should we stop attending away games to save OUR planet?

[Wealwayseatcheese]

They hired diesel generators to charge the fleet of Tesla cars they had laid on because not enough charging points at venues . It’s all hypocritical b ollox 

[IAmNick]

"Other people do bad things so why should I stop?"

Bringing out the secondary school level arguments I see

[cheese]

15 hours ago, myol'man said:

I glued my face to the road outside of the Ricoh, no-one noticed, I'm still here. 

Bit like the players who glued their boots to the turf.

[Bas's perfect hattrick]

4 minutes ago, IAmNick said:

"Other people do bad things so why should I stop?"

Bringing out the secondary school level arguments I see

Agree with this. Ultimately, everyone has to make their own decision on what steps they take to reduce their environmental impact. I personally think we are facing a very serious problem, so I have reduced the amount of meat I eat along with the things I was doing before (cycling, not owning a car etc.). 

I totally agree with the arguments made above about China's huge impact, and the hypocrisy from the rich + famous pisses me off too. However, I can only control my own consumption. I suspect that most people who use the China/elites argument to continue as normal don't really give a toss about climate change and are happy for the excuse

[TheReds]

2 minutes ago, IAmNick said:

"Other people do bad things so why should I stop?"

Bringing out the secondary school level arguments I see

Indeed, and I have no shame whatsoever using it. 

If this is the crisis that these people are telling us it is, then why are they literally doing nothing about it themselves, bar virtue signalling to the peasants of society? Why do they still go on holiday and get flights (mainly private jets)? Why do they still have gas guzzling motors? The climate spokesperson for the PM drives a diesel and not electric, whilst telling people to go electric. How are Gretas people getting everywhere, it wouldn't be flying would it?

I just don't understand how these people know so much about this crisis, and know how much damage we are all doing to the planet, yet they cannot be bothered to even practice what they preach and do absolutely nothing - they cannot be that worried can they.

It's hypocrisy of the highest order, and quite frankly all they are all doing is making people think "why bother".

[IAmNick]

7 minutes ago, TheReds said:

Indeed, and I have no shame whatsoever using it. 

If this is the crisis that these people are telling us it is, then why are they literally doing nothing about it themselves, bar virtue signalling to the peasants of society? Why do they still go on holiday and get flights (mainly private jets)? Why do they still have gas guzzling motors? The climate spokesperson for the PM drives a diesel and not electric, whilst telling people to go electric. How are Gretas people getting everywhere, it wouldn't be flying would it?

I just don't understand how these people know so much about this crisis, and know how much damage we are all doing to the planet, yet they cannot be bothered to even practice what they preach and do absolutely nothing - they cannot be that worried can they.

It's hypocrisy of the highest order, and quite frankly all they are all doing is making people think "why bother".

The truth is that individual changes (e.g. you changing from diesel to electric or me using a refillable washing liquid thingy) are a drop in the ocean on the grand scheme of things. I read recently that if you or I lived an entirely neutral life regarding emissions, it wouldn't even be the equivalent of 1 second of the global energy sector. That doesn't mean we shouldn't do them imo, but we need real systematic, society level changes.

I don't see how it's virtue signaling if they're clearly not doing it themselves at the same time? Surely that's the opposite?

Greta flies around, sure. Does that make her message wrong? It's a classic "You complain about society yet you live in society how curious" thing. Do you expect her to live in a mud hut and wear rags?

One reason they can't be bothered is that they're lobbied with amazing amount of money by the fossil fuel industry. The largest delegation to COP26 was the fossil fuel industry, more so than any single country.

It may be hypocrisy, but people use that as an excuse to ignore the argument and just attack the messengers so they don't have to bother changing. We're all going to be f*cked (or rather, my 1yr old son may well be) if that keeps happening.

Edited November 9, 2021 by IAmNick

[TheReds]

10 minutes ago, IAmNick said:

It may be hypocrisy, but people use that as an excuse to ignore the argument and just attack the messengers so they don't have to bother changing

Well on that note, from now on I will tell everyone to go electric, stop flying, stop eating meat etc etc, but not do it myself as I'm just a messenger. When the messengers are people like Lewis Hamilton who flies a dog on private plane, and Greta who is now reported to be a millionaire (wasn't she having a go at people profiting from this crisis over the weekend), then they won't be getting me on board for the full menu of change. 

I do enough myself imo, but certainly will carry on flying for a holiday, driving a diesel, as an electric car is a non starter for me, and eating meat. As I said it cannot be that much of a crisis when the messengers, actors, celebrities tell us all what to do, but they cannot be bothered to practice what they preach, they either do not care one bit, or there just isn't the crisis they are telling us about. 

[IAmNick]

11 minutes ago, TheReds said:

Well on that note, from now on I will tell everyone to go electric, stop flying, stop eating meat etc etc, but not do it myself as I'm just a messenger. When the messengers are people like Lewis Hamilton who flies a dog on private plane, and Greta who is now reported to be a millionaire (wasn't she having a go at people profiting from this crisis over the weekend), then they won't be getting me on board for the full menu of change. 

I do enough myself imo, but certainly will carry on flying for a holiday, driving a diesel, as an electric car is a non starter for me, and eating meat. As I said it cannot be that much of a crisis when the messengers, actors, celebrities tell us all what to do, but they cannot be bothered to practice what they preach, they either do not care one bit, or there just isn't the crisis they are telling us about. 

I think you're misunderstanding. I'm saying that just because they don't practice what they preach doesn't mean their message is wrong - it just means they're hypocrites.

It seems like you want to follow a person, rather than the look at the argument they're making. If there is a perfect squeaky clean climate activist you'd be on board, if Greta has made some money and sometimes gets on a jet that means the whole thing isn't worth it. That's a really odd stance to me.

I think it's OK to fly sometimes, and eat meat. I eat meat, drive a petrol car, and like the heating on a bit earlier than I should do probably. That doesn't mean I don't think it's an important problem though - it's a scale. I don't think you're a bad person if you have a diesel because you need it.

The problem is that the people who are telling us (the messengers) are in general the ones it wont affect. Like with most of these things, it will affect the poorest here and especially abroad first.

That's why it's important to look at the argument, not the person telling you it.

As I said, what people really need to focus on are large scale changes far outside anything you or I could directly affect. I think it's an intentional tactic to try and push responsibility down onto us while the ones in charge basically pay lip service (if that) to it... or actively work against it. Same with covid - push the responsibility down to normal people so we all fight with each other, while everything goes to hell in the background.

Edited November 9, 2021 by IAmNick

[Crackers Corner]

7 minutes ago, IAmNick said:

I think you're misunderstanding. I'm saying that just because they don't practice what they preach doesn't mean their message is wrong - it just means they're hypocrites.

It seems like you want to follow a person, rather than the look at the argument they're making. If there is a perfect squeaky clean climate activist you'd be on board, if Greta has made some money and sometimes gets on a jet that means the whole thing isn't worth it. That's a really odd stance to me.

I think it's OK to fly sometimes, and eat meat. I eat meat, drive a petrol car, and like the heating on a bit earlier than I should do probably. That doesn't mean I don't think it's an important problem though - it's a scale. I don't think you're a bad person if you have a diesel because you need it.

The problem is that the people who are telling us (the messengers) are in general the ones it wont affect. Like with most of these things, it will affect the poorest here and especially abroad first.

That's why it's important to look at the argument, not the person telling you it.

As I said, what people really need to focus on are large scale changes far outside anything you or I could directly affect. I think it's an intentional tactic to try and push responsibility down onto us while the ones in charge basically pay lip service (if that) to it... or actively work against it. Same with covid - push the responsibility down to normal people so we all fight with each other, while everything goes to hell in the background.

 Complely agree, it all boils down to money, always has and always will, its the same reason why some can afford teslas (and 3 holidays a year) and most are stuck with petrol/diesels and one holiday if they are lucky. Its why everyone would love to go organic but cant. Make green affordable for the masses rather than bombarding them with doom in the news and it will be far more effective Than people superglueing thier hands to the m25. It really boils my piss when the bbc fly reporters to the Antarctic to tell us how bad it is damaging we are when they are creating loads of co2 to go there in the first place. 

[BS4 on Tour...]

Thread title will be used as the next excuse by the roverzzzz for their measly, non-massive away support ...

[oldstandrobin]

On 09/11/2021 at 13:16, Crackers Corner said:

 Complely agree, it all boils down to money, always has and always will, its the same reason why some can afford teslas (and 3 holidays a year) and most are stuck with petrol/diesels and one holiday if they are lucky. Its why everyone would love to go organic but cant. Make green affordable for the masses rather than bombarding them with doom in the news and it will be far more effective Than people superglueing thier hands to the m25. It really boils my piss when the bbc fly reporters to the Antarctic to tell us how bad it is damaging we are when they are creating loads of co2 to go there in the first place. 

Nail on head, all down to money. I have a hearing problem and have waited months to see a specialist, saw him and waited another two months for an MRI two weeks ago. Still awaiting results. If I went private, could have seen a specialist in Bath within a fortnight, MRI in a week and would have known months ago what problem was. The rich will always give a reason for their 'importance' over us plebs

[Jim Davey]

On 09/11/2021 at 12:20, TheReds said:

Indeed, and I have no shame whatsoever using it. 

If this is the crisis that these people are telling us it is, then why are they literally doing nothing about it themselves, bar virtue signalling to the peasants of society? Why do they still go on holiday and get flights (mainly private jets)? Why do they still have gas guzzling motors? The climate spokesperson for the PM drives a diesel and not electric, whilst telling people to go electric. How are Gretas people getting everywhere, it wouldn't be flying would it?

I just don't understand how these people know so much about this crisis, and know how much damage we are all doing to the planet, yet they cannot be bothered to even practice what they preach and do absolutely nothing - they cannot be that worried can they.

It's hypocrisy of the highest order, and quite frankly all they are all doing is making people think "why bother".

Emma Thompson being one off the biggest hypocrites of them all

Edited November 11, 2021 by Jim Davey