Pearson post match ….

[maxjak]

53 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

You can coach until you are blue in the face but the truth is no amount of coaching can prevent a player doing what you ask him to do properly one week and not the next. In the case of Atkinson he did well against Derby and was shocking today. How is that down to coaching? He proved against Derby that he can put the coaching into practice but also proved today that he can't do it every week whilst he is coming to terms with the higher standard.

What cannot be coached is the split second concentration levels needed to play elite level football. You either have it or you have to learn it through the odd mistake or you don't have it and end up in the National League. Look at the Leeds kid at right back tonight who would no doubt have been coached to death since he was 8 and has recently been coached by that "mug" Bielsa who presumably doesn't know jack shit either, literally lost concentration for a split second and bang, 1-0 down two seconds later.

Without a doubt your points are valid, however i cannot exonerate Nige completely, when the same mistakes are repeated, and our manager was a top central defender who obviously knows how to organise a defensive unit.  My main concern are some of his team selections,  i have not seen a great deal of progress in 10 months, but maybe he will redeem himself in the window........though that will be hard to achieve.

[DaveInSA]

3 hours ago, maxjak said:

Mostly agree with your opinion.......the square pegs in round holes assessment is accurate, his Martin fixation and the lack of fitness and poor coaching are also a concern. 

How do you know fitness and coaching are poor?

are you at Failand every day?

Pearson doesn’t trust anyone else to play up front. The options are paper thin. Wells and Semenyo?

So what do you suggest? 

[DaveInSA]

3 hours ago, petehinton said:

He’s just said on RB that Defenders aren’t good enough but they’re what we’re stuck with….

Well, you signed one of them and Kalas is one of the best defenders at this level…!

Didn’t he sign 3?

two pot shots from the lower leagues and Baker?

I just watched the highlights; Vyner is nowhere near good enough and they don’t play as a unit. Who is organising? Because from what I observe, we couldn’t organise a pi55 up in the Thatchers factory.

[mozo]

3 hours ago, the1stknowle said:

I still think Kalas is part of the problem. I know not many agree with that but our defensive record with him in team since Webster left… I honestly think it would be better for both parties to say goodbye. 

 

3 hours ago, petehinton said:

You’re right, apart from laying into Atkinson and the lack of quality from the centre backs for the goals, he was full of praise for them

I think the criticism from NP is fair. Vyner gave a needless, albeit it soft, penalty away and Atkinson I thought had a poor game by his standards and deserving of a roasting.

Kalas, I like his commitment, blocking and rocket-ship heading, but his marking and tracking ability is very err...zonal! He's very much found his level in my opinion.

I actually thought Huddersfield comfortably deserved the win. Definitely I'd criticise the wing back selections, but I'm not sure it's crisis time at the moment. 

 

[Show Me The Money!]

I wouldn’t say I’m in the thinking that we should be questioning NP’s position and get peoples likeness of his honesty but what I’m not so keen on is the distance it seems to suggest there is between him and the players. You don’t get the impression with him that him and the players are in this together. He talks as if he’s viewing the whole thing as an outsider looking in.

Obviously we don’t see what goes on within the training ground or changing room during matches but you just don’t get the impression that everyone is pulling in the right direction.

Some people’s argument that he’s got a crap squad to work with I don’t totally buy. We do have quite a few good players at this club who should be doing a lot better

Palmer, Wells, Kalas, Dasilva, O’Dowda, Wiemann, Atkinson, James, Massengo are all very good players who aren’t all playing to they’re potential and it’s the manager’s job to get them there and keep them there. Not forgetting the promising home grown players too.

So for me NP has to take some responsibility for our struggles over the last year. It’s not just that we have crap players. We don’t.

[maxjak]

1 hour ago, DaveInSA said:

How do you know fitness and coaching are poor?

are you at Failand every day?

Pearson doesn’t trust anyone else to play up front. The options are paper thin. Wells and Semenyo?

So what do you suggest? 

!0 months ......and some of the players have not appeared to have  improved or learnt?    We are poor in possession, and give the ball away too easily. .  Making smug remarks like.."Are you at Failand every day?" 'is just pompous and pointless.  Surely the evidence is apparent during matches that we have a problem maintaining concentration and physicality over 90-95 minutes.  I realise Nige's hands are tied to an extent, but making the best of what is available is the mark of a good manager?.  I would certainly give Martin a rest occassionally, Conway is now fit, and Wells could be utilised more ( But Nige doesn't like him)   i didn't have to loiter at Failand's High Performance Centre to glean that?   I really hope Nige turns it around, the window is a chance to show us how smart he is, and despite  the dangers and obstacles of the January market...........surely  some loans can come in and out, to improve things? 

[Pezo]

52 minutes ago, Show Me The Money! said:

I wouldn’t say I’m in the thinking that we should be questioning NP’s position and get peoples likeness of his honesty but what I’m not so keen on is the distance it seems to suggest there is between him and the players. You don’t get the impression with him that him and the players are in this together. He talks as if he’s viewing the whole thing as an outsider looking in.

Obviously we don’t see what goes on within the training ground or changing room during matches but you just don’t get the impression that everyone is pulling in the right direction.

Some people’s argument that he’s got a crap squad to work with I don’t totally buy. We do have quite a few good players at this club who should be doing a lot better

Palmer, Wells, Kalas, Dasilva, O’Dowda, Wiemann, Atkinson, James, Massengo are all very good players who aren’t all playing to they’re potential and it’s the manager’s job to get them there and keep them there. Not forgetting the promising home grown players too.

So for me NP has to take some responsibility for our struggles over the last year. It’s not just that we have crap players. We don’t.

The first 2 paragraphs are basically what he has been saying since he has arrived “get on the bus” (always a weird analogy because on the bus you’re a passenger whereas what he is saying is those that aren’t on the bus are passengers and aren’t coming on the journey).

The second half I disagree with if your saying they are good enough to be better than where we are, of the 9 players you call out 3 would be top half championship players but would all need someone along side them to bring out there best whereas they have sub 22yo’s beside them, 3 are where they should be at the bottom half of the championship and 3 are playing a league above where they should be for there current ability. If we can only name 3 top half championship players out of our squad then I would say there is merit in saying he hasn’t got much to work with.

[NcnsBcfc]

5 hours ago, LondonBristolian said:

Bentley reminds me of Shay Given, in the sense that he makes great saves but seems to find himself in teams that are defensively suspect to an extent that you really wonder if it is a coincidence. My questions would be how good his communication are and how much the defence trust him? With Kalas, I think there is a similar thing that - whilst he does a lot of good things - we've struggled to find a defensive unit that works around him. He's been in too many poor defensive partnerships for it to always be his partners' fault...

I think the thing with Kalas is he often thinks with his heart, rather than his head. 

When he is playing alongside better players  and thus able to focus on his own game, he's an excellent international defender. You don't get the amount of caps he has through being poor. When he played with Webster, collectively they were the best centre back partnership i'd seen at City in the last 40 years. Yes of course, Webster was superb; but Kalas also played a massive part in that combination.

Unfortunately when he is around young, inexperienced; or plainly not up to it defenders; he obviously tries too hard to cover their failings; and in the process completely compromises his own performances.

He's not a leader of course, however you look at him sometimes and think he should be. He gets emotionally involved in situations when things start going wrong; and his head drops.

Looking at Huddersfield's first goal today. It looks to me as if his first movement is to try to help Atkinson out, as if he feels he's going to lose the challenge. In the process he takes his eye off the runner coming through.

I think in essence, he doesn't trust the defenders he's playing alongside at the moment to get the job done.

Anybody who's played football to a decent level, will know that dreadful feeling when as a defender you line up with players that you can't trust.

Edited December 19, 2021 by NcnsBcfc

[NcnsBcfc]

Whilst people might be drawing comparisons with Huddesfield today on their squad against ours.

Let' not forget that:-

A) They were awful last season, and were in the bottom six most of the season.

B) Were in receipt of Parachute payments that allowed an easier transition from a PL club to a Championship one.

C) Were able to get rid of most of the High earners during the summer. We are still lumbered with a majority of ours until Summer 2023.

D) Despite their failings last season with a young new manager. They didn't panic, even though they had been a PL for a couple of seasons a few years before; sack him; and try to bring someone new in.

Let's not forget, if we had beaten them today we would have been level on points with them in the league.

Yes, this season is a real struggle and the football is extremely poor at times. But I fail to see how making a change now  would be anything other than a massive gamble that could easily backfire on us again.

NP said a 3 year project when he started (probably based on the summer 2023 as mentioned above).

The graphs on budgets to turnover, and the earnings from transfer fees show how we've wasted a golden opportunity over the last 4 years to progress.

We have to do things differently, and that will require people to understand that there will be good performances, bad performances; and sometimes awful performances. That is City at the moment.

The main thing is we need to stay in this division during this financial/team rebuild. It's not going to be pretty; but it is, what it is

[Son of Fred]

6 hours ago, sticks 1969 said:

What the owner who has bank rolled us

built a nice stadium 

built a state of art training ground 

However much £££ are in the account the bloke knows as much about football as you can write on the back of a postage stamp 

Been asleep at the wheel for years & allowed Ashton free hand to squander the family silver & preside over an internal shambles.

Should we stay up this season & subsequently begin to turn the corner it'll be inspite of him,,not because of him.

 

Edited December 19, 2021 by Son of Fred

[Rebounder]

31 minutes ago, NcnsBcfc said:

Whilst people might be drawing comparisons with Huddesfield today on their squad against ours.

Let' not forget that:-

A) They were awful last season, and were in the bottom six most of the season.

B) Were in receipt of Parachute payments that allowed an easier transition from a PL club to a Championship one.

C) Were able to get rid of most of the High earners during the summer. We are still lumbered with a majority of ours until Summer 2023.

D) Despite their failings last season with a young new manager. They didn't panic, even though they had been a PL for a couple of seasons a few years before; sack him; and try to bring someone new in.

Let's not forget, if we had beaten them today we would have been level on points with them in the league.

Yes, this season is a real struggle and the football is extremely poor at times. But I fail to see how making a change now  would be anything other than a massive gamble that could easily backfire on us again.

NP said a 3 year project when he started (probably based on the summer 2023 as mentioned above).

The graphs on budgets to turnover, and the earnings from transfer fees show how we've wasted a golden opportunity over the last 4 years to progress.

We have to do things differently, and that will require people to understand that there will be good performances, bad performances; and sometimes awful performances. That is City at the moment.

The main thing is we need to stay in this division during this financial/team rebuild. It's not going to be pretty; but it is, what it is

Good post. I'm also reminded of Warburton at QPR who was under a fair bit of pressure not that long ago, but slowly turned it around. I can understand why people are frustrated with the performances though. 

Edited December 19, 2021 by Rebounder

[old_eastender]

Once again, having listened to NPs post-match interview in full, a very honest assessment by NP. You cannot really argue with anything he said.

The thing is can he sort it out though?  On that the jury is still out I'd say. He doesn't help himself by his obsession in playing Chris Martin all the time, defending starts from the front and his dire lack of mobility really does not help. The build-up to their 2nd goal started from CM failing to hold the ball. 

[Rob k]

13 minutes ago, old_eastender said:

Once again, having listened to NPs post-match interview in full, a very honest assessment by NP. You cannot really argue with anything he said.

The thing is can he sort it out though?  On that the jury is still out I'd say. He doesn't help himself by his obsession in playing Chris Martin all the time, defending starts from the front and his dire lack of mobility really does not help. The build-up to their 2nd goal started from CM failing to hold the ball. 

He wont be able to sort it out with the current squad no

Edited December 19, 2021 by Rob k

[Waconda]

8 hours ago, Show Me The Money! said:

I wouldn’t say I’m in the thinking that we should be questioning NP’s position and get peoples likeness of his honesty but what I’m not so keen on is the distance it seems to suggest there is between him and the players. You don’t get the impression with him that him and the players are in this together. He talks as if he’s viewing the whole thing as an outsider looking in.

Obviously we don’t see what goes on within the training ground or changing room during matches but you just don’t get the impression that everyone is pulling in the right direction.

Some people’s argument that he’s got a crap squad to work with I don’t totally buy. We do have quite a few good players at this club who should be doing a lot better

Palmer, Wells, Kalas, Dasilva, O’Dowda, Wiemann, Atkinson, James, Massengo are all very good players who aren’t all playing to they’re potential and it’s the manager’s job to get them there and keep them there. Not forgetting the promising home grown players too.

So for me NP has to take some responsibility for our struggles over the last year. It’s not just that we have crap players. We don’t.

Some good insight here - IMO.

[BigTone]

14 hours ago, Andy082005 said:

Can’t wait to hear what tripe he comes out with tonight 

sure it will be an “open and honest” interview that will get lapped up again 

Almost 12 months on and it’s still a shambles . I’m truely amazed people can honestly look at us and see progress 

Starting to lose any enthusiasm TBH

[Loosey Boy]

Interesting to hear Nige’s comments re Pring after the game - was due to start yesterday but Pring himself then said he wasn’t “ready”……not sure that will have gone down well with NP. CP did well when he came on.

It does still beg the question re DaSilva though - as @Davefevs said yesterday; can only assume he’s making up the numbers before we look to move him on in Jan (if there are any takers)

[DaveInSA]

8 hours ago, maxjak said:

!0 months ......and some of the players have not appeared to have  improved or learnt?    We are poor in possession, and give the ball away too easily. .  Making smug remarks like.."Are you at Failand every day?" 'is just pompous and pointless.  Surely the evidence is apparent during matches that we have a problem maintaining concentration and physicality over 90-95 minutes.  I realise Nige's hands are tied to an extent, but making the best of what is available is the mark of a good manager?.  I would certainly give Martin a rest occassionally, Conway is now fit, and Wells could be utilised more ( But Nige doesn't like him)   i didn't have to loiter at Failand's High Performance Centre to glean that?   I really hope Nige turns it around, the window is a chance to show us how smart he is, and despite  the dangers and obstacles of the January market...........surely  some loans can come in and out, to improve things? 

Not pompous. I was asking you to support your opinion, with some facts.

What you’ve stated above re ‘losing concentration’ - how do you coach that? That is an individual weakness- which is far too prevalent in the DNA of our players.

Ashton deliberately recruited ‘mentally weak’ players. As a collective their is no coherence and no leadership on the pitch. You can’t coach that - I think it’s telling that our under 23s are showing these seasoned pros the dark art of shithousery.

We’ll not do much business in Jan (I hope we do) there’s no money. We’re spending all our cash on Players to sit on their backsides. So unless KP, JD, Wells and Moore go, we can’t afford it.

we have defenders who can’t defend, a midfield that is non existent and an attack spearheaded by a geriatric. All in all it’s a total mess. 

[DaveInSA]

9 hours ago, Show Me The Money! said:

I wouldn’t say I’m in the thinking that we should be questioning NP’s position and get peoples likeness of his honesty but what I’m not so keen on is the distance it seems to suggest there is between him and the players. You don’t get the impression with him that him and the players are in this together. He talks as if he’s viewing the whole thing as an outsider looking in.

Obviously we don’t see what goes on within the training ground or changing room during matches but you just don’t get the impression that everyone is pulling in the right direction.

Some people’s argument that he’s got a crap squad to work with I don’t totally buy. We do have quite a few good players at this club who should be doing a lot better

Palmer, Wells, Kalas, Dasilva, O’Dowda, Wiemann, Atkinson, James, Massengo are all very good players who aren’t all playing to they’re potential and it’s the manager’s job to get them there and keep them there. Not forgetting the promising home grown players too.

So for me NP has to take some responsibility for our struggles over the last year. It’s not just that we have crap players. We don’t.

Very good players. I’d gamble that none of them would make it into a top 6 side in this division.

Very inconsistent players too. For me, they’re not good enough. They don’t have the mental fortitude. They’re not ‘winners’. They expend a lot of energy but deliver little.

[Waconda]

8 minutes ago, DaveInSA said:

Very good players. I’d gamble that none of them would make it into a top 6 side in this division.

Very inconsistent players too. For me, they’re not good enough. They don’t have the mental fortitude. They’re not ‘winners’. They expend a lot of energy but deliver little.

Kalas, Weimann, Bentley would for sure.

The players are not as bad as many "conveniently" claim them to be.

We have a mid table Championship squad that has under performed during NPs reign BUT importantly for me things have improved since the Blackburn game, on the pitch, in the dug out and obviously on the training ground. Continue like we are and I can see safety this season and possible light at the end of the tunnel.

Slip back to where we were the weeks before NP went away Ill last time and a change will be required.

[exAtyeoMax]

Are we playing with fear? So many reasons why performances can be effected. I’m not anti Nige but it’s a strange game to play, with the “bus” analogy and seemingly deliberately leaving players out, plus his post match comments regarding the quality of the squad he has to play with. To me, it all seems very negative, or at least creates a kind of malaise, for fans and possibly the players (as his comments are made in public).

RB/Gary Owers commented repeatedly yesterday about how we only started playing towards the end of the match, and that we can do it…

Perhaps Nige should have kept all these comments private/on the training ground. Even so, it strikes me that this style of management isn’t that productive. 

[Rob k]

34 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

I think we have good players at this level. I was disappointed in what I saw yesterday.

Huddersfield manager has them playing some very good football. That comes from the training ground.

Tactically there were problems first half in their shape against ours when we didnt have the ball. And when we did have the ball we didnt pass it well enough.

Whatever Pearson said at half time seemed to make us worse 2nd half.

Hopefully O'Dowda will be back next week as I think we missed him. We no longer had a direct threat on either wing.

I wonder if Pearson might go to a new system soon. I think it might have been a good idea to go something like 4141 2nd half yesterday.

Huddersfield played some nice football as they had O’Brian absolutely running the game - we have nobody even remotely as good as him in that position 

[maxjak]

1 hour ago, DaveInSA said:

Not pompous. I was asking you to support your opinion, with some facts.

What you’ve stated above re ‘losing concentration’ - how do you coach that? That is an individual weakness- which is far too prevalent in the DNA of our players.

Ashton deliberately recruited ‘mentally weak’ players. As a collective their is no coherence and no leadership on the pitch. You can’t coach that - I think it’s telling that our under 23s are showing these seasoned pros the dark art of shithousery.

We’ll not do much business in Jan (I hope we do) there’s no money. We’re spending all our cash on Players to sit on their backsides. So unless KP, JD, Wells and Moore go, we can’t afford it.

we have defenders who can’t defend, a midfield that is non existent and an attack spearheaded by a geriatric. All in all it’s a total mess. 

Do you honestly believe that Ashton set out deliberately to recruit mentally weak players?  I agree that he is despicable Judas, but that would be some agenda to pursue?  Ha!

[JoeAman08]

13 hours ago, sludge said:

We’re Bristol City, most fans on here were turning their nose up at the suggestion of Steven Gerrard 18 months ago. Laughable 

Not sure if I am getting your point right but just because we are Bristol City does not mean we can’t get a good manager in. Our recruitment of managers seems to be similar to how this forum would hire. Who are the names available? Do they have an affiliation with City already? Think there needs to be more due diligence in recruiting someone to run this club. 

1 hour ago, JonDolman said:

I think we have good players at this level. I was disappointed in what I saw yesterday.

Huddersfield manager has them playing some very good football. That comes from the training ground.

Tactically there were problems first half in their shape against ours when we didnt have the ball. And when we did have the ball we didnt pass it well enough.

Whatever Pearson said at half time seemed to make us worse 2nd half.

Hopefully O'Dowda will be back next week as I think we missed him. We no longer had a direct threat on either wing.

I wonder if Pearson might go to a new system soon. I think it might have been a good idea to go something like 4141 2nd half yesterday.

I don’t feel like formation matters when people like Weimann, Martin and James can’t be dropped. Not saying they are poor or shouldn’t ever start. Saying because all 3 of them play all the time, it is hard to blend anything else into this squad. 4141 could work but he needs to be brave enough to drop Weimann or Martin in it imo. Yesterday would have been brave to play Pring LWB and Benarous centrally for Weimann. I know Weimann scored twice but he really didn't help Massengo and James at all defensively. We got cut through the middle time after time because Weimann was too far forward or too wide thinking about attacks. We keep killing ourselves with James in a two. Makes him and his partner so ineffective. Not his fault nor a lack of effort. He just doesn’t have the legs in games like yesterday. 

[The Bard]

The game I saw yesterday saw us start very aggressively pressing high which resulted in our goal.  Huddersfield clearly well coached looked to play through our press.  As soon as they did it put our defence in the position where they have to decide whether to follow the press up or drop off to deal with the counter attack and that is where we lost the game.

 

On at least 2 occasions (build up to the penalty and the 3rd goal), Atkinson got that decision badly wrong, following a player into midfield who just ran him out of position. Their equaliser also came from such a circumstance with Scott pressing high and Vyner getting sucked into midfield meaning they got an overlap down our right.  Even then Atkinson was completely indecisive edge of our box when a bit of cynicism would've got him a yellow but stopped a goal.

2nd goal was also down to indecision between the RCB and RWB.

Once we brought on Pring for Atkinson I thought we improved markedly, creating enough chances to have got back into the game.  

I'm intrigued as to how Pearson reacts to this.  He's called Atkinson out for his performance but I wonder if we'll go back to a back 4.  If we do, I'd expect to see Tanner and Pring starting but am interested whether Vyner or Atkinson get hooked.  If we stay with a 3, Pring will play left of the 3.

 

 

 

 

[Sleepy1968]

2 hours ago, Loosey Boy said:

Interesting to hear Nige’s comments re Pring after the game - was due to start yesterday but Pring himself then said he wasn’t “ready”……not sure that will have gone down well with NP. CP did well when he came on.

It does still beg the question re DaSilva though - as @Davefevs said yesterday; can only assume he’s making up the numbers before we look to move him on in Jan (if there are any takers)

Interesting comment re Pring - I hope "not ready" in terms of fitness only. And that's much better than Nige deciding that AB is a better fit in that position.

Re Dasilva - he seems to be persona non-grata. Can put decent crosses in on his day but I don't think he's a great defender and as we've seen is easy to play against due to us playing narrow (why we do that is another question). Isn't he under contract until June 2023? Might be difficult to shift unless say LJ or MA want him.

[Olé]

2 hours ago, DaveInSA said:

we have defenders who can’t defend, a midfield that is non existent and an attack spearheaded by a geriatric

Match Report: West Brom away

Match Report: Birmingham away

Match Report: Coventry away

Match Report: Sheff Utd away

Match Report: Hull away

[ChubStixx]

The players are better than they're being made out to be. We can definitely get more out of them.

Squad looks devoid of confidence and the right mentality to me.

[Ian M]

Until we fix recruitment at this club we won't succeed under any manager. We only enjoyed a level of success under LJ as some of the 50 odd signings were decent and able to improve the starting XI. But if you are bringing in those sorts of numbers you're gonna get 1 or 2 right.

With our finances we can't repeat that approach unless a couple of our Academy lads end up going for Webster/Kelly/Reid/Bryan money.

We really need to be identifying youngsters with decent potential that at any time we sign them, we believe we can develop them into top 6 Championship players within 2 years and hope that 1 season we get to keep enough of them at the club to get to the PL. Then we can get relegated and receive the bounce-back monies.

Aside from that, with the current squad I'd look to pick a back 4 who can defend, 4 CBs if need be. 2 from James, Massengo & Williams in front. Then I'd be interested to see how Benayous and Scott got on in a 3 behind Semenyo with 1 other.

[pillred]

15 minutes ago, Olé said:

Match Report: West Brom away

Match Report: Birmingham away

Match Report: Coventry away

Match Report: Sheff Utd away

Match Report: Hull away

Groundhog day?

[lenred]

I’m going well against the grain here but I enjoyed much of yesterday. Thought we played some good, aggressive football at times but were let down with some poor positioning and even worse refereeing.  We are where we are at the moment squad ability wise and we will continue to get results go against us a fair portion of the time. Just got to try and enjoy the ride for what it is.
One slight gripe though.  Please can we now stop with the attacking the Atyeo second half. It’s doing my nut in!