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Bored already, immediate end of season thoughts!


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I'll watch the L1 play off matches to see who we will be playing next season but otherwise football is over this season. I certainly have no interest in the Nations league, The various European competition finals or the FA Cup final. 

I'll not be bored though as there will be plenty of cricket, horse racing and cycling (Giro D'Italia, TDF) to pique my sporting interests. 

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11 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Agreed but easier said than done.

People often cite the Cotts double season as how to do recruitment right- and it was. Difference of course is that there is so much more competition at this level, clubs with a equally large or larger income, recent PL history etc and yes bigger clubs- we were quite a big fish in summer 2014, whereas there is a lot more competition and complication with deals the higher the club goes.

It all depends on the financial situation at any given time. We were always seen as a bigger fish at league 1 level.

I always view good recruitment and achievement on longevity and sustainability, rather than short term solutions. Always looking ahead. 

And this is where this club has failed. Either employing people who looked at short term solutions, or then going down the MA route of turnover and mediocrity smothered in bullshit.

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13 minutes ago, RoystonFoote'snephew said:

I'll watch the L1 play off matches to see who we will be playing next season but otherwise football is over this season. I certainly have no interest in the Nations league, The various European competition finals or the FA Cup final. 

I'll not be bored though as there will be plenty of cricket, horse racing and cycling (Giro D'Italia, TDF) to pique my sporting interests. 

Omg there football to watch and 🏏 cricket

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19 minutes ago, spudski said:

It all depends on the financial situation at any given time. We were always seen as a bigger fish at league 1 level.

I always view good recruitment and achievement on longevity and sustainability, rather than short term solutions. Always looking ahead. 

And this is where this club has failed. Either employing people who looked at short term solutions, or then going down the MA route of turnover and mediocrity smothered in bullshit.

Perfect description of Ashton there Spud.  Will use that in conversation...

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13 minutes ago, RoystonFoote'snephew said:

Yes. I have zero interest in UEFAs corrupt club competitions, Liverpool,  Real Madrid or Chelski and the Nations league is an unnecessary addition to the football calendar. 

But footballs football. Who cares about the rest of the shit. It's the game that matters and it's only live once

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8 minutes ago, Rocking Red Cyril said:

But footballs football. Who cares about the rest of the shit. It's the game that matters and it's only live once

I love football. I've been following City for 60 years so I must do. But it's not the only sport for me, and I welcome the summer break to recharge the batteries so I'm ready to go again next season. 

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2 hours ago, The turtle said:

I'm guess the last 15 minutes stat comes from points won and points lost ...... Because it feels like a  hell of a lot more. If we talk about points dropped from winning positions in the last 5 minutes, I would be shocked if it wasn't over 15 points. 

Turtle here’s my reckoning….you might be surprised 

Points dropped / gained due to late goals (in the last fifteen minutes of games) this season

Home to Blackpool - 2 points

Away to Forest Green Rovers - meaning a penalty shoot out which we lost 6-5

Home to Luton - 2 points

Away to QPR + 2 points

Home to Fulham + 1 point

Away at Peterborough + 2 points

Home to Forest - 3 points

Away to Coventry - 2 points

Home to Blackburn - 2 points

Away to Hull - 0 points (both teams scored beyond 75 minutes)

Home to QPR - 1 point

Home to Millwall +2 points

Away to Preston - 2 points

Away to Swansea - 2 points

Home to Coventry - 2 points

Away to Blackburn + 2 points

Home to WBA - 0 points (both teams scored beyond 75 minutes)

Overall - 7 points

Points dropped / gained due to goals (in the last five minutes + additional time of games) this season

Home to Blackpool - 2 points they equalized in the 93 minute

Home to Luton - 2 points they equalized in the 91 minute

Away to QPR + 2 points we scored in the 93 minute

Home to Forest - 3 points they scored in the 91 and 92 minutes

Away to Coventry - 1 point they scored in the 92 minute

Away to Hull + 1 point we equalized in the 91 minute

Home to QPR - 1 point they scored in the 93 minute

Home to Millwall +2 points we scored in the 85 minute

Away to Preston - 2 points they equalized in the 94 minute

Home to Coventry - 1 point they scored in the 89 minute

Away to Blackburn + 2 points we scored in the 92 minute

Away to Stoke +2 points we scored in the 84 minute

12  points lost, 9 points gained, overall 3 points lost.

 

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19 minutes ago, Jerseybean said:

Turtle here’s my reckoning….you might be surprised 

Points dropped / gained due to late goals (in the last fifteen minutes of games) this season

Home to Blackpool - 2 points

Away to Forest Green Rovers - meaning a penalty shoot out which we lost 6-5

Home to Luton - 2 points

Away to QPR + 2 points

Home to Fulham + 1 point

Away at Peterborough + 2 points

Home to Forest - 3 points

Away to Coventry - 2 points

Home to Blackburn - 2 points

Away to Hull - 0 points (both teams scored beyond 75 minutes)

Home to QPR - 1 point

Home to Millwall +2 points

Away to Preston - 2 points

Away to Swansea - 2 points

Home to Coventry - 2 points

Away to Blackburn + 2 points

Home to WBA - 0 points (both teams scored beyond 75 minutes)

Overall - 7 points

Points dropped / gained due to goals (in the last five minutes + additional time of games) this season

Home to Blackpool - 2 points they equalized in the 93 minute

Home to Luton - 2 points they equalized in the 91 minute

Away to QPR + 2 points we scored in the 93 minute

Home to Forest - 3 points they scored in the 91 and 92 minutes

Away to Coventry - 1 point they scored in the 92 minute

Away to Hull + 1 point we equalized in the 91 minute

Home to QPR - 1 point they scored in the 93 minute

Home to Millwall +2 points we scored in the 85 minute

Away to Preston - 2 points they equalized in the 94 minute

Home to Coventry - 1 point they scored in the 89 minute

Away to Blackburn + 2 points we scored in the 92 minute

Away to Stoke +2 points we scored in the 84 minute

12  points lost, 9 points gained, overall 3 points lost.

 

Wow only 12 points lost.. (7 unique occasions) 

I mean "only" 

That can't be in line with league average, it just can't.  There was a moment this season where instead of having the urge to chuck my phone out the window, I was laughing at the ridiculousness of it. 

12 points is somewhat surprising 

7 unique occasions - 46 games (15% of games) 

 

P. S thanks for the info, appreciated 👍👌

 

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21 minutes ago, The turtle said:

Wow only 12 points lost.. (7 unique occasions) 

I mean "only" 

That can't be in line with league average, it just can't.  There was a moment this season where instead of having the urge to chuck my phone out the window, I was laughing at the ridiculousness of it. 

12 points is somewhat surprising 

7 unique occasions - 46 games (15% of games) 

 

P. S thanks for the info, appreciated 👍👌

 

And nine points gained so remarkably only three lost overall, like you I find that surprising.

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8 hours ago, maxjak said:

i believe that it is absolutely crucial that we recruit at least 2 quality midfield players........for me the lack of combative ball winners and their ability to pass consistently is a major failing.  James and  Williams are competent squad players, but alongside the excellent Scott, we need some more quality?   Whether that is possible to achieve within the confines of our budget,, i don't know, but i am certain that there are players out there who we can recruit, if our scouting  department pulls their weight, who are available, and good enough.   We have a good attack, which could probably do with one addition, and an improving defence, but i feel that our midfield is sub standard, and is in need of a major upgrade?   Maybe HNM's departure can provide the funds?   I love HNM, and wish him all the very best in his future career.............perhaps he can leave us with sufficient funds to overhaul our midfield as his parting gift?? 

Puzzling post, is our midfield in all it's permutations that bad that however good HNM is we have still struggled to stop teams dominating us in the middle of the park, I'm struggling to get my head around the fact that he is worth millions yet we are constantly out played in midfield and he often looks lost and uninterested, hardly a ringing endorsement for other teams to sign him. 

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8 hours ago, Bristol Oil Services said:

You don't think our defence is bad?

It has been but…We don’t concede from dead balls anymore so there has been massive improvement notably since Kalas has been injured. The back three has two guys that had never played in this division before this season one of which hadn’t before about ten weeks ago. The improvement is self evident. However you defend as a team and we have got to be more aggressive in midfield!
 

 

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I predicted 17th. We finished 17th. For my next trick I'll predict the next EuroMillions draw!  :laugh:

What was pleasing was that by the end of the season we looked a better side than we did at the start. Pearson had identified some areas of weakness, got things more organised and no doubt has a much better idea of where we need to strengthen now.  Individuals in the side have really blossomed under his (and Fleming's) coaching. The fact we've blooded so many young players and in the main found them to be excellent options, speaks well of youth development at the club.

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11 hours ago, pillred said:

Puzzling post, is our midfield in all it's permutations that bad that however good HNM is we have still struggled to stop teams dominating us in the middle of the park, I'm struggling to get my head around the fact that he is worth millions yet we are constantly out played in midfield and he often looks lost and uninterested, hardly a ringing endorsement for other teams to sign him. 

Why is it puzzling?  Seems pretty straightforward to me?   HNM will go to the very top IMHO,  he is only 21, and with better coaching, and surrounded by better quality players he will improve immeasurably.  Why do you think top coaches, who are far more knowledgeable than us, are interested in him?  Because they can see his tremendous potential, I just hope we make sure we secure sell on clauses, as I see him fetching even bigger money in the future.  It will be fascinating to see what fee we get for him, you might be surprised?

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52 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

I predicted 17th. We finished 17th. For my next trick I'll predict the next EuroMillions draw!  :laugh:

What was pleasing was that by the end of the season we looked a better side than we did at the start. Pearson had identified some areas of weakness, got things more organised and no doubt has a much better idea of where we need to strengthen now.  Individuals in the side have really blossomed under his (and Fleming's) coaching. The fact we've blooded so many young players and in the main found them to be excellent options, speaks well of youth development at the club.

That is a key thing for me.  Would’ve been easy (financially risky) to go to market to plug perceived gaps.  But what he’s done is try what he has.  Bar a cheap 33 year old CB signed in January, he now knows who can help take us forward and who isn’t up to it.

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2 minutes ago, Bedred31 said:

After Somerset lost their first three games of the season, I decided to spend the summer offline in the garden. 

I will spend the summer watching the England Test team sweep all before them.

Or possibly not.😉

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@maxjakstill 20 (21 in July).

 

 

 

FWIW here are the members of City’s squad born a year either side of Han.  Thought it was good context.  Notwithstanding he also cost us €3m so expectations should be higher on the other side of the coin.

image.thumb.png.31500f7f5b10784264d5dc326cd5a869.png

he has 98 first team appearances for Bristol City, over 100 career appearances.

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End of a season thoughts? Watching Somerset Cricket could parallel watching City. I may take a leaf out of Robboreds summer manual and turn up at the local bowls club. I read earlier that Curtis Davis was ooc soon and he was being linked with City. At 37 I thought he'd be too old by now

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3 hours ago, maxjak said:

Why is it puzzling?  Seems pretty straightforward to me?   HNM will go to the very top IMHO,  he is only 21, and with better coaching, and surrounded by better quality players he will improve immeasurably.  Why do you think top coaches, who are far more knowledgeable than us, are interested in him?  Because they can see his tremendous potential, I just hope we make sure we secure sell on clauses, as I see him fetching even bigger money in the future.  It will be fascinating to see what fee we get for him, you might be surprised?

Only 21? that's not that young daft as that may sound, yes I can see glimpses of what he could become but the game is full of players that flattered to deceive, I hope you are right the only thing I'm really interested in his how much we can get for him after that not really bothered as I have found it difficult to warm to him he has always struck me as a player who thinks he is too good for us and can't wait to leave, harsh? well we all have opinions.  

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1 minute ago, pillred said:

Only 21? that's not that young daft as that may sound, yes I can see glimpses of what he could become but the game is full of players that flattered to deceive, I hope you are right the only thing I'm really interested in his how much we can get for him after that not really bothered as I have found it difficult to warm to him he has always struck me as a player who thinks he is too good for us and can't wait to leave, harsh? well we all have opinions.  

Players mature at different times, there is no hard and fast rule.

Opinions will differ of course but what exactly has he done for you to conclude that he thinks he is too good for us? One thing that I haven't seen in him is arrogance; quite the opposite in fact.

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18 minutes ago, pillred said:

Only 21? that's not that young daft as that may sound, yes I can see glimpses of what he could become but the game is full of players that flattered to deceive, I hope you are right the only thing I'm really interested in his how much we can get for him after that not really bothered as I have found it difficult to warm to him he has always struck me as a player who thinks he is too good for us and can't wait to leave, harsh? well we all have opinions.  

He’s 20 🤣🤣🤣

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1).  I was wrong,  he is a mere whippersnapper at 20         2)   I am of the opinion that to believe that HNM thinks he is too good for us,, is extremely harsh and unwarranted, and IMHO says more about you, than him.?

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4 hours ago, Davefevs said:

@maxjakstill 20 (21 in July).

 

 

 

FWIW here are the members of City’s squad born a year either side of Han.  Thought it was good context.  Notwithstanding he also cost us €3m so expectations should be higher on the other side of the coin.

image.thumb.png.31500f7f5b10784264d5dc326cd5a869.png

he has 98 first team appearances for Bristol City, over 100 career appearances.

@Davefevsdo you have any stats on how many games Massengo started this season which we won? For some reason most of the early victories I recall James and King started and then latterly James and Williams. I think he best performance was Preston away but we only drew that one. Not trying to have a dig at HNM at all just interested to see what the stats are 

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27 minutes ago, pl00peh91 said:

@Davefevsdo you have any stats on how many games Massengo started this season which we won? For some reason most of the early victories I recall James and King started and then latterly James and Williams. I think he best performance was Preston away but we only drew that one. Not trying to have a dig at HNM at all just interested to see what the stats are 

I don’t track points per game like some websites, who take the match result at full-time and then allocate based on that, taking no account of what part they played.

I look at the match score at the point they enter the field of play and what it is when then leave the pitch…and apply points as follows:

image.png.310351d5f775f3815f1c1ff789d509bf.png

I believe that is fairer.

An example or two.

Player starts the game, comes off after 75 mins when we are winning 1-0.  Therefore starts with a draw, ends with a win, gets +2 (3 minus 1). Player who comes on, starts with a winning position, ends with a draw, gets -2 (1 minus 3)

Players plays all 90 in a 1-1 draw.  Starts on 0-0 (draw), ends on a draw, therefore 0 (1 minus 1).

Hope that makes sense?

I then divide their total points by minutes played to get a “points + / - per 90” score.

Here's the table, both in terms of total points + / - (left) and points + / - per 90.

89EC8D2D-1D32-4398-B956-7EA468B508FE.thumb.jpeg.42f99d2a87cef2d2312d58a2adefc69a.jpeg

Han-Noah’s total is 0, therefore his + / - per 90 is 0 divided by 2437 equal 0.00.

From a midfield point of view, O’Dowda, King and Palmer are below him…Williams, Benarous, Bakinson and James above him.

You can see Chris Martin has the most “total points”, whereas Joe Williams has the best “+ / - per 90”.

In a hypothetical, extrapolated world, had Joe Williams played every minute at his rate of +0.86, City would’ve got 85.56 points and finished 3rd!!

Had Kasey Palmer played every game at a rate of -0.44, City would’ve got 25.76 points and been relegated!!

I haven’t updated my goals scored / conced on the pitch charts yet.

It’s not something I’d base too many decisions on, but it’s just a different way of looking at things, with the odd trend visible.

Here’s Han-Noah’s match by match data:

6C53A211-A331-4B4A-8438-69CB773A0797.thumb.jpeg.23ecd95ebdb26644dd084f1b32f725e7.jpeg

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