Champions League Final

[TV Tom]

5 hours ago, Bristol Oil Services said:

They didn't, no.

I’m sure they did, full of Irish, Scots and Welsh with an Aussie, Groballar in goal and Moltby, any Liverpool fans out there?

[TV Tom]

6 hours ago, sludge said:

1986 fa cup final? 

That’s the one, I think, they beat Everton ?

[Fordy62]

8 hours ago, KegCity said:

Trent caught napping again. Walker comfortably the better full back.

Ditto James. 

Call me old fashioned but I’d give up all the assists for a defender who can defend. 

[Bris Red]

7 minutes ago, Fordy62 said:

Ditto James. 

Call me old fashioned but I’d give up all the assists for a defender who can defend. 

Me too. Undoubtedly Trent is fabulous going forward but its been proven time and time again in the big matches when it matters against the top teams he really struggles defensively.

[Robbored]

One player was the difference - Courtois. He kept RM in it with several top saves. The one from Salah was top drawer. He was MoM by a mile.

[richwwtk]

5 hours ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

A world of difference between that and "supporting" a side because a) They win a lot and b) One sees them on TV often.

Further, there are shades of grey- family ties etc- but I am quite sure a lot of the plastics fall into the category of the 2nd line.

Is it only me that doesn't get that bothered by 'plastics'? (using the term plastics here for someone supporting a club they have no geographical or family connection to)

I think it would be fair to say that, in football, once you are saddled with a club you are pretty much with that club for life.

Most people tend to make their club connections as they first become really 'aware' of football, and without outside influences I would suggest that comes around 10-11.

It's only natural at that age to be aware of the teams that get the media coverage, or through your peers. In most cases this will be the bigger, more successful clubs of the day. It's why there seems to be hundreds of Leeds fans amongst people my sort of age (mid fifties) for no apparent reason than they were good in the early/mid seventies.

The only way out of you becoming a lifelong supporter of these clubs is for someone to have an effect on you. It may be that you are lucky enough to be taken to Ashton Gate by already City supporting family members in which case the big clubs never took hold or, in my case, I had to wait until I was 15 and old enough to go on my own and went to Ashton Gate with my already City supporting cousin who had in turn been taken by his schoolfriends dad from age 11 or so, thus avoiding the lure of the big clubs. Previous to this I had split my time between being a Man Utd fan (1977 FA Cup) or QPR (League runners up in 1978).

For a lot of people with no influence to turn them towards Ashton Gate, they just remain a supporter of the club they 'chose' at an early age and it becomes part of them. Most will go to no more than a couple of games a season, if at all, in person but it is their club and I do not despise them for it.

I consider myself lucky to have become a City fan, it makes up a part of my identity more than being a big club fan ever would, but I also consider myself lucky to have been set on that course, and I know a lot of people won't have had that chance.

If you are a City fan through family connections etc., then consider yourself very lucky indeed, but remember that other people didn't get that chance.

I also think that this is beginning to change, you see more and more City shirts on kids these days, the club is getting better at marketing itself and I really do feel that in another 20 years or so the proportion of City fans to 'plastics' in the area will have shifted a fair way in our favour.

Having said all that, people that actively turn their backs on City in order to just follow the successful clubs, or change their allegiances each season according to who won the league the year before are the true plastics, and really do deserve all they get.

Edited May 29, 2022 by richwwtk

[Guest]

Without reading through prev 15 pages, was the delayed start down to fake tickets as per uefa? seems one reason, judging from the pics of the amount of fans outside trying to get in I have seen on the beeb,.... fans running through gates and being chased.

Poorly organised or fake tickets, seems a bit of both to me.

Edited May 29, 2022 by gl2

[Redinthehead]

25 minutes ago, gl2 said:

Without reading through prev 15 pages, was the delayed start down to fake tickets as per uefa? seems one reason, judging from the pics of the amount of fans outside trying to get in I have seen on the beeb,.... fans running through gates and being chased.

Poorly organised or fake tickets, seems a bit of both to me.

I think it’s a combination as you say from what I’ve read. 
 

I’ve never understood this fan parks thing, why invite people to come to the city without tickets and if you do, you need to be able to deal with it. However I also think that any Liverpool fan trying to ‘sneak’ in or use a knowingly forged ticket are selfish idiots and need to take their share of the blame.

[Bris Red]

18 minutes ago, richwwtk said:

Is it only me that doesn't get that bothered by 'plastics'? (using the term plastics here for someone supporting a club they have no geographical or family connection to)

I think it would be fair to say that, in football, once you are saddled with a club you are pretty much with that club for life.

Most people tend to make their club connections as they first become really 'aware' of football, and without outside influences I would suggest that comes around 10-11.

It's only natural at that age to be aware of the teams that get the media coverage, or through your peers. In most cases this will be the bigger, more successful clubs of the day. It's why there seems to be hundreds of Leeds fans amongst people my sort of age (mid fifties) for no apparent reason than they were good in the early/mid seventies.

The only way out of you becoming a lifelong supporter of these clubs is for someone to have an effect on you. It may be that you are lucky enough to be taken to Ashton Gate by already City supporting family members in which case the big clubs never took hold or, in my case, I had to wait until I was 15 and old enough to go on my own and went to Ashton Gate with my already City supporting cousin who had in turn been taken by his schoolfriends dad from age 11 or so, thus avoiding the lure of the big clubs. Previous to this I had split my time between being a Man Utd fan (1977 FA Cup) or QPR (League runners up in 1978).

For a lot of people with no influence to turn them towards Ashton Gate, they just remain a supporter of the club they 'chose' at an early age and it becomes part of them. Most will go to no more than a couple of games a season, if at all, in person but it is their club and I do not despise them for it.

I consider myself lucky to have become a City fan, it makes up a part of my identity more than being a big club fan ever would, but I also consider myself lucky to have been set on that course, and I know a lot of people won't have had that chance.

If you are a City fan through family connections etc., then consider yourself very lucky indeed, but remember that other people didn't get that chance.

I also think that this is beginning to change, you see more and more City shirts on kids these days, the club is getting better at marketing itself and I really do feel that in another 20 years or so the proportion of City fans to 'plastics' in the area will have shifted a fair way in our favour.

Having said all that, people that actively turn their backs on City in order to just follow the successful clubs, or change their allegiances each season according to who won the league the year before are the true plastics, and really do deserve all they get.

I see where you are coming from but for me supporting Bristol City has been just as much about the football as it has been about where i went to school and where i grew up in South Bristol. 

When you stand on the terraces at Ashton gate or you go away following City knowing you are surrounded by like minded people from your area and seeing familiar faces from South Bristol is what it’s all about for me. It’s that togetherness that you are all from the same area’s and are all in it together win lose or draw.
 

 

 

[richwwtk]

7 minutes ago, bris red said:

I see where you are coming from but for me supporting Bristol City has been just as much about the football as it has been about where i went to school and where i grew up in South Bristol. 

When you stand on the terraces at Ashton gate or you go away following City knowing you are surrounded by like minded people from your area and seeing familiar faces from South Bristol is what it’s all about for me. It’s that togetherness that you are all from the same area’s and are all in it together win lose or draw.
 

 

 

I'm coming from it as someone from Weston-super-Mare so never really saw people I already knew at Ashton Gate, though over the years there are obviously people there that I consider friends and see regularly.

I'm just proud to be a City fan and, rather than despise people who follow the big clubs, feel a little bit sorry for them that they were never afforded the same opportunity as I was to become a small part of the City supporting community.

[Red DNA]

1 hour ago, gl2 said:

Without reading through prev 15 pages, was the delayed start down to fake tickets as per uefa? seems one reason, judging from the pics of the amount of fans outside trying to get in I have seen on the beeb,.... fans running through gates and being chased.

Poorly organised or fake tickets, seems a bit of both to me.

There is a third factor to be considered here as well…

Classic Scouse tactics to turn up at the turnstiles very very late without tickets, forged or otherwise, push the kids to the front, let them get squashed and distressed then demand the gates are open to avoid someone being seriously injured and get in for free, pushing genuine ticket holders out of their seats. 

I do feel sorry the genuine fans who spent shed loads of money to watch their team and be treated like this but the scallys need to take some ownership and responsibility of the issue and maybe the club won’t keep getting stereotyped by people like me. 

[Pezo]

1 hour ago, richwwtk said:

I'm coming from it as someone from Weston-super-Mare so never really saw people I already knew at Ashton Gate, though over the years there are obviously people there that I consider friends and see regularly.

I'm just proud to be a City fan and, rather than despise people who follow the big clubs, feel a little bit sorry for them that they were never afforded the same opportunity as I was to become a small part of the City supporting community.

But they will never see it like that, not that that matters.

Watching on Robin's TV through COVID gave me a bit of a new perspective - if you're sat at home with a list of things to do but you can convince the misses that there is something on TV that's important to you then you might be able to string out doing chores, watching us was worse than doing the vacuuming - why would you watch a team that's worse than doing chores if all your going to do is watch the game.

For me it's about the day, getting a couple drinks with friends, finding out how friends are getting on, guessing the lineup, figuring out how we're going to play ect, maybe having a drink after.

For armchair supporters/plastics it's a lot more take it or leave it, they don't have anything else to keep them hooked. If there team isn't playing well then what's the point in watching them - might as well do something else. When they aren't playing well they naturally go quiet and don't really have anything to talk about because they aren't watching - then when they are playing well they are interested again and probably as full of it as the rest of us when we're doing well - it just happens a lot more regularly for them.

There are certainly less man u and Chelsea shirts and more Liverpool shirts in pubs than there were 10 years ago.

[TheCerneAbbasGiant]

I won’t watch a European or a Premier League game until City are in it. I detest the eliteness and arrogance of some of the big clubs. I’m just not interested. Each to their own, but unless it’s City and the teams in their league, I really couldn’t give a shit. I just love my club.

Edited May 29, 2022 by TheCerneAbbasGiant

[maxjak]

2 hours ago, Robbored said:

One player was the difference - Courtois. He kept RM in it with several top saves. The one from Salah was top drawer. He was MoM by a mile.

Yep.........the current Madrid side are the most boring side to win the Champions League since Steaua Bucharest......but they have an outstanding keeper, who was, as you say MOM.

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Redinthehead said:

I think it’s a combination as you say from what I’ve read. 
 

I’ve never understood this fan parks thing, why invite people to come to the city without tickets and if you do, you need to be able to deal with it. However I also think that any Liverpool fan trying to ‘sneak’ in or use a knowingly forged ticket are selfish idiots and need to take their share of the blame.

and so does the club, by banning anyone found using forged tickets, as they are stopping the real ticket holders getting in. The fans know where they got tickets from,

I`m sure the real sellers should be able to upgrade the quality of tickets to make it much harder to fake them. Stadium owners should also be able to cope with any "pressure" at entrances as the fans are paying them to do so.

Fake buyers should pay a heavy price as they are shitting on there own supporters

Edited May 29, 2022 by gl2

[luke_bristol]

See the gap between the police van and the wall with two lights on it?

Apparently 20,000 Liverpool fans were expected to pass through that gap and each be individually searched by police. What a joke.

 

[B1ackbird]

Why didn't the Madrid fans get pepper sprayed? It was almost like Wembley in the Euro's but with the authorities giving a **** what's going on ..

[Numero Uno]

3 hours ago, Robbored said:

One player was the difference - Courtois. He kept RM in it with several top saves. The one from Salah was top drawer. He was MoM by a mile.

Wasn’t just the saves though. The thing that all non goalkeepers seem to overlook is that he was dominating when Liverpool got a bit desperate and started loading the box. That’s what sorts out the Goalkeeping men from the boys. Too many see goalkeepers make brilliant saves and say “great keeper” and say he “had no chance” when he’s rooted to his line conceding a four yard header………

[Midred]

Presumably you  can print your ticket at home and then with a decent photo copier make duplicates. If someone gets in with a duplicate ticket does this invalidate the original ticket later on?

No experience of this problem at Ashton Gate! 

[GrahamC]

11 hours ago, Merrick's Marvels said:

Yes, it's amazing what a good dose of self-pity and a chip on both shoulders can do for the atmosphere amongst one's supporters. Plus the odd League title. Or two. And a European title. Or two.

In contrast, we Bristolians do not do self pity, more like meh, shrug shoulders, whatever. As for titles, I'm not sure the JPT comes into it. 

Which means we have precious little to make an atmosphere about. 

I’ve been thinking about this & my take is as follows;

When I started watching football Liverpool were well on their way to being the best team in the country, something they then consistently were for a very long while.

Most people (probably not Mancunians) admired them & respected them then in a world where football was far more equal financially.

They then went post Dalglish into a comparative decline & as Sky emerged, the way you supported clubs fundamentally changed, the first generation of plastic fans were undoubtedly Man U because of Ferguson.

Since then we have had the Abramovich (Putin) bankrolled Chelsea & Dubai backed Man City, but Liverpool under Klopp (& less dubious financial backers) are serious contenders again.

I don’t see their success as anything to do with the unique character of their city, they have history (we simply don’t) I remember having this conversation on a lower scale about the 2 East Anglian sides & why they have retained support.

In the interim due to Sky & technology it has become acceptable/ possible to “support” a club that you never actually see live, which is why Bristol is full of them, in their replica shirts.

Our inability to punch our weight (to me clubs like Leicester are more appropriate comparitors, not Liverpool) is a whole other story & could reasonably write a book on, maybe I will one day.

In short though, poor business decisions, no history of success (no-one is left who was around in the 1900s) a convenient excuse for BCC not to assist in a 2 club city & 1982, which saw our support decline to almost nothing, are all big factors here.

Edited May 29, 2022 by GrahamC

[Bristol Oil Services]

11 hours ago, Merrick's Marvels said:

Yes, it's amazing what a good dose of self-pity and a chip on both shoulders can do for the atmosphere amongst one's supporters. Plus the odd League title. Or two. And a European title. Or two.

In contrast, we Bristolians do not do self pity, more like meh, shrug shoulders, whatever. As for titles, I'm not sure the JPT comes into it. 

Which means we have precious little to make an atmosphere about. 

I love a bit of self pity, me. Can't beat a good old wallow in self pity. The La's "There She Goes," how's that for  3 glorious minutes of self-pitying Scouse scallywag singing and songwriting. Self pity put to jolly good use. Guitar, bass, drums + scallies on self pity = pop music! Alright la'

Them Massive Attack boys, fair play to 'em, they knocked up a decent attempt at putting Bristol's "meh, shrug shoulders, whatever" down on vinyl but that ain't getting yer toe tapping, or yer crowd singing.

[AppyDAZE]

11 minutes ago, Bristol Oil Services said:

I love a bit of self pity, me. Can't beat a good old wallow in self pity. The La's "There She Goes," how's that for  3 glorious minutes of self-pitying Scouse scallywag singing and songwriting. Self pity put to jolly good use. Guitar, bass, drums + scallies on self pity = pop music! Alright la'

Them Massive Attack boys, fair play to 'em, they knocked up a decent attempt at putting Bristol's "meh, shrug shoulders, whatever" down on vinyl but that ain't getting yer toe tapping, or yer crowd singing.

There's a track on The La's album called Failure

Aww, cheer up, boys!

Edited May 29, 2022 by AppyDAZE

[Robbored]

28 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

Wasn’t just the saves though. The thing that all non goalkeepers seem to overlook is that he was dominating when Liverpool got a bit desperate and started loading the box. That’s what sorts out the Goalkeeping men from the boys. Too many see goalkeepers make brilliant saves and say “great keeper” and say he “had no chance” when he’s rooted to his line conceding a four yard header………

Absolutely right. Courtios is one of the best keepers around. His all round game is terrific and he showed that last night.

[Sleepy1968]

16 minutes ago, Midred said:

Presumably you  can print your ticket at home and then with a decent photo copier make duplicates. If someone gets in with a duplicate ticket does this invalidate the original ticket later on?

No experience of this problem at Ashton Gate! 

Yes it would: All tickets will be bar coded and so permit stadium entry only once. There's no information on whether the fake tickets were printed with copies of legitimate bar codes or not, and whether these matched the printed ticket. I image there were varying degrees of fraud going on - from individual copying of single tickets to professionally organised touting. The touts obviously just need your money so there is no particular incentive to make the bar codes appear legitimate, except to maybe get through pre entry checks (as these wouldn't need to mark the ticket as used for entry). And who knows how sophisticed the ticket checks were - if they occured much at all (given the number of ticketless frenchies that seemed to pass through the checking points)? And if tickets were 'print at home' as suggested last night then it is obviously much easier to use copies and deny legitimate holder entry.

One thing for sure though, the organisers from UEFA to the French Football Federation to the Stadium management to the French Police need to be held accountable for what went on. Their job was to run the game and ensure legitimate ticket holders had a hassle free experience, not see them held in queues for hours, denied entry due to fraud and dishonesty, pickpocketed, mugged, and otherwise attacked (both by locals, the police and stadium workers) and mistreated.

[Pezo]

40 minutes ago, Sleepy1968 said:

One thing for sure though, the organisers from UEFA to the French Football Federation to the Stadium management to the French Police need to be held accountable for what went on. Their job was to run the game and ensure legitimate ticket holders had a hassle free experience, not see them held in queues for hours, denied entry due to fraud and dishonesty, pickpocketed, mugged, and otherwise attacked (both by locals, the police and stadium workers) and mistreated.

Yes because you can't get a Scouser who's bought a ticket off a tout or printed there own ticket 4 times and tried to sell the other 3 to take any responsibility what so ever.

[Sir Geoff]

3 hours ago, Midred said:

Presumably you  can print your ticket at home and then with a decent photo copier make duplicates. If someone gets in with a duplicate ticket does this invalidate the original ticket later on?

No experience of this problem at Ashton Gate! 

Moronic by UEFA to issue print at home tickets. Most ( large venue) concert tickets are now only issued a few days before by way of a QR code to an app on your phone. This code changes every 10 minutes or so. Duplicates and black market tickets no more.

[EstoniaTallinnRed]

18 hours ago, Davefevs said:

It’s on YouTube free if anyone didn’t know.

If you’ve got a smart tv, use the YouTube channel on that, rather than through Sky’s YouTube app….pic quality much better.

You were right I got it through my android box and a great quality picture it was indeed. Shame about the result, but Courtois was terrific and deserved MOM.

[Midred]

Did they not have problems with the Spanish fans' tickets? Are we reaping the rewards for previous behaviour at tournaments and the police/organisers were preempting it by causing problems themselves?

[Rich]

4 hours ago, Numero Uno said:

Wasn’t just the saves though. The thing that all non goalkeepers seem to overlook is that he was dominating when Liverpool got a bit desperate and started loading the box. That’s what sorts out the Goalkeeping men from the boys. Too many see goalkeepers make brilliant saves and say “great keeper” and say he “had no chance” when he’s rooted to his line conceding a four yard header………

Someone who knows what they're talking about. Were you a number one?

 

[Engvall’s Splinter]

5 hours ago, Red DNA said:

There is a third factor to be considered here as well…

Classic Scouse tactics to turn up at the turnstiles very very late without tickets, forged or otherwise, push the kids to the front, let them get squashed and distressed then demand the gates are open to avoid someone being seriously injured and get in for free, pushing genuine ticket holders out of their seats. 

I do feel sorry the genuine fans who spent shed loads of money to watch their team and be treated like this but the scallys need to take some ownership and responsibility of the issue and maybe the club won’t keep getting stereotyped by people like me. 

Classic scouse tactics? That’s very harsh. I’ve a couple of friends who attended yesterday. Arrived at the ground at 18.30, plenty of time you would have thought alongside many a fan and found a large amount of the turnstiles were closed. There have since been multiple videos of football supporters (like us) being tear gassed when simply showing their tickets to the authorities. Other videos showing locals trying to squeeze in front at the turnstiles. Eventually one of my pals got in 25 minutes after the KO. Many of the fans have been fleeced for tickets, just to follow their club, and then miss out on the early action. UEFA blamed the fans. Absolute joke. Responses like yours are an insult. Football is broken.