The Pearson Debate - Something Not Mentioned Yet…

[Davefevs]

42 minutes ago, stortfordred said:

Was he involved in signing Elijah Adebayo? Guy had loan spells with Swindon and Cheltenham, has a 1 goal in 2 game ratio this season and looks a real handful. Just the kind of player our recruitment team should have spotted.

 

I don’t know. We didn’t discuss players, was more about how an “outsider” handles the fairly closed shop world of pro football, How they converse etc. 

[Davefevs]

1 minute ago, Harry said:

And my point is exactly this. We probably have plenty of fans across the country who might get to National League/other games when they can’t make it to City. Why shouldn’t we have a fan be able to enter a Chesterfield fixture under an official scout badge and write a full report on the chap. We need to expand the scouting network. What better than having fans, with a huge personal interest in our clubs well-being, to be out there providing reports at zero cost to the club. You personally should be encouraged to go to the next Chesterfield match and report on this lad. 
There should be a facility for you to be able to contact our Head of Recruitment and say “I’m going to the Torquay Chesterfield match on Saturday, I’ll provide a report on Tshimanga”. 

I’m sure you could provide a template to fill in, showing the things they want to know. 

[The Original OTIB]

3 minutes ago, Harry said:

And my point is exactly this. We probably have plenty of fans across the country who might get to National League/other games when they can’t make it to City. Why shouldn’t we have a fan be able to enter a Chesterfield fixture under an official scout badge and write a full report on the chap. We need to expand the scouting network. What better than having fans, with a huge personal interest in our clubs well-being, to be out there providing reports at zero cost to the club. You personally should be encouraged to go to the next Chesterfield match and report on this lad. 
There should be a facility for you to be able to contact our Head of Recruitment and say “I’m going to the Torquay Chesterfield match on Saturday, I’ll provide a report on Tshimanga”. 

Boreham Wood was local, but the point remains valid.

[Davefevs]

This is something I picked up from a Dutch Football Analyst re opposition. Scouting.

[The Original OTIB]

9 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

This is something I picked up from a Dutch Football Analyst re opposition. Scouting.

Someone will bring up Lee Miller as a negative... actually, I just did.

[marmite]

Fascinating thread this. Thanks Harry.

[mozo]

38 minutes ago, Harry said:

And my point is exactly this. We probably have plenty of fans across the country who might get to National League/other games when they can’t make it to City. Why shouldn’t we have a fan be able to enter a Chesterfield fixture under an official scout badge and write a full report on the chap. We need to expand the scouting network. What better than having fans, with a huge personal interest in our clubs well-being, to be out there providing reports at zero cost to the club. You personally should be encouraged to go to the next Chesterfield match and report on this lad. 
There should be a facility for you to be able to contact our Head of Recruitment and say “I’m going to the Torquay Chesterfield match on Saturday, I’ll provide a report on Tshimanga”. 

Does that happen Harry?

I used to work with a bloke who watched games for Rotherham in his spare time. I suppose that makes him an actual scout but he didn't know any more about football than me as far as I was aware and certainly wasn't much of a 5-aside player!

I never understood how he ended up doing it.

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Harry said:

No emotional baggage here mr finker. 
The article you linked is the article to which I referred in my opening post. So I’ve not attempted to hide anything. 
I have no chip on my shoulder at all. I’m simply extremely concerned that one of the most important roles at a pro football club is being run by amateurs. 
As for the agents I refer to; it’s not a small selection with minor clients. These are worldwide agencies, hugely respected. I know from personal conversations that our current set up is viewed as a laughing stock. It has to change. Immediately. 
 

I get it - Mr Gilhespy must be a friend of yours. That’s fine. And good on you for defending him. I have no doubts, as I said in my post, that he’s a nice chap and a competent data analyst. But do you really think he should be in charge of player recruitment for a club with Premier League ambition?? Be honest. 

There are two Post articles about this fella Gilhespy:
https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/unseen-figure-heart-bristol-citys-5409108 - dated May 2021
https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/inside-bristol-citys-recruitment-team-6030875 - dated October 2021
So you seem to be saying that you based your OP on the most recent October article (a couple weeks ago), but scratch the surface of the OP, it very much points to the May article.

For example, you say that your 'agent friends' have been contacting Gilhespy (the first article says that Gilhespy is the point of contact), however other sources like KITR are adamant that it is actually Gould who is the fella who deals with agents (you've gone as far as saying that Gould is a liar if he's said he has been dealing with agents - it couldn't possibly be that you're the one who is wrong). Either your 'agent friends' don't have their finger on the pulse and they are doing their clients a disservice by being their agents, or I suppose there could be a faint whiff of BS in your OP? Maybe that's the reason for not 'returning calls'?

You've indicated that the recruitment seems to consist of only analysts (in-line with the general content of the first Post article) but looking at the October article, it is clear that recruitment is a lot more involved than your meandering OP and involves more than just analysts.

The crux of your OP is that there is no head of recruitment, something identified in the first Post article:
"Bristol City are also weighing up bringing in more senior help, however. And a final decision is yet to be made on whether to bring in a new head of recruitment or director of football, alongside the new CEO, with talks underway on who may replace Ashton."
So are you regurgitating a potential problem that the Post identified in May or are you indicating that you independently identified this problem after the Post identified 5 months ago? If it's the later, maybe your powers of deduction need a recalibration?

Your pet show pony 'Mark Ashton' even gets a special mention:
"The recruitment team basically consisted of Ashton and…..ummmm, no one else."
Something that is demonstrated as being false in the Post articles.

I'll let you kid yourself that there is no 'emotional baggage' or that you don't have a 'chip on your shoulder'

This is an open board and on occasion, it is fair to check if an opinion, masquerading as fact, stands up to scrutiny. Maybe this is the reason for your petty barb in the reply, and I'm disappointed you couldn't do better (if only you could put as much effort into your barbs as you do your diatribes). But maybe a good indicator that I've gotten under your skin.

[And Its Smith]

47 minutes ago, Harry said:

And my point is exactly this. We probably have plenty of fans across the country who might get to National League/other games when they can’t make it to City. Why shouldn’t we have a fan be able to enter a Chesterfield fixture under an official scout badge and write a full report on the chap. We need to expand the scouting network. What better than having fans, with a huge personal interest in our clubs well-being, to be out there providing reports at zero cost to the club. You personally should be encouraged to go to the next Chesterfield match and report on this lad. 
There should be a facility for you to be able to contact our Head of Recruitment and say “I’m going to the Torquay Chesterfield match on Saturday, I’ll provide a report on Tshimanga”. 

This wouldn’t work surely as the knowledge of a lot of fans couldn’t be trusted 

[Harry]

4 minutes ago, bcfcfinker said:

There are two Post articles about this fella Gilhespy:
https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/unseen-figure-heart-bristol-citys-5409108 - dated May 2021
https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/inside-bristol-citys-recruitment-team-6030875 - dated October 2021
So you seem to be saying that you based your OP on the most recent October article (a couple weeks ago), but scratch the surface of the OP, it very much points to the May article.

For example, you say that your 'agent friends' have been contacting Gilhespy (the first article says that Gilhespy is the point of contact), however other sources like KITR are adamant that it is actually Gould who is the fella who deals with agents (you've gone as far as saying that Gould is a liar if he's said he has been dealing with agents - it couldn't possibly be that you're the one who is wrong). Either your 'agent friends' don't have their finger on the pulse and they are doing their clients a disservice by being their agents, or I suppose there could be a faint whiff of BS in your OP? Maybe that's the reason for not 'returning calls'?

You've indicated that the recruitment seems to consist of only analysts (in-line with the general content of the first Post article) but looking at the October article, it is clear that recruitment is a lot more involved than your meandering OP and involves more than just analysts.

The crux of your OP is that there is no head of recruitment, something identified in the first Post article:
"Bristol City are also weighing up bringing in more senior help, however. And a final decision is yet to be made on whether to bring in a new head of recruitment or director of football, alongside the new CEO, with talks underway on who may replace Ashton."
So are you regurgitating a potential problem that the Post identified in May or are you indicating that you independently identified this problem after the Post identified 5 months ago? If it's the later, maybe your powers of deduction need a recalibration?

Your pet show pony 'Mark Ashton' even gets a special mention:
"The recruitment team basically consisted of Ashton and…..ummmm, no one else."
Something that is demonstrated as being false in the Post articles.

I'll let you kid yourself that there is no 'emotional baggage' or that you don't have a 'chip on your shoulder'

This is an open board and on occasion, it is fair to check if an opinion, masquerading as fact, stands up to scrutiny. Maybe this is the reason for your petty barb in the reply, and I'm disappointed you couldn't do better (if only you could put as much effort into your barbs as you do your diatribes). But maybe a good indicator that I've gotten under your skin.

Fair enough finker. Everything is ok and we have a recruitment team absolutely fit for purpose. I was clearly wrong. 

[Harry]

6 minutes ago, mozo said:

Does that happen Harry?

I used to work with a bloke who watched games for Rotherham in his spare time. I suppose that makes him an actual scout but he didn't know any more about football than me as far as I was aware and certainly wasn't much of a 5-aside player!

I never understood how he ended up doing it.

 

Just now, And Its Smith said:

This wouldn’t work surely as the knowledge of a lot of fans couldn’t be trusted 

This isn’t to suggest that the club sign a player on the say so of John who watched him once at Guiseley. It’s to act as an initial ‘eyes-on’ report which, if interesting, can be backed up by the data analysis and further by physical scouting by someone fully employed by the club and with experience at talent ID. 
It’s just a suggestion that could be the first phase of getting a player onto the club list as a potential option. 
I’m certainly not suggesting that we sign a player ONLY on the say-so of a random fan. 

[And Its Smith]

1 minute ago, Harry said:

 

This isn’t to suggest that the club sign a player on the say so of John who watched him once at Guiseley. It’s to act as an initial ‘eyes-on’ report which, if interesting, can be backed up by the data analysis and further by physical scouting by someone fully employed by the club and with experience at talent ID. 
It’s just a suggestion that could be the first phase of getting a player onto the club list as a potential option. 
I’m certainly not suggesting that we sign a player ONLY on the say-so of a random fan. 

I appreciate you aren’t suggesting that. I just wonder what quality of player would be sent to the club in your example. No harm in getting a few trusted fans on board mind you. 

[Kid in the Riot]

15 minutes ago, bcfcfinker said:

For example, you say that your 'agent friends' have been contacting Gilhespy (the first article says that Gilhespy is the point of contact), however other sources like KITR are adamant that it is actually Gould who is the fella who deals with agents (you've gone as far as saying that Gould is a liar if he's said he has been dealing with agents - it couldn't possibly be that you're the one who is wrong).

I suspect Gilhespy may have been a temporary point of contact for agents for a month or two, in-between Ashton leaving and Gould being appointed. 

But since May/June we have had a very obvious point of contact at the club for agents - Gould - and he is the one who negotiates the incomings and outgoings. 

He is not however "talent ID" or a scout, and I think most would agree we need a chief scout/head of recruitment. 

However, this is hardly news... that position has been vacant since Day left, I guess?

[Clevedon Red]

2 hours ago, Davefevs said:

Corrected!

A job for the younger person without a family and with lower wage expectations.

Now if I was a few years older and thinking of semi-retirement now wouldn’t that be a nice thought.

Either that or I’ll be fighting @Clevedon Redfor the minibus driver role!!! 

You take the analyst’s out I’ll deal with the drivers.

[Lrrr]

44 minutes ago, bcfcfinker said:

There are two Post articles about this fella Gilhespy:
https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/unseen-figure-heart-bristol-citys-5409108 - dated May 2021
https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/inside-bristol-citys-recruitment-team-6030875 - dated October 2021
So you seem to be saying that you based your OP on the most recent October article (a couple weeks ago), but scratch the surface of the OP, it very much points to the May article.

For example, you say that your 'agent friends' have been contacting Gilhespy (the first article says that Gilhespy is the point of contact), however other sources like KITR are adamant that it is actually Gould who is the fella who deals with agents (you've gone as far as saying that Gould is a liar if he's said he has been dealing with agents - it couldn't possibly be that you're the one who is wrong). Either your 'agent friends' don't have their finger on the pulse and they are doing their clients a disservice by being their agents, or I suppose there could be a faint whiff of BS in your OP? Maybe that's the reason for not 'returning calls'?

You've indicated that the recruitment seems to consist of only analysts (in-line with the general content of the first Post article) but looking at the October article, it is clear that recruitment is a lot more involved than your meandering OP and involves more than just analysts.

The crux of your OP is that there is no head of recruitment, something identified in the first Post article:
"Bristol City are also weighing up bringing in more senior help, however. And a final decision is yet to be made on whether to bring in a new head of recruitment or director of football, alongside the new CEO, with talks underway on who may replace Ashton."
So are you regurgitating a potential problem that the Post identified in May or are you indicating that you independently identified this problem after the Post identified 5 months ago? If it's the later, maybe your powers of deduction need a recalibration?

Your pet show pony 'Mark Ashton' even gets a special mention:
"The recruitment team basically consisted of Ashton and…..ummmm, no one else."
Something that is demonstrated as being false in the Post articles.

I'll let you kid yourself that there is no 'emotional baggage' or that you don't have a 'chip on your shoulder'

This is an open board and on occasion, it is fair to check if an opinion, masquerading as fact, stands up to scrutiny. Maybe this is the reason for your petty barb in the reply, and I'm disappointed you couldn't do better (if only you could put as much effort into your barbs as you do your diatribes). But maybe a good indicator that I've gotten under your skin.

Being fair we probably couldn't say Gould was already doing bits and pieces in any official capacity, so easy to say the longest serving person in our recruitment department was the point of contact until Gould was officially in his role.

[Simon79]

43 minutes ago, mozo said:

Does that happen Harry?

I used to work with a bloke who watched games for Rotherham in his spare time. I suppose that makes him an actual scout but he didn't know any more about football than me as far as I was aware and certainly wasn't much of a 5-aside player!

I never understood how he ended up doing it.

A friend of mine who is a Norwich fan scouted for them in the Southwest. This came about after Norwich got relegated (possibly early 2000’s) from the Premiership. He actually made contact with them to offer his services, which they accepted. They then sent him to various games to watch certain players & he had to fill out a report on these players. Which included strengths/weaknesses, & marking individual components of each individuals game. He would then hand in the reports & the club took over from there. It served as a base for the club to move forward or not on each individual. He enjoyed it, bumping in to various football people as well as helping his club. COYR 

[Davefevs]

43 minutes ago, And Its Smith said:

I appreciate you aren’t suggesting that. I just wonder what quality of player would be sent to the club in your example. No harm in getting a few trusted fans on board mind you. 

In fairness, “random” fans suggest players to clubs quite frequently.  The question is what info does the person send in and what the club do with these?

- throw them straight in the bin

- have some form of filtering process

- reply to the sender asking them to fill in a standard scout report and then look at

- etc

Was chatting to a fellow OTIBer / Tweeter a few months back about this.  If you wanted City to take your player suggestion seriously, you’d do more than tweet Brian Tinnion and say “you had a look at this player, Bri?” wouldn’t you?

[Harry]

40 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

I suspect Gilhespy may have been a temporary point of contact for agents for a month or two, in-between Ashton leaving and Gould being appointed. 

But since May/June we have had a very obvious point of contact at the club for agents - Gould - and he is the one who negotiates the incomings and outgoings. 

He is not however "talent ID" or a scout, and I think most would agree we need a chief scout/head of recruitment. 

However, this is hardly news... that position has been vacant since Day left, I guess?

You’re right - it’s hardly news. 
But as I specifically mention in the opening post, the fact that we had a data slicer as our focal point of contact in the last window is for me the missing piece which hadn’t featured in any of the Nige in/Nige Out/SL in/SL out debates. 
This was the single biggest problem of the summer 21 transfer window. 
We need to get a Head of Recruitment in situ as a matter of urgency. 
So whilst that’s not ‘new’ news, it seems to have been overlooked in every single thread about our current situation. 

[Bat Fastard]

Were thing so much better under "Uncle Pete Johnson? He seems to tick many of the boxes in the OP.

[RedRock]

26 minutes ago, Harry said:

You’re right - it’s hardly news. 
But as I specifically mention in the opening post, the fact that we had a data slicer as our focal point of contact in the last window is for me the missing piece which hadn’t featured in any of the Nige in/Nige Out/SL in/SL out debates. 
This was the single biggest problem of the summer 21 transfer window. 
We need to get a Head of Recruitment in situ as a matter of urgency. 
So whilst that’s not ‘new’ news, it seems to have been overlooked in every single thread about our current situation. 

Think a lot of us were banging on about the appointment of a Director of Football under the last couple of regimes.

Pity Steve didn’t listen to us, he could have saved himself a few £million, a lot of unnecessary anguish for him and us fans. 
 

[BigAl&Toby]

4 hours ago, Kid in the Riot said:

I don't think it matters that the data analysists don't have any pro-game experience. Luton's head of technical recruitment (so same position as Gilespy) is Jay Socik aka Blades Analytics who was basically an amateur data analyst with a Twitter account. I can't remember which Scottish club it was now, but one appointed a 17 year old Indian kid from Mumbai as a data analyst. Most data analysts will be exactly that, and not played the game to any decent level. 

It's obviously key to have pro-game input alongside this. At Luton it's actually their assistant manager Mick Harford who is also Head of recruitment. 

At the moment, our recruitment is a combined committee effort between the technical team, Nige, Fleming, Rennie, Gould, Jon L. Clearly, it's Nige and Fleming (previously Downing and Simpson) providing the main football experience input. 

It's also pretty obvious Nige is calling the shots, a quick look at summer recruitment confirms that. 

The current situation is not ideal and I have no doubts recruitment is an area (along with plenty of others) we could be doing much better in. There would appear to be a vacancy for head of recruitment, how far down the line we are in terms of appointing someone, I don't know. But clearly it has to be the right person. Nige has only been in FT post since the end of last season, only 5 months or so is not actually very long to try and fix these systemic problems that may well run deep. 

I think he's going as fast as he can but clearly doesn't want the club to rush into an appointment they may regret. Maybe we are waiting for Walsh? 

Data analysts.

Business analysts.

All about simply gathering data and chucking it in whatever business tool you choose to use. Dare I say that anyone with time on their hands and a laptop could do it? If they’re so inclined.

My old dad was a fan of Quicken when he used to get his old photocopied newsletters from HL all those years ago.

Christ did he go on and ******* on about his analysis of his spending. **** me he sometimes did a ******* pie chart

Now we have analysts measuring all manner of data. During 90 minutes of fun.

Only analysis I do is look at the scoreboard and league table. Tells me all I need to know. Don’t care about who’s done what how many times and how far they’ve run.

All counts for nothing if Capn Dan is lumping it forward and it keeps coming back…..

Now anyway I wonder what Mr L’s been thinking up today…….

[The Dolman Pragmatist]

4 minutes ago, RedRock said:

Think a lot of us were banging on about the appointment of a Director of Football under the last couple of regimes.

Pity Steve didn’t listen to us, he could have saved himself a few £million, a lot of unnecessary anguish for him and us fans. 
 

I don’t remember that.  Benefit of hindsight?

[mozo]

1 hour ago, Simon79 said:

A friend of mine who is a Norwich fan scouted for them in the Southwest. This came about after Norwich got relegated (possibly early 2000’s) from the Premiership. He actually made contact with them to offer his services, which they accepted. They then sent him to various games to watch certain players & he had to fill out a report on these players. Which included strengths/weaknesses, & marking individual components of each individuals game. He would then hand in the reports & the club took over from there. It served as a base for the club to move forward or not on each individual. He enjoyed it, bumping in to various football people as well as helping his club. COYR 

Thanks for sharing buddy.  

It's the kind of thing I'd love to do if I didn't have bloody family life! 

[RedRock]

20 minutes ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

I don’t remember that.  Benefit of hindsight?

Nope. Certainly been saying that for ages, together with a need for a network of scouts. Others likewise.

Wasn't rocket science frankly. 
 

We know why it fell of deaf ears don’t we.

 

[Guest]

40 minutes ago, Harry said:

Fair enough finker. Everything is ok and we have a recruitment team absolutely fit for purpose. I was clearly wrong. 

And your reply is pure laziness and I'm not surprised.

You might have insider knowledge, however, you like to create some sort of story about how you have come to believe in your opinions/views i.e. you like to embellish. That's when things just don't add up. You like to introduce all sorts of vagueness, a sprinkling of ITK and then set up some poor sap as being the person to blame. On past experience, I suspect you will not change.

Anyone with half a brain knows that there is a recruitment problem at City but it's probably a secondary issue.
Continuing with the simplistic arguments that its individuals that are to blame will not fix the issues and is a bit like believing in pixie dust, magic wands and silver bullets.

Football is portrayed as a simple game, but what people forget is, a lot of string pulling takes place in the background, leading to intrigue and it then manifests into a soap opera for some fans. Intrigue, plots, sub-plots, what is not to like?

Personally, I'd like to believe NP might be a keystone for starting the fix at City, along with some patience (in the past 20 years, only 3 ex-prem managers have been put in place, Danny Wilson, Coppell (the less we say about that the better) and Nigel). It's a personal opinion/view that I can't backup and I won't attempt to create some story line to support my view either. You either agree, disagree, or worst of all, try to take a middle road approach (is this what SL is really guilty of, ahhhhh, the intrigue). If NP is the keystone, the secondary support functions will start to fall into place.

As to all the character assassinations taking place at the moment, I'd like to say that I'm surprised, but experience tells me not to be. It is merely a lack of maturity that has to be endured.

If you want to find the real reason why City isn't a footballing powerhouse (and being a supporter, I want City to be), why don't you identify the real problem first rather than pontificating on the periphery of THE REAL problem. I would hope that it is apparent that there being no head of recruitment is not a pressing issue - it is secondary.

22 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

I suspect Gilhespy may have been a temporary point of contact for agents for a month or two, in-between Ashton leaving and Gould being appointed. 

But since May/June we have had a very obvious point of contact at the club for agents - Gould - and he is the one who negotiates the incomings and outgoings. 

He is not however "talent ID" or a scout, and I think most would agree we need a chief scout/head of recruitment. 

However, this is hardly news... that position has been vacant since Day left, I guess?

Agree. I suspect Gilhespy will just be the next fall guy if things go pear shaped.

It is my greatest hope that the pieces of the puzzle for Bristol City becoming better are falling into place and this is not some false dawn.

I suppose fans do get frustrated by City's progress, leading to intrigue, plots and sub-plots, along with a need to find the master villain of all City's problem. City fans just aren't very good at finding the master villain and are destined to seasonal sequels. By my reckoning, the drama has been running since 1980.

[Davefevs]

49 minutes ago, BigAl&Toby said:

Data analysts.

Business analysts.

All about simply gathering data and chucking it in whatever business tool you choose to use. Dare I say that anyone with time on their hands and a laptop could do it? If they’re so inclined.

My old dad was a fan of Quicken when he used to get his old photocopied newsletters from HL all those years ago.

Christ did he go on and ******* on about his analysis of his spending. **** me he sometimes did a ******* pie chart

Now we have analysts measuring all manner of data. During 90 minutes of fun.

Only analysis I do is look at the scoreboard and league table. Tells me all I need to know. Don’t care about who’s done what how many times and how far they’ve run.

All counts for nothing if Capn Dan is lumping it forward and it keeps coming back…..

Now anyway I wonder what Mr L’s been thinking up today…….

I’m a Business Analyst….bit more to it than chucking it in a tool…..I’m offended!

[Harry]

34 minutes ago, bcfcfinker said:

And your reply is pure laziness and I'm not surprised.

You might have insider knowledge, however, you like to create some sort of story about how you have come to believe in your opinions/views i.e. you like to embellish. That's when things just don't add up. You like to introduce all sorts of vagueness, a sprinkling of ITK and then set up some poor sap as being the person to blame. On past experience, I suspect you will not change.

Anyone with half a brain knows that there is a recruitment problem at City but it's probably a secondary issue.
Continuing with the simplistic arguments that its individuals that are to blame will not fix the issues and is a bit like believing in pixie dust, magic wands and silver bullets.

Football is portrayed as a simple game, but what people forget is, a lot of string pulling takes place in the background, leading to intrigue and it then manifests into a soap opera for some fans. Intrigue, plots, sub-plots, what is not to like?

Personally, I'd like to believe NP might be a keystone for starting the fix at City, along with some patience (in the past 20 years, only 3 ex-prem managers have been put in place, Danny Wilson, Coppell (the less we say about that the better) and Nigel). It's a personal opinion/view that I can't backup and I won't attempt to create some story line to support my view either. You either agree, disagree, or worst of all, try to take a middle road approach (is this what SL is really guilty of, ahhhhh, the intrigue). If NP is the keystone, the secondary support functions will start to fall into place.

As to all the character assassinations taking place at the moment, I'd like to say that I'm surprised, but experience tells me not to be. It is merely a lack of maturity that has to be endured.

If you want to find the real reason why City isn't a footballing powerhouse (and being a supporter, I want City to be), why don't you identify the real problem first rather than pontificating on the periphery of THE REAL problem. I would hope that it is apparent that there being no head of recruitment is not a pressing issue - it is secondary.

Agree. I suspect Gilhespy will just be the next fall guy if things go pear shaped.

It is my greatest hope that the pieces of the puzzle for Bristol City becoming better are falling into place and this is not some false dawn.

I suppose fans do get frustrated by City's progress, leading to intrigue, plots and sub-plots, along with a need to find the master villain of all City's problem. City fans just aren't very good at finding the master villain and are destined to seasonal sequels. By my reckoning, the drama has been running since 1980.

My reply wasn’t lazy. I laid out plenty in my initial post and multiple subsequent replies. Yours was just one that was for me, defending the indefensible. 
It’s quite clear to me that recruitment was being run by an amateur during the summer. I’m not trying to find “some poor sap to blame”. This person is in the public eye, working as a senior figure in the recruitment dept of a football club with premier league ambition. If he doesn’t like the criticism then get out of the public eye. 
I care for one thing - the health of this football club. I know exactly what’s been going on in the summer window and it stinks. Our recruitment department are an absolute laughing stock. Write that off as “someone trying to pin the blame on a poor sap” if you want, but it’s the truth. That’s verbatim from a large number of people established in the football recruitment industry. We are a laughing stock. 
SL needs to get Mr Gilhespy back behind the computer screen and get a HOR in as a matter of urgency. 
I’m not calling for anyone to lose their job. Just to get back to their own skill set and bring someone in with some competence and actual experience. 
 

I’m not intentionally looking for a fall guy. It’s a simple matter of caring for the welfare of our club and I know exactly how we are currently viewed and exactly what the problem is. 
You can keep your eyes closed on that matter and defend your friend if you like, that’s fine and admirable, but it doesn’t stop it being true. 

Edited October 25, 2021 by Harry

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, Harry said:

My reply wasn’t lazy. I laid out plenty in my initial post and multiple subsequent replies. Yours was just one that was for me, defending the indefensible. 
It’s quite clear to me that recruitment was being run by an amateur during the summer. I’m not trying to find “some poor sap to blame”. This person is in the public eye, working as a senior figure in the recruitment dept of a football club with premier league ambition. If he doesn’t like the criticism then get out of the public eye. 
I care for one thing - the health of this football club. I know exactly what’s been going on in the summer window and it stinks. Our recruitment department are an absolute laughing stock. Write that off as “someone trying to pin the blame on a poor sap” if you want, but it’s the truth. That’s verbatim from a large number of people established in the football recruitment industry. We are a laughing stock. 
SL needs to get Mr Gilhespy back behind the computer screen and get a HOR in as a matter of urgency. 
I’m not calling for anyone to lose their job. Just to get back to their own skill set and bring someone in with some competence and actual experience. 
 

I’m not intentionally looking for a fall guy. It’s a simple matter of caring for the welfare of our club and I know exactly how we are currently viewed and exactly what the problem is. 
You can keep your eyes closed on that matter and defend your friend if you like, that’s fine and admirable, but it doesn’t stop it being true. 

And there you go again '... defend your friend if you like...'

I do not claim ITK, know people at the club or any other combination.
You've resorted to character assassination.

You however like to pull the ITK card. It was pointed out that Gould is the fella in charge of recruitment during the summer but your insistent to the point of wanting to call someone a lier. Character assassination.

You insist that the recruitment team is just a bunch of data analysts even though it factually wrong.

And your fall back now, after being challenged on some of the 'sort of' verifiable facts, is that everyone in the recruitment industry thinks City is a laughing stock. You've now moved into the realm of the unverifiable and everyone has to 'trust' you. You are now moving into fantasy land.

[Harry]

19 minutes ago, bcfcfinker said:

And there you go again '... defend your friend if you like...'

I do not claim ITK, know people at the club or any other combination.
You've resorted to character assassination.

You however like to pull the ITK card. It was pointed out that Gould is the fella in charge of recruitment during the summer but your insistent to the point of wanting to call someone a lier. Character assassination.

You insist that the recruitment team is just a bunch of data analysts even though it factually wrong.

And your fall back now, after being challenged on some of the 'sort of' verifiable facts, is that everyone in the recruitment industry thinks City is a laughing stock. You've now moved into the realm of the unverifiable and everyone has to 'trust' you. You are now moving into fantasy land.

 Believe what you like sir. Hear no evil, See no evil ….. 

[exAtyeoMax]

34 minutes ago, bcfcfinker said:

And there you go again '... defend your friend if you like...'

I do not claim ITK, know people at the club or any other combination.
You've resorted to character assassination.

You however like to pull the ITK card. It was pointed out that Gould is the fella in charge of recruitment during the summer but your insistent to the point of wanting to call someone a lier. Character assassination.

You insist that the recruitment team is just a bunch of data analysts even though it factually wrong.

And your fall back now, after being challenged on some of the 'sort of' verifiable facts, is that everyone in the recruitment industry thinks City is a laughing stock. You've now moved into the realm of the unverifiable and everyone has to 'trust' you. You are now moving into fantasy land.

Who's who

Sean Gilhespy leads the team and weekly recruitment meetings include Nigel Pearson and his coaching team, plus CEO Richard Gould and others such as chairman Jon Lansdown, who takes an interest, as well as other board members who will drop in from time to time.

The team behind the team:

• Dan Calcott - recruitment analyst
• Chester Perks - recruitment analyst
• Simon Cozens - recruitment analyst
• James Borrett - data analyst
• Rishickesh Ramesh - data analyst
• Fraser Franks - scout
• Allan Gemmell - scout
• Martin O'Connor - scout
• Several interns, studying the Championship to begin (two doing their Masters in Performance Analysis at Bristol City for 12 months)