Our worst manager in the last 20 years …

[Fuber]

4 hours ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said:

Here we go again.

Who "people want"

We just don't get the choice on this. Is it a rhetorical  question when people ask this? Why is that when people question a Manager they are expected to state their replacement yet when they criticise a player they are not expected to name a suitable replacement from another club who is affordable available , better and would come here?

Please also remember that many on these particular pages don't actually go to games but formulate opinions based on 'watching' the radio or MDT. Even the TV is suspect for seeing the whole game as much movement is off screen and lost to the viewer.

The likelyhood of NP leaving is growing each game and whoever people would want to replace him is irrelevant because we don't make the decisions . We get what we're given because BCFC is an autocracy but we can decide whether we support any decision with hard cash because that's our freedom of choice.

 

I mean, you can either take it literally - or more perhaps how I mean it in that - do you trust the club to appoint anyone better out of those managers who are realistically available?

I genuinely think we're fudged either way.

[maxjak]

I see Mark Robins is still doing an outstanding job at Coventry on a limited budget? Rightly or wrongly............The phrase "If only" springs to mind?

[Marina's Rolls Royce]

36 minutes ago, Fuber said:

I mean, you can either take it literally - or more perhaps how I mean it in that - do you trust the club to appoint anyone better out of those managers who are realistically available?

I genuinely think we're fudged either way.

I think that at this point I'm in the can anyone of those do worse camp. What we don't know is who is realistically available at the end of this season or what the thinking is or what the budget is or whether we get a sell on bonus or cash-in on one or two of our players and if so, how much? It's not our job and whilst speculation is great fun it is merely that alone.

Despite a popular narrative that we are a basket case of a club- we are still an attractive proposition to many prospective Managers with brilliant facilities,Stadium, Performance centre, stable UK ownership and several emerging youth talents as well as some decent players in our squad. It's not all doom and gloom.

[RedRock]

57 minutes ago, maxjak said:

I see Mark Robins is still doing an outstanding job at Coventry on a limited budget? Rightly or wrongly............The phrase "If only" springs to mind?

Is that you Steve?
 

 I think possibly Steve would have chosen Robins in preference to LJ in the first place. Just a pity LJ convinced him and Jon that he was going to be the next Pep and they took the bait ( as others did). Pretty sure from the ‘World Class field’, Robins would have been Steve’s choice after LJ departed. 

We, I suspect, have Ashton to blame for Holden as it allowed him to continue his role unfettered. 

[Fuber]

1 hour ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said:

I think that at this point I'm in the can anyone of those do worse camp. What we don't know is who is realistically available at the end of this season or what the thinking is or what the budget is or whether we get a sell on bonus or cash-in on one or two of our players and if so, how much? It's not our job and whilst speculation is great fun it is merely that alone.

Despite a popular narrative that we are a basket case of a club- we are still an attractive proposition to many prospective Managers with brilliant facilities,Stadium, Performance centre, stable UK ownership and several emerging youth talents as well as some decent players in our squad. It's not all doom and gloom.

None of that in bold matters however does it?

Especially when we're in such a mess financially.

- Our facilities are good for this level sure. However.

- Stadium doesn't matter if we can't fill it, attendances and income will only decrease.

- Stable must be a by-word for innept and rudderless.

- Talents that will be sold to cover said ownerships own failings.

No other club at this levels has the sheer scale of cultural change required that we do, within both playing staff, ownership, and management.

The only club arguably in a worse situation than us that will be in this league next season is Reading. Maybe Birmingham.

And the latter two are all but hamstrung by worse owners than ours, which makes our situation all the more laughable.

I just don't see who joins us that has experience at this level. Simple as that. We'd end up with another lower league manager, a coach, or LJ. Warburton, if he leaves QPR as an example, would be mad to take us on. Much better clubs would be lining up for him, at the very least more stable than us currently.

[RedM]

14 hours ago, JBFC II said:

Says a lot about our club really that a fan can claim that a manager with a 25% win ratio is ‘one of the best we’ve ever had’. 
 

I think we should stick with Pearson (as realistically we can’t afford to sack him and replace him with someone better) but what’s he done thus far to be one of the best managers we’ve had in the last 20 years?

I don't know what the answer is but surely it cannot be good for the club if the reason he is still in post is that we cannot afford to sack him

[Numero Uno]

1 hour ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said:

I think that at this point I'm in the can anyone of those do worse camp. What we don't know is who is realistically available at the end of this season or what the thinking is or what the budget is or whether we get a sell on bonus or cash-in on one or two of our players and if so, how much? It's not our job and whilst speculation is great fun it is merely that alone.

Despite a popular narrative that we are a basket case of a club- we are still an attractive proposition to many prospective Managers with brilliant facilities,Stadium, Performance centre, stable UK ownership and several emerging youth talents as well as some decent players in our squad. It's not all doom and gloom.

Stable ownership? Do you mean shut the stable door after the horse has bolted? Any Manager worth his salt will want a budget and our offering is “we’re skint, on the verge of a points deduction and you get the few pennies left after we have sold the family silver”. They might then think “ok, let’s watch a few videos of what I would be inheriting” and if yesterday was one of them they would think we have a full squad of poor decision makers with so little bollocks that we have to make the Goalkeeper our Captain. That should get top managerial talent forming an orderly queue around the block

[Redandproud]

21 hours ago, Bristol Oil Services said:

Jon said we should be doing better.

Says a man who knows absolutely nothing about football

[Sir Geoff]

5 hours ago, RedRock said:

You haven’t mentioned CoD! So, progress. 

For me, CoDs time with us just sums up our entire situation/operation and why we are in an absolute cluster**** of a hole.

On your more general point though, I agree. Don’t think I can deal with another season of the same faces, making the same mistakes, the same attitudes, the same injuries, the same inconsistencies while a new manager assesses his squad.

Is the grass any greener on the other side? Possibly not, and you can point to Pearson’s appointments off and on the pitch and say, at best, they’ve made bugger all difference. The likes of Simpson, King have made us worse. Counter-argument would be how many ‘fresh slates’ do our players want? They’ve seen off LJ, Holden, Simpson and nearly Pearson.

I’ve reached the stage of roll-the-dice, I’m past watching the same old players churn out the same old performances. 

Ha ha I forgot all about him...totally agree with your comments. He sums the club up over the past 4 years.

[Lorenzos Only Goal]

23 hours ago, Citychuds said:

Holden would have got more out of this squad than Pearson. LJ would have got more out of this squad than Pearson. Cotterill would have got more out of this squad than Pearson. Maybe only a couple of positions but every position counts when we are the team that would be scrambling for points to stay up had Reading and Derby not had points deductions. 

With this squad Holden would have been down to playing fans due to the injury crisis.

[Portland Bill]

23 hours ago, Dredd said:

Stats aside, SOD and McInnes had us playing some terrible football. It’s not that bad, yet. 

You forgot Lee Johnson.

[RUSSEL85]

I’ve heard 3 people today saying, a relegation might do us some good, to reset etc and I always ask the same question. How many clubs are actually better of, after a relegation. It’s a complete myth! 

[Sturny]

23 minutes ago, RUSSEL85 said:

I’ve heard 3 people today saying, a relegation might do us some good, to reset etc and I always ask the same question. How many clubs are actually better of, after a relegation. It’s a complete myth! 

Would anyone buy into the idea it may not be good for other clubs, but its good for Bristol City? We seem to make or break down there. Comparing the team we had that went down last to the one that went up was a completely different vibe. 

In 5 years from now, is that what we need? The fastest way possible to shake this squad down? Idk

Edited April 10, 2022 by Sturny

[REDOXO]

22 hours ago, Hello Dave said:

Any other manager would’ve been sacked by now!!

The bloke who employed him, has given him a remit to bring through players, whilst keeping spending low to balance the books as much as possible. 
 

In the circumstances we are in Pearson has done what he’s been tasked to do while keeping us up!

As far as Mr Lansdown is concerned it’s mission accomplished for this season AND hopefully he can get a sale/investment while everyone is at it. 

The circumstances of Bristol City are not perfect but not unique. However they are exacerbated by the crazy purchase ‘policy’ under Ashton/LJ supported by The BoD and the Lansdown family leading us toward huge losses and probable FFP issues. 
 

So I disagree with your premise. The issue will only become a problem for Pearson if we are not competitive next season or alternatively Pearson walks. 

[weepywall]

7 hours ago, RUSSEL85 said:

I’ve heard 3 people today saying, a relegation might do us some good, to reset etc and I always ask the same question. How many clubs are actually better of, after a relegation. It’s a complete myth! 

Agree, can't see how a relegation can be any good, if we were to get relegated back to "Championship 2" as our friends call it in the near future I can see us being there for years, bouncing back quickly is not something we generally do and that league is a far tougher proposition now than when we were last in it. 

[Sturny]

6 hours ago, weepywall said:

Agree, can't see how a relegation can be any good, if we were to get relegated back to "Championship 2" as our friends call it in the near future I can see us being there for years, bouncing back quickly is not something we generally do and that league is a far tougher proposition now than when we were last in it. 

But if you asked this question in 2013-13 when we were relegated people would give the same answer as they are now. We would've just been slowing down the inevitable with that awful team we had, would've taken a lot longer to wash our hands of it if we stayed up. We came back up with a much more promising squad don't you think? 

Edited April 11, 2022 by Sturny

[GrahamC]

7 minutes ago, Sturny said:

But if you asked this question in 2013-13 when we were relegated people would give the same answer as they are now. We would've just been slowing down the inevitiable with that awful team we had, would've taken a lot longer to wash our hands of it if we stayed up. We came back up with a such more promising squad don't you think? 

My memory of our last relegation was that under the man who took us there, we were in real danger of dropping to League Two until we made a further change & Cotterill completely revitalised us, despite being a very unpopular appointment on here..

The one before was even worse, after just one season up we went back down & Wilson (4 years), Tinnion (nearly 2), then GJ did the same thing as Cotts, but it was painful playing Colchester, Stockport etc, year after year.

Our best plan (whoever is in charge) is incremental improvement at this level, going down won’t see any reset at all under our current ownership.

[weepywall]

5 minutes ago, Sturny said:

But if you asked this question in 2013-13 when we were relegated people would give the same answer as they are now. We would've just been slowing down the inevitable with that awful team we had, would've taken a lot longer to wash our hands of it if we stayed up. We came back up with a much more promising squad don't you think? 

I know what you are saying and in some ways I can see the point but I think League 1 is a different place now, we were a fairly big fish last time we were there but plenty of big clubs in that league now that are struggling to get out although Wigan and Rotherham seem to be making a good go of it to be fair. Personally I couldn't bear the thought of being in that league again.

[Sturny]

11 minutes ago, GrahamC said:

My memory of our last relegation was that under the man who took us there, we were in real danger of dropping to League Two until we made a further change & Cotterill completely revitalised us, despite being a very unpopular appointment on here..

The one before was even worse, after just one season up we went back down & Wilson (4 years), Tinnion (nearly 2), then GJ did the same thing as Cotts, but it was painful playing Colchester, Stockport etc, year after year.

Our best plan (whoever is in charge) is incremental improvement at this level, going down won’t see any reset at all under our current ownership.

7 minutes ago, weepywall said:

I know what you are saying and in some ways I can see the point but I think League 1 is a different place now, we were a fairly big fish last time we were there but plenty of big clubs in that league now that are struggling to get out although Wigan and Rotherham seem to be making a good go of it to be fair. Personally I couldn't bear the thought of being in that league again.

I don't think neither of you are wrong tbh. it'll be painful and if we drop it could be easily years. The way I see it we reset last time, and returned stronger. It just feels like we're clinging onto the league and not building. 

I guess I just sit in the camp that believes this club needs a harsh shakedown and relegation to ignite a reset. I don't see much in us to rebuild well enough whilst in the champ, that job needs to be taken off our hands going down and getting players poached. 

Edited April 11, 2022 by Sturny

[Sheltons Army]

1 hour ago, Sturny said:

But if you asked this question in 2013-13 when we were relegated people would give the same answer as they are now. We would've just been slowing down the inevitable with that awful team we had, would've taken a lot longer to wash our hands of it if we stayed up. We came back up with a much more promising squad don't you think? 

On average , it’s taken us 8 years to climb out of League One 

Not recommended 

[RedM]

15 hours ago, RUSSEL85 said:

I’ve heard 3 people today saying, a relegation might do us some good, to reset etc and I always ask the same question. How many clubs are actually better of, after a relegation. It’s a complete myth! 

And I would also add there are a lot of decent clubs,  (size, management/owners and history) down there. If we do go down in the next season or two I don't think we will bounce back as quick as some might hope.

 

[Red-Robbo]

On 09/04/2022 at 22:15, Sheltons Army said:

Well according to your stats (Without any context of what League & what circumstances)

....... That has Danny Wilson as at least our second best manager In this period.....

Yep , ok

 

The OP is using stats like a drunk uses a lamp post:  

For support rather than illumination. 

[MarcusX]

On 10/04/2022 at 09:10, AshtonGreat said:

We are but considering where we've finished the last few seasons, it isn't much of an achievement 

I disagree, given the mess we're in survival is an achievement any way it comes.

Is it pretty to watch? No. Have the deductions made it a little more comfortable? Certainly. But, at the start of the season it was the goal for most of us and we've achieved it

[Lanterne Rouge]

5 hours ago, RedM said:

And I would also add there are a lot of decent clubs,  (size, management/owners and history) down there. If we do go down in the next season or two I don't think we will bounce back as quick as some might hope.

 

This. When we were down there it was only PNE, Coventry, Barnsley & Blades that were anything like our `size`. 

[eardun]

7 hours ago, RedM said:

And I would also add there are a lot of decent clubs,  (size, management/owners and history) down there. If we do go down in the next season or two I don't think we will bounce back as quick as some might hope.

 

Agree. I also think that given our current predicament relegation (lower income etc) would be even more of an issue financially than it has in the past - potentially disastrous. 

[beaverface]

I remember when LJ joined, he asked for n transfer windows to get the players he needed. Those transfer windows then passed and he then finished one particular season by stating that the club needed to be brave and trust him to take us to the next level - it then proceeded to not work out!!!

When NP joined, he's asked at the beginning for 3 years to sort things out. He's probably realised he doesn't have the wriggle room that LJ had to wheel and deal, and ultimately his hands are tied by long term contracts preventing him spending money. So until those contracts expire and players are moved on, what can he do?

I'm happy to give NP the time required. It doesn't mean I'm happy with the football being played - it's pretty languid and un-exciting, but I do feel for the constraints we're under, and no matter what NP tries to do or say, it's the same players he's having to squeeze some kind of performance out of.

[Guest]

35 minutes ago, beaverface said:

I remember when LJ joined, he asked for n transfer windows to get the players he needed. Those transfer windows then passed and he then finished one particular season by stating that the club needed to be brave and trust him to take us to the next level - it then proceeded to not work out!!!

When NP joined, he's asked at the beginning for 3 years to sort things out. He's probably realised he doesn't have the wriggle room that LJ had to wheel and deal, and ultimately his hands are tied by long term contracts preventing him spending money. So until those contracts expire and players are moved on, what can he do?

I'm happy to give NP the time required. It doesn't mean I'm happy with the football being played - it's pretty languid and un-exciting, but I do feel for the constraints we're under, and no matter what NP tries to do or say, it's the same players he's having to squeeze some kind of performance out of.

You must also take into account NP`s players he has brought in have arguably made those areas no better or worse. The defence has been a joke and the middle has been from powderpuff to non existant.

His first year has brought twice as many defeats as wins, we are so "passive" and leaderless and to often produce downs league performances.

Lets cut to the chase re players; we have internationals on board and highly sought after youngsters wanted by prem clubs they need managing though and played in their strongest positions.

So year one of our latest manager is done, we are entering sell day time and the never ending re-build time which is no doubt soon to be repeated.... when the next in the long line of managers arrives.

Problem is our slip is showing and we will be likely to be one of the favs for the drop next season