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Joe Williams out Sunday?


DT The Optimist
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1 hour ago, JonDolman said:

He did it on the right second half when dribbling and winning a throw with Fletcher trying to tackle him. Stayed on for a bit longer and was still sprinting so hopefully nothing too serious.

He's an important player but we looked fine once he went off.

I thought for 5-10 minutes after he went off we lost our bite in midfield a bit, but HNM got into it a bit more and we managed to get a foot hold in the game again. 

It wasn't Williams' best performance for us, but he is in credit for sure

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1 minute ago, Rocking Red Cyril said:

I feel after seemingly a good start to the season with refs in the Championship. They dropped back a lot in any sort of constituency. 

Why I wonder ?

Because I watch as much City as I can live and on robins,TV or wherever. And catch as much championship on box as allows and it seems across the board 

 

It is the lack of consistency that is so bad. Various Stoke players were allowed to climb all over Chris Martin, yet when O'Dowda did the same to a Stokie to jump for a long ball, it was given as a foul. There are lots of other examples. 

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It's weird ..........Williams played over one hundred games over 3 seasons prior to joining us, with hardly an injury.  Yet since he has been with us, it has been constant injury issues.  He is 25 next month, so has plenty of time ahead of him, just hope we can keep him fit and healthy, as he is a very important player for us.  He seems to have developed an ongoing weakness with his hamstrings, hoping our medical team can sort him out?

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50 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Those bloody invisible green shirts I reckon! 🤣

King was gonna be early December….let’s hope he’s progressing.

…and also if you bare in mind his age in those seasons….21, 22 and 23, that’s very good.  Shame our ex-Evertonian didn’t play as many in all his time here as Joe did in one season at Bolton.

Did you spot the chunk of shirt / shoulder Østigård had on Massengo?

Didnt realise Bents didn’t save Fletcher’s header onto the cross bar….from 100 yards away it looked a brilliant save 🤣🤣🤣

At the start Dave if you look closely he is pulling Massengo's massive hair. That should have been the first infringement the ref should have spotted before HNM wrestled him to the ground.

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1 minute ago, Red-Robbo said:

 

It is the lack of consistency that is so bad. Various Stoke players were allowed to climb all over Chris Martin, yet when O'Dowda did the same to a Stokie to jump for a long ball, it was given as a foul. There are lots of other examples. 

Yes I felt Blackburn game, which I was at, ref was shocking in what he did not notice or let go. In the seconed half when there two bookable tackles from Blackburn which fair enough the ref played on. But then go back and book the offenders. And last nite yes Stoke players got away with so much , which I felt we dealt with well, and ref missed are disgracions as well. Just no common sense consistent refereeing.I know it goes both ways and swings and roundabouts what goes for you and against you. But is a consistent standard of refering so difficult to attain . Oh well VAR next in the championship 😇 that be interesting

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1 hour ago, Harry said:

I thought he was very fair and realistic actually. 
Yes, they absolutely should’ve had a penalty when HNM wrestled Ostigard down on that corner. They hit the woodwork twice and had a couple of other very good chances and could easily have scored 3 or 4 on another night. 
We got pretty lucky - although we battled well - but we still kinda got away with one last night. 
 

 I think the ref didn't give a pen due to it looking 50/50.......Yep HNM had a hold of Ositgard's shirt, but it seemed reciprocal to me, as Ostigard was holding and pulling HNM too.  I am pretty sure the ref saw it as even stevens, and let it go IMHO ?

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6 minutes ago, Gillies Downs Leeds said:

At the start Dave if you look closely he is pulling Massengo's massive hair. That should have been the first infringement the ref should have spotted before HNM wrestled him to the ground.

I think the ref spotted that their player had a hold of Massengo's shirt dragging him down and also his hair. 

Nowhere near a penalty imo.

Ref got that one spot on.

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1 hour ago, maxjak said:

It's weird ..........Williams played over one hundred games over 3 seasons prior to joining us, with hardly an injury.  Yet since he has been with us, it has been constant injury issues.  He is 25 next month, so has plenty of time ahead of him, just hope we can keep him fit and healthy, as he is a very important player for us.  He seems to have developed an ongoing weakness with his hamstrings, hoping our medical team can sort him out?

One reason.

Andrew Roll's medical team.

Ever since he was appointed in 2018 till he left this summer, injuries under LJ, DH, and NP were measurable. Add to that his records at Watford and Arsenal.

It very well could not be his fault. But there's a definite correlation.

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1 hour ago, bcfc01 said:

I think the ref spotted that their player had a hold of Massengo's shirt dragging him down and also his hair. 

Nowhere near a penalty imo.

Ref got that one spot on.

I agree. I thought the sky pundits were very biased in this case and ignored the fact that Ostigard was also fouling HNM, calling it a blatant penalty. 

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2 hours ago, Harry said:

I thought he was very fair and realistic actually. 
Yes, they absolutely should’ve had a penalty when HNM wrestled Ostigard down on that corner. They hit the woodwork twice and had a couple of other very good chances and could easily have scored 3 or 4 on another night. 
We got pretty lucky - although we battled well - but we still kinda got away with one last night. 
 

If you watch the HNM thing ,look back in box and there are stoke and city players pushing grabbing and pulling same as hmm so ref could have given a foul against about 5 players on each side its what goes on at every corner or free kick into box. 

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14 minutes ago, red colin said:

If you watch the HNM thing ,look back in box and there are stoke and city players pushing grabbing and pulling same as hmm so ref could have given a foul against about 5 players on each side its what goes on at every corner or free kick into box. 

Yep. Tonnes of it goes on at every set play every week. But when a player is holding another one for about 15 yards and isn’t facing the ball, not once, it’s a penalty. 
If that was the other way round, I’m certain it would be unanimous on here that it was a pen. 

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4 hours ago, Harry said:

I thought he was very fair and realistic actually. 
Yes, they absolutely should’ve had a penalty when HNM wrestled Ostigard down on that corner. They hit the woodwork twice and had a couple of other very good chances and could easily have scored 3 or 4 on another night. 
We got pretty lucky - although we battled well - but we still kinda got away with one last night. 
 

Did you notice on there penalty appeal with Massengo their player was pulling messengos hair as they ran in the box ?.

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3 hours ago, maxjak said:

It's weird ..........Williams played over one hundred games over 3 seasons prior to joining us, with hardly an injury.  Yet since he has been with us, it has been constant injury issues.  He is 25 next month, so has plenty of time ahead of him, just hope we can keep him fit and healthy, as he is a very important player for us.  He seems to have developed an ongoing weakness with his hamstrings, hoping our medical team can sort him out?

Remember when Webster joined us he’d had 2-3 years of injury niggles at Ipswich and we got told he was a sick note.  Don’t think he had any issues while with us. 

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1 hour ago, Harry said:

Yep. Tonnes of it goes on at every set play every week. But when a player is holding another one for about 15 yards and isn’t facing the ball, not once, it’s a penalty. 
If that was the other way round, I’m certain it would be unanimous on here that it was a pen. 

Exactly that...crap defending by HNM..again late reacting. And reactionary. Didn't read it, reacted late and just grabbed his man. Why the hell would HNM be assigned that player too? Utter madness. It's these type of errors that cost us. If it were me...at set pieces, if we are playing one man left upfield I'd choose HNM, imo, he's crap at defending inside the box.

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11 minutes ago, spudski said:

Exactly that...crap defending by HNM..again late reacting. And reactionary. Didn't read it, reacted late and just grabbed his man. Why the hell would HNM be assigned that player too? Utter madness. It's these type of errors that cost us. If it were me...at set pieces, if we are playing one man left upfield I'd choose HNM, imo, he's crap at defending inside the box.

We usually have every player back I think

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4 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

We usually have every player back I think

 

Which is a big mistake. Look at the series of corners Stoke had. Without an outlet, we just delayed further attacks.

We had to wait until their shit inswinging corner that went into touch before getting ourselves out of jail. 

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Sat in the lower Lansdown it looked like HNM was preparing to come on when Nige called over Williams, Williams pointed to his hamstring and if my lip reading was right suggested it was a bit tight, to which Nige said right you’re coming off straight away.

The good news was as HNM was getting his tracksuit off, Williams happily went back to play until the ball went out of play again. 

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2 hours ago, robin_unreliant said:

I agree. I thought the sky pundits were very biased in this case and ignored the fact that Ostigard was also fouling HNM, calling it a blatant penalty. 

SKY pundits biased!!......Well i'll go to the foot of my stairs........Shock Horror...Ha!

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1 hour ago, RobintheRed Red said:

Did you notice on there penalty appeal with Massengo their player was pulling messengos hair as they ran in the box ?.

I didn’t see Ostigard pull hair. What I saw was HNM grappling and then Ostigard trying to release himself, which he did by trying to get his left arm over the top of HNm’s head. 
You’ll see it quite clearly broken down in the pics below. 
Look carefully at Ostigard’s left arm. You’ll see clearly that he’s trying to get it over the head, not touching his hair at all. 
It’s a penalty every day of the week. 
 

785C3B60-F656-4A4B-9FEB-51AE45F18ADC.jpeg

C4F6C2E4-19DD-414A-A15B-744B8918F08F.jpeg

78C460C5-E11F-4110-8959-6524B905A118.jpeg

7E2DABE0-BF6C-4DED-B3B5-5FDDAEEAEF80.jpeg

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33 minutes ago, Sir Geoff said:

Back to topic. If Joe is out that gives him a good 10 days recovery before WRDC visit AG. James hopefully back but if not Massengo in for Williams could be the only change with James on the bench.

I had to look that one up!   Who the pheck are WRDC I thought to myself?   Of course formerly known as FLDC?

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4 minutes ago, Harry said:

I didn’t see Ostigard pull hair. What I saw was HNM grappling and then Ostigard trying to release himself, which he did by trying to get his left arm over the top of HNm’s head. 
You’ll see it quite clearly broken down in the pics below. 
Look carefully at Ostigard’s left arm. You’ll see clearly that he’s trying to get it over the head, not touching his hair at all. 
It’s a penalty every day of the week. 
 

785C3B60-F656-4A4B-9FEB-51AE45F18ADC.jpeg

C4F6C2E4-19DD-414A-A15B-744B8918F08F.jpeg

78C460C5-E11F-4110-8959-6524B905A118.jpeg

7E2DABE0-BF6C-4DED-B3B5-5FDDAEEAEF80.jpeg

What day of the frigging week would that be?  If that's a pen, then I'm Lord Lucan?  Ha!

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57 minutes ago, spudski said:

Exactly that...crap defending by HNM..again late reacting. And reactionary. Didn't read it, reacted late and just grabbed his man. Why the hell would HNM be assigned that player too? Utter madness. It's these type of errors that cost us. If it were me...at set pieces, if we are playing one man left upfield I'd choose HNM, imo, he's crap at defending inside the box.

It’s something I’ve noticed all season. The way we set up from corners. 
We have the 3 best headers on the 6 yard box and then we have 3 or 4 ‘blockers’. These blockers aren’t necessarily there to challenge aerially with their opponents, just to delay their arrival, allowing one of the 3 designated ‘headers’ to have the advantage to win the ball. 
We’re not the only ones who do it. Most teams seem to be setting up in a similar fashion this season. Stoke did as well. 
From what I’ve seen of it from ourselves though, our ‘blockers’ don’t tend to be very good at blocking and ultimately end up running back with their opponent, making it appear as though they are marking him - but just end up getting in the way of our designated headers. 
 

I agree re leaving a man up. And I agree, I’d let HNM do it, because he frequently loses his man at these set pieces. 

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1 minute ago, maxjak said:

What day of the frigging week would that be?  If that's a pen, then I'm Lord Lucan?  Ha!

If that was the other way round, what would you say then Mr Lucan? 
 

The fact that HNM held onto him for another 15 yards without once looking at the ball is what makes it a blatant pen. 

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5 hours ago, Davefevs said:

Those bloody invisible green shirts I reckon! 🤣

King was gonna be early December….let’s hope he’s progressing.

…and also if you bare in mind his age in those seasons….21, 22 and 23, that’s very good.  Shame our ex-Evertonian didn’t play as many in all his time here as Joe did in one season at Bolton.

Did you spot the chunk of shirt / shoulder Østigård had on Massengo?

Didnt realise Bents didn’t save Fletcher’s header onto the cross bar….from 100 yards away it looked a brilliant save 🤣🤣🤣

I would think that the ref thought it was each one holding and pushing the other, So how could it be given as a foul to either team? Six of one and half a dozen of the other.

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