to put the purple out if nothing is done!!!

It would be wild, but I'd love it if we did go purple, and put a massive message up on the screens, get Downsy mentioning it on RobinsTV,and a press release explaining why. It would get attention. I appreciate it's not traditional, but for one game it would make a scene.

If you've got twitter please copy Fevs' tweet. If not then an email to the SC&T is about as much as we can do on less than 24 hours' notice I think. info@bristolcitysupporters.org

[GreedyHarry]

Just found the electronic programme in my email and it looks like 1 in 12 of us are in for a difficult afternoon

Edited October 29, 2021 by GreedyHarry

[ExiledAjax]

3 minutes ago, GreedyHarry said:

Just found the electronic programme in my email and it looks like 1 in 12 of us are in for a difficult afternoon

I love spending 90 minutes staring at men's thighs in an attempt to distinguish the shorts. 

[GreedyHarry]

I know it’s not as powerful as Twitter but I’ve just put it on my Instagram account. And not sure if I’ve done the @ and # things properly either but it’s worth a try.

Edited October 29, 2021 by GreedyHarry