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Vaccine Passport - Plan B


Bristol Rob

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3 minutes ago, Harry said:

There’s always an exception to the rule. 
Squaddies = Good. 
Journo’s = Bad. 
Squaddie turned Journo = Steer clear 

 

You'll be safe up at Forest Green. 

You're up against Mansfield, Saturday week and I think you've a big West Country derby v Exeter City to cheer soon.  ?

I even believe there's a Covid vaccination centre at their stadium - the Fully Charged New Lawn as it is now known for sponsorship reasons. ??

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8 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

 

You'll be safe up at Forest Green. 

You're up against Mansfield, Saturday week and I think you've a big West Country derby v Exeter City to cheer soon.  ?

I even believe there's a Covid vaccination centre at their stadium - the Fully Charged New Lawn as it is now known for sponsorship reasons. ??

Yep. Been up there 4 times already this season. I’m familiar with the facilities. 
Enjoy the ‘Fully Vaxxed Ashton Gate’. I’m sure no one will catch any virus as you are all now ‘Fully Immune’. At least that what’s many people incorrectly believe having been ‘fully lied to’.  

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7 minutes ago, Harry said:

Yep. Been up there 4 times already this season. I’m familiar with the facilities. 
Enjoy the ‘Fully Vaxxed Ashton Gate’. I’m sure no one will catch any virus as you are all now ‘Fully Immune’. At least that what’s many people incorrectly believe having been ‘fully lied to’.  

 

Does anyone really think that? Anyone said that here, or are you just imagining it?

Anyoldhow, here's the new forum for you to discuss football and your vaccine theories. They even have a Coronavirus sub-forum. I'm sure you'll win a legion of fans:

https://forum.fgr.co.uk/

 

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On 09/12/2021 at 10:31, Eddie Hitler said:

 

Now that's worth knowing.

I have a pack of LFTs because I (and everyone, not just me) was asked to take one before a social occasion which I was happy to do.

I have massive reservations about taking a vaccine for which the long established standard medical trials have simply been waived but I am perfectly happy to take regular LFTs before going anywhere crowded.

I hadn't realised that that was an option, albeit in Wales at present where I am not, but it does seem a particularly sensible option.

I distrust the vaccines but wouldn't want to spread Covid if I have it and taking a LFT solves that for events; and I would take the test as I'm not trying to "game" the system.

I'm aware that they're not 100% accurate but they're not bad.

What's been waived?

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On 09/12/2021 at 11:20, Riaz said:

Lockdowns didnt work

Masks didnt work

Vaccine didnt work

Boosters arent working

If you are under 60 without any ailments, get on with your life.

If you are over 60 OR have an underlying health condition, take precautions - get family to do your shopping etc.

Lockdowns did work for their purpose

Vaccines are working, that's why we arent in the same position we were last Christmas

You know that over 50% of adults are overweight and about a quarter are clinically obese? That puts them in the higher risk. It's about "having ailments". I bet far more people are higher "risk" than they realise for starters.

I'm not promoting another lockdown though FWIW

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On 09/12/2021 at 13:38, bbew said:

The consequences of having or not having restrictions could be debated forever.  All most people who questioned them wanted however was a cost benefit analysis. 

We now know an estimated 740,000 possible cancer cases have been missed.  Many of these because since lockdown there have been 36 million fewer doctors consultations.  So may have been scared to get checked out as they didn't want to risk catching covid or being a burden on the NHS. 

 

Again, the 400,000 to 500,000 deaths prediction and the basis of this could be debated forever.  We should also never forget the initial panic back in March 2020 and very few would question the initial lockdown when so much was uncertain.

You do have to bear in mind however this prediction was made by the same person who predicted:

2001 - 150,000 deaths from foot and mouth - actual <200

2002 - 50,000 deaths from BSE - actual 177

2005 - 150,000,000 deaths from bird flu - actual 282

2009 - 65,000 deaths from swine flu - actual 457

 

 

I question some of these stats and remarks personally.

It's terrible cancer cases have been missed, I have a good friend who luckily wasnt one of them that was missed however to blame it on lockdown etc is shortsighted.

If we hadn't locked down do you think those people would have got seen? It's quite possible that thousands more people would have been dying and needing medical attention and services would have been stretched further.

Not sure about 36 million fewer doctor consultations? From listening to Doctors on the radio etc they have seen a massive increase in demand for appointments - moving to phone consultations has helped them speak to MORE people than they otherwise would have and enabled them to triage who needs to come in, who could just go to the pharmacist and who needs to go to A&E. Freeing them up to see the people who really need to be seen.

Most of these GPs have done this in their own time, or worked extra hours to accomodate this.

This link says October was 10% higher than pre-covid 2019 numbers, that's 3 million more appointments in a month: https://www.bma.org.uk/advice-and-support/nhs-delivery-and-workforce/pressures/pressures-in-general-practice

It also says face to face appointments increased by 12% too

Not denying there has been some bad handling of this though

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37 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

 

Does anyone really think that? Anyone said that here, or are you just imagining it?

Anyoldhow, here's the new forum for you to discuss football and your vaccine theories. They even have a Coronavirus sub-forum. I'm sure you'll win a legion of fans:

https://forum.fgr.co.uk/

 

Thanks for the link. I’m fully signed up and will no doubt make some friends soon. I just hope there are no sanctimonious ex-bbc journo’s on their forum. 
 

As for “does anyone think that”. Ha ha. You’d be amazed. I’ve seen a remarkable amount of comments on Twitter from people who think the vaccinated can’t pass it on and only the unvaxxed represent any danger to them. There are a very sorry number of folks out there who genuinely believe they won’t get covid from a fellow vaxxed person. 
It’s called conditioning. That’s what happened to these people. It’s very sad to see and I hope no-one suffers any consequences from being conditioned to believe that they are only in danger from an unvaxxed person. 
 

Of course, they’ve been gleefully helped along with this conditioning by your ex-employer and your other old media colleagues. 

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39 minutes ago, Harry said:

Thanks for the link. I’m fully signed up and will no doubt make some friends soon. I just hope there are no sanctimonious ex-bbc journo’s on their forum. 
 

As for “does anyone think that”. Ha ha. You’d be amazed. I’ve seen a remarkable amount of comments on Twitter from people who think the vaccinated can’t pass it on and only the unvaxxed represent any danger to them. There are a very sorry number of folks out there who genuinely believe they won’t get covid from a fellow vaxxed person. 
It’s called conditioning. That’s what happened to these people. It’s very sad to see and I hope no-one suffers any consequences from being conditioned to believe that they are only in danger from an unvaxxed person. 
 

Of course, they’ve been gleefully helped along with this conditioning by your ex-employer and your other old media colleagues. 

 

I would say the fact that restrictions are being put back in place is precisely because vaccination isn't infallible and infection levels are high.

And, hey, I hold no brief for the BBC. Why not write to them to complain - with suitable examples, of course. You can append "...and pay Red-Robbo Ltd the £84,000 you've owed them since 2017" to your note. ? :)

All joking aside, what do you expect Bristol City to do about this government edict?

You're a fan, so I guess you want the best for our club, but staying away may not only rob them of a bit of match day revenue, but if enough people do it would diminish spend available next season.  The club doesn't really have an option other than to bring this in. If they "took a stand" they'd be penalised and potentially shut down

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5 hours ago, James54De said:

scientists don’t agree it’s “mild”. It has been stated that verrrryyy early indications suggest it may lead to shorter hospital stays and less deaths. Encouraging indications? yes. Agreement? Absolutely not. There was also the same things being said about Alpha, and that ended up cause higher rates of hospitalisation and death than previous strains. 
In fact, hospitalisations are now ticking up in the UK, about a week after cases did, so who knows. 

It's been around for at least a month, more than enough time for doctors or scientists to have been able to come to some sort of conclusion, so far the vast majority of people who have had it are now recovered and were not hospitalised I mean a 255% increase in cases in S Africa and a tiny rise in hospital cases how much more proof do you need?

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7 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

 

I would say the fact that restrictions are being put back in place is precisely because vaccination isn't infallible and infection levels are high.

And, hey, I hold no brief for the BBC. Why not write to them to complain - with suitable examples, of course. You can append "...and pay Red-Robbo Ltd the £84,000 you've owed them since 2017" to your note. ? :)

All joking aside, what do you expect Bristol City to do about this government edict?

You're a fan, so I guess you want the best for our club, but staying away may not only rob them of a bit of match day revenue, but if enough people do it would diminish spend available next season.  The club doesn't really have an option other than to bring this in. If they "took a stand" they'd be penalised and potentially shut down

Indeed. I don't understand this whole "I'm taking a stand by boycotting people who have to follow the law" nonsense. It's pure and utter virtue signalling.

If people want to go to London and protest outside parliament or Downing Street that is their business but anyone boycotting a venue or space for following the law is not making a political point but just seeking attention. Sadly the world is full of gutless, spineless people like @Harrywho want to make a lot of noise but lack the courage or conviction to target the people who make the laws and so make a big splash about punishing local businesses instead because it is so much easier to deprive a local business of money than to agitate for genuine change. I find it quite cowardly and shameful. 

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2 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

 

I would say the fact that restrictions are being put back in place is precisely because vaccination isn't infallible and infection levels are high.

And, hey, I hold no brief for the BBC. Why not write to them to complain - with suitable examples, of course. You can append "...and pay Red-Robbo Ltd the £84,000 you've owed them since 2017" to your note. ? :)

All joking aside, what do you expect Bristol City to do about this government edict?

You're a fan, so I guess you want the best for our club, but staying away may not only rob them of a bit of match day revenue, but if enough people do it would diminish spend available next season.  The club doesn't really have an option other than to bring this in. If they "took a stand" they'd be penalised and potentially shut down

To your first paragraph - exactly. The vaccines aren’t infallible. But as I’ve mentioned, there are a remarkable number of people who actually think they are. 
 

Re the BBC. Well, well, well. I never knew you left in such dubious circumstances. I’ll ensure I mention you in my complaint letter. 
 

Re BCFC. I don’t expect them to do anything. They can’t. They have to comply. They won’t lose much money from my own input - season ticket is paid for and I won’t be asking for any refund for the games I don’t attend. My matchday spend usually amounts to £2.25 for a coffee. 
Of course, there may be lots of others who can’t attend and of course the club may lose money. I’d hope that they (and many other businesses who will lose money) will make a stand and pressure the government into not passing this through next week. If enough people say no, then they’d have to concede. However, the more people comply, those in power believe they’ve won. 
I get it - it’s every persons choice to attend, but I’d try to make a case to everyone that, by attending, you are complying. And by complying you are allowing the gradual tiptoe to more and more controls on your lives. This is the first step. See Scotland for the next step (ie lock yourself up at home if you’ve had contact, even if you are triple vaxxed), see Austria for the next step (ie fines for the unvaccinated), see Australia for the next step (ie quarantine for healthy, negative-tested citizens). Anyone who thinks it is wrong to lock healthy people up in a purpose built facility because they are a close contact of a positive case, ought to think about what they are complying with by attending a ‘vax pass’ event. 
I know it’s hard. People want their sport and entertainment, and their restaurants and their gigs and their skiing holidays etc etc, but for every single event that people comply with this tyranny, is one tiny step along the line that the government want you to take. 
 

I know that City can’t do anything about it. And I know it’s hard for fans to do anything about it. But I’d hope many fans are also business owners / employees, whose own livelihoods may be impacted by this, and maybe they ought to pressure those in power too. 
 

As I say, I won’t be complying with anything that requires me to prove I’ve been vaccinated. Whether that be football, restaurant, cinema, pub, whatever. Businesses need to stand against it to ensure they aren’t affected. I mean jeez - how many people have cancelled parties since the announcement 2 weeks ago, losing millions of pounds for millions of businesses, all over some irrational fear over a milder version of what we were already living with, fear caused by the government and the media. 
These businesses aren’t getting that money back. They aren’t getting any furlough this time around either. Fear has caused panic. Panic has resulted in cancellation of plans. Cancelled plans has resulted in millions of lost revenue, lost revenue could result in job losses or business closures, business closures could result in poverty, food bank use, drug abuse, homelessness, suicide etc!! 
 

People need to realise it’s not just the vax pass issue, it’s the whole shebang that’s occurred since omicron was announced. Fear and panic is the current pandemic. It’s time to say no. 

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16 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said:

Indeed. I don't understand this whole "I'm taking a stand by boycotting people who have to follow the law" nonsense. It's pure and utter virtue signalling.

If people want to go to London and protest outside parliament or Downing Street that is their business but anyone boycotting a venue or space for following the law is not making a political point but just seeking attention. Sadly the world is full of gutless, spineless people like @Harrywho want to make a lot of noise but lack the courage or conviction to target the people who make the laws and so make a big splash about punishing local businesses instead because it is so much easier to deprive a local business of money than to agitate for genuine change. I find it quite cowardly and shameful. 

Hilarious. I’ve agitated, my friend. I’ve made my feelings known. If everyone else did too then we might start to get somewhere. But there are far too many people staying silent and just willing to go along with this nonsense even though they know it’s not right. 

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2 minutes ago, Harry said:

Hilarious. I’ve agitated, my friend. I’ve made my feelings known. If everyone else did too then we might start to get somewhere. But there are far too many people staying silent and just willing to go along with this nonsense even though they know it’s not right. 

Nothing hilarious about it. You have whined a bit on the Internet and pledged to boycott a business that had no input in the rules. Utter virtue signalling. You get a bit of attention whilst doing nothing that changes anything.

Those people who have stayed silent have achieved precisely as much as you have with your pretend Protest, which is zilch. At least by staying silent, they are being honest about it.

 

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17 minutes ago, Harry said:

To your first paragraph - exactly. The vaccines aren’t infallible. But as I’ve mentioned, there are a remarkable number of people who actually think they are. 
 

Re the BBC. Well, well, well. I never knew you left in such dubious circumstances. I’ll ensure I mention you in my complaint letter. 
 

Re BCFC. I don’t expect them to do anything. They can’t. They have to comply. They won’t lose much money from my own input - season ticket is paid for and I won’t be asking for any refund for the games I don’t attend. My matchday spend usually amounts to £2.25 for a coffee. 
Of course, there may be lots of others who can’t attend and of course the club may lose money. I’d hope that they (and many other businesses who will lose money) will make a stand and pressure the government into not passing this through next week. If enough people say no, then they’d have to concede. However, the more people comply, those in power believe they’ve won. 
I get it - it’s every persons choice to attend, but I’d try to make a case to everyone that, by attending, you are complying. And by complying you are allowing the gradual tiptoe to more and more controls on your lives. This is the first step. See Scotland for the next step (ie lock yourself up at home if you’ve had contact, even if you are triple vaxxed), see Austria for the next step (ie fines for the unvaccinated), see Australia for the next step (ie quarantine for healthy, negative-tested citizens). Anyone who thinks it is wrong to lock healthy people up in a purpose built facility because they are a close contact of a positive case, ought to think about what they are complying with by attending a ‘vax pass’ event. 
I know it’s hard. People want their sport and entertainment, and their restaurants and their gigs and their skiing holidays etc etc, but for every single event that people comply with this tyranny, is one tiny step along the line that the government want you to take. 
 

I know that City can’t do anything about it. And I know it’s hard for fans to do anything about it. But I’d hope many fans are also business owners / employees, whose own livelihoods may be impacted by this, and maybe they ought to pressure those in power too. 
 

As I say, I won’t be complying with anything that requires me to prove I’ve been vaccinated. Whether that be football, restaurant, cinema, pub, whatever. Businesses need to stand against it to ensure they aren’t affected. I mean jeez - how many people have cancelled parties since the announcement 2 weeks ago, losing millions of pounds for millions of businesses, all over some irrational fear over a milder version of what we were already living with, fear caused by the government and the media. 
These businesses aren’t getting that money back. They aren’t getting any furlough this time around either. Fear has caused panic. Panic has resulted in cancellation of plans. Cancelled plans has resulted in millions of lost revenue, lost revenue could result in job losses or business closures, business closures could result in poverty, food bank use, drug abuse, homelessness, suicide etc!! 
 

People need to realise it’s not just the vax pass issue, it’s the whole shebang that’s occurred since omicron was announced. Fear and panic is the current pandemic. It’s time to say no. 

Fear is a powerful currency, for sure. I wonder if you realise that yours, and others, reaction to these restrictions/laws is also driven by a fundamental fear - as detailed in your post - of a creep of restrictions and "tyranny". 

A concern of harm to future society comes within the very definition of "fear".

Anyway, must give the Omicron report a read, apparently it's got a predicted R number of 3.3-4.4 so far more contagious than the original virus! 

 

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20 minutes ago, Harry said:

Hilarious. I’ve agitated, my friend. I’ve made my feelings known. If everyone else did too then we might start to get somewhere. 

Oh no! Not a real life agitator!

If only I'd known....

You are right about letting your feelings known....here's mine..

You read crap on the Internet and believe shit because it suits your agenda.

You have said you gained information from twitter, says it all really.

You laugh because a Police station is attacked and no doubt loved it when a Police vehicle was set alight.

To sum up, your a knob. Now I've made my feelings clear, hopefully we can start getting somewhere..

 

 

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17 minutes ago, Galley is our king said:

Oh no! Not a real life agitator!

If only I'd known....

You are right about letting your feelings known....here's mine..

You read crap on the Internet and believe shit because it suits your agenda.

You have said you gained information from twitter, says it all really.

You laugh because a Police station is attacked and no doubt loved it when a Police vehicle was set alight.

To sum up, your a knob. Now I've made my feelings clear, hopefully we can start getting somewhere..

 

 

The highlighted part. 
Prove it. 
I think you’ll find you have completely misrepresented what you thought you read on an earlier post in this thread. 
I think you’ll find that the truth is that I was the one who was calling out those who had attacked the police vehicle. I was very much NOT the one who was ‘laughing’ about it - quite the opposite. 
Still, well done for your very incorrect input. Shows exactly how much attention you’ve been paying. 

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9 minutes ago, joe jordans teeth said:

Come to the last page just out of curiosity because it was hot to see if@Harryhas had a Christmas tipple or two or just a angry young man who gets his info on social media,haven’t decided yet so carry on …

 Curiosity clearly got the better of you then and you decided to post anyway. Well done. And welcome to your education. 

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22 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Fear is a powerful currency, for sure. I wonder if you realise that yours, and others, reaction to these restrictions/laws is also driven by a fundamental fear - as detailed in your post - of a creep of restrictions and "tyranny". 

A concern of harm to future society comes within the very definition of "fear".

Anyway, must give the Omicron report a read, apparently it's got a predicted R number of 3.3-4.4 so far more contagious than the original virus! 

 

And if the variant is indeed more contagious, and so far seemingly less deadly, then this is a good thing. 
End of the day, much like any respiratory virus, at some point we are ALL gonna get it. 
So if a milder form of this virus can quickly become the dominant strain then maybe less people will die from Delta. 
Should be a good thing, right? 

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5 minutes ago, Harry said:

And if the variant is indeed more contagious, and so far seemingly less deadly, then this is a good thing. 
End of the day, much like any respiratory virus, at some point we are ALL gonna get it. 
So if a milder form of this virus can quickly become the dominant strain then maybe less people will die from Delta. 
Should be a good thing, right? 

Could be, however the early evidence (as I've just posted) suggests that this variant has mutated so that it is far more resilient to the initial vaccinations and antibodies people developed naturally to combat the virus. Again, this is entirely unsurprising - it's what the flu does year in, year out. 

Fortunately, the booster vaccine seems to have much better efficacy and hence why every effort should be made to get that into people's arms. 

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16 minutes ago, Harry said:

The highlighted part. 
Prove it. 
I think you’ll find you have completely misrepresented what you thought you read on an earlier post in this thread. 
I think you’ll find that the truth is that I was the one who was calling out those who had attacked the police vehicle. I was very much NOT the one who was ‘laughing’ about it - quite the opposite. 
Still, well done for your very incorrect input. Shows exactly how much attention you’ve been paying. 

No, it must be true, I read it somewhere on the intranet...its where I get all my information don't you know..

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16 minutes ago, Galley is our king said:

No, it must be true, I read it somewhere on the intranet...its where I get all my information don't you know..

Don’t believe everything you read squire. 

9 minutes ago, joe jordans teeth said:

Let’s hope your knowledge is better on this than football,you can’t be totally clueless about 2 things surely ?

Nice one centurion 

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20 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Could be, however the early evidence (as I've just posted) suggests that this variant has mutated so that it is far more resilient to the initial vaccinations and antibodies people developed naturally to combat the virus. Again, this is entirely unsurprising - it's what the flu does year in, year out. 

Fortunately, the booster vaccine seems to have much better efficacy and hence why every effort should be made to get that into people's arms. 

But a less deadly strain is a good thing. Less people will die than would have done, vax or no vax. Which is why, by imposing restrictions, we’ll be keeping the deadlier delta in circulation and not let the milder Omicron become dominant. 
If you can allow the milder version to take over from the deadlier version, surely that should be done as early as possible to save more lives? No? 

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7 minutes ago, Harry said:

And if the variant is indeed more contagious, and so far seemingly less deadly, then this is a good thing. 
End of the day, much like any respiratory virus, at some point we are ALL gonna get it. 
So if a milder form of this virus can quickly become the dominant strain then maybe less people will die from Delta. 
Should be a good thing, right? 

If it’s three times more contageous, but  produces half the hospitalisations per infection, we would still see a rise in total hospitalisations, so we far from out the woods yet.

This is still the biggest pandemic to hit the world since the Spanish flu and that killed millions.

I’ll say one thing to you, as you’re one of the chief anti-restriction protestors.

It’s alright you standing on your soapbox shouting about our civil liberties being denied.  Would you have such a cavalier attitude to the results of the virus if you were actually in a position in government where you’re  answerable for the results if you made tbe wrong call and it resulted in a massive loss off life?

It’s easy to do what you’re doing and you’re clearly proud of yourself for your protest, but luckily for you, it means **** all if you’re wrong. 

Unluckily for others, they DO bave to make these decisions and certainly aren’t helped when unaccountable people are spouting conspiracy crap that was probably started by some deluded ******* wannabe Fox Mulder on twitter, who never has to back up their claims!

 

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6 minutes ago, Harry said:

But a less deadly strain is a good thing. Less people will die than would have done, vax or no vax. Which is why, by imposing restrictions, we’ll be keeping the deadlier delta in circulation and not let the milder Omicron become dominant. 
If you can allow the milder version to take over from the deadlier version, surely that should be done as early as possible to save more lives? No? 

A less deadly but dominant strain would be absolutely great news but it’s speculation at the moment

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