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Ashton Gate 8 Tribute


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3 Peaps In A Podcast Bonus Show. A bumper episode with a post match review of the Cardiff win plus a chat with Scott Davidson on the forthcoming AG8 celebrations.  A chat with Kory about his book on the 2014/2015 double winning season.

https://www.podbean.com/ei/pb-w63hy-11874d7

https://open.spotify.com/episode/0brXGsv22b82fuZYHHP4pJ?si=enDDIfWwThaaXpNjjeaSBw

https://apple.co/33zEcWZ

 

 

 

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12 hours ago, Wivs7 said:

3 Peaps In A Podcast Bonus Show. A bumper episode with a post match review of the Cardiff win plus a chat with Scott Davidson on the forthcoming AG8 celebrations.  A chat with Kory about his book on the 2014/2015 double winning season.

https://www.podbean.com/ei/pb-w63hy-11874d7

https://open.spotify.com/episode/0brXGsv22b82fuZYHHP4pJ?si=enDDIfWwThaaXpNjjeaSBw

https://apple.co/33zEcWZ

 

 

 

Enjoyable listen and interesting to hear Scott Davidson talking about plans for the Boro game - hopefully will be a success we owe a huge debt of gratitude to the Ashton Gate 8. Unfortunately I think the club in the past hasn’t done enough and hopefully this will change now going forward. 
 

@Shtanley @petehinton and @headhuntercertainly worth promoting 

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4 hours ago, daored said:

Enjoyable listen and interesting to hear Scott Davidson talking about plans for the Boro game - hopefully will be a success we owe a huge debt of gratitude to the Ashton Gate 8. Unfortunately I think the club in the past hasn’t done enough and hopefully this will change now going forward. 

Seconded, good to hear that Scott Davidson is contributing and is still a fan.

Will need to remind myself to be seated 15 minutes early for the Middlesbrough game, as they hope the centre two blocks of the Dolman will be able to hold up cards to produce an 8, which will be in addition to a surfer flag in the South Stand! Perhaps that should be the “Eight Men Had a Dream Stand”! 🤩

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  • The title was changed to Ashton Gate 8 Tribute
On 25/01/2022 at 09:03, East End Old Boy said:

Suggest a listen to the podcast and hear Scott Davidson’s plans for the Ashton Gate 8 tribute, before the Middlesbrough game and the fans involvement!

Agreed it was a great listen and superb to hear Scott has organised it.

This needs as much publicity as possible.

Edited by One Team
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On 24/01/2022 at 09:10, daored said:

Enjoyable listen and interesting to hear Scott Davidson talking about plans for the Boro game - hopefully will be a success we owe a huge debt of gratitude to the Ashton Gate 8. Unfortunately I think the club in the past hasn’t done enough and hopefully this will change now going forward. 
 

@Shtanley @petehinton and @headhuntercertainly worth promoting 

Revisionist history had no limits it seems. Amazing how the facts (sic) of the matter appear in the hands of those who weren't around at the time.

City owe nothing to 'The 8', unless that is you wanted City to go bust, which is nearly where they took the club. 'The 8' looked only after themselves, for which I don't blame them, but lest not forget the players immediately became free agents and later were paid around half of the outstanding balance on their contracts, so it's not as though they were left high and dry. Bristol Dockers who were being shafted at the time weren't so fortunate. Kids singing their stupid song might start by asking themselves if 'The 8' were such heroes then why were their testimonials so poorly attended? Answer, although one or two genuinely had been playing heroes most weren't and all their attitudes at screwing as much as possible out of the club didn't go down well with fans.

At the time the players, Merrick in particular, were filmed saying they'd never set foot in AG ever again. For several years Merrick also wasn't shy in describing his thoughts on the club's treatment of him, as many a person who's worked in the building trade will attest. How times (and facts) change.

And no, if there's a card on my seat dream on if you think it'll be held aloft, as those like me who thought my beloved club all but gone recall how the hard the PFA had to work to talk the players out of their demands.

City's sad chapter should be buried, not celebrated.

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8 minutes ago, BTRFTG said:

Revisionist history had no limits it seems. Amazing how the facts (sic) of the matter appear in the hands of those who weren't around at the time.

City owe nothing to 'The 8', unless that is you wanted City to go bust, which is nearly where they took the club. 'The 8' looked only after themselves, for which I don't blame them, but lest not forget the players immediately became free agents and later were paid around half of the outstanding balance on their contracts, so it's not as though they were left high and dry. Bristol Dockers who were being shafted at the time weren't so fortunate. Kids singing their stupid song might start by asking themselves if 'The 8' were such heroes then why were their testimonials so poorly attended? Answer, although one or two genuinely had been playing heroes most weren't and all their attitudes at screwing as much as possible out of the club didn't go down well with fans.

At the time the players, Merrick in particular, were filmed saying they'd never set foot in AG ever again. For several years Merrick also wasn't shy in describing his thoughts on the club's treatment of him, as many a person who's worked in the building trade will attest. How times (and facts) change.

And no, if there's a card on my seat dream on if you think it'll be held aloft, as those like me who thought my beloved club all but gone recall how the hard the PFA had to work to talk the players out of their demands.

City's sad chapter should be buried, not celebrated.

Wow, just wow, docker were you?

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3 minutes ago, BTRFTG said:

Revisionist history had no limits it seems. Amazing how the facts (sic) of the matter appear in the hands of those who weren't around at the time.

City owe nothing to 'The 8', unless that is you wanted City to go bust, which is nearly where they took the club. 'The 8' looked only after themselves, for which I don't blame them, but lest not forget the players immediately became free agents and later were paid around half of the outstanding balance on their contracts, so it's not as though they were left high and dry. Bristol Dockers who were being shafted at the time weren't so fortunate. Kids singing their stupid song might start by asking themselves if 'The 8' were such heroes then why were their testimonials so poorly attended? Answer, although one or two genuinely had been playing heroes most weren't and all their attitudes at screwing as much as possible out of the club didn't go down well with fans.

At the time the players, Merrick in particular, were filmed saying they'd never set foot in AG ever again. For several years Merrick also wasn't shy in describing his thoughts on the club's treatment of him, as many a person who's worked in the building trade will attest. How times (and facts) change.

And no, if there's a card on my seat dream on if you think it'll be held aloft, as those like me who thought my beloved club all but gone recall how the hard the PFA had to work to talk the players out of their demands.

City's sad chapter should be buried, not celebrated.

It wasn't the 8's fault that the club was bankrupt, that was down to mismanagement by the Board at the time, the contracts the players were given while in Div 1 should have had clauses regarding what would happen if the club was relegated. The players at that time weren't on the sort of wages being paid now and had families to look after, some were towards the end of their playing days. The club at the time focussed on them to stop people noticing that it was the Board's fault the club was in such a mess financially. This is not revisionist, I was there while it was going on.

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28 minutes ago, BTRFTG said:

Revisionist history had no limits it seems. Amazing how the facts (sic) of the matter appear in the hands of those who weren't around at the time.

City owe nothing to 'The 8', unless that is you wanted City to go bust, which is nearly where they took the club. 'The 8' looked only after themselves, for which I don't blame them, but lest not forget the players immediately became free agents and later were paid around half of the outstanding balance on their contracts, so it's not as though they were left high and dry. Bristol Dockers who were being shafted at the time weren't so fortunate. Kids singing their stupid song might start by asking themselves if 'The 8' were such heroes then why were their testimonials so poorly attended? Answer, although one or two genuinely had been playing heroes most weren't and all their attitudes at screwing as much as possible out of the club didn't go down well with fans.

At the time the players, Merrick in particular, were filmed saying they'd never set foot in AG ever again. For several years Merrick also wasn't shy in describing his thoughts on the club's treatment of him, as many a person who's worked in the building trade will attest. How times (and facts) change.

And no, if there's a card on my seat dream on if you think it'll be held aloft, as those like me who thought my beloved club all but gone recall how the hard the PFA had to work to talk the players out of their demands.

City's sad chapter should be buried, not celebrated.

Well i must be a big kid because iam 65 and love the 8 men had dream song and always singalong hero’s everyone one of them especialy sir geoffrey merrick

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25 minutes ago, BTRFTG said:

Revisionist history had no limits it seems. Amazing how the facts (sic) of the matter appear in the hands of those who weren't around at the time.

City owe nothing to 'The 8', unless that is you wanted City to go bust, which is nearly where they took the club. 'The 8' looked only after themselves, for which I don't blame them, but lest not forget the players immediately became free agents and later were paid around half of the outstanding balance on their contracts, so it's not as though they were left high and dry. Bristol Dockers who were being shafted at the time weren't so fortunate. Kids singing their stupid song might start by asking themselves if 'The 8' were such heroes then why were their testimonials so poorly attended? Answer, although one or two genuinely had been playing heroes most weren't and all their attitudes at screwing as much as possible out of the club didn't go down well with fans.

At the time the players, Merrick in particular, were filmed saying they'd never set foot in AG ever again. For several years Merrick also wasn't shy in describing his thoughts on the club's treatment of him, as many a person who's worked in the building trade will attest. How times (and facts) change.

And no, if there's a card on my seat dream on if you think it'll be held aloft, as those like me who thought my beloved club all but gone recall how the hard the PFA had to work to talk the players out of their demands.

City's sad chapter should be buried, not celebrated.

Fair play for having the nads to post this.

There is a lot of truth and good points raised.

That's not to say I agree with it all though. The overriding factor for me is that if the same scenario had happened in a different era after that, would any other group of players do it? It makes me think of Sol Campbell that dug his heels in over 'money owed' by Portsmouth when they were on their @rse. They were close to going out of business too and he was just one player that refused to give up his contractual rights. I think it was f@ckin image rights FFS.

I was only 13 at the time of the 1982 saga and I still remember the fear of us losing my team and the relief when we were rescued. The sheer joy of seeing us play Fulham at home after that. I guess that is where the fondness of the 8 comes from for me. It is a sad chapter in our history that should never be forgotten for so many reasons but I definitely will celebrate it because whichever way I look at it. City wouldn't exist without the actions of the 8. 

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33 minutes ago, BTRFTG said:

Revisionist history had no limits it seems. Amazing how the facts (sic) of the matter appear in the hands of those who weren't around at the time.

City owe nothing to 'The 8', unless that is you wanted City to go bust, which is nearly where they took the club. 'The 8' looked only after themselves, for which I don't blame them, but lest not forget the players immediately became free agents and later were paid around half of the outstanding balance on their contracts, so it's not as though they were left high and dry. Bristol Dockers who were being shafted at the time weren't so fortunate. Kids singing their stupid song might start by asking themselves if 'The 8' were such heroes then why were their testimonials so poorly attended? Answer, although one or two genuinely had been playing heroes most weren't and all their attitudes at screwing as much as possible out of the club didn't go down well with fans.

At the time the players, Merrick in particular, were filmed saying they'd never set foot in AG ever again. For several years Merrick also wasn't shy in describing his thoughts on the club's treatment of him, as many a person who's worked in the building trade will attest. How times (and facts) change.

And no, if there's a card on my seat dream on if you think it'll be held aloft, as those like me who thought my beloved club all but gone recall how the hard the PFA had to work to talk the players out of their demands.

City's sad chapter should be buried, not celebrated.

Very interesting post and something I’ve often thought about in regards the AG8.

Im too young to remember 1982 and reading through articles about events at the time can be quite confusing. My limited understanding was that there were people working incredibly hard in the background, putting their own livelihoods on the line trying to keep the club alive, who rarely get mentioned...which I think is a huge shame.

Had the 8 dug their heels in would they have received the full amount of their contracts or would they have got nothing? 


I’m grateful to the AG8, I’m just not sure how much of a choice they really had? I think they’re often held up as the sole saviours of the club when in reality others contributed just as much. 

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11 minutes ago, Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan said:

Had the 8 dug their heels in would they have received the full amount of their contracts or would they have got nothing? 

They would have become creditors the administrators retaining their registrations in an attempt to sell them to other clubs, not they were worth anything. This could have taken years, during which time they'd have been unable to have earned a living as footballers.

'The 8' held out for everything they could get, negotiated by Gordon Taylor in his first days as head of the PFA. There's a great account of the facts in For The Love Of The Game (The Official History Of The PFA.)

Did the 8 have a dream? No, they had a nightmare.

Did they tear up their contracts? No, as negotiated by the PFA their playing contracts were annulled but replaced with contracts handing them their registrations, an interim pay-off plus commitments by the new club for longer term compensation. Recall the PFA were also trying to protect their other members still at the club, for whom 'The 8' appeared not to hold consideration.

Were they heroes? Nowhere near as heroic as the board members who devised and saw through City's salvation, those fans who scrimped to buy worthless shares and those who kept turning up to see an assortment of kids getting tonked, week in, week out.

Was it 'The 8's' fault City were in such dire straits? No, that sits wholly with board and management but any suggestion having seen the club's plight that 'The 8' sought to help the club out of it's bind is farcical. They looked after themselves and themselves only, as is their right. That they had Hobson's Choice, that's life and heroism doesn't enter into it.

And then there's the bit few mention. So these 8 heroic players, all free agents, what became of them and their careers? Virtually nothing, that's what. And why? Because despite their long contracts at AG they either weren't any good else were looking at their playing days in the rearview mirror. City didn't prevent them from having success elsewhere. That they didn't is all one needs to know.

1 hour ago, frenchred said:

Wow, just wow, docker were you?

No, but many who stood alongside me on the terrace were.

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City had gone from.the old first division right down to the bottom of the football league. Had social media (including this forum) been around at the time many of these players would have been seen as stealing a living and justifiably received dogs' abuse for their on-the-field capitulation. At the time.they left the the best deal.for them - no altruism, nothing heroic.

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2 hours ago, BTRFTG said:

Revisionist history had no limits it seems. Amazing how the facts (sic) of the matter appear in the hands of those who weren't around at the time.

City owe nothing to 'The 8', unless that is you wanted City to go bust, which is nearly where they took the club. 'The 8' looked only after themselves, for which I don't blame them, but lest not forget the players immediately became free agents and later were paid around half of the outstanding balance on their contracts, so it's not as though they were left high and dry. Bristol Dockers who were being shafted at the time weren't so fortunate. Kids singing their stupid song might start by asking themselves if 'The 8' were such heroes then why were their testimonials so poorly attended? Answer, although one or two genuinely had been playing heroes most weren't and all their attitudes at screwing as much as possible out of the club didn't go down well with fans.

At the time the players, Merrick in particular, were filmed saying they'd never set foot in AG ever again. For several years Merrick also wasn't shy in describing his thoughts on the club's treatment of him, as many a person who's worked in the building trade will attest. How times (and facts) change.

And no, if there's a card on my seat dream on if you think it'll be held aloft, as those like me who thought my beloved club all but gone recall how the hard the PFA had to work to talk the players out of their demands.

City's sad chapter should be buried, not celebrated.

As someone who was around at the time, watched them in Division 4,bought the shares etc., I totally agree with you.  Although 6 of them were City heroes having been part of the promotion winning team/ top flight journey, they were also responsible for the abysmal performances that saw us drop down the leagues.  If this had happened these days, when we no longer have to rely on a drip-feed from the local media who held the view that the 8 were martyrs, they would have been run out of town for the shocking and abysmal performaces they were putting in.

The contracts were not their fault, and obviously no-one likes to see people lose their jobs, but if they had been worth the money we were paying them they would have been snapped up by rival clubs.

Edited by New Dazzler
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2 hours ago, BTRFTG said:

Revisionist history had no limits it seems. Amazing how the facts (sic) of the matter appear in the hands of those who weren't around at the time.

City owe nothing to 'The 8', unless that is you wanted City to go bust, which is nearly where they took the club. 'The 8' looked only after themselves, for which I don't blame them, but lest not forget the players immediately became free agents and later were paid around half of the outstanding balance on their contracts, so it's not as though they were left high and dry. Bristol Dockers who were being shafted at the time weren't so fortunate. Kids singing their stupid song might start by asking themselves if 'The 8' were such heroes then why were their testimonials so poorly attended? Answer, although one or two genuinely had been playing heroes most weren't and all their attitudes at screwing as much as possible out of the club didn't go down well with fans.

At the time the players, Merrick in particular, were filmed saying they'd never set foot in AG ever again. For several years Merrick also wasn't shy in describing his thoughts on the club's treatment of him, as many a person who's worked in the building trade will attest. How times (and facts) change.

And no, if there's a card on my seat dream on if you think it'll be held aloft, as those like me who thought my beloved club all but gone recall how the hard the PFA had to work to talk the players out of their demands.

City's sad chapter should be buried, not celebrated.

Thanks for this perspective, I didn’t know a lot of that. 

Having been fed the heroes line for decades you assume that’s the full story but I guess there is always a different side to things. 

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As catchy as the song is, “8 men had a dream” is hardly an accurate statement.

Glad to see there will be something to honour them though, whatever the opinions of the time, we wouldn’t have a club if they’d dug their heels in and refused the deal. There’s many who wouldn’t have

 

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3 minutes ago, MarcusX said:

As catchy as the song is, “8 men had a dream” is hardly an accurate statement.

Glad to see there will be something to honour them though, whatever the opinions of the time, we wouldn’t have a club if they’d dug their heels in and refused the deal. There’s many who wouldn’t have

 

Again that's not strictly true. City would have gone bust but salvation was in the ground being ring-fenced (a la Derby.)

A phoenix City would have emerged and irrespective at which level they might have started would still have had the hardcore of support that turned out to watch the 'kids and crocks' - and we shouldn't forget the heroism of some of those coming out of retirement or having the guts to pull on a shirt knowing they were light years out of their depth. Though many players of that era were truly talentless they didn't receive the ferocity of criticism they'd get today. They gave it a go. They gave their best and for little reward. That's heroism that deserves celebrating.

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Whilst, with the benefit of hindsight, you can turn it round to say that the eight were acting in their own best interests if they didn't think this at the time and instead thought that they had to compromise and lose money in order for the club to survive - as they were being told - then they should be celebrated.

People can only act upon the knowledge they have at the time and at the time they thought that they were losing serious money in order to save the club but agreed anyway.

That's what matters, not what happened afterwards in terms of their playing careers.

It would be churlish not to cheer eight players who thought that they were sacrificing a lot to save the club and did it anyway.

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30 minutes ago, Eddie Hitler said:

Whilst, with the benefit of hindsight, you can turn it round to say that the eight were acting in their own best interests if they didn't think this at the time and instead thought that they had to compromise and lose money in order for the club to survive - as they were being told - then they should be celebrated.

People can only act upon the knowledge they have at the time and at the time they thought that they were losing serious money in order to save the club but agreed anyway.

That's what matters, not what happened afterwards in terms of their playing careers.

It would be churlish not to cheer eight players who thought that they were sacrificing a lot to save the club and did it anyway.

Save that's not what happened and hindsight isn't required.

The 8 knew exactly the stark decision they had to make: hold out for everything, become creditors and end up with little else take the negotiated deal on offer. Forget not their decision was taken to the wire with the players and PFA trying to extract every last cent they could. Taylor pressured them to consider the other players who weren't getting their registrations or payoffs. He quickly realised City's board were truthful when stating if these contracts weren't annulled they'd have no option other than to call in the administrators. Taylor knew the contracts might never realistically be discharged. The players delay is what incurred the wrath of fans. There was no consideration for the club, the 8 were initially very bitter and vocal about the way they'd been treated. The footage of them repeating the PFA's official line (through gritted teeth) lingers.

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24 minutes ago, BTRFTG said:

Save that's not what happened and hindsight isn't required.

The 8 knew exactly the stark decision they had to make: hold out for everything, become creditors and end up with little else take the negotiated deal on offer. Forget not their decision was taken to the wire with the players and PFA trying to extract every last cent they could. Taylor pressured them to consider the other players who weren't getting their registrations or payoffs. He quickly realised City's board were truthful when stating if these contracts weren't annulled they'd have no option other than to call in the administrators. Taylor knew the contracts might never realistically be discharged. The players delay is what incurred the wrath of fans. There was no consideration for the club, the 8 were initially very bitter and vocal about the way they'd been treated. The footage of them repeating the PFA's official line (through gritted teeth) lingers.

 

Okay, my knowledge is second hand as I was young at the time but I have set out what people who were following it then have told me.

I won't continue to disagree on the basis of second hand information.

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1 minute ago, Eddie Hitler said:

 

Okay, my knowledge is second hand as I was young at the time but I have set out what people who were following it then have told me.

I won't continue to disagree on the basis of second hand information.

As I say, The PFA official history is a good starter and amazing to think this was Taylor's first day on the job. It also opened the floodgates for as soon as he looked into City's plight he was contacted by other clubs stating they'd soon have to act likewise. Taylor resolved to take a pragmatic view as to how best to protect all members interests, the first of which was to guard all parties against offering over long contract terms.

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45 minutes ago, BTRFTG said:

Save that's not what happened and hindsight isn't required.

The 8 knew exactly the stark decision they had to make: hold out for everything, become creditors and end up with little else take the negotiated deal on offer. Forget not their decision was taken to the wire with the players and PFA trying to extract every last cent they could. Taylor pressured them to consider the other players who weren't getting their registrations or payoffs. He quickly realised City's board were truthful when stating if these contracts weren't annulled they'd have no option other than to call in the administrators. Taylor knew the contracts might never realistically be discharged. The players delay is what incurred the wrath of fans. There was no consideration for the club, the 8 were initially very bitter and vocal about the way they'd been treated. The footage of them repeating the PFA's official line (through gritted teeth) lingers.

From what I am told one of the eight in particular is still extremely bitter about the whole thing to this day..........actually you mention it in one of your earlier posts.

Edited by Numero Uno
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6 hours ago, Banjo Island said:

Well i must be a big kid because iam 65 and love the 8 men had dream song and always singalong hero’s everyone one of them especialy sir geoffrey merrick

Who genuinely seems to be the most bitter of the eight to this day.....................

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13 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

From what I am told one of the eight in particular is still extremely bitter about the whole thing to this day..........

I don't blame them for being bitter or if they still are. They were given little notice as to what was about to happen to them. They went from security to insecurity within a matter of hours, much as anybody else facing enforced redundancy undergoes. Horrible and easy to understand why they needed to protect their own.

Like City players to this day their bitterness probably relates to the realization they'd never, ever get a deal as good as that they were presently on.

But like anybody else who's been escorted to the door clutching their P45 and minimum statutory redundancy it's unlikely you were offered hero status by colleagues or shareholders for sacrificing your lot to save the company.

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1 minute ago, BTRFTG said:

I don't blame them for being bitter or if they still are. They were given little notice as to what was about to happen to them. They went from security to insecurity within a matter of hours, much as anybody else facing enforced redundancy undergoes. Horrible and easy to understand why they need to protect their own.

Like City players to this day their bitterness probably relates to the realization they'd never, ever get a deal as good as that they were presently on.

But like anybody else who's been escorted to the door clutching their P45 and minimum statutory redundancy it's unlikely you were offered hero status by colleagues or shareholders for sacrificing your lot to save the company.

.............especially when the people remaining have got to do 120% of their current workload on 90% of the salary.

When you consider we gave Clive Whitehead an ELEVEN YEAR contract and Ritchie and Gow SEVEN year contracts you realise how mismanaged the club was at the time.

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