Muppets

[Guest]

20 hours ago, daored said:

Remember used to stand at the bottom of the dolman stand as a kid with a programme and a pen during the warm up and the players would come and sign- not everyone’s admittedly and would head back either to the warm up or back in the changing rooms - how life has changed!!

Indeed, life has changed.......the benches around the pitch are gone along with every stand/terrace that was there during my first game.

Social media rules now, maybe phones should be banned from grounds then fans stages to perform on would be gone also.

Sky and other medias havent helped with way over the top coverage/analasis and the slow motion finger tip/toe offside decisions made are tiresome, why not let the refs decide thats what they are there for, not bleeding computers, sucks the life out of games.

Pitch invasions after last game why not, without fans the club are nothing, they have followed their club all over and been there for them and before many of the players were anywhere near this club.

Sorry but dont like the thread title we are ALL FANS imo, yes all, those who have been here 5mins and those who have been here over 50years

 

[Sixtyseconds]

On 02/05/2022 at 16:07, Merrick's Marvels said:

Well done Boro.

Any chance anyone at City wants to grow a pair and do likewise? 

Hope not.

Too much of that going on.

Down with stuff because we dont like their stuff.

But what for? 

A tradition.

This what bans are for?

How long? Ten years.?

Lets ban the children first ...Their noisy.

19 hours ago, Merrick's Marvels said:

Steaming horseshite from start to finish.

You can create a fantastic atmosphere in support of your team without acting like selfish d1kheads.

You can?

When do you do this?

Your going to have to be one hell of an architect of sound for YOU to be fantastic.

Edited May 3, 2022 by Sixtyseconds

[Northern Red]

Parklife!

[Merrick's Marvels]

50 minutes ago, Northern Red said:

Parklife!

Pondlife.

[Sixtyseconds]

10 minutes ago, Merrick's Marvels said:

Pondlife.

Put it on your wanted fans poster. 

 

 

 

[spudski]

Imo...what needs to happen, is stricter control over drink and more so... Colombian marching powder.

Imo, it's got far worse since 'coke' has become the norm.

As for the walk around the pitch...it isn't to celebrate the season, it's for players and families to thank the fans for their support.

[A Horse With No Name]

2 minutes ago, spudski said:

 

Imo, it's got far worse since 'coke' has become the norm

The queue for the gents cubicle has certainly lengthed at half time.

[Rich]

23 hours ago, KegCity said:

I did say not everyone wants to sing and thats fine. Equally they can't then moan about the atmosphere when they do nothing to help create one. Think the only thing I disagree with is about being next to away fans. You can't hear the away end from S82 unless they're deafening and I would imagine they can't really hear S82. Atmosphere was always much more hostile when you're packed in next to the away supporters. The best away atmospheres I've been part of have been when home fans have been next door. Talking about spreading noise is irrelevant when barely anyone joins in outside the immediate areas next to the singing section, aside from the occasional dreary "Come on you reds". I agree that the club would like everything as family friendly as possible, I would argue that those who want to get aggressive are going to do so regardless.

Don't really see the point of unreserved seating in the South Stand but if safe standing was widened I think it would be a good thing. You can still sit and watch the game fine, I have when we've been dreadful and had an unrestricted view. 2 and 3 would be nice but no idea if its logistically doable, also don't think it'll change the fact that most people aren't interested in creating an atmosphere.

 

 

With all due respect, I don't think you properly understood what I'm saying. 

You state that you cannot hear the away supporters from S82, unless they are deafening. Does this not also apply to other sections of the ground then? Or why opposition fans say they never heard the home fans. When your crew are quiet, what is the reason for that and, that reason might also be why the rest of the ground appear quiet. I would suggest that it's a lull in the play or, it's just not inspirational enough to get people excited enough to sing/chant whatever. The best atmospheres are created when it's a good game, nullify that a bit by keeping fans under control, which is why S 82 are in the corner and, it lessens the atmosphere  by making it less likely to join in. Hence why I said about splitting up the away support, other clubs do it.

As for those that would get aggressive anyway. That is of course the case but, put a barrier between two groups of opposing fans and it makes the animosity worse and "some", will take that a little further. Does this extra competition with the away supporters actually help the team? I would argue that it is tenuous at best. A lot is not aimed at either encouraging the team or discouraging the opposition, merely a who can insult the opposition support the most. And I'll be quite honest, most other supporters ignore it anyway, as they're engrossed actually watching the game.

As for making the middle sections of the SS unreserved, it's plainly obvious that, there are people that would go there and enjoy encouraging the team when attacking and helping the team when defending. Currently they cannot do that because of reserved seating, the same thing happened at the opening of the Atyeo, when the singers were pushed from pillar to post over quite a few years until, they finally shoved them in the most innocuous fragmenting space possible.

Increase the amount of people singing and you increase the noise. Position that behind the goal and it helps the team. That's why it's traditional to have the popular ends behind the goal, Think of all the successful teams and the majority have their what was once known as "choir" behind the goal. I've seen defending teams players almost quaking in their boots with the volume created at the old East End.

It would appear that like most people from S82 that have an opinion, it's more to do with their personal enjoyment of the game, than actually getting behind the team.

 

Edited May 3, 2022 by Rich
correction

[KegCity]

16 hours ago, Rich said:

With all due respect, I don't think you properly understood what I'm saying. 

You state that you cannot hear the away supporters from S82, unless they are deafening. Does this not also apply to other sections of the ground then? Or why opposition fans say they never heard the home fans. When your crew are quiet, what is the reason for that and, that reason might also be why the rest of the ground appear quiet. I would suggest that it's a lull in the play or, it's just not inspirational enough to get people excited enough to sing/chant whatever. The best atmospheres are created when it's a good game, nullify that a bit by keeping fans under control, which is why S 82 are in the corner and, it lessens the atmosphere  by making it less likely to join in. Hence why I said about splitting up the away support, other clubs do it.

As for those that would get aggressive anyway. That is of course the case but, put a barrier between two groups of opposing fans and it makes the animosity worse and "some", will take that a little further. Does this extra competition with the away supporters actually help the team? I would argue that it is tenuous at best. A lot is not aimed at either encouraging the team or discouraging the opposition, merely a who can insult the opposition support the most. And I'll be quite honest, most other supporters ignore it anyway, as they're engrossed actually watching the game.

As for making the middle sections of the SS unreserved, it's plainly obvious that, there are people that would go there and enjoy encouraging the team when attacking and helping the team when defending. Currently they cannot do that because of reserved seating, the same thing happened at the opening of the Atyeo, when the singers were pushed from pillar to post over quite a few years until, they finally shoved them in the most innocuous fragmenting space possible.

Increase the amount of people singing and you increase the noise. Position that behind the goal and it helps the team. That's why it's traditional to have the popular ends behind the goal, Think of all the successful teams and the majority have their what was once known as "choir" behind the goal. I've seen defending teams players almost quaking in their boots with the volume created at the old East End.

It would appear that like most people from S82 that have an opinion, it's more to do with their personal enjoyment of the game, than actually getting behind the team.

 

My point is that even when the singing section are in full voice there never seems to be much coming from the rest of the ground. Not been anywhere other than S82 since the pandemic but used to be the other end of the South Stand and the Dolman and you could hear a pin drop. Again not everyone wants to sing and thats fine, equally I have no interest in people moaning about the atmosphere that then don't add to it. I personally feel that being near the away fans brings out more chants, at a louder volume, as it becomes competitive. I again go back to the games where there were home fans in the Atyeo next to the away end. I have no interest in the hooligan side of things, but I enjoy the tribalism for 90 minutes. To me that's part of football and part of what distinguishes it from Rugby etc, it's all banter. 

I agree with you that it would be great for more of the SS to be unreserved, I'd like to see safe standing go across the whole stand and make it a "proper" home end like the East End was. Then you get your "choir" or whatever. Thats what I'm trying to get across. The more people that sing the better, so can more people please get involved? I think we agree on pretty much everything apart from being near the away end and having a right to moan? 

Yeah it certainly affects peoples enjoyment of the game, which in turn makes them less likely to create an atmosphere if you're enjoying the game less. To be honest I don't really understand your point, and that's my fault rather than yours. Either way, I assume we can all agree that the more people are getting involved the better the atmosphere is, and that anyone not in S82 is more than capable of creating a better atmosphere wherever they're sat if they don't like the current one.

Either way, hopefully we'll have more to analyse/sing/clap about next season 

[spudski]

Some interesting comments in this thread regarding ' atmosphere' and ' support'.

It's apparent there are those that just want to generate some noise and have ' banter' with the opposition's fans.

Then there are those who want to support the team on the field. To encourage and get behind them.

Obviously two different scenarios.

When supporting the team...what difference does it make if one stand can't hear another?

What counts is what can be heard on the pitch by the players. Often the players will mention how loud the support was. Imo...it's obviously heard louder on the pitch than in opposite stands.

Surely supporting and getting behind the team is most important?

Just creating ' white noise' for the sake of an ' atmosphere'...imo just becomes that...irritating noise.

It seems we've become a society where noise is seen as a good atmosphere.

The same when announcers scream...' make some noise'...it's just inane nonsense that doesn't serve any purpose. It's just noise. And noise is generally irritating or something you block out.

' show your appreciation' or ' show your support'...is a better instructed request.

I personally think we now misundstand as a society how to create atmosphere at grounds. Blaring loud music pre game actually kills a good atmosphere. Pre music blaring...crowds would anticipate the start of a game and an atmosphere would naturally build.

Again with singing...if it's done just to make some noise...then it kills any natural atmosphere. 

Can't beat some well sung chants supporting and getting behind the team...the rest of it is just irritating white noise.

[phantom]

2 minutes ago, spudski said:

I personally think we now misundstand as a society how to create atmosphere at grounds. Blaring loud music pre game actually kills a good atmosphere. Pre music blaring...crowds would anticipate the start of a game and an atmosphere would naturally build.

Again with singing...if it's done just to make some noise...then it kills any natural atmosphere. 

Can't beat some well sung chants supporting and getting behind the team...the rest of it is just irritating white noise.

Completely agree with this point, but it is easy to name songs that fans use the tunes of to sign along to - these songs kill two birds by creating the tunes for fans to sign to

[spudski]

12 minutes ago, phantom said:

Completely agree with this point, but it is easy to name songs that fans use the tunes of to sign along to - these songs kill two birds by creating the tunes for fans to sign to

Never been a fan of ' singing'...much prefer hearing gutteral chants of support.

Singing just comes across like nursery rhymes...sends you to sleep. Maybe not for those singing. 

I just find the idea of 'singing' at footy a bit weird. I guess it's aimed more for the fans having a jolly drunken sing along together. Because imo...it doesn't help the team, it's just for the fans to enjoy together. 

 

 

[southside]

On 02/05/2022 at 16:07, Merrick's Marvels said:

Well done Boro.

Any chance anyone at City wants to grow a pair and do likewise? 

I don't think us banning a Middlesbrough father and  son would worry then too much  

[Rich]

56 minutes ago, KegCity said:

My point is that even when the singing section are in full voice there never seems to be much coming from the rest of the ground. Not been anywhere other than S82 since the pandemic but used to be the other end of the South Stand and the Dolman and you could hear a pin drop. Again not everyone wants to sing and thats fine, equally I have no interest in people moaning about the atmosphere that then don't add to it. I personally feel that being near the away fans brings out more chants, at a louder volume, as it becomes competitive. I again go back to the games where there were home fans in the Atyeo next to the away end. I have no interest in the hooligan side of things, but I enjoy the tribalism for 90 minutes. To me that's part of football and part of what distinguishes it from Rugby etc, it's all banter. 

I agree with you that it would be great for more of the SS to be unreserved, I'd like to see safe standing go across the whole stand and make it a "proper" home end like the East End was. Then you get your "choir" or whatever. Thats what I'm trying to get across. The more people that sing the better, so can more people please get involved? I think we agree on pretty much everything apart from being near the away end and having a right to moan? 

Yeah it certainly affects peoples enjoyment of the game, which in turn makes them less likely to create an atmosphere if you're enjoying the game less. To be honest I don't really understand your point, and that's my fault rather than yours. Either way, I assume we can all agree that the more people are getting involved the better the atmosphere is, and that anyone not in S82 is more than capable of creating a better atmosphere wherever they're sat if they don't like the current one.

Either way, hopefully we'll have more to analyse/sing/clap about next season 

As I've said in previous posts, how can you tell if there's no noise coming from other areas if you and those around you are making a noise? Your efforts and attention are put into making that noise. To hear other parts of the ground you'd have to be separate from that noise source. Where I sit I am separate from that source and, you can also hear other areas and the whole ground. I'm not saying it's perfect or that it's the whole ground, just small pockets. It takes an awful lot to get 50+ year olds chanting songs, especially if they're not known and, there's very little hope of anything other than the odd traditional older songs. Shouting encouragement and clapping the teams efforts is about the best you'll get from most people, at most grounds. Frankly some of it is embarrassing as well. Can you imagine being there with your family or anyone else's family and chanting about some footballer shagging your wife and you encouraging it?

As for being next to away supporters, it has no desired effect in getting others to take part as it's mostly aimed at the away support, the rest of the ground is separated from it. No doubt there's been great atmospheres at away matches that you've enjoyed, because you enjoy that aspect, others don't want it. I'd also bet that most clubs don't want that either, as they want to nullify away support. If it were directly adjacent to other home support, then it has a chance of spreading, in the Atyeo it hasn't, as there's a natural break. Plus there's also the fact that the allocated away area has to be of a certain size for cup games, meaning that at times the home section is outnumbered by the away section, not good practice. That's why central to the South Stand is the ideal place, just like in the old East End days, when it would encourage adjoining fans to join in, either side of the main group. Currently the powers that be can control any rowdiness, which is why S82 are in that corner.

[southside]

2 hours ago, southside said:

I don't think us banning a Middlesbrough father and  son would worry them too much  

 

[spudski]

From the same Millwall game where the stewards did nothing...a Millwall fan takes it into his own hands to clear the pitch. https://www.facebook.com/EFLBantz/videos/1866014863593769/?app=fbl

[italian dave]

20 minutes ago, spudski said:

From the same Millwall game where the stewards did nothing...a Millwall fan takes it into his own hands to clear the pitch. https://www.facebook.com/EFLBantz/videos/1866014863593769/?app=fbl

There’s nothing quite as weird as a bunch of Millwall fans, eh?

[Three Lions]

On 01/05/2022 at 14:57, Harry said:

Embarrassing to run on the pitch. 
Embarrassing also for players to do a lap of honour after a dreadful season. 
Why not just do what they do at the final whistle of every match - do a lap, applaud the fans, say bye. 
I didn’t see the point of going down the tunnel, collecting their kids and then coming back out. It’s was as it there was something we should all be grateful for, when in truth we’re all mostly glad the season has ended and we’re safe! 
The delay with the players heading off down the tunnel just increased the length of time these nobbers had to plan their embarrassing pitch invasion. 

Some of the fans you call nobbers you know from when you were more regular around the City pubs. You wouldnt say it to their faces!

On 04/05/2022 at 12:11, spudski said:

Some interesting comments in this thread regarding ' atmosphere' and ' support'.

It's apparent there are those that just want to generate some noise and have ' banter' with the opposition's fans.

Then there are those who want to support the team on the field. To encourage and get behind them.

Obviously two different scenarios.

When supporting the team...what difference does it make if one stand can't hear another?

What counts is what can be heard on the pitch by the players. Often the players will mention how loud the support was. Imo...it's obviously heard louder on the pitch than in opposite stands.

Surely supporting and getting behind the team is most important?

Just creating ' white noise' for the sake of an ' atmosphere'...imo just becomes that...irritating noise.

It seems we've become a society where noise is seen as a good atmosphere.

The same when announcers scream...' make some noise'...it's just inane nonsense that doesn't serve any purpose. It's just noise. And noise is generally irritating or something you block out.

' show your appreciation' or ' show your support'...is a better instructed request.

I personally think we now misundstand as a society how to create atmosphere at grounds. Blaring loud music pre game actually kills a good atmosphere. Pre music blaring...crowds would anticipate the start of a game and an atmosphere would naturally build.

Again with singing...if it's done just to make some noise...then it kills any natural atmosphere. 

Can't beat some well sung chants supporting and getting behind the team...the rest of it is just irritating white noise.

Making some noise banter being close to the away fans was part of it for quite a few. Its not your it but it for is some. noise is atmosphere and the noise the banter the stupid odd chants (Tom Thumb??) frequently will keep the atmosphere going as well as the game does. City used to have stars in the crowd like AP and co who could work and lift a crowd, and their chants sometimes had little to do with the game they were jokes about us their fans all sorts leading into a chant getting behind the team then the next was about drinking ten pints then back to the team. You call that irritating others enjoyed being part of the din. Making noise doesnt kill natural atmosphere whatever that means.   

Most important? Enjoying the experience is the most important thing and used to be what also happened off the pitch Citys characters were stars. The singing section has been used to control atmosphere in the Dolman stop fans using one rule for the singing section and a rule that you can only do that in the singing section for the rest. That has led to less noise, less atmosphere less supporting of the team fro the Dolman. 

 

[spudski]

36 minutes ago, Three Lions said:

Some of the fans you call nobbers you know from when you were more regular around the City pubs. You wouldnt say it to their faces!

Making some noise banter being close to the away fans was part of it for quite a few. Its not your it but it for is some. noise is atmosphere and the noise the banter the stupid odd chants (Tom Thumb??) frequently will keep the atmosphere going as well as the game does. City used to have stars in the crowd like AP and co who could work and lift a crowd, and their chants sometimes had little to do with the game they were jokes about us their fans all sorts leading into a chant getting behind the team then the next was about drinking ten pints then back to the team. You call that irritating others enjoyed being part of the din. Making noise doesnt kill natural atmosphere whatever that means.   

Most important? Enjoying the experience is the most important thing and used to be what also happened off the pitch Citys characters were stars. The singing section has been used to control atmosphere in the Dolman stop fans using one rule for the singing section and a rule that you can only do that in the singing section for the rest. That has led to less noise, less atmosphere less supporting of the team fro the Dolman. 

 

With respect, you aren't telling me anything I don't already know. Been going since the 70s. Seen pretty much all of it. From every stand.

Thing is...times moved on. People change....mature.

I feel you are in a minority these days. You'll always have a few 'lads'... Young ens trying to make their mark, and old en's trying to relive their youth. You can see it a mile off. Trying to create something they remember fondly.

I sense you are harking back to the old days, and wish they were still the same?

I am sorry you don't understand the difference between inane noise ( white noise) and atmosphere. There is a big difference.