Lansdown willing to sell the club

[The Nest Egg]

Honestly? I'm all for him selling up. We're just going in circles now 

[where's the joy]

Time surely for Mr Scudamore to step forward and open up his address book. if anyone can raise big bucks for city it should be him.

I would hope that the Lansdowns would stay in any new ownership structure, like crystal palace for example. but its not fair to keep asking him to put his hand in his pocket anymore, nor is it likely; he might be down to his last billion

[real_bristol]

2 hours ago, Negan said:

Well others aren’t spending the maximum and are having a lot more success than us. New owner with different ideas and philosophy might just be what we need to finally get to the prem, everything else is ready and waiting. Then again it could go completely pear shaped. Extremely risky move. 

Funny thing is we are right in the middle of trying out a new idea and philosophy. Lansdown himself has said what he tried previously has not worked and this is his new approach. More power has been given to the manager, owners have let him get on with it and it’s a totally different look to the Ashton-Johnson days which we’ve only just transitioned from. We are beginning to find our feet structurally and thankfully we are still a championship club. I’m not sure things behind the scenes could be any better than they are. Apart from maybe the manager/ first team coaches, who IMO need the time we promised them, what would you change?

[real_bristol]

27 minutes ago, Redrascal2 said:

If we want to see the football club progress then 

The trouble was Lansdown wasn't the dream ticket for all his massive financial support he has selected a stream of sub standard Managers and topped it off with Ashton as CEO and his son as a Chairman. If only he had kept out of the football side of things and just did the financial side then it would have been brilliant. But for all the great facilities and ground that will form his legacy look at the state of the team/squad and Manager he has left us with.

I happen to think he’s trying that now. - stepping out of the football side. Ok we don’t have a DOF but do we really need one, I don’t know of one club where that works. NP is not substandard, at least he wasn’t until he joined us. 

[Red Bill]

It seems that just about everything in Britain is up for sale - be it a water company, rail, health...you name it.  The government call it "investing in Britain".  I call it selling the family silver.  I would passionately oppose the sale of BCFC to any foreign company and would much rather the club remained in the hands of the Lansdown family.

[The Nest Egg]

17 minutes ago, real_bristol said:

Funny thing is we are right in the middle of trying out a new idea and philosophy. Lansdown himself has said what he tried previously has not worked and this is his new approach. More power has been given to the manager, owners have let him get on with it and it’s a totally different look to the Ashton-Johnson days which we’ve only just transitioned from. We are beginning to find our feet structurally and thankfully we are still a championship club. I’m not sure things behind the scenes could be any better than they are. Apart from maybe the manager/ first team coaches, who IMO need the time we promised them, what would you change?

I understand this, although remember him also saying this in 2013 following the embarrassment that the years post 2010 were. I don't doubt his good intentions but the last few years have been eerily similar.

Johnson = Johnson Jr

Millen = Holden

Pearson = O'Driscoll?

His legacy should rightly be the massive infrastructure investments that he has made. There's many worse owners out there and I know that a new owner would be heaven or hell. Trouble is, I'm at the point of accepting that risk, because I'm absolutely sick of purgatory.

[Guest]

46 minutes ago, Redrascal2 said:

If we want to see the football club progress then 

The trouble was Lansdown wasn't the dream ticket for all his massive financial support he has selected a stream of sub standard Managers and topped it off with Ashton as CEO and his son as a Chairman. If only he had kept out of the football side of things and just did the financial side then it would have been brilliant. But for all the great facilities and ground that will form his legacy look at the state of the team/squad and Manager he has left us with.

Exactly this, the managers have been his choices so where we are today is down to him; no-one forced him to invest his money and he has not exactly chucked it down the drain. He will be looking to "cash in" on some of his investments, his and Dawes first mistake was sacking our double winning manager SC giving him far less time than LJ or even his present choice NP.

So anotherone who is just passing through our club bye then, next.

Edited August 7, 2022 by gl2

[Bris Red]

2 minutes ago, An Outstanding Human said:

I understand this, although remember him also saying this in 2013 following the embarrassment that the years post 2010 were. I don't doubt his good intentions but the last few years have been eerily similar.

Johnson = Johnson Jr

Millen = Holden

Pearson = O'Driscoll?

His legacy should rightly be the massive infrastructure investments that he has made. There's many worse owners out there and I know that a new owner would be heaven or hell. Trouble is, I'm at the point of accepting that risk, because I'm absolutely sick of purgatory.

Indeed. It is history repeating itself, sadly. 

[ExiledAjax]

Interesting that this has come during the 25th year of his ownership. I know there was some talk of commemorating that milestone somehow, but perhaps not if a sale or investment is on the horizon 

[REDOXO]

8 minutes ago, An Outstanding Human said:

I understand this, although remember him also saying this in 2013 following the embarrassment that the years post 2010 were. I don't doubt his good intentions but the last few years have been eerily similar.

Johnson = Johnson Jr

Millen = Holden

Pearson = O'Driscoll?

His legacy should rightly be the massive infrastructure investments that he has made. There's many worse owners out there and I know that a new owner would be heaven or hell. Trouble is, I'm at the point of accepting that risk, because I'm absolutely sick of purgatory.

The philosophy of the Johnsons was different. But Mr Lansdown felt he owed something for the way Gary Johnson was kicked out. 
 

Millen Tinnion and Holden were similar in as much as they were here. Brian faced a player revolt as did Johnson senior. Millen and Holden were out of their depth. 
 

I don’t see any comparison between ODriscoll who had overwhelming fan support but was pony. Getting the job on the basis of a decent couple of seasons at Doncaster. Pearson has a track record of rebuilding clubs from the ground up, which has its own pitfalls as it’s easy to panic when things are against you, as a supporter. 
 

Pearson said n my opinion is the only not manager that has made sense since Gary Johnson came in and we all remember how that went at fist 

IMO City are suffering for Mr Lansdowns loyalty to Ashton and Johnson and has Presided over some horror decisions on the playing side. However I’m bloody 60 I’ve see. Us in all four divisions and at last we are an established Championship team. Something we can’t say for the majority of the last 41 years. 

[italian dave]

11 minutes ago, REDOXO said:

 

 

Pearson said n my opinion is the only not manager that has made sense since Gary Johnson came in and we all remember how that went at fist 

 

At first, maybe. But we’re way beyond that now. NP has been here 18 months. At that stage under GJ we were on an 18 game unbeaten run.

[Mr Popodopolous]

1 minute ago, italian dave said:

At first, maybe. But we’re way beyond that now. NP has been here 18 months. At that stage under GJ we were on an 18 game unbeaten run.

At League One and as one of (at that time) the bigger clubs at that level- however GJ did great stuff with us for the most part and I'd have given one final chance to rebuild the side back in 2010- could it have been any worse than the subsequent 3 seasons?

[Major Isewater]

2 hours ago, paul_fox said:

I was thinking the other about other clubs who have had very mixed ups and downs in the time SL has been at the club. 

As fans would we be happy if city had a similar recent history to the likes of Bolton, Wigan, maybe Bradford, Blackpool etc who have been in the Premiership, won the FA Cup like Wigan, had a season in Europe like a couple of them but then collapsed and on the brink while we've been fairly stable in the 2 leagues? 

They’ve made history whilst we keep Bob Bob bobbin along anonymously.

 I believe that one day our time will come. I want that day soon not in fifteen or twenty years. This is why I am hoping that Largish Nige delivers. 

[Supersonic Robin]

2 hours ago, paul_fox said:

I was thinking the other about other clubs who have had very mixed ups and downs in the time SL has been at the club. 

As fans would we be happy if city had a similar recent history to the likes of Bolton, Wigan, maybe Bradford, Blackpool etc who have been in the Premiership, won the FA Cup like Wigan, had a season in Europe like a couple of them but then collapsed and on the brink while we've been fairly stable in the 2 leagues? 

If you were to reverse the question and ask Wigan fans "Would you trade your Premier League years, FA Cup win, and European appearances for the midtable Championship stability of Bristol City?" then I think the response would be a resounding "Hell no". 

In the case of Wigan, they haven't even fallen THAT hard. Since their relegation from the Prem in 2012/13, they've spent 4 seasons in League 1, and the rest in the Championship. Their average league finish in that time has been 23rd in the Championship. Comparatively, in that time we've spent 2 seasons in League 1 (and the rest in the Championship) with an average league finish of 18th in the Championship. We've done better than them, yes, but not significantly better. 

[Fpcity]

17 minutes ago, Supersonic Robin said:

If you were to reverse the question and ask Wigan fans "Would you trade your Premier League years, FA Cup win, and European appearances for the midtable Championship stability of Bristol City?" then I think the response would be a resounding "Hell no". 

In the case of Wigan, they haven't even fallen THAT hard. Since their relegation from the Prem in 2012/13, they've spent 4 seasons in League 1, and the rest in the Championship. Their average league finish in that time has been 23rd in the Championship. Comparatively, in that time we've spent 2 seasons in League 1 (and the rest in the Championship) with an average league finish of 18th in the Championship. We've done better than them, yes, but not significantly better. 

Yeah they've probably faired better than most although didn't they have financial issues not too long ago? 

[Supersonic Robin]

8 minutes ago, paul_fox said:

Yeah they've probably faired better than most although didn't they have financial issues not too long ago? 

Yeah, they had some financial issues when they were last relegated from the Championship in 2019/2020 - I think they received a points deduction that season. I believe the issues continued for a little while in League 1 and they struggled to put a senior side out for a few weeks before sorting themselves out.

[Mr Popodopolous]

Just in respect of other clubs, I'd say that we failed to strike when the iron was hot, when it was easier to do on one level.

When you look at...*deep breath* sides such as Cardiff, Hull, Reading ,Stoke and Wigan to name 5.

For one, there was no such thing as FFP, plus Parachute Payments were lower too.

Secondly, and sure there are no guarantees- but all of these had new stadiums with greater revenue stream which perhaps helped to push on momentum and cash streams wise in some cases. Swansea had one too but weren't really all that big spending- expect it still helped though.

This advantage is still of use but Point 1 certainly has helped to reduce this.

Brighton were an interesting one as they spent big AND did infrastructure. 2016/17- FFP still relatively early.

Brentford were interesting due to their unique model paying off albeit expenditure increased significantly there in the 2-3 years leading to it.

Burnley were interesting as they went up the first time under Coyle and capitalised on momentum- that is another way in which a club can strike while the iron is hot. Beat a range of PL clubs and gave it an excellent go in the League Cup...does that sound familiar?? That will have infused such confidence into their League season. Yoyoing via Parachute Payments and careful management will have helped- see also Hull, went up again in 2012/13, dunno if Parachute Payments but that year before FFP...these Payments helped them to return in 2015/16.

Edited August 7, 2022 by Mr Popodopolous

[LondonBristolian]

I immediately think of the Aesop Fable of the Frogs who wished for a King.

The short version being there were a group of frogs who wanted a King. So they prayed to Zeus and he sent them a wooden log and told them the wooden log was their King. The Frogs got angry with how passive and inactive the log was so sent back to Zeus and demanded a King who was more proactive.

So Zeus sent them a new King, who was a Water Snake, which proceeded to eat all the frogs. 

 

In short, change isn't necessarily going to be for the better. 

[Mr Popodopolous]

Just now, billywedlock said:

He did not take the wage bill from 38 m to under 20 m . 

Am not sure the club wage bill will have been <£20m...still won't be, as that £38m will have included everything under BCH, the lot.

[The Nest Egg]

5 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said:

I immediately think of the Aesop Fable of the Frogs who wished for a King.

The short version being there were a group of frogs who wanted a King. So they prayed to Zeus and he sent them a wooden log and told them the wooden log was their King. The Frogs got angry with how passive and inactive the log was so sent back to Zeus and demanded a King who was more proactive.

So Zeus sent them a new King, who was a Water Snake, which proceeded to eat all the frogs. 

 

In short, change isn't necessarily going to be for the better. 

if we've got our bones don't go for other people's bones because you might lose your own

Edited August 7, 2022 by An Outstanding Human

[Mr Popodopolous]

Two pinpoint examples

Stoke invested well in Jan 2008- we did not, they got over the line- NO FFP.

Burnley in Jan 2009 had all that confidence that I mentioned above- won playoffs, momentum carried them forward and drove them on IMO. We had much the same backdrop in Jan 2018 but imploded. I'd say that such a cup run is prefect preparation for the playoffs...which are like 3 Cup ties/finals.

Two examples, two clear opportunities -two misses.

To a lesser extent, could be argued another CM and striker in Jan 2019 is the difference between top 6 and just missing out- and we still had some Cup run/big Cup tie experience in the squad- which feels useful for playoffs- LJ could have managed varied issues better too of course.

Edited August 7, 2022 by Mr Popodopolous

[Kid in the Riot]

1 hour ago, ExiledAjax said:

Interesting that this has come during the 25th year of his ownership. I know there was some talk of commemorating that milestone somehow, but perhaps not if a sale or investment is on the horizon 

He joined the City board in 1996, but didn't become Chairman/owner until 2002. So, this is his 20th year. 

[city52]

5 hours ago, pillred said:

Would it make much difference surely the new owners would be under the same constraints of FFP and would not be able to just throw money at the problem.

i think your right there we would still be in the same as we are now 

[ExiledAjax]

55 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

He joined the City board in 1996, but didn't become Chairman/owner until 2002. So, this is his 20th year. 

Interesting. The 25 year figure came from someone who would know, and would be involved with it if there were to be celebrations. It's been said to me several times. Perhaps I misheard and it is 25 years of something else to do with Lansdown and City.

We're definitely in the ballpark for these kind of anniversaries.

Edited August 7, 2022 by ExiledAjax

[bcfc01]

1 hour ago, Supersonic Robin said:

If you were to reverse the question and ask Wigan fans "Would you trade your Premier League years, FA Cup win, and European appearances for the midtable Championship stability of Bristol City?" then I think the response would be a resounding "Hell no". 

In the case of Wigan, they haven't even fallen THAT hard. Since their relegation from the Prem in 2012/13, they've spent 4 seasons in League 1, and the rest in the Championship. Their average league finish in that time has been 23rd in the Championship. Comparatively, in that time we've spent 2 seasons in League 1 (and the rest in the Championship) with an average league finish of 18th in the Championship. We've done better than them, yes, but not significantly better. 

Could be wrong, but I make it an average of 14th (18th, 17th, 11th, 8th, 12th, 19th, 17th)

 

 

[italian dave]

1 hour ago, billywedlock said:

He did not take the wage bill from 38 m to under 20 m . 

I know. 

Different league, different finances, different era. I'm not trying to get into a detailed analysis of the two regimes. Simply making the point that we're long beyond being able to compare the two managers records "at first". 

[Supersonic Robin]

48 minutes ago, bcfc01 said:

Could be wrong, but I make it an average of 14th (18th, 17th, 11th, 8th, 12th, 19th, 17th)

 

 

Sorry, I should have been more clear - it's an average of all league finishes since 2012/13 (including seasons in League 1), so:

36th (12th in L1), 25th (1st in L1), 18th, 17th, 11th, 8th, 12th, 19th, 17th

The average of the above 9 seasons is an 18th place finish in the Championship.

 

[bcfc01]

9 minutes ago, Supersonic Robin said:

Sorry, I should have been more clear - it's an average of all league finishes since 2012/13 (including seasons in League 1), so:

36th (12th in L1), 25th (1st in L1), 18th, 17th, 11th, 8th, 12th, 19th, 17th

The average of the above 9 seasons is an 18th place finish in the Championship.

 

So you are counting L1 finishes as Championship finishes.

I'm out.

[Supersonic Robin]

18 minutes ago, bcfc01 said:

So you are counting L1 finishes as Championship finishes.

I'm out.

No, I'm not. You're misunderstanding either the concept or the maths.

It is an average of ALL league finishes since the end of the 2012/13 season. That includes the 2 seasons we've played in League 1, and the 7 seasons we've played in the Championship. The result of that calculation shows that our average finish in the football league across that time period was 18th place in the Championship. 

[maxjak]

4 hours ago, Wiltshire robin said:

That’s a good question but honestly it looks like if things aren’t sorted we could be heading to league one anyway so would of been nice to have at least a year of prem football before we go back . 
 

The thought of being on the brink like derby and Blackpool isn’t a nice one but I think the reality is that if we stay under the lansdowns ownership both of those will be at least challenging for prem football before we ever do .

 

For a good comparison of how badly we’ve been run the year we got promoted to the champ and had a promising squad with what looked like great momentum  luton had just got promoted from the conference and even they have had a crack in the play offs .

i look back on the 2004 play off final between us and Brighton, which i attended, and compare our paths?  Brighton finished 9th in the Prem last season, they have a 20 million pound training ground and a fantastic stadium...and having sold two players in the close season for around 90 million.....they went to Old Trafford today and won 2-1.  They have a fantastic manager in Graham Potter, who states that it is all about the collective and the tactics, rather than individuals?  Makes you sick?  Ha!   PS Whatever did happen to that irritating little dwarf.....Leon Knight?